Dave Hedblom on wed 17 jul 96
My brother, who works for a foundry, was able to get me enough bricks to
build a kiln. The bricks are of various shapes and sizes. I have
everything figures out except for the floor of the kiln. The bricks were
made for a special purpose and a corner of the brick is rounded. This
causes the floor to have several holes. I was wondering what I could use to
plug these holes??? I was wondering about fireclay?? And if I use clay
should I dry pack it???
Dave Hedblom
cobalt@winternet.com
Nils Lou on wed 17 jul 96
yIf sand would not run out, that would work and is cheap and easy; cone
10, no problem. Nils Lou
On Wed, 17 Jul 1996, Dave Hedblom wrote:
> ----------------------------Original message----------------------------
> My brother, who works for a foundry, was able to get me enough bricks
> build a kiln. The bricks are of various shapes and sizes. I have
> everything figures out except for the floor of the kiln. The bricks were
> made for a special purpose and a corner of the brick is rounded. This
> causes the floor to have several holes. I was wondering what I could use to
> plug these holes??? I was wondering about fireclay?? And if I use clay
> should I dry pack it???
>
>
> Dave Hedblom
> cobalt@winternet.com
>
Vince Pitelka on thu 18 jul 96
Dave -
Wedge up a very stiff mixture of 80% grog and 20% fireclay and ram it into the
holes. You should get minimal shrinkage and a good solid floor after it is
fired once.
- Vince
Vince Pitelka - wkp0067@tntech.edu
Appalachian Center for Crafts
RandHeazlt@aol.com on fri 19 jul 96
If it is not a salt or wood kiln you might try ceramic fiber. This would also
depend on the size of the hole, a more expensive way would be cover it with
extra kiln shelves, you would still need to put something in the hole), or
cut pieces of soft brick to fill the holes.
Tina on fri 2 aug 96
Hello All
Thank you to all who have offered great advice about building my kiln. The
process is still in the research stages, but I feel like I'm on the right
path. The next question that has come up is what type of structure if any
to house the kiln in. I have pretty much decided to build a gas kiln
probably using propane as the fuel. I live inside the city limits and have
a very private back yard. Most of the kiln that I have seen in the area
either have no shelter or a tin canopy structure. In this part of NC the
winters are not very harsh. We occasionally will have snow or ice ( last
year was the exception), but for the most apart we only have a few weeks of
freezing conditions. We have talked about several types of "kiln houses"
for reasons of asthetics mostly. I welcome any comments about the subject.
As always TIA,
Tina Morris
Greensboro NC where the days have mostly been in the 80's but the
mosquitoes in the millions
mel jacobson on mon 17 feb 97
if when looking at plans for kilns the builder can
almost always adapt those plans for a different
size. we have pushed and shoved the plans from
nils lou to create 5 different kilns...if you keep in mind
the size of the flue, how the metal work is arranged,
and establish a basic understanding of what you
are doing... you can build a kiln of any size with
any set of plans... kilns are kilns...the size has little
to do with it... the flat top for instance is just an easy
way to build a kiln...how the braces in the corners are
'made is key to the top. if you take nils' theory and assuming
you believe it.....the double venturi really works...it is not a
theory any longer....i believe it is a fact.
and if you believe that 34 square inches of outlet flue are
appropriate....who cares how large you build your kiln. if
you have 81 square inches of outlet flue you may have trouble
no matter how big or small your kiln is.
arches are nice...they are nice antiques...but they cost a great
deal, are complex to construct for beginners, and of course
need arch and wedge bricks, not just straights as in the flat
top.
in my 50 cubic foot flat top in my home studio i have only used
the idea of the braces for the corners and the metal work, have the
same size flue that i have had for 35 years...34 square inches and then
i doubled that again up the fire box...to create a double venturi...
i still use the same stack, my old 500,000 BTUs denver fire clay burners
that are 35 years old...no forced air...no car....and i built the door
in the side of the kiln. the kiln is perfect for my needs........cone 11
in 10 hours...that i can increase to 8 hours or make it last for 12. cone
11 drops
down all together in 4 locations...it just works...
study plans, look at how people stack up bricks, how they make stacks,
get a lot of plans........then build a simple flat top...fire it well, but make
sure you make good pots to go in it.
and as i have said on many occasions........most young potters are building
kilns far too big....and that includes wood fired kilns...i would
prefer 2 small kilns...maybe a stoneware and a salt... use the same burners
for both... give yourself some variety...it helps avoid burn out to
your brain./mel jacobson/minnesota/ HCASLC (nice huh?)
Bob Pulley on tue 18 feb 97
Mel Jacobson talked about the difficulty of arches and the need for arch
bricks.
My 80 cubic ft. kiln is abut 12 years and has one arch brick in each
course, as the keystone. All others are straights with fireclay and grog
smashed between them. over all is 6-8 inches of
fireclay/vermiculite/cement castable. Cheap cheap. The arch is getting
worisomely flat, but I hope to rebuild soon.
Robert Pulley
bpulley@hsonline.net
Timothy Young on wed 19 feb 97
Speaking if kilns. Is any one out there an "expert" on kilns in general. I
live at 8300' of elevation and am having a bit of trouble getting a fiber
downdraft kiln (26 cu. ft total space, 20 cu. ft stacking space) to cone 10
in a reasonable period of time. I converted the kiln to natural gas. It had
previously been fired with propane by its previous owner. I am using the
same Eclipse, venturi type burners (2, TR80s) with the orifices drilled out
a bit. The burners may be a bit undersized(?), taking into consideration the
altitude. Can anyone provide guidelines on the # of BTUs actually needed to
fire a fiber kiln this size to cone 10 and the merits of a venturi burner
system vs a burner with forced air etc.
LOWELL BAKER on thu 20 feb 97
Timothy, You may have hit it on the head with your concern about the
size of the orfice. The small fiber kilns I have fired withnatural
draft burners are very sensitive to over reduction. If the orfice is
too large all of the heat will be in the flue due to the longer
flame. I do not know the math on this so I would simply plug the
orfices with solder and drill them out to the original size and try
to fire it again. You can also call your gas supplier and ask them
the size/pressure at your elevation to get the recommended btu from
your burner.
Lowell Baker
The University of Alabama
480- ft elevation
Marcia Selsor on thu 20 feb 97
For natural draft with venturis at 8300 ft. increase the height of your
stack. To test it, light newpaper in the flu and see if it draws. Keep
adding height 'til it does.
Marci in Montana
Timothy Young wrote:
>
> ----------------------------Original message----------------------------
> Speaking if kilns. Is any one out there an "expert" on kilns in general. I
> live at 8300' of elevation and am having a bit of trouble getting a fiber
> downdraft kiln (26 cu. ft total space, 20 cu. ft stacking space) to cone 10
> in a reasonable period of time. I converted the kiln to natural gas. It had
> previously been fired with propane by its previous owner. I am using the
> same Eclipse, venturi type burners (2, TR80s) with the orifices drilled out
> a bit. The burners may be a bit undersized(?), taking into consideration the
> altitude. Can anyone provide guidelines on the # of BTUs actually needed to
> fire a fiber kiln this size to cone 10 and the merits of a venturi burner
> system vs a burner with forced air etc.
--
Marcia Selsor
http://www.imt.net/~mjbmls/
mjbmls@imt.net
c ramberg on tue 14 oct 97
Hello,
I would like some information on how to build a propane fired kiln. If
anyone can recommend some reference sources for detailed information, or
if you have built a kiln, I would like to hear from you.
Thank you,
Christine
Vince Pitelka on wed 13 jan 99
I received an email message from Joann Quillman, Prof. of Art at Louisiana
State University - Eunice. She used to be on Clayart but isn't right now,
and she needs our help. She recently received state grant money for studio
equipment for her program at the university. She needs a new gas kiln, and
wants to bring in an experienced professional kiln builder to do it. Any
recommendations from the list. Obviously she is looking for someone with the
needed experience and qualifications who is willing to travel to Louisiana
to do the job. She needs to do this within the next few months, so a quick
response will be greatly appreciated.
You can email me privately at vpitelka@dekalb.net or you can email Joann
directly at jquillma@asbank.com
Thanks -
- Vince
Vince Pitelka - vpitelka@DeKalb.net
Home 615/597-5376, work 615/597-6801, fax 615/597-6803
Appalachian Center for Crafts
Tennessee Technological University
1560 Craft Center Drive, Smithville TN 37166
Kim Slinski on wed 24 mar 99
I was wondering if anyone had any advice or knew where I could find good
resources on kiln building. I would like to build a smallish (maybe 6
square feet) gas fired kiln. Thank you in advance.
Kim Slinski
Gretchen Zinkan on wed 24 jul 02
I am in the process of securing all the pieces I need to build myself a
kiln. I have a couple of questions.
1) I was wanting to buy 2 venturie burners...but what I am learning is that
there is really no such thing...venturie...is a design...a burner that mixes
gases together...air and propane or air and natural gas...is that accurate?
2) If I have a low pressure natural gas line...and I want to put a venturie
burner on for firing...is there a joiner/coupler thing that will create a
higher pressure for better firing?
3) If I choose to go with propane instead...how much propane does a
"typical" firing use? So what size tank should I be considering?
Thanks,
Gretchen Zinkan
Gavin Stairs on wed 24 jul 02
Dear Gretchen,
Venturi is actually the name of the Italian who discovered the curious fact
that fast moving gas has a dynamic pressure lower than slower moving gas in
the same stream. This phenomenon has since been know as the Venturi
effect. Its use in burners is to induce air to enter the burner to mix
with a small jet of fuel gas, thereafter to burn at the tip of the
diverging section of the burner. The fast moving gas jet causes the local
pressure to drop, and air rushes in to fill the vacuum. Momentum transfer
ensures that the combined gas stream flows in the intended direction, and
the flame stays at the burner tip. This arrangement is a so-called
Venturi, or naturally aspirated, burner. It is often shaped in the double
conical shape of the so-called Venturi meter, but this is not actually
necessary. The general diverging shape of the burner is to slow the gas
stream at the flame, and the length of the mixing tube is to ensure that
gas mixes well with the primary air. You can build such a burner from a
few pieces of pipe and ordinary fittings, and a drill to make holes for air
and gas. However, it is probably better for someone who is unfamiliar with
them to buy from a reputable dealer. I suggest you get in touch with Marc
Ward at Ward Burners for your requirements.
Marc Ward
Ward Burner Systems
PO Box 333
Dandridge, TN 37725
USA
423.397.2914 voice
423.397.1253 fax
wardburner@aol.com
Marc will answer all your questions and guide you to the system that will
suit your kiln, but here are a few answers to begin with.
Whichever gas you use, it is customarily supplied at a higher pressure than
you actually want at the burner. So you usually need a regulator. This is
a semi-automatic valve which reduces the pressure to a constant value which
is right for your burner. There are set-point regulators which cannot be
altered, screw adjustable regulators and one with a hand knob to permit you
to adjust the pressure to suit you own judgement. Regulators for natural
gas and propane are somewhat different, because natural gas is usually
supplied at a lower pressure than propane from a tank. Also, the pressure
at the orifice which makes the burner jet is different. The jet velocity,
and therefore the burner design may also be different, but that is less
pronounced, and the same burner will usually serve both gasses with a
change of orifice.
There is no such thing as a coupler that will increase the gas pressure in
a supply line. If you do need to increase the gas pressure, you will need
a pump, but normally there is enough pressure in the line to supply your
burners, if they have been set up properly. What you do have to do is
specify a large enough gas pipe so that the drop in pressure from the main
to the orifice is not excessive.
The amount of propane you will use depends on many things, including the
size and construction of the kiln, the way you fire it, and how full it is,
among other things. You need to decide on the size and construction of
your kiln before you can figure out how big your burners should be, and how
big a tank you will need.
All the best to you. Gavin
At 11:26 AM 24/07/2002, Gretchen Zinkan wrote:
>1) I was wanting to buy 2 venturie burners...but what I am learning is that
>there is really no such thing...venturie...is a design...a burner that mixes
>gases together...air and propane or air and natural gas...is that accurate?
>
>2) If I have a low pressure natural gas line...and I want to put a venturie
>burner on for firing...is there a joiner/coupler thing that will create a
>higher pressure for better firing?
>
>3) If I choose to go with propane instead...how much propane does a
>"typical" firing use? So what size tank should I be considering?
Hank Murrow on wed 24 jul 02
Gretchen Zinkan wrote;
>I am in the process of securing all the pieces I need to build myself a
>kiln. I have a couple of questions.
>
>1) I was wanting to buy 2 venturi burners...but what I am learning is that
>there is really no such thing...venturi...is a design...a burner that mixes
>gases together...air and propane or air and natural gas...is that accurate?
***** A Venturi burner is one whose throat design takes advantage of
Bernoulli's Law to provide a force which inspirates (draws in)
primary air in proportion to the flow of gas through the orifice. It
is not a brand, it is a strategy. Many burners are based upon this
strategy. Some are not manufactured well enough to completely exploit
this strategy.
Also, a Venturi is not a burner, a Venturi is a mixer (gas &
air) which delivers a mixture to the flame retention tips (there may
be one or more of these), where the mixture is burned. If there is
more than one flame retention tip, there is a manifold to deliver the
mixture to the tips.
I have had wonderful service from the people at Eclipse
Combustion Division, who make great
mixers and tips for natural draft. I have no interest in the company
other than using their
products. At http://www.murrow.biz/hank/kiln-and-tools.htm , you may
see my use of a single
2.5" mixer with 16 very small tips to fire a lifting fiber kiln of
about 28 cuft capacity. This
design is detailed in an article I wrote for Ceramics Monthly @
http://www.ceramicsmonthly.org/mustreads/shinofire.asp (scroll down
to the kiln article).
>2) If I have a low pressure natural gas line...and I want to put a venturi
>burner on for firing...is there a joiner/coupler thing that will create a
>higher pressure for better firing?
***** You are probably thinking of a gas regulator, which controls
the pressure from that point on in the gas line. I can't recall a
case of using a regulator to increase the pressure in a line, but
maybe Mark Ward can clarify this point for you. A typical Eclipse
mixer will operate down to around 3" (full on) water column, though
their greatest efficiency is at 10"(full on) water column. Your
pressure and expected demand will determine the size of orifice to
use.
>
>3) If I choose to go with propane instead...how much propane does a
>"typical" firing use? So what size tank should I be considering?
**** This would be determined by the size of your kiln and the way it
is constructed (brick...fiber...etc), so we'll need much more info
from you to help with this. BTW, All Eclipse mixers are available for
propane if that is your fuel of choice. How much pressure and volume
of natural gas is available at your kiln site?
Welcome to your Big Adventure, Hank
Phil Smith on wed 16 oct 02
I'm looking for gas fired kiln building plans with materials list for
the novice builder.
Any suggestions?.
Thanks.
Fredrick Paget on wed 16 oct 02
As far as I know such plans do not exist. (There is rumor of a set of plans
available from Nils Lou but if true, he does not agressively advertize
them.) There are also books but they are not terribly specific or detailed.
Now if you wanted to build a boat for instance there are thousands of plans
available and some designer - draftsmen have made a business out of selling
such plans. Also boat magazines are full of ads for them.
I wonder why some of our kiln gurus don't get busy and draw up such
detailed plans, material lists and instructions. It could be a good
business. There is money in it!
Fred Paget
>I'm looking for gas fired kiln building plans with materials list for
>the novice builder.
>Any suggestions?.
>Thanks.
From Fred Paget, Marin County, California, USA
Alan Lent Sr. on wed 16 oct 02
Fred,
I thought rather seriously of building a gas kiln for Catherine here in
Yuma. Didn't do it because of the perceived "hassle" since we live within
city limits. However I can recommend two books for you.
1. The Kiln Book by Fredrick Olsen - very good for a basic understanding of
kilns in general and lots of good info.
2. The Energy Efficient Potter by Regis C. Brodie - Has a pictorial with
parts list on how to build a 27 cuft ( 16 or 20 cuft stacking space
depending on which style you build. Don't know if kit is still available
since book was written in early 80's, but still lots of good info. This is
a fiber lined instead of brick kiln if that makes a difference to you.
Both books were acquired at www.half.com at very reasonable prices.
Hope this helps
Alan in Yuma
Going to put 300 mi on the bike tomorrow!!
----- Original Message -----
From: "Fredrick Paget"
To:
Sent: Wednesday, October 16, 2002 11:59 AM
Subject: Re: kiln building
> As far as I know such plans do not exist. (There is rumor of a set of
plans
> available from Nils Lou but if true, he does not agressively advertize
> them.) There are also books but they are not terribly specific or
detailed.
>
> Now if you wanted to build a boat for instance there are thousands of
plans
> available and some designer - draftsmen have made a business out of
selling
> such plans. Also boat magazines are full of ads for them.
>
> I wonder why some of our kiln gurus don't get busy and draw up such
> detailed plans, material lists and instructions. It could be a good
> business. There is money in it!
> Fred Paget
>
>
> >I'm looking for gas fired kiln building plans with materials list for
> >the novice builder.
> >Any suggestions?.
> >Thanks.
>
> From Fred Paget, Marin County, California, USA
>
>
____________________________________________________________________________
__
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
melpots@pclink.com.
>
Don Jung on thu 17 oct 02
There seems to be several people asking about kiln building plans and
venturi burners as well. I would also include Nils Lou's Art of Firing book.
In the back, there are plans for a small (~3x3x4)flat top kiln (Oregon Flat
Top). Olsen's book is good, but the treatment of flues and chimneys is much
better by Nils. There's a number of kiln plans actually right on the web...
some lack a bit of specific instructions though. The books are better. Just
do a search for kilns, kiln plans, etc.
On venturi burners... look for Ward Burners at www.wardburner.comYou can
also build your own from pipe fittings. Quite easy actually, but you should
be comfortable with building things.
Best regards,
Don Jung
Eddie Krieger on fri 18 oct 02
Alan in Yuma,
Thanks for the half.com tip. I found both books and ordered both. I even
saved some money on the Olsen book--the new edition.
Eddie Krieger
Abilene, Tx
aharon on thu 16 sep 04
hello from israel
my name is aharon
i am looking for directions
i want to build a kiln
my aime is to melt glass and then poor it into molds and then anneal the
glass
.
i tried to build a kiln based on wood but the fire was too strong i just
couldent controld her
it was build out of mud briks and metal bars
in the end the mettel melted as well as the briks(i had a good draft)
can u help me build an electric kiln sketches and drowing
thank u very much
i was looking for books on the subjects in israel but ther are non
i made an order by familly but they will arive here in tow month from now
agane thnk u very much for any help
aharon
Rick Bonomo on wed 10 may 06
For those folks who may be interested in a kiln building project to =
accomodate a Geil DLB-12
Click here for the plan:
http://www.ricks-bricks.com/kilnplan.htm
Click here for the execution:
http://www.ricks-bricks.com/kilnlog.htm
Rick Bonomo
http://www.ricks-bricks.com/
Weiland, Jeff on tue 18 sep 07
For those of you who eat up kiln building info and pictures, paste this
link to Kokomo Glass rebuilding their glass kiln a couple of years ago.
Great stuff!!!
=20
www.kog.com/Rebuild/rebuild-main.html
=20
Jeff Weiland
Greenfield-Central High School
810 North Broadway
Greenfield, Indiana 46140
317-462-9211
jweiland@gcsc.k12.in.us
=20
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