Cathy Nelson Hartman on mon 25 mar 96
---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Sun, 24 Mar 1996 10:53:05 -0600 (CST)
From: Cathy Nelson Hartman
To: listserv@ukcc.uky.edu
Subject: Kiln firing
I'm looking for advice on evening out the temperature range in a 60 cu. ft.
downdraft kiln. Four homemade forced draft burners (like in Rhodes book).
Chimney about 6 ft. above the top of my kiln. No pyrometer, no gauges-all
pretty basic. I have a cone and a half differential with the top the hotter.
I need to get at least the half cone increased. The question I want to raise
is whether dampering back will force the heat downward to even out the
temperature. I have tried a couple of times but it seemed to have the
opposite effect-the top seemed to speed up. But usually I have done the
dampering late in the firing-cone 8 tipping in top. I fire in oxidation
so my damper is usually wide open throughout normally. Damper earlier?
I will appreciate hearing from anyone who has had any similar
experiences.
Walter Hartman
jonpjon@ibm.net on tue 26 mar 96
Hi Walter,
a one and a half cone difference in a 60 ft. downdraft doesn`t seem all
that bad.If the difference was larger I would suggest that you check out
the chimney height and diameter and flue sizes to make sure that you
have sufficient draft. The symptom of lack of draft would be a hotter
top, but I would expect a bigger difference.
In my opinion using the damper would tend to concentrate the flames
in the top,you could use the damper to lessen the draft which would
cure the opposite situation, a hot bottom.
With such a small difference in top to bottom temp.(about 25 dC.)
you should be able to adjust either by the stacking, make sure there
is enough room under the bottom shelf for the flames to pass and that
the area in front of the exit flue is not too crowded; or by lowering
the height of the bag wall or opening more holes in it (assuming you use
a bag wall) The main thing is that it takes a few firings to get
the "fine tuning" right.
Good luck happy firing Jon Pettyjohn Manila
jonpjon@ibm.net
------------------------Original message----------------------------
>>>>>>>I'm looking for advice on evening out the temperature range in a
60 cu. ft. downdraft kiln. Four homemade forced draft burners (like in
Rhodes book). Chimney about 6 ft. above the top of my kiln. No
pyrometer, no gauges-all pretty basic. I have a cone and a half
differential with the top the hotter. I need to get at least the half
cone increased. The question I want to raise is whether dampering back
will force the heat downward to even out the temperature. I have tried a
couple of times but it seemed to have the opposite effect-the top seemed
to speed up. But usually I have done the dampering late in the
firing-cone 8 tipping in top. I fire in oxidation so my damper is
usually wide open throughout normally. Damper earlier? I will appreciate
hearing from anyone who has had any similar experiences.
Walter Hartman<<<<<<<<<<<
Bob Kavanagh on tue 26 mar 96
Good morning Walter
Without knowing specifics I would suggest: somewhat higher chimney to
increase draw; open your bag wall a little get more heat and flow into the
bottom of your kiln early; maybe alter the placing of the shelves on the
bottom of your kiln so that they are just above the exit flue; try
channeling underneath your bottom shelve to control how your gases exit the
kiln; if clean fire is important to you, do other things before you dampen
your kiln.
b.
>----------------------------Original message----------------------------
>
>
>---------- Forwarded message ----------
>Date: Sun, 24 Mar 1996 10:53:05 -0600 (CST)
>From: Cathy Nelson Hartman
>To: listserv@ukcc.uky.edu
>Subject: Kiln firing
>
>I'm looking for advice on evening out the temperature range in a 60 cu. ft.
>downdraft kiln. Four homemade forced draft burners (like in Rhodes book).
>Chimney about 6 ft. above the top of my kiln. No pyrometer, no gauges-all
>pretty basic. I have a cone and a half differential with the top the hotter.
>I need to get at least the half cone increased. The question I want to raise
>is whether dampering back will force the heat downward to even out the
>temperature. I have tried a couple of times but it seemed to have the
>opposite effect-the top seemed to speed up. But usually I have done the
>dampering late in the firing-cone 8 tipping in top. I fire in oxidation
>so my damper is usually wide open throughout normally. Damper earlier?
>I will appreciate hearing from anyone who has had any similar
>experiences.
>
>Walter Hartman
Kathy McDonald on tue 26 mar 96
At 10:16 PM 3/25/96 EST, you wrote:
>----------------------------Original message----------------------------
>
>
>---------- Forwarded message ----------
>Date: Sun, 24 Mar 1996 10:53:05 -0600 (CST)
>From: Cathy Nelson Hartman
>To: listserv@ukcc.uky.edu
>Subject: Kiln firing
>
>I'm looking for advice on evening out the temperature range in a 60 cu. ft.
>downdraft kiln. Four homemade forced draft burners (like in Rhodes book).
>Chimney about 6 ft. above the top of my kiln. No pyrometer, no gauges-all
>pretty basic. I have a cone and a half differential with the top the hotter.
>I need to get at least the half cone increased. The question I want to raise
>is whether dampering back will force the heat downward to even out the
>temperature. I have tried a couple of times but it seemed to have the
>opposite effect-the top seemed to speed up. But usually I have done the
>dampering late in the firing-cone 8 tipping in top. I fire in oxidation
>so my damper is usually wide open throughout normally. Damper earlier?
>I will appreciate hearing from anyone who has had any similar
>experiences.
>
>Walter Hartman
>
Walter,
I had similiar probs several years ago with my own homemade kiln.
I finally, in desperation added some height to the chimney...
that really improved the draw and evened out the top/ bottom probs.
I'm no expert so lets see what other have to say.
Kathy McDonald
mcdonaldk@docker.com
WardBurner@aol.com on tue 26 mar 96
Walter,
Your problem is most likely in your bag wall configuration not the damper.
Think of bag walls as rocks in a stream and the flame as the water. Your
getting most of your flame (heat) to go up. Open your bag walls and/or lower
them a course and see what happens. Place cones throughout the kiln so you
can monitor what's going on. It may take a coupla tries to get it evened out.
Bag Walls direct the current, Dampers are like damns that hold back the
current to pressurize and slow the flow. If you're still having problems,
give me a call...
Marc Ward
Ward Burner Systems
PO Box 333
Dandridge, TN 37725
423.397.2914 voice
423.397.1253 fax
wardburner@aol.com
Walter wrote:
<<<<ft.
downdraft kiln. Four homemade forced draft burners (like in Rhodes book).
Chimney about 6 ft. above the top of my kiln. No pyrometer, no gauges-all
pretty basic. I have a cone and a half differential with the top the hotter.
I need to get at least the half cone increased. The question I want to raise
is whether dampering back will force the heat downward to even out the
temperature. I have tried a couple of times but it seemed to have the
opposite effect-the top seemed to speed up. But usually I have done the
dampering late in the firing-cone 8 tipping in top. I fire in oxidation
so my damper is usually wide open throughout normally. Damper earlier?
I will appreciate hearing from anyone who has had any similar
experiences.
Walter Hartman>>>>
Leanne on tue 26 mar 96
Hi all -
I'd try cutting back on the gas slightly and opening the primaries more
(secondary air, too). This keeps the temp at the top from climbing, and
give the bottom time to catch up. (Opening the primaries makes the flame
burn hotter at the bottom.) If the color starts to change on the top (ie,
gets redder), then you've turned the gas down too far. Good luck!
Leanne
P.S. There is clay in Texas, too!!!
>I'm looking for advice on evening out the temperature range in a 60 cu. ft.
>downdraft kiln. Four homemade forced draft burners (like in Rhodes book).
>Chimney about 6 ft. above the top of my kiln. No pyrometer, no gauges-all
>pretty basic. I have a cone and a half differential with the top the hotter.
>I need to get at least the half cone increased. The question I want to raise
>is whether dampering back will force the heat downward to even out the
>temperature. I have tried a couple of times but it seemed to have the
>opposite effect-the top seemed to speed up. But usually I have done the
>dampering late in the firing-cone 8 tipping in top. I fire in oxidation
>so my damper is usually wide open throughout normally. Damper earlier?
>I will appreciate hearing from anyone who has had any similar
>experiences.
_______________________________
_______________________________
Dave Eitel on tue 26 mar 96
>----------------------------Original message----------------------------
>
>
>---------- Forwarded message ----------
>Date: Sun, 24 Mar 1996 10:53:05 -0600 (CST)
>From: Cathy Nelson Hartman
>To: listserv@ukcc.uky.edu
>Subject: Kiln firing
>
>I'm looking for advice on evening out the temperature range in a 60 cu. ft.
>downdraft kiln. Four homemade forced draft burners (like in Rhodes book).
>Chimney about 6 ft. above the top of my kiln. No pyrometer, no gauges-all
>pretty basic. I have a cone and a half differential with the top the hotter.
>I need to get at least the half cone increased. The question I want to raise
>is whether dampering back will force the heat downward to even out the
>temperature. I have tried a couple of times but it seemed to have the
>opposite effect-the top seemed to speed up. But usually I have done the
>dampering late in the firing-cone 8 tipping in top. I fire in oxidation
>so my damper is usually wide open throughout normally. Damper earlier?
>I will appreciate hearing from anyone who has had any similar
>experiences.
>
>Walter Hartman
First, your chimney seems quite a bit too short. Increase it to about 16'.
I think that might improve the draw and pull heat down from the top. Or,
soak for a longer period at the end, so the heat has a chance to even out.
If you could soak for a half hour or so that would probably help. I'll be
interested toread other responses.
Dave...waiting patiently for over-the-counter rogaine
Dave Eitel
Cedar Creek Pottery
Cedarburg, WI
daveitel@execpc.com
Cobalt1994@aol.com on tue 26 mar 96
Here's my kiln dilemma:
After getting lazy about firing evenly, I made an effort, and got to the
point in my 36 cu. foot downdraft Brookfield(4 venturi propane burners) where
It's pretty even at the cone packs in front, but always hotter in the middle
of the middle( midway front to back, midway top to bottom. The last firing
cone 10 was bending TMB and My glaze was slightly underfired in the back top
and bottom, slightly overfired in the middle/middle. If I move the bag walls
either way I make top or bottom even more underfired while correcting the
problem somewhere else. I need a way to heat up the bottom, while raising the
bagwalls to get the top hotter. Hopeless: right?
---------------------------------------------------
Jennifer in Vermont
email: Cobalt1994@aol.com
snail: Jennifer Boyer
Thistle Hill Pottery
HCR 32 Box 755
Montpelier, Vt. 05602
Voice: 802-223-8926
Fax: 802-223-1180
---------------------------------------------------
WardBurner@aol.com on tue 26 mar 96
Walter,
I see you've been getting quite a few suggestions about your uneven kiln....
I'll put 2 more cents in about this. First, I'm sorry if I embarrass anyone
by squashing their well meant advice.
Your chimney height is not an issue. Chimney height helps provide draft.
You have forced draft burners making chimney height a mute point. All you
need is enough height to exhaust the flue gases from the shed or building. I
have a 120 cubic foot downdraft w/forced air and have a 9' chimney.
I saw a reference that a cone and a half difference is no big deal. I see
no reason to settle for such a difference. A kiln can and should be even
(within a half cone is not really even).
Again feel free to give me a call if you don't know where to go with this
info. Good Luck....
Marc Ward
Ward Burner Systems
PO Box 333
Dandridge, TN 37725
423.397.2914 voice
423.397.1253 fax
wardburner@aol.com
>I'm looking for advice on evening out the temperature range in a 60 cu. ft.
>downdraft kiln. Four homemade forced draft burners (like in Rhodes book).
>Chimney about 6 ft. above the top of my kiln. No pyrometer, no gauges-all
>pretty basic. I have a cone and a half differential with the top the hotter.
>I need to get at least the half cone increased. The question I want to raise
>is whether dampering back will force the heat downward to even out the
>temperature. I have tried a couple of times but it seemed to have the
>opposite effect-the top seemed to speed up. But usually I have done the
>dampering late in the firing-cone 8 tipping in top. I fire in oxidation
>so my damper is usually wide open throughout normally. Damper earlier?
>I will appreciate hearing from anyone who has had any similar
>experiences.
>
>Walter Hartman
BobWicks@aol.com on tue 26 mar 96
Dave:
There are at least three ways to make the temperature even throughout your
kiln. The concept is that the tip of the flame is where most of the heat is
produced so you must learn to control the length of the flame. Making the
flame longer will heat the upper part of the kiln more than where it is
presently. I would suggest the following actions:
Lengthening the flame will heat the upper portions of the kiln and shortening
the flame will heat the lower portion of the kiln. By closing the damper
down as you indicate will give you a reduction condition and therefore a
lower temperature. I have a question as to whether it will even out the temp
from top to bottom. Leaving your damper in a average condition try the below
suggestions.
1. Since the length of the flame is controled by changing the air/gas
mixture, try to decrease the air blower, leaving the gas pressure constant.
This will lengthen the flame and make the upper part of the kiln hotter.
2. Leave the air pressure constant and increase the gas pressure and this
will also make the upper part of the kiln hotter by lengthening the flame.
3. Use a combination of both one one and two. Decrease the air and increase
the gas to make the flame longer.
I hope I'm not telling you something you already know but I'm not familiar
with your backgtound. Try this out and get back to me. I do some
consulting on this for a ceramic equipment company.
Bob
tom gray on wed 27 mar 96
------ =_NextPart_000_01BB1B79.89C36F60
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8BIT
When I go fishing I try to think like a fish- when I fire my kiln(s) I try to
think like a flame. At least until I get the bugs out. Look at Marc Wards
analogy in response to anothers kiln firing problems. I know this is an over
simplification- but try & visualize where you want the flames to go & make
necessary adjustments (minor).
I fire most of our work in a MODIFIED Minn. flat top w/ 2 big bertha torches w/
drilled out orifices. I have found (for me) that cutting back on the variables
makes firing much simpler, ie. 2 burners w/ all air controled by the damper.
This is only the 3rd. kiln I have built- but the 1st. 2 taught me a lot. In
other words they fired like trash & I can't afford to lose very many pots so I
decided to make life simple & build a simple kiln! This one has a maximum 3/4
cone spread. It isn't perfect- but it fires the same every time & our glazes
don't suffer over this high a spread.
One more thing- flames are always looking for the easiest way OUT of a kiln. A
hot middle is usually indicative of too much draft. The flames rise to top of
bagwall & scream toward the exit flue. A cold back kind of indicates the speed
at which the flames are moving also.
Look forward to hearing what the power burner folks have to say about this!
Marc?
Tom Gray
Seagrove,N.C.
----------
From: Cobalt1994@aol.com[SMTP:Cobalt1994@aol.com]
Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 1996 11:50 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list CLAYART
Subject: Re: Kiln firing (fwd)
----------------------------Original message----------------------------
Here's my kiln dilemma:
After getting lazy about firing evenly, I made an effort, and got to the
point in my 36 cu. foot downdraft Brookfield(4 venturi propane burners) where
It's pretty even at the cone packs in front, but always hotter in the middle
of the middle( midway front to back, midway top to bottom. The last firing
cone 10 was bending TMB and My glaze was slightly underfired in the back top
and bottom, slightly overfired in the middle/middle. If I move the bag
------ =_NextPart_000_01BB1B79.89C36F60
Content-Type: application/ms-tnef
Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
eJ8+IjEGAQaQCAAEAAAAAAABAAEAAQeQBgAIAAAA5AQAAAAAAADoAAENgAQAAgAAAAIAAgABBJAG
ACwBAAABAAAADAAAAAMAADADAAAACwAPDgAAAAACAf8PAQAAAE4AAAAAAAAAgSsfpL6jEBmdbgDd
AQ9UAgAAAABDZXJhbWljIEFydHMgRGlzY3Vzc2lvbiBMaXN0AFNNVFAAQ0xBWUFSVEBMU1YuVUtZ
LkVEVQAAAB4AAjABAAAABQAAAFNNVFAAAAAAHgADMAEAAAAUAAAAQ0xBWUFSVEBMU1YuVUtZLkVE
VQADABUMAQAAAAMA/g8GAAAAHgABMAEAAAAfAAAAJ0NlcmFtaWMgQXJ0cyBEaXNjdXNzaW9uIExp
c3QnAAACAQswAQAAABkAAABTTVRQOkNMQVlBUlRATFNWLlVLWS5FRFUAAAAAAwAAOQAAAAALAEA6
AQAAAAIB9g8BAAAABAAAAAAAAAM6NQEIgAcAGAAAAElQTS5NaWNyb3NvZnQgTWFpbC5Ob3RlADEI
AQSAAQAWAAAAUkU6IEtpbG4gZmlyaW5nIChmd2QpANAGAQWAAwAOAAAAzAcDABsAAQAFACUAAwAf
AQEggAMADgAAAMwHAwAbAAAAKAAgAAMAPAEBCYABACEAAABDQjc3RDU0NTY4ODdDRjExQjhFRDAw
NjA4Q0M5QTcxRgBMBwEDkAYAQAkAABIAAAALACMAAAAAAAMAJgAAAAAACwApAAAAAAADADYAAAAA
AEAAOQCgdnVroxu7AR4AcAABAAAAFgAAAFJFOiBLaWxuIGZpcmluZyAoZndkKQAAAAIBcQABAAAA
FgAAAAG7G6NrdUXVd8yHaBHPuO0AYIzJpx8AAB4AHgwBAAAABQAAAFNNVFAAAAAAHgAfDAEAAAAV
AAAAdGdyYXlwb3RzQGF0b21pYy5uZXQAAAAAAwAGEJDkX3YDAAcQ7AcAAB4ACBABAAAAZQAAAFdI
RU5JR09GSVNISU5HSVRSWVRPVEhJTktMSUtFQUZJU0gtV0hFTklGSVJFTVlLSUxOKFMpSVRSWVRP
VEhJTktMSUtFQUZMQU1FQVRMRUFTVFVOVElMSUdFVFRIRUJVR1NPVVQAAAAAAgEJEAEAAADDBwAA
vwcAAP8MAABMWkZ1zZYirf8ACgEPAhUCqAXrAoMAUALyCQIAY2gKwHNldDI3BgAGwwKDMgPFAgBw
ckJxEeJzdGVtAoMzdwLkBxMCgH0KgAjPCdk78RYPMjU1AoAKgQ2xC2DgbmcxMDMUUAsKFFFFC/Jj
AEAgV2gJ8CBASSBnbyBmBABoxQuAZxsxdHJ5HCAbcAJ0G8FrIGxpa2XEIGEbgy0gdxsEG5ApFhAg
bRxQawMQbii8cykcDx0VC2AHgC4UsJEFQGxlYRPAIHUCMB8DERtBEcAckR0wYnVniwQgCGB0IPBM
b28c4OphBUBNCsBjGuALEQQgswBwB0BvZx+AC4AgFhC8c3ACIBGwH5IAcG8iYd8RoB6zHjIb0hNQ
bwJgE+D2cyDwG0BrJfAH4ByhBCBTKGEDkW92BJAgAJBt0wtQBpBpYyOQaQIgHbBHIqAiQR9xJiB2
BAB1uQdAaXodMB3RHmF5CGD/HcAAcCJEIKMEIB+hG2EqwNsAwB0hbgWQB5BzCsAfgPBhZGp1E8AH
gAIwBCDMKG0LgAWwKS4KhR4msm8hcW9mIuEFwHcFsAcc4CTxHVBNT0RJRthJRUQF0AuAbiDwGOFJ
IkFvcB3ALyAR4GL6aRvwYgSQHKAdUB+gI+BXGwAEIDORZAUQbCFAZP8i4iLgBoEpsAeQJ7IRgCkA
6xuACGBuNaAoAhAFwAeAdx8gNFEFQGMjACHAG+Fi7wDQHOACICJTdgrABzAnYc8EIC2iBCAmxW11
EXApNP0EkCwk4CDhM8EIcC3wJkH/M5EHQAMgC3AFwAWgAjADYK01gmIfgSJxZCDAcASQWyDwCoVU
KFUCIGw+JDO/CyAg8CZzNqUioAMQdColvSJxMRPAPAIBkCKwaAVA7weAHUEVoCMRSSjRJhIxYv8k
QSJhH4AeQjWgHQMfYCFgTzswKsAbQCnAbicFQGH/DdBEoR+SFaAlgSkBH4ADgXcfgCVQLyFzG3Ab
QAWBaf8NsEdDLaMpgR0wO1QqsUGS7zWgHVBKdR7CIT9kAiAdMJcRgCRRLZF4B3B1bUBwfC80PWJK
URNQIVBAoUlfBUAEAEayPrFKQGNB1WmfBUAeQkTTKTAgwSBlR+PvIcBDYSrAMTJnC2ArUAQg/mQC
IEbBKwAN0CkRKPMoQ98bwEMgS1JOZAqFT0yxBGB7HmEcomcdsCy1CsAdMWz/LCATsEOhI2Ab0jeC
ImIhUc8IkCFxV2FVgFVUMPIdUL8ewiDxNrAmAB6ASVBkSrHfKGEuwCsRQBELgGQpszbh/zEBH6BJ
sTsSNUBG8CMRP3C/LJcFECWEM1IxATjQZywg/z0BKsAE8SFQTaAfoCwgRzL/WIJNYFBBCkFaQhWB
PfE44v9X4TWhMRBb5VCWPrA1kSOR/x3QKbA7MCx5VwIEYCrgG+H/B0BI0C/GI0M3gWCUG3AbAL85
oRvhHdAzIiJxJVB3KRHzPEQ3AWxrVCE20h+hLkC/LnEG4EITBABMMCPCPwqF0z8GA3AgR0YAeQqF
BmCHX3ADYCkALE4uQz7nIwqLHQAxODAC0WkteDE0NA3wDNBwowtZMZ42CqADYBPQT7AgLXLHrwqH
cXsMMHJGRgNhOnPOO3JGDIIgCFA40EHAMTlQOTRAYQbwLgWgbUBbU01UUDp3j21+XXNvdH0GYAIw
da92u1R1ClBzPoB5O8AjwjswMhY2O8B34TZCcDE6NfAwIFBNej90fWzwfH/5drtNdUHABSBKsRYQ
SUA+cAiQLxIxAR0AIXFDTGBBWUFSVIBfe051nGJqT6GCf3a7UmWI8MZLJok3cHdkKW7Pb9N8MzZx
RxpFck+Pr3LAT/0FEGcLgAdAN7EuMSIgj9/rkpkKhUgroSc6ER6kNTDXAxAT4ADAOgqFQQGAKRH/
IiE4g1JxauYmxVFRQAE7wP8bQADADbAosg3BFbE7wABw/zWgG2AzMiJSCoUlUAuATuH/A6AekY2A
OEEy4SNQBUBS0OZ3N0BdYiBCA2AjYBuQ2mVLMChN4JgBdAhxJyK/CrBMsTxFHyArgy/WdJRR/05h
AkAfgJfyI4IiYk4DCrD/OPAocSahA2ACMDvAKkJXRf9agZYSJPEiYlrECoVckqRX/ihaslkyooMf
kjjSO8CmRf8zUqcSo7EDcF2kC2AhcSbE/wqFTgMZMCwRBCA0IFvxG+H4VE1CmYMF0B+AUmOq0/5z
HQBDIUARNzFPcUVTpBX/ONMzUQqFmZKohDvArQco8vut61rEL1rEJ7ExEJhxKPHXrmVoYTzxcwqF
ZVAwRFP/WUGYY0XCXwJpUaiToNRV0/+tmWSBSrEFoYThOIOaSSdE/0jBB4ArhJ1wEbAnsi3wZCL/
WSNn1CGBqDEicq/1uDRGAP8EALkMX2UtBCI1M1KjpCDw/kgzYJ1wLiGI8JDxQzBsBu+Sn8OfxK8K
hUoJ8AMAU2L9JPFWBJAEYAIwtGYAwAMQe4jweQ9tCoVPEMfzxihC/G95BJAKhcuYP3KtUB0wPkg1
YYAgo7NtZsuYSEOOUkBwEeDK4HggNxhQvc2PTQIhwUEIkTvAViMR1DA1jZAyCoVWmvAuEAOI8HAw
Mi0yMjMt7Dg5f0AKhUZNUMohrBD/0rZ/0HAwwi/WL9c/cvyMLy+NP45MCoUVMQDc4AADABAQAAAA
AAMAERAAAAAAQAAHMOA4TeqfG7sBQAAIMOA4TeqfG7sBHgA9AAEAAAAFAAAAUkU6IAAAAADxDw==
------ =_NextPart_000_01BB1B79.89C36F60--
Ron Roy on wed 27 mar 96
I can't remember who gave it to me but the best advice I ever got about
making a kiln fire more evenly was to direct flame to the cold and/or under
reduced areas. I have arranged my bag walls and flue and now have an even
(24 cu ft) firing at cone 10 R using atmospheric burners.
RR
| |
|
