don jung on thu 15 aug 96
Hi folks, I was hoping to get a bit of advice from those with some
experience with Kiln vents. I'm looking into getting a permanent
bottom mounted exhaust vent like the Orton or Skutt systems. We have
two locally made electrics that need this addition. They're square
with about an interior of 24x24x24. Currently the kiln room is fitted
with a large ceiling exhaust fan that works well, but the heat and
fumes still travel out of the kiln through whatever opening is
available through the air and on up/out.
So my questions are, what's available, and which one is better? Any
gotchas?
Your info is much appreciated.
thx Don Jung
in sunny Vancouver
Vince Pitelka on fri 16 aug 96
At 08:22 PM 8/15/96 -0400, you wrote:
>----------------------------Original message----------------------------
>Hi folks, I was hoping to get a bit of advice from those with some
>experience with Kiln vents. We have
>two locally made electrics that need this addition. They're square
>with about an interior of 24x24x24.
Don -
Sounds to me like the Bailey kiln vent would be the most ideal for your
application. Why pay for two separate systems? A single Bailey unit will
handle two kilns of the size you mention, and the installation is so simple.
Good luck.
- Vince
Vince Pitelka - vpitelka@Dekalb.Net
Phone - home 615/597-5376, work 615/597-6801
Appalachian Center for Crafts, Smithville TN 37166
don jung on fri 16 aug 96
On Fri, 16 Aug 1996 10:27:38 EDT you wrote:
>----------------------------Original message----------------------------
>At 08:22 PM 8/15/96 -0400, you wrote:
>>----------------------------Original message----------------------------
>>Hi folks, I was hoping to get a bit of advice from those with some
>>experience with Kiln vents. We have
>>two locally made electrics that need this addition. They're square
>>with about an interior of 24x24x24.
>
>Don -
>Sounds to me like the Bailey kiln vent would be the most ideal for your
>application. Why pay for two separate systems? A single Bailey unit will
>handle two kilns of the size you mention, and the installation is so simple.
>Good luck.
>
> - Vince
>
>Vince -
Excellent idea, I was just looking into the Bailey...
I understand the Bailey connects to the bottom venting hole. Will
this produce an uneven firing by drawing the gases through one side
instead of down the center? It does seem attractive though...no
drilling through the bottom...no raising of the kiln to fit the motor.
Does a hole still need to be drilled on the top to allow a controlled
air flow in?
thanks again for the speedy response.
Don
in cooler and cloudier Vancouver
Anne McFadden on sat 17 aug 96
>Excellent idea, I was just looking into the Bailey...
>I understand the Bailey connects to the bottom venting hole. Will
>this produce an uneven firing by drawing the gases through one side
>instead of down the center? It does seem attractive though...no
>drilling through the bottom...no raising of the kiln to fit the motor.
> Does a hole still need to be drilled on the top to allow a controlled
>air flow in?
Hi again, don -
Just to clarify....
the bailey vent does NOT connect to the bottom venting hole. A hole
is drilled into the side of the kiln, toward the bottom. ...and
that's the only hole that needs to be drilled.
The motor for the system is attached to the wall and it vents outside
through a metal dryer vent.
The fan is on a timer.
Firing is more even throughout the kiln.
Anne
ANT KAR on tue 3 jun 97
Could someone please inform me how to get into the archives. Cindy told
me to check back articles for kiln venting information there, but I don't
know how to access that area. I've never used this listserv program B4
and don't know how to get around very well yet. Any help would be
appreciated!
Thanks,
Karen
DS6NJ on sat 16 may 98
Hello......I have an electric kiln that I need to vent. I was wondering if
it's possible to vent with a stove hood vent. The kind that you use when
dinner burns. If so, suggestions would be appreciated. I am a hobby potter and
fire pretty infrequently so I'm looking for something inexpensive and
uncomplicated. As an aside, I really appreciate all the sharing and time spent
from people in clay. Thanks........Donna
B. Tate on wed 21 apr 99
I posted 2 days ago so sorry if this repeats. I have a garage studio below =
where
I live. I fire a small Cress FX23 electric kiln during the nite and return =
to
the studio once it has cooled down about once every 3 weeks.
With regard to venting...the garage has one wall open to the outside with a =
mesh
metal gate that has alot of circulation. From what I can tell there is no =
other
way out for fumes. Do you think there is a possibility fumes can seep thru a
roof, insulation and floor to my apt?
Thank you--Beth Tate
John Baymore on fri 23 apr 99
------------------
(snip)
.........I fire a small Cress FX23 electric kiln during the nite and return
to the studio once it has cooled down about once every 3 weeks. With
regard to venting...the garage has one wall open to the outside with a mesh
metal gate that has alot of circulation. From what I can tell there is no
other way out for fumes. Do you think there is a possibility fumes can seep
thru a roof, insulation and floor to my apt?
(snip)
Beth,
First of all please see my other posting on the other venting question.
Lots of general good infor that relates too.
The problem with the effluent form a kiln is that it has some
=22directionality=22 to it. The gases are generally hot and therefore less
dense than typical room air. So they tend to rise to the upper part of the
room. In fact, way back in the =22good old days=22 foundry's used this idea=
to
help protect the workers by having tall open buildings with room for =22fume
stratification=22 above the workers heads. Better than nothing..... but not
much =3Cg=3E.
Unless the roof of the garage is exceptional in it's construction, the
gases can go right through every little crack and seam. How much of this
stuff actually WILL is another question.
If the opening in the one wall goes right up to the top of the line where
the roof is (no pocket to collect hot gases) than the odds are the vast
preponderance are spilling right out that wall.
Best,
.....................john
John Baymore
River Bend Pottery
22 Riverbend Way
Wilton, NH 03086 USA
603-654-2752
JBaymore=40Compuserve.com
Tom Wirt on sat 24 apr 99
There's another issue re: kiln venting, that I haven't seen touched on in
this or other venting threads. I had it happen with a Bailey vent where
there is a small hole in the side of the kiln to draw out the air. Over
time (maybe 1-1/2 years) that hole got mostly filled with "crud" - a
technical terms for unknown material of icky appearance (another technical
term). It appeared to be what I would imagine condensation of bisque firing
fumes might be along with some IFB dust.
What happens with other vents, I don't know, but the point is, after some
time, you should recheck the draw of your vent to make sure it's still doing
what it should be.
Tom Wirt,
Clay Coyote Pottery
17614 240th St.
Hutchinson, MN 55350
320-587-2599 fax 320-234-6849
claypot@hutchtel.net
-----Original Message-----
From: John Baymore
To: CLAYART@LSV.UKY.EDU
Date: Friday, April 23, 1999 7:50 AM
Subject: Kiln Venting
----------------------------Original message----------------------------
------------------
(snip)
.........I fire a small Cress FX23 electric kiln during the nite and return
to the studio once it has cooled down about once every 3 weeks. With
regard to venting...the garage has one wall open to the outside with a mesh
metal gate that has alot of circulation. From what I can tell there is no
other way out for fumes. Do you think there is a possibility fumes can seep
thru a roof, insulation and floor to my apt?
(snip)
Beth,
First of all please see my other posting on the other venting question.
Lots of general good infor that relates too.
The problem with the effluent form a kiln is that it has some
"directionality" to it. The gases are generally hot and therefore less
dense than typical room air. So they tend to rise to the upper part of the
room. In fact, way back in the "good old days" foundry's used this idea to
help protect the workers by having tall open buildings with room for "fume
stratification" above the workers heads. Better than nothing..... but not
much .
Unless the roof of the garage is exceptional in it's construction, the
gases can go right through every little crack and seam. How much of this
stuff actually WILL is another question.
If the opening in the one wall goes right up to the top of the line where
the roof is (no pocket to collect hot gases) than the odds are the vast
preponderance are spilling right out that wall.
Best,
.....................john
John Baymore
River Bend Pottery
22 Riverbend Way
Wilton, NH 03086 USA
603-654-2752
JBaymore@Compuserve.com
Cameron Harman on sat 24 apr 99
John Baymore has given the definitive answer as far as a room with
one open wall is concerned. An open wall is no help. People have
died while trying to barbecue in the garage because there is no
safe way out for the gasses, they can get blown right back in, you
need circulation.
Good job, John.
Cameron
--
**********************************************************
Cameron G. Harman, Jr. 215-245-4040 fax 215-638-1812
e-mail kilns@kilnman.com
Ceramic Services, Inc 1060 Park Ave. Bensalem, PA 19020
get your free ezine: http://www.kilnman.com/ezine/ezine.html
THE place for total kiln and drier support
**********************************************************
ELIZABETH JACOBS on sun 25 apr 99
Yet another kiln venting issue... For years I had the envirovent (under the
kiln) and would use it when I was candleing (sp) the kiln.
After about two years of firing once a week, the fan rotted out. I was told by
the manufacturer that I shouldn't use it while candleing because the combination
of the heat, moisture, and clay minerals create a sulfuric acid that eats away
the metal vent system. Yikes!
So, I bought a second envirovent and used it for about 4 years, but never
candled with it, then it too eventually rotted away. Since I was unable to just
buy and replace the rotted fan blades, I decided to try the Vent a kiln ( over
lid) and it works just fine.
I also fire at night with the computer controller so as to avoid any
unsucked fumes...
Elizabeth
Tom Wirt wrote:
> ----------------------------Original message----------------------------
> There's another issue re: kiln venting, that I haven't seen touched on in
> this or other venting threads. I had it happen with a Bailey vent where
> there is a small hole in the side of the kiln to draw out the air. Over
> time (maybe 1-1/2 years) that hole got mostly filled with "crud" - a
> technical terms for unknown material of icky appearance (another technical
> term). It appeared to be what I would imagine condensation of bisque firing
> fumes might be along with some IFB dust.
>
> What happens with other vents, I don't know, but the point is, after some
> time, you should recheck the draw of your vent to make sure it's still doing
> what it should be.
>
> Tom Wirt,
> Clay Coyote Pottery
> 17614 240th St.
> Hutchinson, MN 55350
> 320-587-2599 fax 320-234-6849
> claypot@hutchtel.net
> -----Original Message-----
> From: John Baymore
> To: CLAYART@LSV.UKY.EDU
> Date: Friday, April 23, 1999 7:50 AM
> Subject: Kiln Venting
>
> ----------------------------Original message----------------------------
> ------------------
> (snip)
>
> .........I fire a small Cress FX23 electric kiln during the nite and return
> to the studio once it has cooled down about once every 3 weeks. With
> regard to venting...the garage has one wall open to the outside with a mesh
> metal gate that has alot of circulation. From what I can tell there is no
> other way out for fumes. Do you think there is a possibility fumes can seep
> thru a roof, insulation and floor to my apt?
>
> (snip)
>
> Beth,
>
> First of all please see my other posting on the other venting question.
> Lots of general good infor that relates too.
>
> The problem with the effluent form a kiln is that it has some
> "directionality" to it. The gases are generally hot and therefore less
> dense than typical room air. So they tend to rise to the upper part of the
> room. In fact, way back in the "good old days" foundry's used this idea to
> help protect the workers by having tall open buildings with room for "fume
> stratification" above the workers heads. Better than nothing..... but not
> much .
>
> Unless the roof of the garage is exceptional in it's construction, the
> gases can go right through every little crack and seam. How much of this
> stuff actually WILL is another question.
>
> If the opening in the one wall goes right up to the top of the line where
> the roof is (no pocket to collect hot gases) than the odds are the vast
> preponderance are spilling right out that wall.
>
> Best,
>
> .....................john
>
> John Baymore
> River Bend Pottery
> 22 Riverbend Way
> Wilton, NH 03086 USA
>
> 603-654-2752
> JBaymore@Compuserve.com
Phyllis E. Tilton on mon 26 apr 99
The fan on my Orton Vent had to replaced after three years. They are
stainless steel and I thought should have lasted forever. The symptom that
told me I had a problem was the vibration-started to shake the kiln! George
at Columbus Clay was very nice and gave me a price to calm this irritated
lady. My husband further mollified me by pointing out how the cost could be
thought about in a different way by dividing the cost by 3. That was my cost
per year for use. The replacement fan has lasted 4 or 5 years at least. My
records are not by my side. In those first years of vent use, I used more
earthenware clay and glazes. Is the sulfuric acid more of a by product of low
fired pottery?
I have wondered if(and maybe they do by now) there could be a coating on the
metal as a protection. Would ITC, teflon,or one of many other things that
could be available, be sprayed on the affected parts-fan blades etc.? I know
the blades have to be balanced to work properly but the coating could be part
of their manufacture.
Phyllis Tilton
Daisypet@aol.com
L&L Kiln Mfg on tue 27 apr 99
At 10:15 AM 4/25/99 EDT, you wrote:
>----------------------------Original message----------------------------
>Yet another kiln venting issue... For years I had the envirovent (under the
>kiln) and would use it when I was candleing (sp) the kiln.
>After about two years of firing once a week, the fan rotted out. I was
told by
>the manufacturer that I shouldn't use it while candleing because the
combination
>of the heat, moisture, and clay minerals create a sulfuric acid that eats
away
>the metal vent system. Yikes!
>So, I bought a second envirovent and used it for about 4 years, but never
>candled with it, then it too eventually rotted away. Since I was unable to
just
>buy and replace the rotted fan blades, I decided to try the Vent a kiln (
over
>lid) and it works just fine.
> I also fire at night with the computer controller so as to avoid any
>unsucked fumes...
> Elizabeth
>Tom Wirt wrote:
>
>> ----------------------------Original message----------------------------
>> There's another issue re: kiln venting, that I haven't seen touched on in
>> this or other venting threads. I had it happen with a Bailey vent where
>> there is a small hole in the side of the kiln to draw out the air. Over
>> time (maybe 1-1/2 years) that hole got mostly filled with "crud" - a
>> technical terms for unknown material of icky appearance (another technical
>> term). It appeared to be what I would imagine condensation of bisque
firing
>> fumes might be along with some IFB dust.
>>
>> What happens with other vents, I don't know, but the point is, after some
>> time, you should recheck the draw of your vent to make sure it's still
doing
>> what it should be.
>>
>> Tom Wirt,
>> Clay Coyote Pottery
>> 17614 240th St.
>> Hutchinson, MN 55350
>> 320-587-2599 fax 320-234-6849
>> claypot@hutchtel.net
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: John Baymore
>> To: CLAYART@LSV.UKY.EDU
>> Date: Friday, April 23, 1999 7:50 AM
>> Subject: Kiln Venting
>>
>> ----------------------------Original message----------------------------
>> ------------------
>> (snip)
>>
>> .........I fire a small Cress FX23 electric kiln during the nite and return
>> to the studio once it has cooled down about once every 3 weeks. With
>> regard to venting...the garage has one wall open to the outside with a mesh
>> metal gate that has alot of circulation. From what I can tell there is no
>> other way out for fumes. Do you think there is a possibility fumes can seep
>> thru a roof, insulation and floor to my apt?
>>
>> (snip)
>>
>> Beth,
>>
>> First of all please see my other posting on the other venting question.
>> Lots of general good infor that relates too.
>>
>> The problem with the effluent form a kiln is that it has some
>> "directionality" to it. The gases are generally hot and therefore less
>> dense than typical room air. So they tend to rise to the upper part of the
>> room. In fact, way back in the "good old days" foundry's used this idea to
>> help protect the workers by having tall open buildings with room for "fume
>> stratification" above the workers heads. Better than nothing..... but not
>> much .
>>
>> Unless the roof of the garage is exceptional in it's construction, the
>> gases can go right through every little crack and seam. How much of this
>> stuff actually WILL is another question.
>>
>> If the opening in the one wall goes right up to the top of the line where
>> the roof is (no pocket to collect hot gases) than the odds are the vast
>> preponderance are spilling right out that wall.
>>
>> Best,
>>
>> .....................john
>>
>> John Baymore
>> River Bend Pottery
>> 22 Riverbend Way
>> Wilton, NH 03086 USA
>>
>> 603-654-2752
>> JBaymore@Compuserve.com
>
L&L's Vent-Torr kiln vent system has the vent motor mounted on the wall
away from the heat of the kiln. There is a collection box (with an
adjustment damper) mounted to the kiln (either on the bottom or the side of
the bottom ring). This keeps the heat of the kiln away from the fan motor.
We think this is a superior design to the Skutt Environvent or the Orton
version of this. I just don't understand the idea of putting a motor near
heat. Our kiln vents don't cost any more than the Envirovent or the Orton.
They can be installed on any kiln. There is an added bonus. If a leak
developes in the aluminum hose that goes from the the kiln to the vent
motor room air gets sucked into the vent hose rather than fumes being blown
out of the hose into your room.
I recently asked our foreman whether we sold many vent motors as spare
parts because I was redoing our parts catalog. He doesn't rememeber selling
any in the past several years. That has to tell you something!
Please excuse the advertisement.
Stephen Lewicki
President
L&L Kiln Mfg Inc.
6B Mt. Pleasant Drive
Aston, PA 19014
Phone: (610) 558-3899
Fax: (610) 558-3698
Email: steve@hotkilns.com
CNW on wed 14 jul 99
Arnold at Paragon and others- I have been wondering how much information
there is about the flow of air in electric kilns. There are all sorts of
differing views on how to vent them. But no strong info on how the air moves
in them. I realize that alot depends on the way it is stacked. But there
should be some regular way that air flows. so to speak. Are there any
studies? It seems that some sort of test could be designed to understand it
better.
I was at a workshop recently and the person doing the firing left all the
peepholes closed (tightly) and the lid shut from the start. (In a once fire
situation) Since the kiln was outside and the humidity was high I was kind
of worried, but everything came out fine. I was worried the most about
bloating (besides the humidity) because I had always heard that not allowing
the kiln to vent well during the period organics are burning off caused
bloating. So I am totally confused. I doubt that I will start firing with
peepholes shut but I hear of a lot of people doing it.
What really happens inside the kiln?!?
Celia in NC
cwike@conninc.com
Janet Price on wed 9 may 01
Hi,
I have a small electric kiln--a Skutt 818, about 2.5 cubic feet. I've moved yet
again and this time I don't have a garage. When I had the kiln in a garage, I
didn't worry about venting since I didn't live in the garage and the garages
I've had were never exactly airtight. However, now I must set it up in the
unfinished part of my basement, which is behind a door, but still it is in my
house. There is a tiny window in the foundation above where I'd like to put the
kiln and I think I could get a small fan installed there. Will that provide
adequate venting for any fumes? I fire to cone 4 or 5, don't use lead or barium
in my glazes and don't do lusters or anything like that.
I want to operate safely, but I don't want to spend a lot of money
unnecessarily.
Thanks for any advice or suggestions.
Janet
--
Janet Price
Curricular Computing Support Specialist
Amherst College
Amherst, MA 01002
jkprice@amherst.edu
413-542-5141
Lori Wilkinson on wed 9 may 01
> I have a small electric kiln--a Skutt 818, about 2.5 cubic feet. I've
moved yet
> again and this time I don't have a garage. When I had the kiln in a
garage, I
> didn't worry about venting since I didn't live in the garage and the
garages
> I've had were never exactly airtight. However, now I must set it up in
the
> unfinished part of my basement, which is behind a door, but still it is in
my
> house. There is a tiny window in the foundation above where I'd like to
put the
> kiln and I think I could get a small fan installed there. Will that
provide
> adequate venting for any fumes? I fire to cone 4 or 5, don't use lead or
barium
> in my glazes and don't do lusters or anything like that.
> I want to operate safely, but I don't want to spend a lot of money
> unnecessarily.
>
Well Janet, it depends on how unnecessary your lungs and health are. For
years I ran an 818 on and off in my basement with a window and fan down
there but still some of the smells and fumes found their way upstairs and
even to the second floor bedroom area. I am now on oxygen 24 hours per day
of which a respirator is also necessary for 10 -12 of those hours. Two of
my the three of my adult children have breathing problems. Did that cause
it? I don't know but if I get near fumes now, I get light headed and feel
as if I am going to pass out.
I never used lead either. My ceramic teacher taught and believed the fumes
wouldn't hurt you as she ran several kilns below her studio. Take it for
what it's worth but if I had it to do over.....
Lori Wilkinson, Roswell New Mexico - back on Clayart after a 6 month hiatus.
Frederich, Tim on thu 10 may 01
Janet,
Please vent your kiln for health and safety reasons at the least. It will be
one of the best investments that you can make. I work for Orton and of
course like the Orton downdraft vent system but please buy any vent you
prefer. Just vent! It will not be an unnecessary expense.
Best regards,
Tim
Gordon on tue 23 oct 01
Due to the space constraints they have moved our kilns into the
classroom... they said it would be okay since they vented the kilns.. then
they hired a new person to fire the kilns.. he will not use the vents
consistently saying he is worried that the motors will burn out.. I am
worried about the human lungs in the room with the unvented kilns.. some as
young as 3 years old and many pregnant women.... Do I have reason to be
concerned or am I just being paranoid? I need to feel on firm ground when I
talk to the boss.. Any opinions would be appreciated...
Kathleen Gordon
Palo Alto, Ca 94301
650-328-9164
fax 650-328-9113
email:kjgordon1@homail.com
"if things seem under control then you are not going fast enough!"
Mario Andretti
Earl Brunner on tue 23 oct 01
The idiot needs to use the vents. ALL THE TIME. They burn out, you fix'em.
Gordon wrote:
> Due to the space constraints they have moved our kilns into the
> classroom... they said it would be okay since they vented the kilns.. then
> they hired a new person to fire the kilns.. he will not use the vents
> consistently saying he is worried that the motors will burn out.. I am
> worried about the human lungs in the room with the unvented kilns.. some as
> young as 3 years old and many pregnant women.... Do I have reason to be
> concerned or am I just being paranoid? I need to feel on firm ground when I
> talk to the boss.. Any opinions would be appreciated...
>
> Kathleen Gordon
> Palo Alto, Ca 94301
> 650-328-9164
> fax 650-328-9113
> email:kjgordon1@homail.com
>
> "if things seem under control then you are not going fast enough!"
> Mario Andretti
>
> ______________________________________________________________________________
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at melpots@pclink.com.
--
Earl Brunner
http://coyote.accessnv.com/bruec/
bruec@anv.net
Alan D. Scott on tue 23 oct 01
You could 'fire the people who hired the guy to fire the kilns without the
vents running'... (sung to the tune "I know an old woman who swallowed a
fly")
OK, OK, I know, I'll go get some more coffee...
Alan
-----Original Message-----
From: Ceramic Arts Discussion List [mailto:CLAYART@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG]On
Behalf Of Gordon
Sent: Tuesday, October 23, 2001 04:16
To: CLAYART@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG
Subject: Kiln venting
Due to the space constraints they have moved our kilns into the
classroom... they said it would be okay since they vented the kilns.. then
they hired a new person to fire the kilns.. he will not use the vents
consistently saying he is worried that the motors will burn out.. I am
worried about the human lungs in the room with the unvented kilns.. some as
young as 3 years old and many pregnant women.... Do I have reason to be
concerned or am I just being paranoid? I need to feel on firm ground when I
talk to the boss.. Any opinions would be appreciated...
Kathleen Gordon
Palo Alto, Ca 94301
650-328-9164
fax 650-328-9113
email:kjgordon1@homail.com
"if things seem under control then you are not going fast enough!"
Mario Andretti
____________________________________________________________________________
__
Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
melpots@pclink.com.
Cindy Strnad on tue 23 oct 01
Dear Kathleen,
Yes, you certainly do have a reason to be
concerned. When you talk to you're boss, tell her
this is an OSHA issue. She probably does care
about the children, as the vent was, after all,
installed, but EVERYONE cares about OSHA.
Best wishes,
Cindy Strnad
Earthen Vessels Pottery
RR 1, Box 51
Custer, SD 57730
USA
cindy@earthen-vessels-pottery.com
http://www.earthen-vessels-pottery.com
John Hesselberth on tue 23 oct 01
on 10/23/01 7:15 AM, Gordon at emgordon@BATNET.COM wrote:
> Due to the space constraints they have moved our kilns into the
> classroom... they said it would be okay since they vented the kilns.. then
> they hired a new person to fire the kilns.. he will not use the vents
> consistently saying he is worried that the motors will burn out.. I am
> worried about the human lungs in the room with the unvented kilns.. some as
> young as 3 years old and many pregnant women.... Do I have reason to be
> concerned or am I just being paranoid? I need to feel on firm ground when I
> talk to the boss.. Any opinions would be appreciated...
Hi Kathleen,
Put your foot down firmly and refuse to let the kilns be fired unless the
vent fans are on. Period! Your new person is misinformed to be polite about
it. Vent fans on kilns last a long time and, even if they don't, replacing
them is a minor task compared to endangering people's health.
Just say "no" and make it stick.
Regards,
John
Web site: http://www.frogpondpottery.com Email: john@frogpondpottery.com
"The life so short, the craft so long to learn." Chaucer's translation of
Hippocrates, 5th cent. B.C.
vince pitelka on tue 23 oct 01
> Due to the space constraints they have moved our kilns into the
> classroom... they said it would be okay since they vented the kilns.. then
> they hired a new person to fire the kilns.. he will not use the vents
> consistently saying he is worried that the motors will burn out.. I am
> worried about the human lungs in the room with the unvented kilns.. some
as
> young as 3 years old and many pregnant women.... Do I have reason to be
> concerned or am I just being paranoid? I need to feel on firm ground when
I
> talk to the boss.. Any opinions would be appreciated...
Kathleen -
Well for criminy sake what the hell are the vent's for??? I am not aiming
this at you, because you are obviously concerned. But who is that idiot you
have firing the kilns? Has this person even stopped to think about his
convoluted (lack of) logic? Even if no one is present at night he should
always have the vents running when the kilns are firing in order to evacuate
corrosive fumes from the room. Otherwise every non-stainless-steel metal
object or surface in the vicinity of the kilns will eventually start to
corode. When people are present there are toxic fumes released, and the
vents must always be running if the kiln is firing.
Best wishes -
- Vince
Vince Pitelka
Appalachian Center for Crafts
Tennessee Technological University
1560 Craft Center Drive, Smithville TN 37166
Home - vpitelka@dtccom.net
615/597-5376
Work - wpitelka@tntech.edu
615/597-6801 ext. 111, fax 615/597-6803
http://www.craftcenter.tntech.edu/
GlassyClass on wed 24 oct 01
Just did a quick search on "OSHA kiln vent"
-------------------------------
http://www.ortonceramic.com/firing/venting.html
Health and Safety Issues
OSHA has set standards for carbon monoxide exposure of 35 ppm (parts per
million) for long-term exposure and 200 PPM for short-term exposure.
Independent testing has shown that fumes near the kiln can exceed 200 PPM
near the kiln during the firing of greenware. This can cause headaches,
fatigue, sore throats and nausea. When properly installed and operated, a
downdraft vent removes ALL harmful fumes and provides a safer working
environment.
Regulations
Most states and localities have set venting requirements for firing kilns in
public places. Your local and state health board should have this
information. The Uniform Mechanical Code lists accepted venting methods. The
downdraft system made by Orton is listed in the 1992 approved Code. Orton
downdraft vents have been certified by ETL (Intertek Testing Services NA,
Inc.), a Nationally Recognized Testing Laboratory) See
www.osha-slc.gov/dts/otpca/nrtl/index.html for more detail on OSHA safety
testing labs. Orton's vents have earned the right to bear the ETL mark in
the US, CETL in Canada. Additionally, Orton downdraft vents bear the CE mark
for sale into the European Market.
Why Do We Vent Kilns?
To Improve your Fired Product
All products fired in electric kilns contain organic materials that make
carbon monoxide and other fumes when they are burned. These include clays,
glazes, decorating products, decals and the like. Fumes released may contain
sulfur oxides, hydrogen fluoride and metal vapors, depending on the products
fired. Carbon monoxide and other fumes can affect the color and properties
of the fired product if they are not removed from the kiln earlier in the
firing. Red, green, gold and similar products are particularly affected by
carbon monoxide at temperatures where the color develops.
To Improve your Work Environment
Removing fumes released from the kiln from your work environment is
important, since these are unhealthy to breathe on a regular basis. Carbon
monoxide can cause headaches and nausea. Other fumes can potentially cause
health problems.
http://www.osha-slc.gov/SLTC/healthguidelines/carbonmonoxide/recognition.htm
l
2. Effects on Humans: Carbon monoxide is an asphyxiant in humans. Inhalation
of carbon monoxide causes tissue hypoxia by preventing the blood from
carrying sufficient oxygen. Carbon monoxide combines reversibly with
hemoglobin to form carboxyhemoglobin. The reduction in oxygen-carrying
capacity of the blood is proportional to the amount of carboxyhemoglobin
formed [Gosselin 1984]. All factors that speed respiration and circulation
accelerate the rate of carboxyhemoglobin formation; thus exercise, increased
temperature, high altitude, and anemia increase the hazard associated with
carbon monoxide exposure[Gosselin 1984]. Other conditions that increase risk
are hyperthyroidism, obesity, bronchitis, asthma, preexisting heart disease,
and alcoholism [NLM 1993]. In tests with human volunteers breathing 50 ppm
carbon monoxide (a concentration that produces 27 percent carboxyhemoglobin
after an exposure of 2 hours), there was a significant decrease in time to
onset of exercise-induced angina[Gosselin 1984]. Carbon monoxide can be
transported across the placental barrier, and exposure in utero constitutes
a special risk to the fetus. Infants and young children are generally
believed to be more susceptible to carbon monoxide than adults. The elderly
are also believed to be more susceptible to carbon monoxide poisoning
[Gosselin A carboxyhemoglobin level of 0.4 to 0.7 percent is normally
present in the blood of adults. In cigarette smokers, the range is 4 to 20
percent, which places smokers at greater risk in exposure situations
[Clayton and Clayton 1982; ACGIH 1991]. A capacity to adapt to carbon
monoxide exposure has been reported in several human studies. Healthy young
men exposed to carbon monoxide at a concentration of 44 ppm for a prolonged
period suffered no adverse health effects [ACGIH 1986]. Men exposed to 50
ppm for several days without relief complained of headaches, but exposure to
40 ppm for 60 days was without effect [ACGIH 1986]. Workers in the Holland
Tunnel working 8-hour swing shifts of 2 hours in and 2 hours out at an
average carbon monoxide exposure concentration of 70 ppm had average
carboxyhemoglobin levels of 5 percent, and none had levels above 10 percent
[ACGIH 1991].
* Signs and symptoms of exposure
1. Acute exposure: The signs and symptoms of acute exposure to carbon
monoxide may include headache, flushing, nausea, vertigo, weakness,
irritability, unconsciousness, and in persons with pre-existing heart
disease and atherosclerosis, chest pain and leg pain.
2. Chronic exposure: Repeated bouts of carbon monoxide poisoning may cause
persistent signs and symptoms, such as anorexia, headache, lassitude,
dizziness, and ataxia.
EXPOSURE SOURCES AND CONTROL METHODS
The following operations may generate or involve carbon monoxide and lead to
worker exposures to this substance:
* The manufacture and transportation of carbon monoxide
Operations near furnaces, ovens, stoves, forges, and kilns when they are
being fired up to operating temperatures; firefighting, particularly in
mines; testing of internal combustion engines; operations near portable
stoves
---------------------
Maybe these few short snips might help your bosses to reconsider the kiln
tech choice not to protect the children from the so-called smells from the
kiln, at the cost of a fan motor.
Bud
----- Original Message -----
From: "Gordon"
Sent: Tuesday, October 23, 2001 4:15 AM
Subject: Kiln venting
> Due to the space constraints they have moved our kilns into the
> classroom... they said it would be okay since they vented the kilns.. then
> they hired a new person to fire the kilns.. he will not use the vents
> consistently saying he is worried that the motors will burn out.. I am
> worried about the human lungs in the room with the unvented kilns.. some
as
> young as 3 years old and many pregnant women.... Do I have reason to be
> concerned or am I just being paranoid? I need to feel on firm ground when
I
> talk to the boss.. Any opinions would be appreciated...
>
> Kathleen Gordon
> Palo Alto, Ca 94301
> 650-328-9164
> fax 650-328-9113
> email:kjgordon1@homail.com
>
> "if things seem under control then you are not going fast enough!"
> Mario Andretti
>
Ron Roy on sun 28 oct 01
Hey Bud,
Thanks for this - excellent information - anyone who did not read this
first time around - read it now cause it's important for all potters.
RR
>http://www.ortonceramic.com/firing/venting.html
>
>Health and Safety Issues
>OSHA has set standards for carbon monoxide exposure of 35 ppm (parts per
>million) for long-term exposure and 200 PPM for short-term exposure.
>Independent testing has shown that fumes near the kiln can exceed 200 PPM
>near the kiln during the firing of greenware. This can cause headaches,
>fatigue, sore throats and nausea. When properly installed and operated, a
>downdraft vent removes ALL harmful fumes and provides a safer working
>environment.
>
>Regulations
>Most states and localities have set venting requirements for firing kilns in
>public places. Your local and state health board should have this
>information. The Uniform Mechanical Code lists accepted venting methods. The
>downdraft system made by Orton is listed in the 1992 approved Code. Orton
>downdraft vents have been certified by ETL (Intertek Testing Services NA,
>Inc.), a Nationally Recognized Testing Laboratory) See
>www.osha-slc.gov/dts/otpca/nrtl/index.html for more detail on OSHA safety
>testing labs. Orton's vents have earned the right to bear the ETL mark in
>the US, CETL in Canada. Additionally, Orton downdraft vents bear the CE mark
>for sale into the European Market.
>
>
>Why Do We Vent Kilns?
>To Improve your Fired Product
>
>All products fired in electric kilns contain organic materials that make
>carbon monoxide and other fumes when they are burned. These include clays,
>glazes, decorating products, decals and the like. Fumes released may contain
>sulfur oxides, hydrogen fluoride and metal vapors, depending on the products
>fired. Carbon monoxide and other fumes can affect the color and properties
>of the fired product if they are not removed from the kiln earlier in the
>firing. Red, green, gold and similar products are particularly affected by
>carbon monoxide at temperatures where the color develops.
>
>To Improve your Work Environment
>
>Removing fumes released from the kiln from your work environment is
>important, since these are unhealthy to breathe on a regular basis. Carbon
>monoxide can cause headaches and nausea. Other fumes can potentially cause
>health problems.
>
>
>http://www.osha-slc.gov/SLTC/healthguidelines/carbonmonoxide/recognition.htm
>l
>
>2. Effects on Humans: Carbon monoxide is an asphyxiant in humans. Inhalation
>of carbon monoxide causes tissue hypoxia by preventing the blood from
>carrying sufficient oxygen. Carbon monoxide combines reversibly with
>hemoglobin to form carboxyhemoglobin. The reduction in oxygen-carrying
>capacity of the blood is proportional to the amount of carboxyhemoglobin
>formed [Gosselin 1984]. All factors that speed respiration and circulation
>accelerate the rate of carboxyhemoglobin formation; thus exercise, increased
>temperature, high altitude, and anemia increase the hazard associated with
>carbon monoxide exposure[Gosselin 1984]. Other conditions that increase risk
>are hyperthyroidism, obesity, bronchitis, asthma, preexisting heart disease,
>and alcoholism [NLM 1993]. In tests with human volunteers breathing 50 ppm
>carbon monoxide (a concentration that produces 27 percent carboxyhemoglobin
>after an exposure of 2 hours), there was a significant decrease in time to
>onset of exercise-induced angina[Gosselin 1984]. Carbon monoxide can be
>transported across the placental barrier, and exposure in utero constitutes
>a special risk to the fetus. Infants and young children are generally
>believed to be more susceptible to carbon monoxide than adults. The elderly
>are also believed to be more susceptible to carbon monoxide poisoning
>[Gosselin A carboxyhemoglobin level of 0.4 to 0.7 percent is normally
>present in the blood of adults. In cigarette smokers, the range is 4 to 20
>percent, which places smokers at greater risk in exposure situations
>[Clayton and Clayton 1982; ACGIH 1991]. A capacity to adapt to carbon
>monoxide exposure has been reported in several human studies. Healthy young
>men exposed to carbon monoxide at a concentration of 44 ppm for a prolonged
>period suffered no adverse health effects [ACGIH 1986]. Men exposed to 50
>ppm for several days without relief complained of headaches, but exposure to
>40 ppm for 60 days was without effect [ACGIH 1986]. Workers in the Holland
>Tunnel working 8-hour swing shifts of 2 hours in and 2 hours out at an
>average carbon monoxide exposure concentration of 70 ppm had average
>carboxyhemoglobin levels of 5 percent, and none had levels above 10 percent
>[ACGIH 1991].
>
>* Signs and symptoms of exposure
>
>1. Acute exposure: The signs and symptoms of acute exposure to carbon
>monoxide may include headache, flushing, nausea, vertigo, weakness,
>irritability, unconsciousness, and in persons with pre-existing heart
>disease and atherosclerosis, chest pain and leg pain.
>
>2. Chronic exposure: Repeated bouts of carbon monoxide poisoning may cause
>persistent signs and symptoms, such as anorexia, headache, lassitude,
>dizziness, and ataxia.
>
>EXPOSURE SOURCES AND CONTROL METHODS
>
>The following operations may generate or involve carbon monoxide and lead to
>worker exposures to this substance:
>
>* The manufacture and transportation of carbon monoxide
>
>Operations near furnaces, ovens, stoves, forges, and kilns when they are
>being fired up to operating temperatures; firefighting, particularly in
>mines; testing of internal combustion engines; operations near portable
>stoves
Ron Roy
RR# 4
15084 Little Lake Rd..
Brighton,
Ontario, Canada
KOK 1H0
Residence 613-475-9544
Studio 613-475-3715
Fax 613-475-3513
william schran on tue 2 sep 03
Wayne asks: > If a kiln vent sucks air from inside the kiln,
and exhausts it, how does that affect the heating of the kiln?<
Wayne - I finally broke down and bought a vent a couple of years ago
for my kiln in the basement of a townhouse. Had used fans and open
door previously. Did not notice any difference in firing time, but
did notice an evening out of the temperature throughout the kiln, and
oh yeah, a lot less stink in the house!
Bill
wayneinkeywest on tue 2 sep 03
This is perhaps an ignorant question, but I have no experience with it.
I've never used a kiln vent, such as a Bailey or an Orton. Seen the =
ads, tho.
I have always fired outside. If a kiln vent sucks air from inside the =
kiln,
and exhausts it, how does that affect the heating of the kiln? Does it=20
considerably slow a firing (I'm thinking electric kilns here, not =
propane=20
or gas) or is the cubic feet of air exchanged low enough where the heat =
loss
is not enough of a factor to consider?
Wayne in Key West
Alycia Goeke on tue 2 sep 03
hi wayne,
i just got an orton kiln vent for my electric kiln. last week i spent an
evening at the emergency hospital for carbon monoxide poisoning because i didn't
have proper ventilation on my kiln.
the vent system works by drilling holes in the floor of the kiln that allows
the fumes to be pulled out of the kiln, while holes in the lid allow fresh air
to enter. the kiln lid and peepholes remain closed throughout the firing.
negative pressure in the firing chamber insures complete fume removal. the fumes
are diluted and exhausted to the outside through aluminum duct.
i haven't installed mine yet but the literature states that the firing time
is not altered, giving troubleshooting tips if problems are encountered. it
says it will produce a cleaner firing, colors are reported to be brighter and the
cool down time after firing is reduced.
i debated on whether to get a hood type vent or the one installed directly
onto the kiln but, after going through what i did last week, i chose the kiln
vent. carbon monoxide it nothing to fool around with.
happy firings.
alycia
Ian Smith on tue 2 sep 03
Though it would seem that exhausting valuable heat to the outside world
would slow the progress of firing, venting a kiln has not lengthened the
firing times of my kiln. Perhaps the kiln has enough reserve heating
capacity to overcome the energy drain imposed by the vent, or perhaps
the amount of heat bled off by the vent is negligible.
I purchased a kiln vent built into a stand. I believe the stand is too
small (it does not extend to the edge of the kiln to support the weight
of the walls). To correct this lack of support, I placed bricks under
the walls of the kiln on the sides of the kiln vent stand. Later I read
that one must not place bricks under a kiln, though the article did not
explain why. I have not removed the bricks and the kiln is firing fine
(so far). Any comments?
Arnold Howard on tue 2 sep 03
The amount of air that the downdraft vent removes from the kiln is so
small that firing and cooling times are affected only slightly.
Sincerely,
Arnold Howard
Paragon Industries, L.P.
arnoldhoward@att.net
From: wayneinkeywest
I've never used a kiln vent, such as a Bailey or an Orton. Seen the
ads, tho.
I have always fired outside. If a kiln vent sucks air from inside the
kiln,
and exhausts it, how does that affect the heating of the kiln? Does it
considerably slow a firing (I'm thinking electric kilns here, not
propane
or gas) or is the cubic feet of air exchanged low enough where the heat
loss
is not enough of a factor to consider?
Arnold Howard on wed 3 sep 03
The downdraft kiln vent removes just enough air from the kiln to create
negative pressure, which prevents fumes from entering the room. It
requires very little air removal from the kiln to create the negative
pressure in the firing chamber.
When UL tests kilns, they use the stand that is shipped with the kiln.
If you place bricks under the kiln, you are not using the kiln the same
way UL tested it.
Sincerely,
Arnold Howard
Paragon Industries, L.P.
arnoldhoward@att.net
From: Ian Smith
> Though it would seem that exhausting valuable heat to the outside
world
> would slow the progress of firing, venting a kiln has not lengthened
the
> firing times of my kiln. Perhaps the kiln has enough reserve heating
> capacity to overcome the energy drain imposed by the vent, or perhaps
> the amount of heat bled off by the vent is negligible.
>
> I purchased a kiln vent built into a stand. I believe the stand is too
> small (it does not extend to the edge of the kiln to support the
weight
> of the walls). To correct this lack of support, I placed bricks under
> the walls of the kiln on the sides of the kiln vent stand. Later I
read
> that one must not place bricks under a kiln, though the article did
not
> explain why. I have not removed the bricks and the kiln is firing fine
> (so far). Any comments?
william schran on tue 26 oct 04
Just got a letter from Bailey's about their venting system so we can
go before some engineers and argue that the Bailey vent system would
be a more efficient and cost effective ($500) solution, than spending
almost $40,000 on three stainless steel custom made vent hoods to be
installed in a kiln shed.
We're dealing with a state government that wants to cover its butt at
every turn.
Anyway, in the letter it's stated the system works by drilling a 3/8"
hole in the wall opposite the spy holes and the top spy hole plug is
left out during the firing to create the down draft venting. It's
also written that if the kiln is older and has more gaps/spaces
between sections, that the spy hole plug might be left in, allowing
air to enter through the gaps. It's also written that larger kilns
might need to use the double vent system and have two holes/vent
ducts used.
Bill
Cheryl Harvey on tue 6 dec 05
I have a Cress Kiln FX23. When using the Firemate settings, the
instruction manual states after loading to close the lid, set the timer,
rotate thumwheel to 1, push in the kiln sitter and leave the top peep open
throughout firing.
Just recently, I read the instrucitons for a manual firing and it states
to prop the lid to the highest vent position, turn to low, fire one hour,
move the lid to the lowest vent potition, fire at medium two hours, close
the lid, turn to high until temp is reached, etc.
I have been using this kiln for over a year in my garage (with either the
windows open or the garage door half open). Is there a concern that I
have not been venting the kiln? Does anyone have an opinion as to why the
instructions are different for the Automatic Firing settings? Is the
temperature reached so slowly that the fumes do not occur?
Thanks for your comments,
Cheryl
Arnold Howard on tue 6 dec 05
The automatic firing is probably designed so that you don't have to return
to the kiln to lower the lid. The manual mode includes propping the lid,
because you have to return to the kiln to change switch positions. Since you
are already near the kiln, you can lower the lid also.
Thorough venting solves a host of firing problems. Propping the lid is
better than not propping it unless you have a downdraft motorized vent. In
that case the lid is kept closed, and the peephole plugs remain inserted
throughout the firing.
If you have had no adverse firing results, then venting may have been
adequate.
By the way, I suggest leaving your car out of the garage while your kiln is
firing.
Sincerely,
Arnold Howard
Paragon Industries, L.P., Mesquite, Texas USA
ahoward@paragonweb.com / www.paragonweb.com
From: "Cheryl Harvey"
>I have a Cress Kiln FX23. When using the Firemate settings, the
> instruction manual states after loading to close the lid, set the timer,
> rotate thumwheel to 1, push in the kiln sitter and leave the top peep open
> throughout firing.
>
> Just recently, I read the instrucitons for a manual firing and it states
> to prop the lid to the highest vent position, turn to low, fire one hour,
> move the lid to the lowest vent potition, fire at medium two hours, close
> the lid, turn to high until temp is reached, etc.
>
> I have been using this kiln for over a year in my garage (with either the
> windows open or the garage door half open). Is there a concern that I
> have not been venting the kiln? Does anyone have an opinion as to why the
> instructions are different for the Automatic Firing settings?
Cheryl Harvey on wed 7 dec 05
Thank you for your response. I have not had any firing problems but I
have been low firing all year. In the new year I will be firing ^6 so I
will see if there's any difference. And, yes, the car is definately
relegated to the driveway during the firing (and cool down.
The past year has been a good learning experience throwing and firing my
own kiln. I took one semester in college (over 20 years ago!) and always
had the desire to throw again. So my husband bought me a wheel and kiln
and I have been re-learning a lot of things. This board, which I have
just discovered, has a wealth of knowledge.
Thanks again!
Nanci Mansfield on sat 11 mar 06
I'm also trying to set up a kiln area in a shed I hope to enclose. Would you share those instructions with me?
Thanks,
Nanci
mtigges@NOSPAM.SHAW.CA wrote:
On Sat, Mar 11, 2006 at 10:54:04AM -0500, LindaC wrote:
> Thanks for all the input on this venting issue- William Melstrom has a great
> diagram showing how to simply buy your own stuff and install it in your
> studio so the fan is separate from the kiln. I can't afford
> school/workshops
> so access to ready information is a Godsend! The clayart exchange
> has been so fulfilling too--ya'll would get a lot out of being part of
> it. take care, lc Ohio
>
In which case, http://www.m2crafts.ca/vent.html
I mentioned that page many times here, and hesitated mentioning it
again.
Mark.
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LindaC on sat 11 mar 06
Thanks for all the input on this venting issue- William Melstrom has a great
diagram showing how to simply buy your own stuff and install it in your
studio so the fan is separate from the kiln. I can't afford
school/workshops
so access to ready information is a Godsend! The clayart exchange
has been so fulfilling too--ya'll would get a lot out of being part of
it. take care, lc Ohio
mtigges@NOSPAM.SHAW.CA on sat 11 mar 06
On Sat, Mar 11, 2006 at 10:54:04AM -0500, LindaC wrote:
> Thanks for all the input on this venting issue- William Melstrom has a great
> diagram showing how to simply buy your own stuff and install it in your
> studio so the fan is separate from the kiln. I can't afford
> school/workshops
> so access to ready information is a Godsend! The clayart exchange
> has been so fulfilling too--ya'll would get a lot out of being part of
> it. take care, lc Ohio
>
In which case, http://www.m2crafts.ca/vent.html
I mentioned that page many times here, and hesitated mentioning it
again.
Mark.
William Melstrom on sun 12 mar 06
> I'm also trying to set up a kiln area in a shed I hope to enclose. Would
> you share those instructions with me?
> Thanks,
> Nanci
Nanci, is this what you want?
http://www.handspiral.com/kiln_vent.htm
The article is unfinished, but should be helpful. It would really help if
you could find someone's installed commercial system to see how the
"diffuser box" functions and how to drill the inlet holes in your kiln. For
a diffuser box, go to Home Depot or an electrical supply house, and buy a 6
x 6 x 6 metal junction box. One word of caution: I have found that the
little fan that I have specified in the article does not move enough air.
It should be very easy to find a fan with a greater CFM (cubic feet per
minute) rating.
It is really worth doing this yourself. You will save a few hundred dollars
over a commercial system, with very little added labor on your part. Kiln
vents are not rocket science. There is not a lot of engineering involved.
It is very easy to adjust the amount of air movement by adding (by drilling)
or subtracting (by duct-taping over or plugging) holes in the kiln and or
diffuser box.
William Melstrom
LindaC on sun 12 mar 06
To Nanci Mansfield--kiln venting instructions from Mark Tigges--
www.m2crafts.ca/vent.html Good luck!
bill edwards on sun 19 mar 06
You cannot prevent an un-vented kiln from releasing
noxious gas. It won't happen! Even on a good day one
with a vent will release some in the studio atmosphere
to a degree. We won't even talk about a sealed kiln
system because your not going to have one as a studio
potter. Now there are studio's that do fire unvented
kilns but often in a room with windows and a way to
shut the door creating a vacuum effect since the
interior pressure is pulling air from the cracks
around the door and gases will take the route most
easily traveled. I can easily detect the suphuric odor
from combustion if I go into a studio and can smell
that, I leave. At least most modern day vehincles have
a catalytic converter but if you park your car in the
garage and leave it running and shut the doors you
usually will not stick around too long to enjoy the
next days challenges that life has to offer. Should I
make a strong comparison and not sound an alarmist? I
believe so when someone asks a question about firing
in an unvented room. It will help them think it over a
little better. (those that want to get touchy with
this can do so by writing me off-list) I am tired of
having to tip toe around in here, especially on issues
like this.
There are inert (based on what you consider inert)
materials in glaze, there are no inert gases in firing
since there is often too many materials used either in
the glaze or the clay, something is going to give off
gases under combustion and those are not going to be
good for your health if you stick around with them for
long. It all goes as to how much, what it is, how
healthy you are now etc.
If a vent came with the kiln why not use it? It does
alot more than saves your delicate human system from
having to deal with one more issue. It will pull junk
from the kiln that would settle or fume the brick and
stick around longer. It will even out the temperature.
You stand a better chance at getting consistency in
your firings and a better product when finished. More
reasons to go there than not!
LOI - represents a weight of something being lost
during firing and a reduction of content. This means
under heat, whatever the range is for the material it
will vaporize and drift from its origin. Clay has a
shrinkage rate, some better than others but its going
to shrink and lose some materials under combustion.
Glaze and clay when closely fitted is often what
potters seek to reduce issues with fit. It all ties
into the other. Look at your glaze materials, check
each for LOI, check you clays, check it for LOI. Now
think about impurities. Check and see which materials
are analyzed for content and look at each of their
LOI's and consider zinc, copper, lead, cadmium,
sulphur and other volatiles are in there and if your
willing to stick around a kiln that is un-vented just
so you can say you done it for 20 years. The point,
there's simply no reason at all to do this and if you
live long enough it doesn't warrant it is good for
others. Keith Richards is petrified from his hay-day
while millions of others are buried that have tried
the same things. Not everyone is a Rolling Stone.
Apparently some people have organs made of steel or
have been just lucky. Since I haven't won the lottery
I am going to assume trusting my luck to what I know
for a fact and if I don't know I am going to find out.
This probably explains my long winded and often boring
replies. I often check under most rocks if I can see
them. Creative Mindz will explore like that.
I am not harping here. I am trying to show my love and
concern. I have a little left in me yet!
Bill Edwards
http://apottersmark.blogspot.com/
'Studio Pottery Set-up for Sell, offers considered!'
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Judy Picard on thu 12 apr 07
I just purchased a big Duncan kiln 30" inside diameter, 3 rings high and want to place it under the house. I live in a stilted house on the outer banks of NC.
I'm worried about fumes rising up into the house so plan to vent it from the bottom to a point outside the exterior of the house but I don't want the fumes to waft in the windows.
My s-i-l says he could pipe it to a bathroom pipe that vents out of the roof.
Are the above too over-reactive and running a good-sized fan to channel the fumes out from under would be good enough? That's be ideal but I want to be sure it's safe for my family.
thanks,
judy
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Beth Tate on sat 12 may 07
Hi all,
I am one of those silent readers mainly because I am more a hobbyist though I've been working in
clay for over 13 years.
But I have this continuing problem....venting out bad fumes. My new Cress e series kiln is not
wowing me so far. Add to that the weak venting system motor.
So am thinking of switching to a Skutt downdraft.
But one Clayarter said that down draft systems aren't very good.
So am wondering if it is worth the expense and hassle to switch out the system.
Any of you Cress kiln owners? Any advise?
thank you very much
Beth Tate
Venice, CA
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