Talbott on thu 16 jan 97
In response to a question on this topic, I write a follows: My
son, Eric, and I prepared the ground to accept a concrete slab... We had
crushed gravel brought in to get the area for the concrete slab above grade
(to avoid flooding)... We "formed-up" for the slab, did the tamping etc..
and finally poured the slab... 4"-6" deep in the middle and 12"-18" around
the perimeter..... I set several 6"x6" pressure treated posts around the
perimeter and erected a shed with a gable roof which we covered with steel
roofing. Make sure your shed is large enough to allow for kiln shelf
storage, working space for loading and unloading the kiln, room for your
kiln car (a necessity.. if you care anything about your BACK!!!) Make your
roof coverage and overhang large enough and wide enough to protect against
precipitation. Best Wishes.. Marshall
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1ST ANNUAL CLAYARTERS' GALLERY - NAPLES, MAINE (Summmer 1997)
{contact me directly for more information}
Celia & Marshall Talbott
Pottery By Celia
Route 114
P.O. Box 4116
Naples, Maine 04055-4116
(207)693-6100 voice and fax
clupus@ime.net
JJHerb@aol.com on sat 18 jan 97
I have thought that the general recommendation for footers in slab-on-grade
construction was that the footer should extend to below the frost line. This
provision is to prevent movement of the structure during the annual
freeze-thaw cycle. Pottery isn't the only thing that changes volume when
heated and cooled - Water does too. I am surprised that the Kiln pad that
Marshall Talbott describes is successful. Maine is, after all, the frost
heave capital of the eastern U.S. I would have been inclined to include
deeper footers and re-inforcing steel in the slab. For other people in other
areas of the country, observation of construction practice or enquiries at
the local building inspector's office might give guidance. In some areas of
Texas the dirt changes volume significantly as it changes moisture content -
again like pottery. If the movements caused by these volume changes are not
accounted for in the design and construction of the building, the building
can be torn apart in a few years. A spectacular example that recently came
to light was the severing, by earth movement, of all sewer connections for an
upscale resturaunt here in Irving. Located in a nice looking shopping
center, many were surprised when the goes-in-tos kept working while the
goes-out-ofs didn't. Kiln sheds aren't large constructions but having your
slab flexed by frost, or other soil conditions, won't help car alignment, for
example. See if you can't get some insight into local soil conditions and
the accepted construction practices that accommodate them before you call the
concrete truck.
Joseph Herbert
JJHerb@aol.com
afrancis on sun 19 jan 97
Hello All,
On the other side from J Herberts suggestions is the independant
structure method which provides a strong slab, good preparation below
and around the slab, and reenforcement within the slab. I observed this
in Tokyo when they construct modern structures they create a solid block
of a foundation suspended withing a trap rock or washed stone surround
which allows the whole structure to move freely when the Quake hits. It
essentially floats in the earth. A slab can be made strong enough to do
the same assuming it is reenforced and well suspended in the earth with
loose material around it. This also assumes that the kiln is not a
monster which greatly effects the ability of the slab to go with the
heaving frost's flow. The posts can be sunk outside the slab and below
frost level to keep them sturdy.
Just another suggestion.
Andrew Francis
Interlaken School of Art
Dave and Pat Eitel on sun 19 jan 97
>----------------------------Original message----------------------------
>I have thought that the general recommendation for footers in slab-on-grade
>construction was that the footer should extend to below the frost line.
In Wisconsin footers have to go 4 feet below grade to be below the
frostline. However, many folks build ksmall sheds, etc on what is called a
floating slab--usually 4" thick with some rebar. The outer edges are maybe
a foot thick. A fellow potter has her kiln shed built on such a slab--its
probably about 15" square--and hasn't heaved in about 4 years, to my
knowledge.
I erected an olsen 24 kiln outside here in Wis. and just set it on 6
concrete blocks--a really dumb thing to do--but the kiln lasted several
years. When we took it down, most of the bricks were cracked, I had
replaced the arch twice and the floor once--but this was with no concrete
floor at all. There was a very noticeable skew to the kiln, which seemed to
shift every Spring!
So, I think the floating slab would probablay suffice in a lot of
circumstances. I am not in construction work, but I did research this a
bit with people who are. I think the floating slab makes economical sense,
since onedoesn't have to dig a 4-foot deep trench and then pour or build
concrete footings.
Later...Dave
Dave Eitel
Cedar Creek Pottery
Cedarburg, WI
pots@cedarcreekpottery.com
http://www.cedarcreekpottery.com
Margaret Arial on mon 20 jan 97
Dave, What about a covering.How have you allowed for the stack to go thru the
roof without burning the roof or delivering the heat beneath the ceiling.
M.Arial
Pat Chesney on tue 21 jan 97
To prevent any heat dangers, we built our 26 x 15 kiln shed roof of all
metal parts. We did our own welding-made three trusses, welded on metal
purlins, attached raised seam galv. roof metal. We painted the structure
black. The paint is the only thing that can burn in our whole shed-kiln. I
am so glad we did this as we had trouble with final adjustments to our
boury boxes and we saw a lot of flame and smoke go into the roof. Nothing
was damaged and no worries of fire. Where the stack goes through, you use
flashings to seal the rain out. Works great and the whole thing only cost
$450.00-using top grade materials-If you can weld or get someone to teach
you (or do it-maybe in trade for pots, eh?)
Good luck,
Pat Chesney
Pat-Chesney@easy.com
Waco, Texas
Richard Gralnik on wed 22 jan 97
Another option for an all metal outdoor shed worked for me.
Go to a chain link fence installing company and see what kind of deal
you can make for used posts, eye tops (for holding up the roof),
door hinges, etc. They make 2 part clamps for holding horizontal
sections between upright posts. The clamps are bolted together. Have
your uprights and roof supports made of single poles or welded together
sections (you can paint it all a nice forest green later ;). Let them
do the welding. Galvanized metal gives off toxic fumes when welded.
Get a bunch of used sections for the cross bracing. You can cut them to
length yourself with a plain old circular saw and a 7" abrasive cutoff blade
(the brown ones, not the metal ones. $1.77 each at Home Depot). Have the
fence company weld the door sections or use the tie clamps to build to size.
Get sheet metal for the walls and ceiling, not the corrugated stuff. The
sheets are cheaper, lay on the pole frame better and can be cut with the
same circular saw cutoff blade. Attach them to the poles with self tapping
screws or pop rivets.
Screw or rivet the eye tops to the tops of the uprights so they don't blow
off.
Richard
Ellen Baker on wed 22 jan 97
We built a new shed about two years ago for a large gas kiln.
Remember to design-in "supply air" (fresh air) for your burners when
planning your shed walls. We left one wall open about 6" above the
floor slab, adjacent to the kiln on one side. Be thoughtful about
prevailing wind direction or your pilot(s) may blow out unnecessarily.
Also -- In order to prevent critters invading through this opening, we
installed heavy-gauge galvanized ("rabbit cage") screen -- AFTER
mice nested in a few square feet of ceramic fiber.
Erin Hayes on thu 23 jan 97
I want to warn everybody to also cover the interior flue opening in their
downdraft kilns that are outside. In grad school we had a pregnant cat
rummaging through the kilnyard for awhile. Lo and behold, the mama cat
crawled back into the flue box and had her kittens without us realizing it.
We didn't know they were there and so we loaded the kiln, bricked it up and
started a firing. We kept hearing these tiny little peeps from behind the
kiln after about an hour. Finally I thought "Ohmigod the mama cat had her
kittens in there!" I was absolutely in a panic! We shut down the kiln and
ripped the top off the flue box, all of us in tears and panicking. Those
poor kittens were in bad shape. We pulled them out, cooled them off with
rags soaked in cool water and felt awful.
Only one of the five died, I'm glad to say. I have one of the fated litter
now, and he has grown into a devoted 3 year old tabby. The others were
quickly adopted out to clay students who learned of their fate.
Please be careful with the open flues - I don't want anyone to feel the way I
felt when I realized we had been practically cooking those kittens for an
hour! It still makes me feel awful to think about it!
Erin.
Margaret Arial on thu 23 jan 97
Hi! Yeh, critters invaded my fiber blanket topping the kiln arch under the
transite cover.The cats wet in my clay in the studio.A snake had her young in
my clay barrell.a SNAKE , NOT THE HOSE I thought it was at first was in my
sink when i had left some water init for a number of days, brfore I had a
threshold under my studio door.The mud daubbers and hornets also kept me
company until i got the studio tight.Oh, there were also occasional birds
too.
THANKS FOR YOUR HELP AND ADVICE.
Margaret T. Arial
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