mel jacobson on fri 12 apr 96
talented people are a dime a dozen..most teachers adore talent,
worship talent, but i have always admired "energy.." let me find a student
with boundless energy, care, and wit, and i will show you success over the
long haul.
mel
John Bensing on sat 13 apr 96
At 07:24 PM 4/12/96 EDT, mel jacobson wrote:
>----------------------------Original message----------------------------
> talented people are a dime a dozen..most teachers adore talent,
>worship talent, but i have always admired "energy.." let me find a student
>with boundless energy, care, and wit, and i will show you success over the
>long haul.
>
>mel
>
Don't forget desire. That is the key to success. Give me students
with a strong desire to learn over talented students any day.
>
John T. Bensing
Louisville, Kentucky
Gareri PIKE TWP SCHOOL on sat 13 apr 96
On Fri, 12 Apr 1996, mel jacobson wrote:
> ----------------------------Original message----------------------------
> talented people are a dime a dozen..most teachers adore talent,
> worship talent, but i have always admired "energy.." let me find a student
> with boundless energy, care, and wit, and i will show you success over the
> long haul.
>
> mel
>
I would have to agree with Mel. I have 135 high school ceramic students,
some of my best potters are those that are not that strong at painting or
drawing say. But, they fell in love with ceramics and were determined to
learn the wheel, stuck to it during the difficult process of centering
etc. hour, after hour after hour..... They are quite proud to have
other kids come into the ceramics classroom and watch them in awe turning
out these wonderful pots. I often hear them telling Ceramic 1 students,
"stick to it and you can do this too..." then on the other hand I see
some of the known "talented" art students come in and get really
frustrated with the wheel. They do the least they can to get by then go
back to drawing or what ever they are best at.
Give me those kids that
want to work, work, work.... any day!
Charlie Gareri
Pike High School Art Dept.
Indianapolis, IN
Dan Wilson on sat 13 apr 96
>----------------------------Original message----------------------------
>
>
>On Fri, 12 Apr 1996, mel jacobson wrote:
>
>> ----------------------------Original message----------------------------
>> talented people are a dime a dozen..
>I would have to agree with Mel.
> Give me those kids that
>want to work, work, work.... any day!
Talent?
Talent is not dependent on practice and discipline. Success is. Talent
is not the product of repetitive activity . Talent is not the result of
mastery of a medium. Why is it that I have talent and you don't? (a
rhetorical question) Talent is 'Random'. Recognizing talent is easy.
Appreciating talent is more difficult. Cultivating talent is more difficult
still.
Cyberpots@aol.com on sat 13 apr 96
Talent doesn't do too muchif one doesn't know how to get along with people.
Show me
a student who is humble and eager and the talent means more.
Marie Palluotto
israel shmueli on sat 13 apr 96
Talent is nothing. At least it is not so importent to artistic expression.
The need , the passion are what count. You are not going into art because
something you have but because something you havn't ,something you need.
Something that you still have to understand , and in our case understand
also throu our bodies .
I belive that being human is unstable situation and some of us in art and
also in science are working to understand ,reflect and maybe to make
it more bearable.
please forgive my english I'll do the same to your hebrew.
Israel Shmueli
Petach Tikva
ISRAEL
e-mail: bpottery@netvision.net.il
CaroleER@aol.com on mon 15 apr 96
Wait a minute! Why is everyone putting down talent? God gave everyone their
own special talent. Talent (or natural affinity) is what gives us a clue as
to what we're suppose to be doing with our lives. It's a gift from God which
we in turn share with the rest of the world. Pursuing our particular talent
makes us happy (even when everything falls apart). Having a particular
talent doesn't mean that you don't have to work hard to learn the field, but
it does make it a lot more fun and interesting to learn and work at - and
you're likely to spend a lot more time in pursuit of the applicable skills.
I could commit myself to learn how to be a CPA - but why would I want to?
I'd feel miserable and incomplete because math is not one of my talents
(that's an understatement!). Personally, I'm extremely grateful that some
people are talented at accounting and taxes etc.!!
Talent isn't an end in itself - but it is the driving force that steers us in
the right direction.
If you have students in your classes who don't put much effort into clay,
maybe it's because clay doesn't interest them (it happens!). Don't criticize
them. Try to steer them in the direction of their natural talent.
Carole Rishel
Bastrop, TX
CaroleER@aol.com
Sue Lily on tue 16 apr 96
Pursuing our particular talent
makes us happy (even when everything falls apart).
What about those of us with talent in areas that seem meaningless? I am so
lucky to have talent in many areas, especially brainstorming( ;-) ), but
it often directs me in ways that don't matter - I can hit a very long golf
ball, for example, and can draw anything - but so what? It is the teacher
that finds the soul in a student that serves us best - not what your
talents are, but what your spirit wants to give, what brings your own
life into center - and joy.
Repeal the Salvage Rider.
Write: president@whitehouse.gov
Ms. Lily
lily@mind.net
Lily's Pots in Southern Oregon
Dan Wilson on thu 18 apr 96
I've been reading the 'Teaching and Talent' thread with much interest
lately and I can't help adding more than my two cents worth to the mix. For
me it will be the last word on the subject and for you? Who knows. Some of
you may know me. I'm the one who was always a little more talented than the
average person ; always a little bit farther along the endless path. I was
the one who always captured the 'essence of a things existence' with
envious facility and was willing to share with others. With boundless
energy and youthful naiveteĜ I set teaching as my highest goal. For
teaching is a noble
endeavor and a weighty responsibility worthy of my highest regard. Alas, I
had no talent for teaching. Suffering from terminal shyness and an
inability to communicate clearly left me adrift for many years. Oh, I still
worked constantly. But always alone. In fact, even though I'm here with you
I'm painting in the other room and potting in the studio/garage. My goal
today is different than the goal of my youth. Then it was to use my talent
to make a living. I took it for granted. Now it is not to waste my talent.
Things do have a way of changing. Whether Talent is a gift or a random
occurrence hardly matters. It is a fact. And a teacher for good or ill
illuminated this path.
CaroleER@aol.com on thu 18 apr 96
Ms. Lily,
>On 4-16 96 Ms. Lily writes in part:
>It is the teacher that finds the soul in a student that serves us best -
not what your
>talents are, but what your spirit wants to give, what brings your own
>life into center - and joy.
That's a pretty hefty trip to lay on a teacher! What if your only teacher is
God and yourself? You have to listen to what's going on around you and
inside you to find your soul because (I swear!) your talent will lead you in
the right direction. Many times it doesn't happen when you are a child or
even a young adult. Sometimes we have to travel down life's highway (oh
please!) until we finally figure out where our talents are leading us.
>What about those of us with talent in areas that seem meaningless? I am so
>lucky to have talent in many areas, especially brainstorming( ;-) ), but
>it often directs me in ways that don't matter - I can hit a very long golf
>ball, for example, and can draw anything - but so what?
There are a lot of people making money hitting very long golf balls!
Drawing, of course, is a form of art, which seems to be important to you.
Sometimes things that seem meaningless now won't be later on - have faith.
>Repeal the Salvage Rider.
>Write: president@whitehouse.gov
What is the Salvage Rider?
Carole Rishel
Bastrop, TX
CaroleER@aol.com
Hluch - Kevin A. on mon 22 apr 96
Talent! I guess many people believe in it. It seems that some are
born with a prediliction towards certain skills but can waste them
through neglect, being side-tracked, being lazy, or a host of other
reasons. Talents are sometimes latent, sometimes obvious, sometimes
exploited, sometimes ignored.
It appears that most think that even those without "talent" can be
directed towards exceptional work...if they just work hard and
practice. Apparently talent is the mistress of passion. The love of work
appears to drive a lot. Perhaps even the most stultifying and seemingly
boring activity of various kinds can become magically alive. (It might
have been interesting to view the unabombers handiwork prior to its
destruction. Obviously, a case of mis-directed talent.)
Is this Soetsu Yanagi's point in "The Unknown Craftsman"? That is, even a
laborer untrained in art, in aesthetics, in the vocabulary of expression
can become an artist just through working?
Are those "talented" students the ones that can be shown the joy of
working with one's hands to make something of use and beauty? And
further, that this process is also a struggle but for those who persevere
will succeed in the end? Is this all it takes to be an artist -
practice and stamina?
I'm beginning to wonder if most of you think that artists are not so
special after all.
Kevin
dannon@ns1.koyote.com on tue 23 apr 96
>----------------------------Original message----------------------------
>
>Talent! I guess many people believe in it.....
>
>Are those "talented" students the ones that can be shown the joy of
>working with one's hands to make something of use and beauty....
>
>I'm beginning to wonder if most of you think that artists are not so
>special after all.
>
>Kevin
>
>What do you mean by "special"? Is the implication here that you
do believe or have believed that artists as a group are so remarkably vain
that they assume themselves superior to non-artists? This is not meant to
be inflammatory. I want to know quite literally if that is/has been your
belief. "Special" can mean a lot of things, and I do not know the
connotation here. Enlighten me, por favor, y gracias.
Dannon
Carl D. Cravens on tue 23 apr 96
On Mon, 22 Apr 1996 22:55:43 EDT, "Hluch - Kevin A." wrot
>I'm beginning to wonder if most of you think that artists are not so
>special after all.
"Special" in the sense of "mystical," I don't think so. I think
everyone has the potential to be an artist. Those who *are* artists are
special because they have found the right circumstances to allow them to
develop their art. Art-for-a-living is a dangerous route.
Art-as-a-hobby fights with many other demands for the artist's time.
Artists are special because they do no accept the status quo of working
a 9 to 5 job, collecting a paycheck, and just sitting in front of the TV
outside of working hours. (A gross exaggeration in many cases, but
spot-on in others when it comes to the average Joe.)
The artist is special because he or she is devoted to the art *in spite
of* all the things that make it difficult. In spite of the risk of
being unable to provide for the family. In spite of having to raise
children. In spite of having to work a day job. The easy way out is to
watch TV... don't do anything constructive or challenging. Don't learn.
Just sit back and absorb. The artist doesn't find satisfaction in
just absorbing... the artists finds satisfaction in doing. That's what
makes the artist special. The artist is not special because of what he
or she is. The artist is special because of what he or she does.
--
Carl (ravenpub@southwind.net)
* It's only a hobby ... only a hobby ... only a
Kathy Wosika on tue 23 apr 96
>>
>>I'm beginning to wonder if most of you think that artists are not so
>>special after all.
>>
>>Kevin
>
>
>I'd like to add a word in on this one. I feel that it's not that " artists
>are not so special" but that EACH one of us IS an artist, individually and
>uniquely. Our essence is creative. We are born into a world/universe
>that is in the continual process of creating and destroying itself. At
>our very molecular essences physicists know that we are continually
>creating and destroying our own bodies! To be a creator, an artist is our
>birthright! We live it on many levels every day, albiet unconsciously.
>Whether we wish to develop our fundamental creative truth to further
>levels of expression is our individual CHOICE. Here, some of us have a
>head start in a particular medium...... an affinity called Talent!...and
>some of us discover a Love and just have to commit to working hard in
>order to explore and develop its potential and meaning in our lives.
>
>Kathy Wosika
Hluch - Kevin A. on wed 24 apr 96
Dannon,
I consider "special" to mean unique, distinctive, unusual....Like she has
a specialtalent for the piano. Furthermore...one is led to
believe that some, if one takes seriously what one reads, are gifted by
the gods...
I could mention a few names, but then again, so probably could you.
Certainly, however, if one has a "special" ability like throwing pots on
the wheel then at least in that skill they are superior to others who
cannot demonstrate that ability.
Artists are indeed a rather vain lot. After all, some would say that
every work of art is a self portrait...I guess a lifetime of that kind of
activity would have an impact.
Kevin
On Tues 13 Apr 1996 dannon@ns1.koyote.com wrote:
> ----------------------------Original message----------------------------
> >----------------------------Original message----------------------------
> >
> >Talent! I guess many people believe in it.....
> >
> >Are those "talented" students the ones that can be shown the joy of
> >working with one's hands to make something of use and beauty....
> >
> >I'm beginning to wonder if most of you think that artists are not so
> >special after all.
> >
> >Kevin
> >
> >What do you mean by "special"? Is the implication here that you
> do believe or have believed that artists as a group are so remarkably vain
> that they assume themselves superior to non-artists? This is not meant to
> be inflammatory. I want to know quite literally if that is/has been your
> belief. "Special" can mean a lot of things, and I do not know the
> connotation here. Enlighten me, por favor, y gracias.
>
> Dannon
>
Darlene Yarnetsky on wed 24 apr 96
Hello all!
I can certainly relate to the blue frustrations. I remember reading
somewhere that blue is supposed to have a soothing calming effect on
people. Certainly not for many potters!
"Don't you have that in blue?" is one of those exasperating
questions we all hear too often. I like to use blue sparingly, mostly in
combinations with other colors. There are a few people buying pottery
who appreciate this. I was so excited to hear a women exclaim "I love
your brown and greens!" last Saturday. What a relief! I suspect I could
sell more if all my pots were blue, but such is life.
I am reminded of my college professor hiding the cobalt
periodically from beginning students. Can't say I blame him
Darlene Y. in Madison In.,
where spring has finally bloomed, all in a weekend...
wehrman@goldrush.com on thu 25 apr 96
I think the only artists we become aware of are the "vain" or arrogant. Without
this beneficial quality, an artist may not have the confidence to even imagine
their work is important enough to be seen. A certain amount of arrogance is
necessary to sell anything. (IMHO)
"Cockroaches and vanity are the only things that will survive the
nuclear holocaust..."
anonymous
Pat wehrman@goldrush.com
http//www.goldrush.com/~wehrman/index.html
TROY@JUNCOL.JUNIATA.EDU on fri 26 apr 96
"Cockroaches and vanity are the only things that will survive the
nuclear holocaust..."
anonymous
And vanity will initiate the holocaust.
Jack Troy
dannon@ns1.koyote.com on fri 26 apr 96
>----------------------------Original message----------------------------
>Dannon
>
>Artists are indeed a rather vain lot. After all, some would say that
>every work of art is a self portrait...I guess a lifetime of that kind of
>activity would have an impact.
>
>
>Kevin
I think that vanity as a human trait is not at a greater percentage among
artists than among the population at large, but I have no intention of doing
any kind of study to support my position. It's just my observation.
I will go a bit further, and state that my experience (limited, I'm well
aware) has been that most of the artists I know are not only not vain, they
have no real interest in how others view them; their interest tends to be in
the work they do, and in the work others do. They have a disinterested eye,
as it were.
Dannon
Chris Stanley on sat 27 apr 96
>----------------------------Original message----------------------------
>"Cockroaches and vanity are the only things that will survive the
>nuclear holocaust..."
> anonymous
>And vanity will initiate the holocaust.
>Jack Troy
> Me I'm climbing in the kiln with the pots. Better yet, only Cockroaches
>with Vanity will Survive.
They will probably take credit for the whole thing and in their own little
way laugh it up over several brews in somebodies bomb shelter.
"Hey, Remember those stinking Humans?" HEE Heee Hee!
Anyway, the dome has been stuccoed and we did a very tastefull job of using
the shard pile to decorate the stucco. We're trying to keep that southwest
adobe feel around here, it's so hard to do with all the seven-elevens and
Pizza huts. (secretly, I believe both to be base on the Golden Section)
On that Armagedon thread. There used to be a Bumper sticker we played
with in school.
The original said " You can't hug your kids with Nuclear Arms" A little
cut and paste and
"You can't Arm your kids with Nuclear Hugs" Anyway it was funny in the 70's!
Peas,
art_selsor@vicuna.emcmt.edu on sat 27 apr 96
Artists may be a vain bunch, but my observations world-wide tends to
indicate clay workers share a humilty spawned by the clay itself.
Marcia in Montana
Joyce Lee on thu 18 jun 98
In my limited but growing experience as a groupie and ardent admirer of
potters and potter/artists, it's apparent to me (for now...still open to
conjecture) that the only ones who passionately avow that there is no
such thing as "native talent" are the ones who possess it in abundance.
The rest of us know better. A still developing secondary theory is that
many of these naturally endowed talented artists too often "give up" on
throwing..."just can't do the wheel," they'll say...after only a few
attempts because (and here's the "theory" part) they're so accustomed to
artistic endeavor resulting in immediately acceptable results...at
least, close to what they envision with their artist's eye. The concept
of working for months, maybe years, to create an "adequate" product is
beyond their experience. Read on, please, before hittin' the keyboard.
Of course, these wonderful artists must have labored through trial and
error and accident and fire and brimstone and still not reached the
pinnacle for which they are striving. Naturally, nothing worth having
comes easily (to coin a cliche), but they struggle on........however,
all of us here know that their striving is not to compare with most of
our first baby-step attempts at the wheel. I think that's why so many
potters exude that most valuable form of humor, self-denigration.
Throwing keeps us beyond simply humble. Have you noted that the very,
very finest of us, after 30 years of being accepted as "on top," let
slip that small, whispery sigh of relief after once again completing a
successful demonstration of some clay feat (another coin here)most of us
can't even hope to achieve in one lifetime. My point, I think, is that
while throwing successfully (and firing and glazing and all the
mechanical, crafty kinds of acts in which we indulge) may be a result of
hard work, knowledge, attention to detail and practice, the final magic
touches that can exist on the simplest of pots, but never on mine, are
the manifestation of "native talent."
Joyce
In the Mojave not believing that she dares to comment on ART...
Richard Aerni on fri 19 jun 98
Joyce,
An interesting point, but hard for anyone to analyze/validate, given that
we haven't lived with the person in question, and watched them develop.
As I progress and grow in my ceramic career, I have come to the
conclusion that the main requisite to becoming successful with clay is
perseverance. Plus, of course, a dose of focus and a willingness to
learn, and a large dollop of pure love of the medium. When I look at
people's work, I don't see talent or lack of it, just an abundance or
scarcity of some of the above qualities.
Respectfully,
Richard Aerni, not sure whether he's a potter, artist, or craftsperson,
but damn sure that he's a baseball coach and cook...
Joyce Lee wrote:
>
> ----------------------------Original message----------------------------
> In my limited but growing experience as a groupie and ardent admirer of
> potters and potter/artists, it's apparent to me (for now...still open to
> conjecture) that the only ones who passionately avow that there is no
> such thing as "native talent" are the ones who possess it in abundance........
major snippage
.......... My point, I think, is that
> while throwing successfully (and firing and glazing and all the
> mechanical, crafty kinds of acts in which we indulge) may be a result of
> hard work, knowledge, attention to detail and practice, the final magic
> touches that can exist on the simplest of pots, but never on mine, are
> the manifestation of "native talent."
>
> Joyce
> In the Mojave not believing that she dares to comment on ART...
Paul Lewing on fri 19 jun 98
Joyce,
It's an interesting observation that the only people who deny the
existence of talent are those who possess it. I think I'm one of those
people who have always had whatever that is, because drawing was
easier for me to learn than writing, and came earlier. I keep a
drawing of mine from the third grade on my studio wall. I'm not sure
I can draw that well now, in some ways. But I've also always believed
that anybody who really wanted to do art could do it. Thomas Edison
said that creativity was 10% inspiration and 90% perspiration. After
all, back in Victorian times, when they didn't think women were worth
educating, every upper class English woman was expected to know how to
draw, play a musical instrument, and speak a foriegn language (and not
much else. "Don't wory your pretty little head about that, my dear.")
Well, upperclass Victoria English women can't have been any more or
less talented than any other random group.
However, my brother, who is an accomplished musician, says there's
nothing to playing the piano- you just hit the right key at the right
time. To which I reply that there's nothing to drawing- you just put
the right mark in the right place. But the fact remains that the only
thing he can draw is flies, and I can't carry a tune in a bucket. So
in spite of my rationalization, you may be right. I'll tell you one
thing, though. If there is such a thing as talent, and I did get it,
I thank whatever source it came from every day.
Paul Lewing, Seattle
Talbott on fri 19 jun 98
Joyce.. Good post.. I agree that talent is developed over time with much
hard work and perseverance. I agree that it often takes years for one to
refine their talents as a potter, woodworker, sculptor, etc. I fortunately
have been able to witness this evolution. A few years ago I built a black
walnut rocking chair that required many hours of hard work. The chair is
admired greatly by many that see it but the basic design is not my own..
Therein is the difference between an artist and the rest, the ability to
design.
Marshall
http://www.PotteryInfo.com
>----------------------------Original message----------------------------
>In my limited but growing experience as a groupie and ardent admirer of
>potters and potter/artists, it's apparent to me (for now...still open to
>conjecture) that the only ones who passionately avow that there is no
>such thing as "native talent" are the ones who possess it in abundance.
>The rest of us know better. A still developing secondary theory is that
>many of these naturally endowed talented artists too often "give up" on
>throwing..."just can't do the wheel," they'll say...after only a few
>attempts because (and here's the "theory" part) they're so accustomed to
>artistic endeavor resulting in immediately acceptable results...at
>least, close to what they envision with their artist's eye. The concept
>of working for months, maybe years, to create an "adequate" product is
>beyond their experience. Read on, please, before hittin' the keyboard.
>Of course, these wonderful artists must have labored through trial and
>error and accident and fire and brimstone and still not reached the
>pinnacle for which they are striving. Naturally, nothing worth having
>comes easily (to coin a cliche), but they struggle on........however,
>all of us here know that their striving is not to compare with most of
>our first baby-step attempts at the wheel. I think that's why so many
>potters exude that most valuable form of humor, self-denigration.
>Throwing keeps us beyond simply humble. Have you noted that the very,
>very finest of us, after 30 years of being accepted as "on top," let
>slip that small, whispery sigh of relief after once again completing a
>successful demonstration of some clay feat (another coin here)most of us
>can't even hope to achieve in one lifetime. My point, I think, is that
>while throwing successfully (and firing and glazing and all the
>mechanical, crafty kinds of acts in which we indulge) may be a result of
>hard work, knowledge, attention to detail and practice, the final magic
>touches that can exist on the simplest of pots, but never on mine, are
>the manifestation of "native talent."
>
>Joyce
>In the Mojave not believing that she dares to comment on ART...
http://www.PotteryInfo.com
101 CLAYART MUGS (Summer 1998)
2ND ANNUAL CLAYARTERS' GALLERY - NAPLES, MAINE (Summer 1998)
E-MAIL ME FOR APPLICATIONS
Celia & Marshall Talbott, Pottery By Celia, Route 114, P O Box 4116,
Naples, Maine 04055-4116,(207)693-6100 voice and fax,(call first)
---------------------------------------------------------------------
Don & Isao Morrill on fri 19 jun 98
At 08:55 6/18/98 EDT, you wrote:
>----------------------------Original message----------------------------
>In my limited but growing experience as a groupie and ardent admirer of
>potters and potter/artists, it's apparent to me (for now...still open to
>conjecture) that the only ones who passionately avow that there is no
>such thing as "native talent" are the ones who possess it in abundance.
>The rest of us know better. A still developing secondary theory is that
>many of these naturally endowed talented artists too often "give up" on
>throwing..."just can't do the wheel," they'll say...after only a few
>attempts because (and here's the "theory" part) they're so accustomed to
>artistic endeavor resulting in immediately acceptable results...at
>least, close to what they envision with their artist's eye. The concept
>of working for months, maybe years, to create an "adequate" product is
>beyond their experience. Read on, please, before hittin' the keyboard.
>Of course, these wonderful artists must have labored through trial and
>error and accident and fire and brimstone and still not reached the
>pinnacle for which they are striving. Naturally, nothing worth having
>comes easily (to coin a cliche), but they struggle on........however,
>all of us here know that their striving is not to compare with most of
>our first baby-step attempts at the wheel. I think that's why so many
>potters exude that most valuable form of humor, self-denigration.
>Throwing keeps us beyond simply humble. Have you noted that the very,
>very finest of us, after 30 years of being accepted as "on top," let
>slip that small, whispery sigh of relief after once again completing a
>successful demonstration of some clay feat (another coin here)most of us
>can't even hope to achieve in one lifetime. My point, I think, is that
>while throwing successfully (and firing and glazing and all the
>mechanical, crafty kinds of acts in which we indulge) may be a result of
>hard work, knowledge, attention to detail and practice, the final magic
>touches that can exist on the simplest of pots, but never on mine, are
>the manifestation of "native talent."
>
>Joyce
>In the Mojave not believing that she dares to comment on ART...
>
>Well Joyce, here comes a stab at the business from our also limited
experience.It has been our experience that,in addition to much of what you
have mentioned is a very strong social component dealing with 'status'.
There are few contries, wherepotters have had status..potting has usually
been of the lower classes. If potting in Japan became of higher status,it
has been principply through 'raku' which,as Leach,(?) has written,was the
affectation of the dillitante and bore no relationship to the 'common
pottery' in everyday use. While it is true that such persons as
Hamada,Leach and Tomomoto have attempted to 'raise' thestatus of pottery by
resurrecting folk pottery,even here we are not dealing with common
potters,but with highly educated,essentially upper-class,persons. Perhaps
Yanagi,Soesetsu,(The Unknown Craftsman) cuts best through most of the crap
to get to the level of the peasantry but,even here his own background gets
in the way by idolizing the 'unknown' craftsman. You will note that there
is no mention of the 'unknown "Crafts woman."
amy parker on sat 20 jun 98
>
>However, my brother, who is an accomplished musician, says there's
>nothing to playing the piano- you just hit the right key at the right
>time. To which I reply that there's nothing to drawing- you just put
>the right mark in the right place. But the fact remains that the only
>thing he can draw is flies, and I can't carry a tune in a bucket. So
>in spite of my rationalization, you may be right. I'll tell you one
>thing, though. If there is such a thing as talent, and I did get it,
>I thank whatever source it came from every day.
>
>Paul Lewing, Seattle
>
Our brains are all different. Some things are easier for some of us than
others. Some of us can spell. Some of us are good at calculus. Some can
cook. Some can draw. Some paint. Some scuplt. Some throw clay. All of
us can learn to do all of this to a certain degree. It just takes PRACTICE.
LOTS of PRACTICE. Then we can produce an acceptable end product. This is
the ability to learn a skill or (God forbid) a CRAFT!
As to whether or not it is ART - ART, like beauty, is in the eye of the
beholder. If it truly appeals to YOU, then for you it is ART. For me,
it might be trash. Or worse, I might have to ASK what it IS!
ART is something that jumps out & grabs you & you say WOW! I really like
this! Of course this is Your Humble Opinion and who are they to say that
their opinion is more worthy than yours - ???
Good art should have enough good CRAFT behind it that it will last for
generations. We can all learn the craft, and if we are lucky, then others
will appreciate what we have made.
amy parker Lithonia, GA
amyp@sd-software.com
Joyce Lee on sun 21 jun 98
In my limited but growing experience as a groupie and ardent admirer of
potters and potter/artists, it's apparent to me (for now...still open to
conjecture) that the only ones who passionately avow that there is no
such thing as "native talent" are the ones who possess it in abundance.
The rest of us know better. A still developing secondary theory is that
many of these naturally endowed talented artists too often "give up" on
throwing..."just can't do the wheel," they'll say...after only a few
attempts because (and here's the "theory" part) they're so accustomed to
artistic endeavor resulting in immediately acceptable results...at
least, close to what they envision with their artist's eye. The concept
of working for months, maybe years, to create an "adequate" product is
beyond their experience. Read on, please, before hittin' the keyboard.
Of course, these wonderful artists must have labored through trial and
error and accident and fire and brimstone and still not reached the
pinnacle for which they are striving. Naturally, nothing worth having
comes easily (to coin a cliche), but they struggle on........however,
all of us here know that their striving is not to compare with most of
our first baby-step attempts at the wheel. I think that's why so many
potters exude that most valuable form of humor, self-denigration.
Throwing keeps us beyond simply humble. Have you noted that the very,
very finest of us, after 30 years of being accepted as "on top," let
slip that small, whispery sigh of relief after once again completing a
successful demonstration of some clay feat (another coin here)most of us
can't even hope to achieve in one lifetime. My point, I think, is that
while throwing successfully (and firing and glazing and all the
mechanical, crafty kinds of acts in which we indulge) may be a result of
hard work, knowledge, attention to detail and practice, the final magic
touches that can exist on the simplest of pots, but never on mine, are
the manifestation of "native talent."
Joyce
In the Mojave not believing that she dares to comment on ART...
Tom Wirt on sun 21 jun 98
This 'natural talent' thing has always puzzled me because I do believe that
the human animal is naturally creative....maybe that is the thing that
separates us from the other critters.
One hypothesis I have is that it's not 'talent' per se that makes one a
musician, one a writer and one a potter. Rather it is the way our muscles
work, the way our brains are wired and the environmental influences in those
first few years.
Example, some people are good a fast reactions, abrupt movements, others at
slower, flowing movements. Some see 'the big picture', some the detail.
Some think and learn logically, some emotionally. Add the variations of
these various 'talents' together and you get potters, writers, painters,
etc.
But someone's probably already done a thesis on this so it's probably old
news.
FWIW
Tom Wirt
Clay Coyote Pottery
Hutchinson MN
claypot@hutchtel.net
Cindy on mon 22 jun 98
Joyce,
There is no such thing as native talent. I am quite passionate about this.
Sorry--couldn't resist.
Actually, I agree that some people tend to be better at this, and others at
that. You just have to find your niche. The thing that irritates me is that
so many people insist they aren't good at anything. Sometimes it takes some
searching to find the gifts within us, but we do all have something special
and unique to offer. That, I *am* passionate about.
Cindy Strnad
Earthen Vessels
Custer, SD
USA http://blackhills-info.com/a/cindys/menu.htm
Richard Aerni on tue 17 aug 04
I guess I feel that I don't really know much about talent. I've never
thought of myself as talented in clay, or in art for that matter. What I
do have, is a brain to noodle things out, and a damn hard head that refuses
to take no for an answer. I don't "get" art or craft things quickly, which
would probably have made me a poor candidate to succeed in one of our
establishments of higher art/craft learning, but working on my own, and in
a studio with others, I had time to do and do over, over and over, until I
began to get things right.
Don't feel bad if you've no talent. Do feel bad if you give up because you
think you've no talent.
Keep working!
Best,
Richard Aerni
Rochester, NY
Rimas VisGirda on sun 19 jun 11
Nice clip about talent... -Rimas
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3DCtUuJo_DeyI&feature=3Dfvwrel
| |
|
