Vince Pitelka on thu 3 may 07
Darrell Calhoun wrote:
"I'm in Concord, NC. They are saying that the black smoke is polluting the
environment. No, the kiln is built away from the school in area designated
by the school system's supervisor of maintenance. I need facts and
statistics that show just how insignificant this little 35 cubic foot kiln
is compared to other things. I'm worried this will become a battle of
politics and want to be prepared with a good argument."
Darrell -
You can fire a wood kiln in such a fashion to minimize smoke, and you should
certainly do that. But more importantly, this is a very old tradition that
produces results available through no other firing method. Ceramics
students need to learn this firing process, and it is an incredible
cooperative experience for everyone involved. The wood-firing experience
builds confidence and a broadened cultural perspective in the students.
You probably do not fire this kiln very often, and with that in mind, the
carbon particulates and CO2 produced over time would be extremely small
compared to what is produced by the vehicles that those scientists drive to
work every day. Please point out to them how often this kiln is fired.
When you are firing, once the chimney gets hot, make sure you are letting a
little oxygen into the chimney to improve combustion of remaining carbon
particulates. That increases the CO2 produced, but cuts down on the carbon
particulates (the smoke), and thus less complaints. There isn't really any
way to fire a wood kiln and cut down on CO2 produced, but it's a microscopic
fraction of what is causing global warming, with far more practical ways to
cut back on CO2 production than complaining about wood kilns.
If you think it would help, I would be glad to write a letter to the
concerned scientists.
- Vince
Vince Pitelka
Appalachian Center for Craft, Tennessee Technological University
Smithville TN 37166, 615/597-6801 x111
vpitelka@dtccom.net, wpitelka@tntech.edu
http://iweb.tntech.edu/wpitelka/
http://www.tntech.edu/craftcenter/
darrell calhoun on thu 3 may 07
After getting approval from the High School's Principal, the school system and safety inspector I built a wood kiln here for my students. We just had our first firing which was very nice. It was my first woodfiring experience and I feel very fortunate that it went well.
NOW a few science teachers are thinking of getting a petition started to do away with the kiln because of the smoke. Can anyone give me some "ammo" in the form of statements to justify my kiln.
PS
Thanks to Mel, John Britt, Shane Mickey, Hank Murrow and all of the other that gave me design and construction advice. The kiln fires like a dream and I couldn't have done it without you guys and this Clayart community. Also a big thanks to Andrew Linton who was our Artist in Residence during the firing.
Randy Calhoun
Pottery and Sculpture Teacher
Jay M. Robinson High School
---------------------------------
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Lee Burningham on thu 3 may 07
Where are you? Why are they complaining? Is the kiln built near an air
intake for the school ventilation system?
Lee Burningham
"NOW a few science teachers are thinking of getting a petition started
to do away with the kiln because of the smoke. Can anyone give me some
"ammo" in the form of statements to justify my kiln."
darrell calhoun on thu 3 may 07
>Lee Burningham wrote: >Where are you? Why are they complaining? Is the kiln built near an air
>intake for the school ventilation system?
I'm in Concord, NC. They are saying that the black smoke is polluting the environment. No, the kiln is built away from the school in area designated by the school system's supervisor of maintenance. I need facts and statistics that show just how insignificant this little 35 cubic foot kiln is compared to other things. I'm worried this will become a battle of politics and want to be prepared with a good argument. Thanks
Lee Burningham wrote:
Where are you? Why are they complaining? Is the kiln built near an air
intake for the school ventilation system?
Lee Burningham
"NOW a few science teachers are thinking of getting a petition started
to do away with the kiln because of the smoke. Can anyone give me some
"ammo" in the form of statements to justify my kiln."
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jim on thu 3 may 07
I am in Concord also. If you need any help just let me know..
>
> I'm in Concord, NC. They are saying that the black smoke is
> polluting the environment. No, the kiln is built away from the
> school in area designated by the school system's supervisor of
> maintenance. I need facts and statistics that show just how
> insignificant this little 35 cubic foot kiln is compared to other
> things. I'm worried this will become a battle of politics and want
> to be prepared with a good argument. Thanks
>
WJ Seidl on fri 4 may 07
Vince and Darrell:
A bit ago, I posted about an article in (I believe) "The Log Book" about
a university
that removed all traces of smoke from their wood kiln exhaust
by the addition of a blower in the bottom of the flue, IIRC.
It should be in the archives.
I have recently heard from another potter that almost completely removed
all smoke from their
stack on a 30 cu ft. MFT style kiln, simply by putting a blow dryer in a
secondary air inlet
near the stack.
I don't know how that would affect clay body/glaze reduction, but it
might be worth a shot. You can buy a cheap
blow dryer at any drug store for $10 or less. A leaf blower on low might
also be enough to remove all smoke.
No visible smoke, no visible problem, no reason to complain.
Best,
Wayne Seidl
Vince Pitelka wrote:
> Darrell Calhoun wrote:
> "I'm in Concord, NC. They are saying that the black smoke is polluting the
> environment. No, the kiln is built away from the school in area designated
> by the school system's supervisor of maintenance. I need facts and
> statistics that show just how insignificant this little 35 cubic foot kiln
> is compared to other things. I'm worried this will become a battle of
> politics and want to be prepared with a good argument."
>
> Darrell -
> You can fire a wood kiln in such a fashion to minimize smoke, and you
> should
> certainly do that. But more importantly, this is a very old tradition that
> produces results available through no other firing method. Ceramics
> students need to learn this firing process, and it is an incredible
> cooperative experience for everyone involved. The wood-firing experience
> builds confidence and a broadened cultural perspective in the students.
>
> You probably do not fire this kiln very often, and with that in mind, the
> carbon particulates and CO2 produced over time would be extremely small
> compared to what is produced by the vehicles that those scientists drive to
> work every day. Please point out to them how often this kiln is fired.
>
>
> When you are firing, once the chimney gets hot, make sure you are letting a
> little oxygen into the chimney to improve combustion of remaining carbon
> particulates. That increases the CO2 produced, but cuts down on the carbon
> particulates (the smoke), and thus less complaints. There isn't really any
> way to fire a wood kiln and cut down on CO2 produced, but it's a
> microscopic
> fraction of what is causing global warming, with far more practical ways to
> cut back on CO2 production than complaining about wood kilns.
>
> If you think it would help, I would be glad to write a letter to the
> concerned scientists.
> - Vince
>
> Vince Pitelka
> Appalachian Center for Craft, Tennessee Technological University
> Smithville TN 37166, 615/597-6801 x111
> vpitelka@dtccom.net, wpitelka@tntech.edu
> http://iweb.tntech.edu/wpitelka/
> http://www.tntech.edu/craftcenter/
>
> ______________________________________________________________________________
>
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
> melpots@pclink.com.
>
David Woof on fri 4 may 07
Darrel, Some good people helped you with a good design. You had a
successful first firing. Good start. You are more than half way there.
It's good to cultivate friendships or at least respect between you and the
fire department, the dean and higher ups in any field or government agency
that has authority to call your shots or support you.
However because we live in a world where Green is the current wagon to lip
serve while our personal vehicles and war machinery spew the planet with
waste and ruin, notes from other potters and these fore named connections
will not help your cause.
Already, public education is underway and regulations are being put in
effect re fireplaces, campfires.........Campfires in wilderness areas. A
ranger I was discussing this with said, "pack in a coleman gas light or
light a flouresent lantern and sit around that." On reflecting I came up
with pure starlight and wind soughing in the pines.
It is here now, "smoke and we will shut you down" and if we attempt to
persuade that we really aren't contributing "that much in comparison to...."
we either hit the knee jerk denial buttons or trigger the "my authority is
being challenged" reflex and it all goes down from there.
However we have those among us who are working successfully with the
officials, who because they sense a responsible and cooperative attitude are
working with us to achieve a mutual goal and not shut us down. They are
published, perhaps they will speak to this here.
We have good information in the archives re smokeless kilns. Some of the
information really works.
We must educate ourselves. It is a new challenge, a new point of interest
for experimenting, research and publishing. Someone near you is fireing
smokless.
Here are some basics; dry hard wood produces less visable smoke per
calorie than the resinous pines. but the ash of soft pines produce a nice
finish to overlay the hardwood ash accumulation during the last seveal hours
of firing. Both can be fired "smokeless" to cone 12 and higher.
There is good information on chimney design in publications and the clayart
archives. Good design with proper air adjustments, intake and exit, will
bring you to temp with efficient use of a resource.
We must be honest at least to ourselves about all this, nothing goes away,
it just changes form. So we have a kiln that dosen't smoke, we haul our
precious creations to market in a "smokeless" conveyance, we burned wood
that was waste bla bla. but and so, are we Green or any Greener? where has
our by products of smokeless energy production gone off to? If I thought
too long or hard about this what changes would I need make, where would I
go, what would I have to do?
So it's 6:30 am, my little sweetie is out working her 11' stainless steel
sculpture with orbital 320 grit and I have clay to work and kiln to prep for
the next "smokeless" firing.
Best wishes
David
_________________________________
_________________________________
David Woof Studio
Clarkdale, Arizona
Ph. 928-821-3747
________________________________
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David Hendley on fri 4 may 07
I don't know what kind of kiln you have, but, really, black
smoke should not be coming out the chimney. Maybe you
haven't learned how to fire it properly? (very likely after
only one firing)
Even for a reduction firing, black smoke is not necessary,
just some periods of "light gray" smoke. This need be no
more noticeable than the smoke from a fireplace when it is
first started or an air-tight wood stove with the air supply
slightly restricted.
David Hendley
Maydelle, Texas
david@farmpots.com
www.farmpots.com
>> They are saying that the black smoke is
>> polluting the environment. No, the kiln is built away from the
>> school in area designated by the school system's supervisor of
>> maintenance. I need facts and statistics that show just how
>> insignificant this little 35 cubic foot kiln is compared to other
>> things. I'm worried this will become a battle of politics and want
>> to be prepared with a good argument. Thanks
The Goodsons on fri 4 may 07
I will come help too, if you need people to support you.
Linda in Lincolnton
jim wrote:
> I am in Concord also. If you need any help just let me know..
>
>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
Lee Burningham on fri 4 may 07
Howdy,
The nceca conference notes from a couple of years back should give you
more than enough ammo for your science guys. John Neely and the crew
from Utah State presented information comparing salt and soda firings.
I'm sure they also have information on the wood kilns up there. Check
with them for the best information available.=20
Don't quote me but I think it was said that the firing of the salt kiln
was less contaminating of the environment than a metro bus running
routes for mass transit. I don't have any facts or figures on wood kilns
but John Neely could hook you up.
Lee Burningham
Duff bogen on fri 4 may 07
Darrell
You did a good job going through the authority struture- now that they have signed off on the project they are signed on to your team.
I think the political/educational approach would follow this line-
"I share your concern about pollution."
"I think that what you're pointing out is an educational opportunity for students to understand the environmental consequences of all human activity. (Even breathing has the consequence of exhaling a greenhouse gas!)"
"The importance of this project is that our students can experiential explore these consequences. They can hold their pot in one hand and remember the fire and smoke of it cost to make it."
"So often these children experience a disconect between what they have and what it cost. That the mug they bought at Mall-Wart was at the cost of burning coal which releases Sulfates and particulates which blow across the Pacific to pollute the US."
"I'd really like your help tying in this big picture of the relationship of production, pollution and consumerism. Linking it to our students' real time experience with this kiln, with its demonstration of the relationship of their product and its pollution will be a powerful learning experience."
Bon Chance
Duff
darrell calhoun wrote:
After getting approval from the High School's Principal, the school system and safety inspector I built a wood kiln here for my students. We just had our first firing which was very nice. It was my first woodfiring experience and I feel very fortunate that it went well.
NOW a few science teachers are thinking of getting a petition started to do away with the kiln because of the smoke. Can anyone give me some "ammo" in the form of statements to justify my kiln.
PS
Thanks to Mel, John Britt, Shane Mickey, Hank Murrow and all of the other that gave me design and construction advice. The kiln fires like a dream and I couldn't have done it without you guys and this Clayart community. Also a big thanks to Andrew Linton who was our Artist in Residence during the firing.
Randy Calhoun
Pottery and Sculpture Teacher
Jay M. Robinson High School
---------------------------------
Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell?
Check outnew cars at Yahoo! Autos.
______________________________________________________________________________
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You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
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---------------------------------
Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell?
Check outnew cars at Yahoo! Autos.
Paul Herman on fri 4 may 07
Hi Randy,
I think I would try to enlist the science teachers in helping to get
the kiln to smoke less. After all, they teach science, and are
hopefully aware of the dangers of burning fossil fuels, and the
advantages of burning biomass fuels.
At the wood fire conference in Flagstaff last fall, there was a
presentation about fixing a problem very much like yours. Wayne
mentioned an article in "The Log Book", written by the same guy.
(Issue # 27, 2006 "Smoke Free Woodfiring?" by Bede Clarke) They got
the local air quality officials to help design an air injection
system that they swear by, and they are able to fire their anagama in
town with very little visible smoke.
It has a blower that adds air to a small chamber just before the
chimney base. In Japan they call the small chamber the sutema. They
stoke the kiln, and turn on the blower. After a minute or two they
turn the blower off. Next time they stoke, they hit the blower again.
From their description, it sounded like a total success.
I'm not clear on what style of kiln you have. Would you describe it
please?
I highly recommend The Log Book. It's a little magazine for wood
firers and other interested people, and comes out four times a year.
It has great articles from all over the world, and no ads.
http://homepage.eircom.net/~thelogbook/
I think your students are fortunate to have such an enthusiastic
teacher.
Good luck,
Paul Herman
Great Basin Pottery
Doyle, California US
http://greatbasinpottery.com
On May 3, 2007, at 11:32 AM, darrell calhoun wrote:
> NOW a few science teachers are thinking of getting a petition
> started to do away with the kiln because of the smoke. Can anyone
> give me some "ammo" in the form of statements to justify my kiln.
>
Andrew M Casto on fri 4 may 07
Randy,
If you find that you do have make modifications to the structure of the
kiln, I think a taller chimney may decrease your smoke production. I had a
wood kiln until very recently (sold house & studio) that was pretty smokey
at times, especially when I was learning to fire it. I increased the height
of the chimney to acheieve better draft in the kiln, and found that it also
smoked much less. The Kansaki (SP?) Japanese Wood Fired Ceramics book lists
a "smokeless" wood kiln design, and as far as I can tell the main idea
behind this is a tall chimney. You would of course need to consider the
ramifications on the rest of your firing process, which, if you got a good
firing on the first try, sounds like it may be pretty good. Not sure that I
would want to mess things up I guess. But in my experience (which is not
much - 1 kiln) the added height would cut down on the smoke factor. There
also may be things you can change with dryer wood, less aggressive stoking,
less reduction/damper use, etc to cut back as well.
Good Luck...
Andy Casto
www.redbridgepottery.com
darrell calhoun wrote:
After getting approval from the High School's Principal, the school system
and safety inspector I built a wood kiln here for my students. We just had
our first firing which was very nice. It was my first woodfiring experience
and I feel very fortunate that it went well.
NOW a few science teachers are thinking of getting a petition started to do
away with the kiln because of the smoke. Can anyone give me some "ammo" in
the form of statements to justify my kiln.
PS
Thanks to Mel, John Britt, Shane Mickey, Hank Murrow and all of the other
that gave me design and construction advice. The kiln fires like a dream
and I couldn't have done it without you guys and this Clayart community.
Also a big thanks to Andrew Linton who was our Artist in Residence during
the firing.
Randy Calhoun
Pottery and Sculpture Teacher
Jay M. Robinson High School
---------------------------------
Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell?
Check outnew cars at Yahoo! Autos.
______________________________________________________________________________
Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
melpots@pclink.com.
---------------------------------
Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell?
Check outnew cars at Yahoo! Autos.
______________________________________________________________________________
Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
melpots@pclink.com.
Vince Pitelka on fri 4 may 07
Wayne Seidl wrote:
> A bit ago, I posted about an article in (I believe) "The Log Book" about
> a university
> that removed all traces of smoke from their wood kiln exhaust
> by the addition of a blower in the bottom of the flue, IIRC.
Wayne -
That is indeed a great idea. At NCECA I bought the entire set of "The Log
Book," so I'll look through them and see if I can find that article.
The stack on our "hoggama" has a passive damper port just above the
mechanical dampers, and as soon as the chimney gets hot, that passive damper
makes all the difference in smoke production. When it is closed, there's
smoke. When it is at least partially open, there's little or no smoke. If
the smoke was still a problem, then the next step would be to use a blower
as you describe. My only hesitation about blow driers is that they are
never intended for continuous duty. If one goes to www.grainger.com, there
is a wide range of 110v blowers that are rated for continuous duty and would
work great for this purpose.
- Vince
Vince Pitelka
Appalachian Center for Craft, Tennessee Technological University
Smithville TN 37166, 615/597-6801 x111
vpitelka@dtccom.net, wpitelka@tntech.edu
http://iweb.tntech.edu/wpitelka/
http://www.tntech.edu/craftcenter/
Lee Love on fri 4 may 07
Darrell,
What kind of wood are you firing? If it is wood that is going to
be burnt anyway, you are not adding any pollution, but are getting
work out of otherwise junk wood.
Also, you can plant trees to offset any carbon you put in
the air. If you manage a woodlot for the purpose of fuel, you take
a net 2/3rds carbon out of the air in the form of roots, leaves, etc,
left in the woods.
--
Lee in Mashiko, Japan
Minneapolis, Minnesota USA
http://potters.blogspot.com/
"To affect the quality of the day, that is the highest of arts." -
Henry David Thoreau
"Let the beauty we love be what we do." - Rumi
Lee Love on sat 5 may 07
On 5/5/07, Vince Pitelka wrote:
> The stack on our "hoggama" has a passive damper port just above the
> mechanical dampers, and as soon as the chimney gets hot, that passive damper
> makes all the difference in smoke production. When it is closed, there's
> smoke. When it is at least partially open, there's little or no smoke.
Nice thing about the design of the kiln I use is that the flue
channel between the fireboxes allows for a passive damp in the front,
between the fire chambers. This is important when firing alone,
because you don't have to run around to the stack to put the passive
damper.
> the smoke was still a problem, then the next step would be to use a blower
> as you describe. My only hesitation about blow driers is that they are
> never intended for continuous duty. If one goes to www.grainger.com, there
> is a wide range of 110v blowers that are rated for continuous duty and would
> work great for this purpose.
The exhaust of a shop vac, hooked up to a long steel pipe
(my yard is full of scaffolding pipe), would do the trick.
--
Lee in Mashiko, Japan
Minneapolis, Minnesota USA
http://potters.blogspot.com/
"To affect the quality of the day, that is the highest of arts." -
Henry David Thoreau
"Let the beauty we love be what we do." - Rumi
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