David Hendley on tue 15 may 07
I feel like I have entered the twilight zone. The lengths
to which people will come up with tortured logic,
twisted definitions, and odd extreme situations, in an effort
to equate molded and thrown pottery is breathtaking.
All the way from "Everything that all of us do is handmade."
("someone who wrote Lili off list") to "I think [only] coiled
and the pinched [pottery] should bear the title "Handmade",
not wheel thrown pottery nor molded stuff." (John Rogers),
to the question about how to hand make "twelve life-sized
bison" (Lili).
From John Rogers:
> I often throw pots on my wheel and never touch the clay with my hands
> except to weigh it and shape it into a ball - and they are not jiggered
> nor jollyed.
What an odd argument.
How?
More importantly, why? Is mental telepathy involved?
Do you center the clay with a tool? What does that
tool look like if it's not a jigger arm?
And yes, even if your fingertips never touch the clay, a
thrown pot is handmade because your hand is directly
guiding the tools that shape the clay. This is quite a different
scenario than pouring liquid clay into a mold, because your
hands have absolutely no effect on the resulting shape.
> Just because you squish the clay
> in your hands on a wheel does not necessarily make it "handmade".
Yes, it does. And a slip cast pot is not handmade because
there is no clay to squish. If there is no clay to squish, it
is impossible to shape the clay - it can only take the form
of the mold.
> To exclude the slip casters because of their molds, one must
> exclude the thrower because of their wheel.
A mold and a potters wheel are as different as a piano and
a 99 cent toy electronic keyboard. A piano, with a skilled
musician, can play many thousands of melodies. The toy plays
music with the touch of a button, but it plays only one tune.
This is not to imply that a slip mold is a toy, but a mold can
make only one item, while a potters wheel, with a skilled
potter, can make many thousands of different things.
A mold and a potters wheel are as different as pen and
a rubber stamp. A pen in the hand of a calligrapher can make
many thousands of beautiful letters and words. A rubber
stamp can only print one thing.
I realize these comparisons sound like they demean slip
casting. In that sense, the analogies are not really fair
because there are other steps involved, besides the
forming, in completing a piece of pottery.
But, it is the forming or shaping that determines how the
piece is actually"made". If I am asked what I did at work
at the end of the day I will say, "I made some bowls" or "I
made some pitchers". If I spent the day doing other
jobs, I say "I glazed pottery", or "I loaded the kiln", or
"I decorated pots" - the word "made" is not used in this
case because the pots were already "made".
So, even if a piece of pottery is not hand formed, it can still
be called "hand-finished", "hand painted", or "hand crafted",
just not "handmade".
Alas, these terms too are also poorly defined and
often misused.
> The real bottom line here is financial.
Finances have absolutely nothing to do with this bottom
line. For me, this is a purely academic discussion, as much
about semantics as pottery, and value-neutral in terms
of evaluating any work made by any means.
David Hendley
Maydelle, Texas
david(at)farmpots(dot)com
http://www.farmpots.com
lela martens on tue 15 may 07
>From: David Hendley
Date: Tue, 15 May 2007 03:29:58 -0500
>
>I feel like I have entered the twilight zone. The lengths
>to which people will come up with tortured logic,
>twisted definitions, and odd extreme situations, in an effort
>to equate molded and thrown pottery is breathtaking.
Thank you David and for your reply to John also Vince.. My sentiments
exactly.
I was starting to wonder if I was loosing it. I did wonder if John was
really
serious, or playing devil`s advocate.
Lela
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Lee Love on wed 16 may 07
On 5/16/07, lela martens wrote:
> >From: David Hendley
> Date: Tue, 15 May 2007 03:29:58 -0500
> >
> >I feel like I have entered the twilight zone. The lengths
> >to which people will come up with tortured logic,
> >twisted definitions, and odd extreme situations
>
> My sentiments exactly.
> I was starting to wonder if I was loosing it. I did wonder if John was
> really
> serious, or playing devil`s advocate.
Everybody argues what they want to, no matter what the original
question was ("Is printmaking hand made?") Or, Are Rodin's bronzes
handmade? Brian stated it as a "given" that potters do not see cast
work as handmade, regardless if the artist hand crafted the mold or
used the cast pieces like others use an extruder or thrown rings that
are cut up for handbuilding.
In art, we are allowed to be more open minded about the methods used.
Why all the concern on what other people do? Why do folks
lamely ignore the original question? Just grinding axes?
--
Lee in Mashiko, Japan
Minneapolis, Minnesota USA
http://mashikopots.blogspot.com/
"To affect the quality of the day, that is the highest of arts." -
Henry David Thoreau
"Let the beauty we love be what we do." - Rumi
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