John Rodgers on thu 31 may 07
My brother is an expert in the craft of the American Indians of the
southeastern US. So much so that he has served as consultant to the
Poarch Creek Indians of Alabama
(http://www.poarchcreekindians.org/xhtml/index.htm) on cultural matters,
even though he is non-Native American. Through his years of reading,
studying, and travel to various museums and carefully studying the few
woven artifacts of this type of work that have survived to this day, he
has managed to rediscover and resurrect some weaving techniques that had
gone the way of the Dodo bird. He is now using these weaving techniques
and producing the same type bags and totes that were used by the Indians
before the Europeans came to the Americas. This work is magnificent, and
- at least in my eyes - work that should be in a museum, to represent
what was done so long ago.
He and I have had great debates about this, as I have encouraged him to
approach museums and cultural centers about the work, but he will not,
citing prevailing attitudes that if it was not made by Native American
hands then the work has little or no value, that it was just one more
example of non-natives ripping off the Indian. Given the nature of the
work, and the fact that he single handedly resurrected this particular
method of weaving, I disagree. I feel there has to be a place for such
magnificent work, but he firmly disagrees.
Am I wrong in this? Is this wonderful weaving method and works he has
done exactly like the American Indians of the past did it, simply going
to disappear once again when he passes? Surely there must be some
places that would appreciate the work and get beyond this Native vs
non-Native thing, for the sake of the craft that the Indians developed
in the first place.
Any thoughts, opinions, suggestions on this matter would be appreciated.
Regards,
John Rodgers
Chelsea, AL
Elizabeth Priddy on thu 31 may 07
He should approach and teach some native americans
how to do the lost process, and then the work that
they do could be in the museums.
I agree with your brother. His work is not appropriate
for native american museum pieces. It is at best a
reinactment of the craftwork they did.
But as fine work, the american craft museum might be
appropriate, with a clear record of making included.
My grandfather was a Tuscarora Indian and my grandmother
was half Cherokee. But I know nothing of the traditions, so
I don't go on about it. But I do care about people claiming
things they don't have a right to.
He has a right to the work he is making, but not the tradition.
Elizabeth Priddy
Beaufort, NC - USA
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Dannon Rhudy on thu 31 may 07
There is definitely some difficulty here. First, your brother is
correct that museums etc. will not look at the work as valuable
in collection terms if it has been made by a non-native maker. This
may seem silly, and in fact it may BE silly, but that's how they
look at such things, in my experience. There might be some
museums more enlightened, but if your brother is disinclined
to spend time finding any, one can hardly blame him.
Your brother could teach some Poarch Creek Indians how to
do this, if they have an interest. No guarantee it would continue
past a generation or so, of course. The work may just have to
stand on it's own as objects of beauty and skill. Nothing is forever,
as we all know.
If you're determined that he is wrong in his view, you might contact
a likely museum (an Alabama museum might take an interest, for
instance). If he's wrong, tell him. You can be the catalyst, eh?
Maybe he should have a small website, so the work can be seen,
at least.
My grandmother was a Cherokee, and I find that part of my history
interesting. But, there was nothing tribal about her life, nor mine. I
don't make anything of Cherokee design; it would be presumptious
of me I believe. The only things she made that I've seen are some
beautiful beaded mocasins, and a bead necklace she made for me
when I was small. I've no idea if the designs are traditional, or if she
merely liked to make things with her hands.
So, it's tricky. You can't make people value things if they don't, and
you can't necessarily expect museums to be reasonable. You can
try, though. Have at it.
regards
Dannon Rhudy
Patty Kaliher on thu 31 may 07
There are Native American organizations dedicated to reviving the old
crafts. And teaching them to the children. He could possibly approach
these organizations to see if they would like to review his research and
come to the conclusion on their own that he has in fact discovered an old
way of weaving. Possibly they could compare one of his pieces with some old
ones in their own collection. They then might want to introduce the
technique in their educational programs. He may find an organization that
is not adverse to learning from a white face. This oblique approach may be
the best way to get recognition for his work. Let the Native Americans find
him.
-----Original Message-----
From: Clayart [mailto:CLAYART@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG] On Behalf Of John Rodgers
Sent: Thursday, May 31, 2007 6:40 AM
To: CLAYART@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG
Subject: Dilemma - not clay related, but art/craft related
My brother is an expert in the craft of the American Indians of the
southeastern US. So much so that he has served as consultant to the
Poarch Creek Indians of Alabama
(http://www.poarchcreekindians.org/xhtml/index.htm) on cultural matters,
even though he is non-Native American. Through his years of reading,
studying, and travel to various museums and carefully studying the few
woven artifacts of this type of work that have survived to this day, he
has managed to rediscover and resurrect some weaving techniques that had
gone the way of the Dodo bird. He is now using these weaving techniques
and producing the same type bags and totes that were used by the Indians
before the Europeans came to the Americas. This work is magnificent, and
- at least in my eyes - work that should be in a museum, to represent
what was done so long ago.
He and I have had great debates about this, as I have encouraged him to
approach museums and cultural centers about the work, but he will not,
citing prevailing attitudes that if it was not made by Native American
hands then the work has little or no value, that it was just one more
example of non-natives ripping off the Indian. Given the nature of the
work, and the fact that he single handedly resurrected this particular
method of weaving, I disagree. I feel there has to be a place for such
magnificent work, but he firmly disagrees.
Am I wrong in this? Is this wonderful weaving method and works he has
done exactly like the American Indians of the past did it, simply going
to disappear once again when he passes? Surely there must be some
places that would appreciate the work and get beyond this Native vs
non-Native thing, for the sake of the craft that the Indians developed
in the first place.
Any thoughts, opinions, suggestions on this matter would be appreciated.
Regards,
John Rodgers
Chelsea, AL
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Bonnie Staffel on fri 1 jun 07
I have what I call a smattering of information on this dilemma. When I
lived in Mississippi, I met a basket weaver who was reproducing an =
ancient
form of baskets as the Indians of that area were doing. However, the
difference was, she was taught and/or given the blessing of the tribe to =
do
this work. Her work was absolutely gorgeous and followed the strict
guidelines as practiced by the Indians for this technique. It is true =
that
there is a wall up about "whites" copying the native work. =20
Here in the north country, I have another native American friend who was
only about 1/10th native, but he immersed himself into the their =
traditions
and through his work with them, he was welcomed into the tribe and given =
the
Eagle Feather which I believe gave him that honor. He even learned =
their
language and had a native mentor. =20
Really, your friend is being true to the spirit of his gift of talent, =
but
since he has no native blood I don't think he has a ghost of a chance. =
Why
don't you encourage him to switch gears and in using this technique make
objects of his own design and relate that his work was influenced by his
studies of this particular tribe, you get my idea here? So he needs to
decide what his purpose is and follow his dream if it is to weave in =
this
manner. I don't think that even the Native Americans will accept the =
copies
unless he establishes an interest with them so he could teach them the
method to keep it alive. Giving them the gift of his study would do the
most good, IMO. My northern friend makes it his business to teach the =
young
natives the craft of their ancestors. So they will be the ones who will
carry it on. However, as in any culture, the young people don't want to
deal with the old, they want to be a part of here and now. It would be =
a
tough road but it can be done. But you really need to work through the
tribe.
Hope this helps.
Bonnie Staffel
http://webpages.charter.net/bstaffel/
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