more on oxidation- again (long)

updated sun 16 nov 97

WardBurner@aol.com on fri 14 nov 97

Bill,

This is why I'm leary of posting information.....I don't have time, sorry.
This will be my last post on the subject.

YOU CANNOT OXIDIZE IN AN ELECTRIC KILN.

Now, I know you're not supposed to use uppper case because it's rude, but I'm
feeling a bit of frustration. Some of what you said, I agree with, some I
don't. Step by step here is my reply to your points.

You said;

<<<(to
me) words and definitions are very important. I worked for many years with
combustion processes, including advise and consultation to fuel chemists.
there is a vast difference between "Oxidation" as a process, and
"Oxidizing" as a condition. "Oxidation" means something is happening-
namely, an Oxidizing element is entering into combination with other
elements. "Oxidizing" describes a condition where there is enough
Oxidizing material present to participate, IF (important IF), there is
anything present that is ready to participate. The result of having an
Oxidizing atmosphere in contact with things that are perfectly happy at
their present state of combination is a "neutral" process.

Simple re-statement--- If the material in an Oxidizing atmosphere is
already oxidized to the normal state, the result will be a neutral
exchange.>>>

I agree. The most important point, and one I think you overlook though, is
the last word of your quote; "exchange". Exchange can only happen if
molecular bonds are broken and one atom joins with another. The combustion
process breaks the bonds between the two atoms of oxygen that form a molecule
making this single atom very reactive and ready to bond. There is no
significant bond breaking in the neutral atmosphere of an electric kiln, so
no oxidation takes place. Also neutral process and neutral atmosphere are two
entirely different things. Neutral process means things may change a bit, but
are pretty much happy as they are. This is what happens when you have a
stochiometric burn or excess free oxygen in a gas fueled kiln. It's a neutral
process. A neutral atmosphere is different. The molecular bonds aren't
constantly being ripped apart and reformed like in combustion, the stay the
same or remain neutral and inactive.

You then say;

<<<Oxidizing,
but the process is neutral.>>>>

No, The atmosphere is neutral. Oxidation takes place to the elements because
of electron flow through them, but the atmosphere is neutral because the
molecular bonds are still intact. There is no combustion (rapid oxidation)
taking place.

You further state;

<<<the atmosphere in a fuel burning kiln is THE SAME AS IN AN ELECTRIC KILN!>>>>

Quite true, but the huge difference is that the molecular bonds between atoms
of oxygen are intact in the electric kiln, because no combustion (rapid
oxidation) has taken place. In a fuel fired kiln these bonds are broken,
reform, broken, reform, ect. During this, things are interacting on a
molecular basis. This interaction does not take place to any great degree in
an electric kiln because there is no oxidation (combustion) taking place.

You refered to my post about nothing changing in an electric kiln by saying;

<<<important- **nothing is changing. **>>>>

See what I said above. LOTS of things are changing in a fuel fired kiln on a
molecular level while not much is changing in an electric kiln. I believe the
key misunderstanding is semantic and lies with the use/defination of
oxidation. You pointed out that;

<<<present. The result is a neutral firing, but only because all the
materials are already at their preferred state of Oxidation. If there are
materials present that are not at the preferred state- you had better
believe they WILL oxidize, even in an electric kiln, with or without a
power vent. Try sticking a small piece of paper into your peep hole.>>>>

No, the paper is oxidizing, the atmoshere provides oxygen. Once you use some
of this oxygen, you have a localized reduction atmosphere with a lack of
oxygen. What happens is you have inserted a substance in the form of a
hydrocarbon (paper) that has combusted (rapid oxidizing) thus breaking the
molecular bonds of the hydrocarbons and the molecular oxygen present. That
paper is going through rapid oxidation. If you kept shoveling paper into the
kiln, you would then have a fuel fired kiln with oxidation (or reduction)
taking place and it would no longer be neutral. With nothing burning you have
a neutral atmosphere. Pots, shelves, and bricks are refractory meaning they
are resistant to heat and do not contain many items that can rapidly oxidize
(burn). If you made kiln shelves out of plywood, they'd burn like hell and
then you would have combustion and a atmosphere that would no longer be
neutral.

gas burns.....it's oxidizing
iron rusts.....it's oxidizing
electric elements rust in their own way....they're oxidizing
The atmosphere of an electric kiln has no combustion, no rusting, nothing
going on except molecular vibration (heat). There is radiational heating,
conductive heating, and a tiny amount of convectional heating, but no
oxidizing (burning).

An electric kiln has a neutral atmosphere. The atmosphere we live in is
neutral, it's just cooler where we are. If we were forced to breath elemental
oxygen ( a single atom unbonded from the two atom pair), it would destroy our
lungs (oxidize them).

Marc Ward
Ward Burner Systems
PO Box 333
Dandridge, TN 37725
USA
423.397.2914 voice
423.397.1253 fax
wardburner@aol.com