Nobody Special on thu 10 apr 08
During the course of my readings, I have been led to believe that the
predecessor to the Anagama was a rather simple tunnel dug into the side of a
hill, with no structural support or refractories at all. For reasons not
entirely clear to me, I have gotten the idea into my head to attempt to
build and fire such a kiln. I have a small but steep side-hill behind the
house that slopes directly to my woodlot, so the site is almost begging for
a wood kiln.
My idea is to dig into the side of the hill, creating a small elongated cave
of perhaps 40 or 50 cubic feet. The entrance to the cave would be
reinforced with a hardbrick or castable arch to prevent collapse of the
fragile leading edge. The chimney would be a simple hole bored straight
down into the cave, with a kiln shelf set over for a damper. The plan,
assuming the cave could be dug without my being buried alive, would be to
fire the thing empty to a very high temperature in order to try to fuse the
surface of the cave, and I was thinking about adding salt to aid in this
process. My soil is a sandy loam, consisting of 57% sand, 27% silt, and
only 16% clay. The native clay here is Michigan blue clay, which I
understand is a very low firing earthenware clay. My initial thought is
that my clay content might be too low to offer enough structure.
Does anyone on the list have any knowledge of or experience with such a
primitive kiln? Any thoughts? Any advice other than to up my life insurance?
As much as I want to do this, the little "reasonable person" inside my head
is telling me rather emphatically to go to Plan B.
Thanks for any input.
...James
Hank Murrow on thu 10 apr 08
Dear James;
It has worked for other people, though the temperature your kiln will
reach will be limited by the content of your soil. When the soil of
the inside surface of your kiln gets to melting and dripping on your
ware, you have reached maximum temp for that kiln. The kiln will need
to be protected from water damage until it has been fired a time or
two. My friend, Cory Levins once dug a hole in the riverbank behind
his mother's home in Aspen and lined the hole with castable to a
thickness of 1.5_2" leaving a hole around 18" diameter at the top of
the chamber. He loaded the pots in to the chamber stacking on each
other, and closed it with a domed 'lid' of castable. Fired it until
cone 10, salted, and when he opened it the pots had settled down
around 8_10" lower than before the fire. I still have one of those
pots. Have pics somewhere, but they are slides and not scanned.
Cheers, Hank
On Apr 10, 2008, at 6:13 AM, Nobody Special wrote:
> During the course of my readings, I have been led to believe that the
> predecessor to the Anagama was a rather simple tunnel dug into the
> side of a
> hill, with no structural support or refractories at all. For
> reasons not
> entirely clear to me, I have gotten the idea into my head to
> attempt to
> build and fire such a kiln. I have a small but steep side-hill
> behind the
> house that slopes directly to my woodlot, so the site is almost
> begging for
> a wood kiln.
>
> My idea is to dig into the side of the hill, creating a small
> elongated cave
> of perhaps 40 or 50 cubic feet. The entrance to the cave would be
> reinforced with a hardbrick or castable arch to prevent collapse of
> the
> fragile leading edge. The chimney would be a simple hole bored
> straight
> down into the cave, with a kiln shelf set over for a damper. The
> plan,
> assuming the cave could be dug without my being buried alive, would
> be to
> fire the thing empty to a very high temperature in order to try to
> fuse the
> surface of the cave, and I was thinking about adding salt to aid in
> this
> process. My soil is a sandy loam, consisting of 57% sand, 27%
> silt, and
> only 16% clay. The native clay here is Michigan blue clay, which I
> understand is a very low firing earthenware clay. My initial
> thought is
> that my clay content might be too low to offer enough structure.
Steve Dalton on thu 10 apr 08
I read about the same thing. From what I understood of it all, the hole/cave was where the potters mined their clay. They left a clay lining and this became basically the insulation.
I can't remember what the title was.
You should get or at least borrow Nils Lou's book, the Art of Firing. He dug a similar type of kiln. But cast the roof and back filled with dirt. His walls though had started as bare dirt but after a firing or two had to use castable on them.
Nil's method would be safer as opposed to digging a cave. Pick and shovel for the chamber. Post hole digger for the first part of the flue.
Hope this helps,
Steve Dalton
Snohomish, WA
Clear Creek Pottery
clearcreekpottery.etsy.com
Nobody Special wrote: During the course of my readings, I have been led to believe that the
predecessor to the Anagama was a rather simple tunnel dug into the side of a
hill, with no structural support or refractories at all. For reasons not
entirely clear to me, I have gotten the idea into my head to attempt to
build and fire such a kiln. I have a small but steep side-hill behind the
house that slopes directly to my woodlot, so the site is almost begging for
a wood kiln.
My idea is to dig into the side of the hill, creating a small elongated cave
of perhaps 40 or 50 cubic feet. The entrance to the cave would be
reinforced with a hardbrick or castable arch to prevent collapse of the
fragile leading edge. The chimney would be a simple hole bored straight
down into the cave, with a kiln shelf set over for a damper. The plan,
assuming the cave could be dug without my being buried alive, would be to
fire the thing empty to a very high temperature in order to try to fuse the
surface of the cave, and I was thinking about adding salt to aid in this
process. My soil is a sandy loam, consisting of 57% sand, 27% silt, and
only 16% clay. The native clay here is Michigan blue clay, which I
understand is a very low firing earthenware clay. My initial thought is
that my clay content might be too low to offer enough structure.
Does anyone on the list have any knowledge of or experience with such a
primitive kiln? Any thoughts? Any advice other than to up my life insurance?
As much as I want to do this, the little "reasonable person" inside my head
is telling me rather emphatically to go to Plan B.
Thanks for any input.
...James
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Paul Herman on thu 10 apr 08
James,
I have no personal experience with building a primitive tunnel kiln,
but do remember a description I read of a potter who tried what you
describe. It was near the Oregon coast, and the tunnel was impossible
to get up to stoneware temperature, but the potter said it did cause
one hell of a cloud of steam to come out of the earth, just like
making your own bank of clouds.
If you decide to pursue this kiln, please do the digging when someone
else is around, so they can dig you out if need be.
Best wishes,
Paul Herman
Great Basin Pottery
Doyle, California US
www.greatbasinpottery.com/
On Apr 10, 2008, at 6:13 AM, Nobody Special wrote:
> During the course of my readings, I have been led to believe that the
> predecessor to the Anagama was a rather simple tunnel dug into the
> side of a
> hill, with no structural support or refractories at all. For
> reasons not
> entirely clear to me, I have gotten the idea into my head to attempt
> to
> build and fire such a kiln. I have a small but steep side-hill
> behind the
> house that slopes directly to my woodlot, so the site is almost
> begging for
> a wood kiln.
>
> My idea is to dig into the side of the hill, creating a small
> elongated cave
> of perhaps 40 or 50 cubic feet. The entrance to the cave would be
> reinforced with a hardbrick or castable arch to prevent collapse of
> the
> fragile leading edge. The chimney would be a simple hole bored
> straight
> down into the cave, with a kiln shelf set over for a damper. The
> plan,
> assuming the cave could be dug without my being buried alive, would
> be to
> fire the thing empty to a very high temperature in order to try to
> fuse the
> surface of the cave, and I was thinking about adding salt to aid in
> this
> process. My soil is a sandy loam, consisting of 57% sand, 27% silt,
> and
> only 16% clay. The native clay here is Michigan blue clay, which I
> understand is a very low firing earthenware clay. My initial
> thought is
> that my clay content might be too low to offer enough structure.
>
> Does anyone on the list have any knowledge of or experience with
> such a
> primitive kiln? Any thoughts? Any advice other than to up my life
> insurance?
>
> As much as I want to do this, the little "reasonable person" inside
> my head
> is telling me rather emphatically to go to Plan B.
>
> Thanks for any input.
>
> ...James
gary navarre on thu 10 apr 08
Ya Jim it is a romantic idea and in fact many years
ago Drew Krouse at Kalamazoo Valley C.C. would take
the classes out to Lake Michigan and dig a hill side
kiln where the clay content was high enough to
maintain stability. I'll have to ask their clay people
next time I'm in Kalamazoo. Most Michigan clay is low
fire except for some along Lake Superior that might
withstand ^6, but I have yet to locate any.
--- Nobody Special wrote:
the Anagama was a rather simple
> tunnel dug into the side of a
> hill, with no structural support or refractories
at..
> My idea is to dig into the side of the hill,
> creating a small elongated cave
> of perhaps 40 or 50 cubic feet...
If ya didn't know roughly estimating 2000 standard
sized brick as enough to enclose 50cu.ft. more or
less.
> My initial thought is
> that my clay content might be too low to offer
> enough structure.
> As much as I want to do this, the little "reasonable
> person" inside my head
> is telling me rather emphatically to go to Plan B.
>
> Thanks for any input.
>
> ...James
If the clay content is too low you can still use the
slope and even dig in a bit for buttressing half the
chamber brick with the clay/soil. For a kiln that size
I would dispense with steps in the floor and make it
level. I added about three feet of stone and gravel
for drainage and frost protection this time around and
everything is above ground. One big advantage is the
fuel close at hand. My last kiln was a success because
we had 10 acres of mixed Pines with enough dead limbs
on them I seldom cut one down unless it was dying.
Just learned how to climb with hand tools and trim
them up. I wish I had realized back then I coulda sold
the boughs off the White Pine to greenhouses for
Christmas decorations. That's big business up here and
it fits right in with my gathering fuel. Cut the limbs
and make wreaths with the greens. Save the limbs for
fuel and make pots till spring for a firing. Turn the
scrap from the greens into ash for glaze. That reminds
me I ought to get busy and do something before I gotta
go back to Wal*Mart. Sposta get snowed on 6-8" again
this weekend I HOPE. Stay in there eh!
Gary Navarre
Navarre Pottery
Navarre Enterprises
Norway, Michigan, USA
http://public.fotki.com/GindaUP/
http://www.youtube.com/GindaUP
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Fredrick Paget on thu 10 apr 08
OH BOY!What a great idea.
I could dig a firing pit where my litle greenhouse sits and tunnel up
under the veggie garden in the layer of great clay that lies under
our lot. Only a 10 degree slope so I will have to start from a deep
pit.
Fire in the winter and warm up the soil above so I can plant a month earlier.
Oh, wait a minute. This is Mill Valley where you can't even build a
fireplace in a new house and wood stoves are verboten unless EPA
approved.
--
Fred Paget
Twin Dragon Studio
Mill Valley, CA, USA
fredrick@well.com
Charter Member Potters Council
pdp1@EARTHLINK.NET on thu 10 apr 08
Hi Fred,
How 'bout if you just put a 'Bar-B-Que' Pit over the end of it?
Nobody'd know then...they'd just think you are Bar-B-Que-ing again if they
see some 'smoke' coming out...and, in fact DO Bar-B-Que now and then, just
to keep it 'real'...
Anytime anyone sees smoke, and also smells Bar-B-Que Sauce on the winds,
they just think it is nice, and wish they had some...
Phil
l v
----- Original Message -----
From: "Fredrick Paget"
> OH BOY!What a great idea.
>
> I could dig a firing pit where my litle greenhouse sits and tunnel up
> under the veggie garden in the layer of great clay that lies under
> our lot. Only a 10 degree slope so I will have to start from a deep
> pit.
>
> Fire in the winter and warm up the soil above so I can plant a month
> earlier.
>
> Oh, wait a minute. This is Mill Valley where you can't even build a
> fireplace in a new house and wood stoves are verboten unless EPA
> approved.
>
> --
> Fred Paget
> Twin Dragon Studio
> Mill Valley, CA, USA
> fredrick@well.com
>
> Charter Member Potters Council
Nobody Special on sat 12 apr 08
Thank you all for your knowledge and input. IF I do this (and survive), I
shall post the results.
...James
Lee on sat 12 apr 08
James, the original Mashiko kilns were made of sandy stone blocks.
They didn't fire too high and the sandstone blocks melted on the
fireface, but they lasted a number of firings.
Of course, the most primitive kilns were really not kilns,
but simply bonfires. That is how all the Jomon work was fired.
--
Lee, a Mashiko potter in Minneapolis
http://mashikopots.blogspot.com/
"If you fear making anyone mad, then you ultimately probe for
the lowest common denominator of human achievement." -- Jimmy Carter
Jim Kasper on sat 12 apr 08
Hi James,
I too have been planning a similar kiln for quite some time. I
had actually planned on the barbeque
disguise that Phil had mentioned also. If you mentioned it, I missed
it..... where are you located?
Regards,
Jim
19a. Re: Very, very, very primitive kiln
Posted by: "Nobody Special" jsfreeman@HOTMAIL.COM
Sat Apr 12, 2008 9:56 am (PDT)
Thank you all for your knowledge and input. IF I do this (and survive), I
shall post the results.
...James
Zafka Studios
Jensen Beach, FL
http://zafka.com
772-334-3070
Nobody Special on sun 13 apr 08
On Sat, 12 Apr 2008 19:03:58 -0500, Jim Kasper wrote:
>Hi James,
> I too have been planning a similar kiln for quite some time. I
>had actually planned on the barbeque
>disguise that Phil had mentioned also. If you mentioned it, I missed
>it..... where are you located?
>Regards,
>Jim
>
Jim...
I'm in southern Michigan, in the middle of nowhere in a town nobody ever
heard of, where it was 72 degrees two days ago and is now snowing. The
upside is that my nearest neighbor is over 1/4 mile away, so I don't have to
disguise anything. The downside is... did I mention it was SNOWING?
...James
KATHI LESUEUR on sun 13 apr 08
On Apr 13, 2008, at 9:04 AM, Nobody Special wrote:
>
>
> I'm in southern Michigan, in the middle of nowhere in a town nobody
> ever
> heard of, where it was 72 degrees two days ago and is now snowing.
> The
> upside is that my nearest neighbor is over 1/4 mile away, so I
> don't have to
> disguise anything. The downside is... did I mention it was SNOWING?
>
> ...James
>
JIm,
I bet I've heard of that town and I bet I know where it is. And if
you're anywhere near Ann Arbor we should get together and talk pots.
And damn, I wish Michigan could make up it's mind. You can never
count on the weather here. I once did a fair on Mother's Day in the
snow in Birmingham, MI.
Kathi
Lee on mon 14 apr 08
On Sat, Apr 12, 2008 at 7:03 PM, Jim Kasper wrote:
> Hi James,
> I too have been planning a similar kiln for quite some time. I
> had actually planned on the barbeque
> disguise that Phil had mentioned also. If you mentioned it, I missed
> it..... where are you located?
>
I have mentioned here before, I am building a brick box
"barbecue". Will experiment with yohen type pots. LPG burners
until cone 10 then filled with charcoal and closed up.
During the daytime, I can barbecue or bake in the top
chamber using only charcoal to cook with.
--
Lee, a Mashiko potter in Minneapolis
http://mashikopots.blogspot.com/
"Not everything that counts can be counted, and not everything that
can be counted counts." --(Sign hanging in Einstein's office at
Princeton)
Nobody Special on mon 14 apr 08
On Sun, 13 Apr 2008 15:43:07 -0400, KATHI LESUEUR
wrote:
>
>JIm,
>I bet I've heard of that town and I bet I know where it is. And if
>you're anywhere near Ann Arbor we should get together and talk pots.
>
Kathi...
I don't get to A2 much, but I'll send you an email next time I'm headed that
way. Do the same if you are ever headed southwest (20 minutes west of
Adrian). I don't get many visitors to the Fortress of Solitude!
...James
gary navarre on tue 15 apr 08
Hay Nobody,
Somehow I was thinking you are near where Mobil Oil
had a bunch of us Michigan hillbillies from Kalamazoo
hunting oil and sure enough... we took store stops in
Sand Creek, Locust Corners, Rome... somehow the crew
got the Hillsdale County Sheriff after ourselves by
pitching just about every empty pop and beer can onto
a long stretch of road, maybe it was S.Pittsford Rd.
just North of Squawfield Rd., and waited for the back
road drivers to do the rest. It made a hell of a
racket in the dog house whenever cars would drive over
them too, couldn't shoot the line because of the
"noise" in the ground. Eventually the cops made us
pick all them up. I think the whole point to the "show
time" was all those cans were from the people driving
over them, probably including the sheriff himself.
Artfully annoying! Two years later Michigan enacted
the beginning of the our bottle deposit laws.
--- Nobody Special wrote:
> On Sun, 13 Apr 2008 15:43:07 -0400, KATHI LESUEUR
> wrote:
>
>
> >
> >JIm,
> >I bet I've heard of that town and I bet I know
> where it is. And if
> >you're anywhere near Ann Arbor we should get
> together and talk pots.
> >
> Kathi...
>
> I don't get to A2 much, but I'll send you an email
> next time I'm headed that
> way. Do the same if you are ever headed southwest
> (20 minutes west of
> Adrian). I don't get many visitors to the Fortress
> of Solitude!
>
> ...James
Have you ever been over to Ken Shenstone's enormous
kiln near Albion?
Gary Navarre
Navarre Pottery
Navarre Enterprises
Norway, Michigan, USA
http://public.fotki.com/GindaUP/
http://www.youtube.com/GindaUP
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Nobody Special on tue 15 apr 08
On Tue, 15 Apr 2008 01:18:40 -0700, gary navarre
wrote:
>Hay Nobody,
>
> Somehow I was thinking you are near where Mobil Oil
>had a bunch of us Michigan hillbillies from Kalamazoo
>hunting oil and sure enough... we took store stops in
>Sand Creek, Locust Corners, Rome...
>>
>
> Have you ever been over to Ken Shenstone's enormous
>kiln near Albion?
>
>
Gary...
You may not have been here, but you were close by. Every once in a while we
get some gentleman stopping by trying to buy up our mineral rights. Like I
really want to look at an oil derrick in my front yard every day just for a
few bucks per year. If oil keeps going up though, I might just reconsider!
I visited Ken Shenstone's anagama a couple of years ago when Michigan Mud
was in Albion. That kiln is a work of art, and big enough to park a
Volkswagen in! A very impressive setup indeed!
All the best.
...James
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