jean szostek on thu 10 jul 08
hi ivor and olive,
i followd the hole story about crazing
the romans en greeks made sigilata for home cooking, is that so healty???
and that is something vince should now.
and the japanees drinks out of raku chawan , soo????
cheers jean
mail: fa520033@skynet.be
site : www.szostekjean.be
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ivor and Olive Lewis"
To:
Sent: Monday, July 07, 2008 8:34 AM
Subject: Misc: Crazing; NASCO; the world of clay
> Dear Vince Pitelka,
> Conjecture, Maybe.
> But the proposition that craze lines can act as reservoirs of
> infectious organisms can be tested.
> Best regards,
> Ivor Lewis.
> Redhill,
> South Australia.
>
>
> --
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG.
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> 7:40
>
>
Ivor and Olive Lewis on fri 11 jul 08
Dear Jean Szostek,
Never having seen any pictures of Terra Sigillata that reveal its
microstructure I cannot comment.
But I do recall reports that many of the aristocracy of the Roman
Empire fell victims to Lead poisoning after drinking and eating from
Galena Glazed pots.
As I said earlier it would be possible to use vital staining
techniques to disclose the presence of Bacteria or take swab samples
for culture on sterile growth media.
One well known reason for cooking food is to destroy organisms that
can harm us. This especially true for Duck Eggs, the shells of which
are porous and can be contaminated when resting on the floor of a
nest. Another is the destruction of parasitic worm eggs that can
infest raw pork and could hatch if not sterilised by high temperature
cooking.
As I said previously, the hypothesis that craze lines can be infested
with microbes is testable.
Best regards,
Ivor Lewis.
Redhill,
South Australia.
Neon-Cat on fri 11 jul 08
Ivor wrote:
"Never having seen any pictures of Terra Sigillata that reveal its
microstructure..."
Ivor, here’s a scanned photo of a micrograph of a cross section of terra
sigillata on a sample of Eastern Gaulish tableware. See the pic under
Ceramic Novelties at http://www.neon-cat.com/ceramic_novelties
A string of modern professionally cited articles on bacterial colonization
of ceramics begins with two articles: Sand, W. and E. Bock, 1991,
"International Biodeterioration and Biodegradation" 27:175-183 and
Saiz-Jimenez, C., 2001. I’d rather not use crazed tableware myself but each
to his or her own. As potters I do think that with our current abilities and
knowledge we could rise to the challenge and, like those in the dinnerware
industry, satisfy societal sensibilities and concerns by providing
ultra-smooth, non-porous, easy to sanitize surfaces on tableware intended
for the public.
Cheers,
Marian
Neon-Cat Ceramics
www.neon-cat.com
neoncat@flash.net
Neon-Cat on sat 12 jul 08
Love your blog photos, Edouard. You've always got something new coming down
the pike.
Let's not go into all possible bacterial, viral, and fungal entities (good
and bad) that might grow and colonize here and there, on and in ceramic
materials, OK? I'd rather be sculpting:>)
Or you can go there, I'll pass.
But if lowly cat breeders are cognizant of the health of kitties they adopt
out to the general public shouldn't potters be a little savvy about what's
possible or not with their vessels, platters, and whatnots? The public can
and will do and believe all kinds of strange things with and about both
kitties and ceramics. Being aware of the possibilities of microbe
transmission is as much about protecting the supplier (breeder or potter) as
it is about protecting those who purchase something from us, sometimes
more-so. We should know our materials and products well enough to
confidently stand behind what we're sending out into the world.
Much of the world's people believe themselves to be immuno-compromised. Many
others take an assortment of drugs designed to modify gut pH, from stomach
through the intestinal tract. Others just get off on jerking someone else's
chain - out of fear, desperation, general prickishness, or ignorance. Make
and sell as you all please but I don't believe we should promote crazed
glazes as 'totally safe' for whatever reasons. Retrospective testing is time
consuming and expensive. A little knowledge will help us protect ourselves
and those things we love to do and share.
Here's a true life example dealing with both clay and kitties. Had a client
recently who adopted a kitten. Came by to visit frequently while kitty was
growing up. Big family. One of the kids, a girl, is a freshman taking a
ceramics class at the same school where I now attend. One day the mom calls
up and wants to stop by with a friend and ask me something. Although
pressed for time I said OK, the lady seemed rattled. She and her buddy got
here, played with kittens, looked at art work, then started asking about
ringworm. The girl taking the ceramics class has a small blemish on her
hand. They are sure it is ringworm contracted during one of their visits. No
doctor visit, no culture. Nevertheless I feel I need to make some kind of
response. Kitten's home-leaving is delayed and off he goes to the vet for
testing ($100.00 plus vet visit fee). I home test with assays, more expense.
We're all fine. Then the mom says her girl must have gotten "something"
because I work in clay and it is all around my house -- "can't clay harbor
bacteria? It's probably bacteria!!". This not withstanding that the girl has
a full and active life as a teen, working with clays of her own and doing
lord knows what else. She once had methicillin-resistant staphylococcus
aureus (MRSA) so her mom is leery about many things in general. We talk
about clay and "germs". I suggest the girl be taken to her doctor if they
have further doubts. I also pass the buck and suggest they talk to the
girl's own clay professor. Meanwhile time passes while kitty's test is
culturing (2 -3 weeks is normal). Eventually the happy home-leaving day
arrives. The whole family arrives; the girl with blemish has been made to
wear gloves (white) in our Texas heat. I sigh inwardly at her gloved-plight
but she seems to be handling it all rather stoically. Get to look at the
blemish -- looks like nothing to me (a simple scratch, a prick?) and she
seems fine, over-all. We play and chat and eventually they all leave with
their kitten; all do well. They return a month later for a second kitty. So,
strange, yes? But true. I knew all was well here with me and mine but
sometimes we are required to take a stand, educate, and prove our point.
Taking a stand is often expensive and time consuming. If you are unsure of
your "product" and materials, something like my experience might well be
nerve-wracking instead of just interestingly peculiar. I do rather like the
mom but could not resist telling her during a follow-up conversation that I
was rather aggrieved about the hundred dollars. I did get an apology and the
family later brought food and goodies for my kitties when they came to pick
up their second kitten.
I'm getting hungry and was thinking, yes, serve me something good on a
crazed plate today and I'd relish it. I'm in perfect shape, stomach acid and
all.
In lieu of food, someone send me a nice recipe for a nice darkish-brown
celadon with a light touch for white stoneware, Cone 10 reduction, please.
Standard materials (no fancy ashes or regional materials). It needs to go
over a few stains and then take some overglaze embellishments.
And hey -- happy potting everyone!
We should have fun with clay and glazes.
Marian
neoncat@flash.net
-----Original Message-----
From: Clayart [mailto:CLAYART@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG]On Behalf Of Edouard
Bastarache
Sent: Saturday, July 12, 2008 12:08 PM
To: CLAYART@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG
Subject: Re: Crazing; NASCO; the world of clay
(snip) It also depends on the type of bacteriae encountered.
Some are saprophytes i.e. "good guys".
For example, our skin is covered by zillions of them.
The saprophytes need special conditions to cause harm.
Some are pathogens i.e. "bad guys".
Our stomach has lots of concentrated hydrochloric acid and the
pH is at 2. One of the purposes of this condition is to kill ingested
germs.
Gis la revido
Edouard Bastarache
Spertesperantisto
Sorel-Tracy
Quebec
Canada
http://www.flickr.com/photos/30058682@N00/
http://pagesperso-orange.fr/smart2000/livres.htm
http://www.flickr.com/photos/potier/20321056/
http://myblogsmesblogs.blogspot.com/
Edouard Bastarache on sat 12 jul 08
Hello Marian,
A string of modern professionally cited articles on bacterial colonization
of ceramics begins with two articles: Sand, W. and E. Bock, 1991,
"International Biodeterioration and Biodegradation" 27:175-183 and
Saiz-Jimenez, C., 2001. Marian"
It also depends on the type of bacteriae encountered.
Some are saprophytes i.e. "good guys".
For example, our skin is covered by zillions of them.
The saprophytes need special conditions to cause harm.
Some are pathogens i.e. "bad guys".
Our stomach has lots of concentrated hydrochloric acid and the
pH is at 2. One of the purposes of this condition is to kill ingested
germs.
Gis la revido
Edouard Bastarache
Spertesperantisto
Sorel-Tracy
Quebec
Canada
http://www.flickr.com/photos/30058682@N00/
http://pagesperso-orange.fr/smart2000/livres.htm
http://www.flickr.com/photos/potier/20321056/
http://myblogsmesblogs.blogspot.com/
Ivor and Olive Lewis on mon 14 jul 08
<<...Ivor, here's a scanned photo of a micrograph of a cross section
of terra
sigillata on a sample of Eastern Gaulish tableware. See the pic under
Ceramic Novelties at http://www.neon-cat.com/ceramic_novelties...>>
Dear Marian,
That seems to be a flawless impermeable surface layer.
Good to know that these things can be found with a diligent search.
Thank you.
Best regards,
Ivor Lewis.
Redhill,
South Australia.
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