Eva Gallagher on sat 20 sep 08
We have just started adding a drop of bleach to our wash bucket - that is
the bucket we use after we dumped everything into the reclaim. We use this
bucket to wash out our bowl and tools. Periodically the water on top is
emptied and the sediment which remains at the bottom starts to get rather
smelly after a while. The bleach seems to be working very well - however we
do not reclaim the sediment. When the sediment builds up too much - like
several inches, we switch to a new bucket. The old bucket - we pour off the
water and let it dry out, then dump the sediment into the garbage.
Eva Gallagher
Deep River Potters Guild
http://stephenhilljourneyworkshopjuly2008.blogspot.com/
----- Original Message -----
From: "James F"
To:
Sent: Saturday, September 20, 2008 2:34 PM
Subject: Bleach question for Marian Neon-Cat and other science-types
Without arguing the merits of stinky clay, suppose someone was truly
disgusted by the stench of a festering slop bucket, and was considering
adding a touch of bleach to the water to curb anaerobic bacterial growth. I
know that both the sodium hypochlorite itself, and the sodium hydroxide
household bleaches often contain, would add sodium to the reclaim and flux
it a bit, but I am guessing that this would be negligible. Can you think of
any negatives to this idea? I know that bleach tends to promote
precipitation of minerals, but wondered if this would be an issue in the
clay slurry. I employ "lazy reclamation" in that I just mix the slop bucket
well then pour the contents onto a plaster batt to stiffen. I am therefore
also wondering if the bleach or any of it's products of decomposition such
as chlorates would attack my plaster batt. Any thoughts would be
appreciated.
All the best.
...James
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Neon-Cat on sat 20 sep 08
Good golly, James!
I had too much sun and fun today, trying to get it together to play with
clay. Definitely am not in the mood for science.
I've been meaning to publish my preservative for paperclay. Might as well be
on clayart.
But not tonight.
It might be a help for those feeling overwhelmed by mold in and around their
clay. It definitely works well as a paperclay preservative. Seems to work on
anaerobic bacteria as well.
Bleach is lame in clay - it becomes very quickly inactivated by organic and
inorganic residue. It works best on non-porous surfaces (and that's not raw
clay, even smoothed and burnished).
If you love your clay body and treat it to kill bacteria and fungi, be aware
that some of its working properties might diminish or disappear over time as
the clay neutralizes pH once the often acidic products of metabolism
generated by the clay body's resident microbial colonies decrease or stop
abruptly. Usually clays I've experimented with just feel a tad stiffer. If
you're into handbuilding, the treated clay may make better joins for you.
Oh, forgot, I even have a scent you all can add - it's been working on some
river clay slip I've got around. Comes with it's own antibacterial,
antifungal, and anti-viral properties. Wow - just took a whiff of some of
that jugged river-clay slip - nary a trace of odor except my added scent.
Interesting. Been awhile, too. That stuff was nasty before the added scent.
I like it - neither too sickly sweet or too funkily robust. Perfect for the
male or female potter. I use to wear it sometimes, that is until one of the
gals at 7-11 where I trade said it smelled like earthworms.
Earthworms!
And how did she know what earthworms smell like?
On my way to a presentation at the time, too. Must say it took the edge of
all nervousness to wonder what exactly earthworms smell like and was it a
good or bad scent on me. (Jeez, the world is a trip sometimes.)
Let me pull together some notes. I'll post back in the next few days. Have
tomorrow tied up.
In the meantime, try giving any problematic bagged or containered clay a
little breath of air once a week. Just a few minutes worth, that's all it
takes. Anaerobic bacteria hate that. Keeps growth way down. At school, the
reclaim container sits outside in the sun, open most of the time. Helps keep
the undesirables down and disperses the stench of their own decomp and/or
products of their decomposition activities.
If you want to dump a little bleach into your reclaim water, it will kill
many things in the water (but not in the interior of the clay). Might be a
temporary help to you. It's not a long-term solution. The clay from a
bleach-treated vat shouldn't hurt your equipment, but I will check further
on that with respect to plaster and long-term use. Metal frames and parts of
equipment would be at most risk from fresh bleach; spent bleach is rarely a
problem.
Hope everyone is having a good weekend!
Marian
James F on sat 20 sep 08
Without arguing the merits of stinky clay=2C suppose someone was truly disg=
usted by the stench of a festering slop bucket=2C and was considering addin=
g a touch of bleach to the water to curb anaerobic bacterial growth. I kno=
w that both the sodium hypochlorite itself=2C and the sodium hydroxide hous=
ehold bleaches often contain=2C would add sodium to the reclaim and flux it=
a bit=2C but I am guessing that this would be negligible. Can you think o=
f any negatives to this idea? I know that bleach tends to promote precipit=
ation of minerals=2C but wondered if this would be an issue in the clay slu=
rry. I employ "lazy reclamation" in that I just mix the slop bucket well t=
hen pour the contents onto a plaster batt to stiffen. I am therefore also =
wondering if the bleach or any of it's products of decomposition such as ch=
lorates would attack my plaster batt. Any thoughts would be appreciated.
All the best.
...James
_________________________________________________________________
See how Windows Mobile brings your life together=97at home=2C work=2C or on=
the go.
http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/msnnkwxp1020093182mrt/direct/01/=
Lee Love on sun 21 sep 08
James,
I sometimes use a copper basin for a throwing bowl. It tends to
stink less. All natural clays are more prone to organic growth,
because they are not "killed" clays.
Sun helps as well as putting the throwing bowl on the woodstove. I
put the bowl in a larger bucket of water on the stove.
Ich bin kein Berliner
--
Lee Love in Minneapolis
http://heartclay.blogspot.com/
http://mashikopots.blogspot.com/
http://claycraft.blogspot.com/
"Let the beauty we love be what we do.
There are hundreds of ways to kneel and kiss the ground." --Rumi
Ivor and Olive Lewis on sun 21 sep 08
Dear James Freeman,
Sodium compounds are noteworthy for their ability to deflocculate clay
slurries, effectively destroying the plastic nature of what might
eventually become a good workable material.
If this is a communal bucket of slops from potters wheels then it is
going to contain decomposing cellular derbies that are sloughed from
the hands of the people that use the equipment. Whether or not this
would in fact be a health hazard I would not know. But if the stench
is a problem and there is free water on the surface it might become a
breeding ground for mosquitoes.
Best regards,
Ivor Lewis.
Redhill,
South Australia.
May Luk on sun 21 sep 08
Hello James;
I put a few drops of bleach in my paper porcelain clay (4 kg). The bleach b=
urned my hand when I wedge and I also found that it "corrupts" my plaster b=
at. The bat turned yellow and bumpy and powdery on the surface. I wasn't su=
re if it's the newspaper ink or the bleach, but now I have to put a canvas =
plus synthetic cloth on my plaster bat in order to reclaim and make my pape=
r clay. I stop using bleach because of my skin. My paper porcelain is disgu=
sting and I just have to warn my studio mate for the stink when I open the =
bucket. And I always think of Alexander Fleming when I see mould in my clay=
and of course, no further insight ever come up.
Note to self: wear gloves!
Regards
May
Brooklyn NY
[...] Can you think of any negatives to this idea?
> I know that bleach tends to promote precipitation of
> minerals, but wondered if this would be an issue in the clay
> slurry. I employ "lazy reclamation" in that I
> just mix the slop bucket well then pour the contents onto a
> plaster batt to stiffen. I am therefore also wondering if
> the bleach or any of it's products of decomposition such
> as chlorates would attack my plaster batt. Any thoughts
> would be appreciated.
>=20
> All the best.
>=20
> ...James
>=20
> _________________________________________________________________
> See how Windows Mobile brings your life together=E2=80=94at home,
> work, or on the go.
> http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/msnnkwxp1020093182mrt/direct/01/=0A=0A=0A =
Lee Love on sun 21 sep 08
The late Vivia H. said she used a drop of lavender oil.
--
--
Lee Love in Minneapolis
http://heartclay.blogspot.com/
http://mashikopots.blogspot.com/
http://claycraft.blogspot.com/
"Let the beauty we love be what we do.
There are hundreds of ways to kneel and kiss the ground." --Rumi
Fredrick Paget on sun 21 sep 08
There is a product called Physan 20 that is sold to Orchid growers
among other groups of consumers, that is a top knotch disinfectant
and deodorizer. It is used in medical practice to sanitize various
appliences such as colonoscopy tubes made of plastic that can not be
autoclaved.
A very similar product is sold as a swiming pool algae killer.
The chemical name is a yard long and forgive me for posting it but if
you are looking for a generic version in the swimming pool supplies
at Home Depot you need it.
It is loooosly known as a quatenary ammonium salt I believe.
The chemical names:
dimethyl benzyl ammonium chloride and n alkyl dimethyl ethylbenzyl
ammonium chlorides.
The swimming pool stuff is just the first chemical.
I put this stuff in the hand rinse bucket and in slop and it works.
It takes very little. In throwing water it makes a funny scum
sometimes if the clay has gum in it like cmc or peg.
--
Fred Paget
Twin Dragon Studio
Mill Valley, CA, USA
fredrick@well.com
Charter Member Potters Council
Fredrick Paget on sun 21 sep 08
The stink of paper clay going bad can be avoided entirely if instead
of just any old paper you use 100 percent cotton fiber paper.
This can be purchased from suppliers to hobby paper makers as a thick
mat of pure cotton fiber that they use to make paper. Comes in sheets
about a square yard and easily is made into paper pulp.
I have a quart jar of the pure wet pulp that I made 3 or 4 years ago
and it is still fine with no smell. I just grab a small hand full and
mix it into slip if I need a little paperclay slip for repairs and
the slip does not smell and will keep for years.
--
Fred Paget
Twin Dragon Studio
Mill Valley, CA, USA
fredrick@well.com
Charter Member Potters Council
pdp1@EARTHLINK.NET on sun 21 sep 08
Hi Fred,
I have come to like Chlorine Dioxide for a variety of disinfectant or
medical applications.
Sometimes called 'Oxine'...
Used sensibly it is very safe...and lethal to micro-organisms in any
contexts.
Phil
l v
----- Original Message -----
From: "Fredrick Paget"
> There is a product called Physan 20 that is sold to Orchid growers
> among other groups of consumers, that is a top knotch disinfectant
> and deodorizer. It is used in medical practice to sanitize various
> appliences such as colonoscopy tubes made of plastic that can not be
> autoclaved.
>
> A very similar product is sold as a swiming pool algae killer.
>
> The chemical name is a yard long and forgive me for posting it but if
> you are looking for a generic version in the swimming pool supplies
> at Home Depot you need it.
>
> It is loooosly known as a quatenary ammonium salt I believe.
>
> The chemical names:
> dimethyl benzyl ammonium chloride and n alkyl dimethyl ethylbenzyl
> ammonium chlorides.
>
> The swimming pool stuff is just the first chemical.
>
> I put this stuff in the hand rinse bucket and in slop and it works.
> It takes very little. In throwing water it makes a funny scum
> sometimes if the clay has gum in it like cmc or peg.
>
> --
> Fred Paget
> Twin Dragon Studio
> Mill Valley, CA, USA
> fredrick@well.com
>
> Charter Member Potters Council
James F on mon 22 sep 08
Thanks to all for the information. I guess bleach is a decent idea for the=
prewash bucket=2C but a dumb idea for the reclaim and throwing water bucke=
ts. I guess I'll just have to learn to enjoy that heady swamp-muck aroma!
Du zol nicht vissen frum tsores.
...James
_________________________________________________________________
See how Windows Mobile brings your life together=97at home=2C work=2C or on=
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