lili krakowski on tue 11 aug 09
There are things one hates to talk about--but sometimes must. Because =3D
not only do time and tide edit or rewrite history, but =3DE2=3D80=3D9Cold m=
en =3D
forget.=3DE2=3D80=3D9D
The Thirties were a time when =3DE2=3D80=3D9Crace=3DE2=3D80=3D9D was reintr=
oduced =3D
into the active vocabulary.. Hitler loved the word =3D
=3DE2=3D80=3D9CRasse=3DE2=3D80=3D9D and gave us the term =3DE2=3D80=3D9CRas=
sen =3D
Schande=3DE2=3D80=3D9D meaning Race Shame, meaning relations between Gentil=
es =3D
and Jews.
I am not going there. Wikipedia does--as do numbers of books I buy, own, =
=3D
but never read. But =3DE2=3D80=3D9Crace=3DE2=3D80=3D9D was not a word anyon=
e used =3D
casually.
So when Bernard Leach--who, after all, was not an =3D
=3DE2=3D80=3D9Cethnic=3DE2=3D80=3D9D or any other Japanese, but the son of =
a British =3D
lawyer practicing in Hong Kong--started preaching about the general =3D
superiority of Japanese/Oriental art and mores, and spouting about tap =3D
roots, whcih Amerrica lacked as a mixture of races-- it was not a good =
=3D
choice of words.
Leach was incredibly rude to American potters, and as much to those who =3D
like Binns and Doat had come to the US years before.. But his remarks =3D
were outrageous towards the =3DE2=3D80=3D9Cintellectual migration=3DE2=3D80=
=3D9D =3D
--many of whom Jews, or of Jewish descent , who had come here as =3D
refugees.
Leach wrote of his good fortune in having been born into an old culture. =
=3D
Yet, of course, he was far more involved with the culture he grafted =3D
himself into than the one into which he was more or less (Colonial Hong =3D
Kong?) born. Leach apparently spouted his views even at Black Mountain =3D
which had a large number of Hitler refugees on its faculty.=3D20
Americans lacked tap-roots --and those who had been transplanted had not =
=3D
had time to develop them=3DE2=3D80=3DA6 America as a blend of races and =3D
cultures did not have the roots and purity Leach prided himself on.=3D20
Marguerite Wildenhain=3DE2=3D80=3D99s response not only is to the point, bu=
t =3D
tactfuland forebearing..
She points out that British tradition had many roots--in other =3D
cultures: Roman, Saxon, Celtic, etec. =3DE2=3D80=3D9CRoots grow when one li=
ves =3D
according to what is right for you, when your life is honest and your =3D
work related to it in the deepest sense, when one has a country with =3D
which one is closely connected and intimately bound, roots can never be =3D
seen (except when you pull man or tree out of his ground) but they are =3D
there all the same.
=3DE2=3D80=3D9CAmerica has roots too, but it has many and they come from al=
l =3D
over the world, from all races of the earth, from all classes of =3D
society--that is its grandeur, uniqueness, this growing together of a =3D
thousand parts.=3DE2=3D80=3D9D
And more like that.
America received the Intellectual Migration with great generosity. =3D
America demonstrated its receptivity to ideas and to those who embody =3D
them. Just as in earlier times America had welcomed countless religious =3D
and philosophical groups and ideas-- so now it was welcoming another =3D
group that fled to these blessed shores to escape extermination.
There is a more in this this =3DE2=3D80=3D9Cexchange=3DE2=3D80=3D9D than me=
ets the =3D
eye. But it should not be forgotten.=3DE3=3D80=3D80
=3DE3=3D80=3D80
Lili Krakowski
Be of good courage
Lee Love on tue 11 aug 09
On Tue, Aug 11, 2009 at 11:27 AM, lili krakowski w=
=3D
rote:
> There is a more in this this =3D93exchange=3D94 than meets the eye. But i=
t sh=3D
ould not be
>forgotten.
Leach's criticism was valid and did much to improve the situation
in America. We have come a long way in 50 years. There is no need
to take offense, unless you are insecure about your own work.
--
Lee Love, Minneapolis
"The tea ceremony bowl is the ceramic equivalent of a sonnet: a
small-scale, seemingly constricted form that challenges the artist to
go beyond mere technical virtuosity and find an approach that both
satisfies and transcends the conventions." -- Rob Sliberman
full essay: http://togeika.multiply.com/journal/item/273/
Randall Moody on tue 11 aug 09
On Tue, Aug 11, 2009 at 1:12 PM, Lee Love wrote:
> On Tue, Aug 11, 2009 at 11:27 AM, lili krakowski
> wrote:
>
> > There is a more in this this =3D93exchange=3D94 than meets the eye. But=
it =3D
should
> not be
> >forgotten.
>
> Leach's criticism was valid and did much to improve the situation
> in America. We have come a long way in 50 years. There is no need
> to take offense, unless you are insecure about your own work.
>
> --
> Lee Love, Minneapolis
> "The tea ceremony bowl is the ceramic equivalent of a sonnet: a
> small-scale, seemingly constricted form that challenges the artist to
> go beyond mere technical virtuosity and find an approach that both
> satisfies and transcends the conventions." -- Rob Sliberman
> full essay: http://togeika.multiply.com/journal/item/273/
>
I didn't find Leach's criticism to be well thought out or valid. It showed =
=3D
a
gross misunderstanding of America and Americans as well as only a cursory
knowledge of the pottery tradition in the States. The Leachophiles will
disagree of course. But they disagree with any criticism of Leach's
writings.
--=3D20
Randall in Atlanta
ncwhite on tue 11 aug 09
"Lee Love" wrote:
"There is no need to take offense, unless you are insecure about your own
work."
What a nasty little addition to an otherwise adult comment.
Neva, Yuma, AZ
----- Original Message -----
From: "Lee Love"
To:
Sent: Tuesday, August 11, 2009 10:12 AM
Subject: Re: Leach Wildenhain exchange
Leach's criticism was valid and did much to improve the situation
in America. We have come a long way in 50 years. There is no need
to take offense, unless you are insecure about your own work.
--
Philip Poburka on tue 11 aug 09
Aside from the pleasure people seem to find in critiqueing vagueries or
spin-offs which supposedly concern what Mr. Leach is
said-to-have-said...does any one ever bother providing any actual, authenti=
c
'Quotes', so their readers can actually read WHAT Mr. Leach had said?
This might be helpful, even if it is a bother to actually care about or
address what he HAD said, as such...
Oye...
Love,
Phil
Lv
Lorraine Pierce on tue 11 aug 09
Lee, I would be interested to read in what way you believe Leach' 'criticis=
=3D
m
was valid' and which 'situation in America' he improved. Thank you. Lori
Pierce
On Tue, Aug 11, 2009 at 1:12 PM, Lee Love wrote:
> On Tue, Aug 11, 2009 at 11:27 AM, lili krakowski
> wrote:
>
> > There is a more in this this =3D93exchange=3D94 than meets the eye. But=
it =3D
should
> not be
> >forgotten.
>
> Leach's criticism was valid and did much to improve the situation
> in America. We have come a long way in 50 years. There is no need
> to take offense, unless you are insecure about your own work.
>
> --
> Lee Love, Minneapolis
> "The tea ceremony bowl is the ceramic equivalent of a sonnet: a
> small-scale, seemingly constricted form that challenges the artist to
> go beyond mere technical virtuosity and find an approach that both
> satisfies and transcends the conventions." -- Rob Sliberman
> full essay: http://togeika.multiply.com/journal/item/273/
>
Lorraine Pierce on tue 11 aug 09
Thank you Lili for an intelligent,thoughtful, caring and heartfelt post. It
was much appreciated, and so are you.
Lori Pierce in Orange Park, Fl.
On Tue, Aug 11, 2009 at 12:27 PM, lili krakowski w=
=3D
rote:
> There are things one hates to talk about--but sometimes must. Because not
> only do time and tide edit or rewrite history, but =3D93old men forget.=
=3D94
>
> The Thirties were a time when =3D93race=3D94 was reintroduced into the ac=
tive
> vocabulary.. Hitler loved the word =3D93Rasse=3D94 and gave us the term =
=3D93Ra=3D
ssen
> Schande=3D94 meaning Race Shame, meaning relations between Gentiles and J=
ew=3D
s.
>
> I am not going there. Wikipedia does--as do numbers of books I buy, own,
> but never read. But =3D93race=3D94 was not a word anyone used casually.
>
> So when Bernard Leach--who, after all, was not an =3D93ethnic=3D94 or any=
oth=3D
er
> Japanese, but the son of a British lawyer practicing in Hong Kong--starte=
=3D
d
> preaching about the general superiority of Japanese/Oriental art and mor=
=3D
es,
> and spouting about tap roots, whcih Amerrica lacked as a mixture of
> races-- it was not a good choice of words.
>
> Leach was incredibly rude to American potters, and as much to those who
> like Binns and Doat had come to the US years before.. But his remarks we=
=3D
re
> outrageous towards the =3D93intellectual migration=3D94 --many of whom Je=
ws, =3D
or of
> Jewish descent , who had come here as refugees.
>
> Leach wrote of his good fortune in having been born into an old culture.
> Yet, of course, he was far more involved with the culture he grafted hims=
=3D
elf
> into than the one into which he was more or less (Colonial Hong Kong?) bo=
=3D
rn.
> Leach apparently spouted his views even at Black Mountain which had a lar=
=3D
ge
> number of Hitler refugees on its faculty.
>
> Americans lacked tap-roots --and those who had been transplanted had not
> had time to develop them=3D85 America as a blend of races and cultures di=
d =3D
not
> have the roots and purity Leach prided himself on.
>
> Marguerite Wildenhain=3D92s response not only is to the point, but tactfu=
la=3D
nd
> forebearing..
>
> She points out that British tradition had many roots--in other cultures:
> Roman, Saxon, Celtic, etec. =3D93Roots grow when one lives according to w=
ha=3D
t is
> right for you, when your life is honest and your work related to it in th=
=3D
e
> deepest sense, when one has a country with which one is closely connected
> and intimately bound, roots can never be seen (except when you pull man o=
=3D
r
> tree out of his ground) but they are there all the same.
>
> =3D93America has roots too, but it has many and they come from all over t=
he
> world, from all races of the earth, from all classes of society--that is =
=3D
its
> grandeur, uniqueness, this growing together of a thousand parts.=3D94
>
> And more like that.
>
> America received the Intellectual Migration with great generosity. Americ=
=3D
a
> demonstrated its receptivity to ideas and to those who embody them. Just =
=3D
as
> in earlier times America had welcomed countless religious and philosophic=
=3D
al
> groups and ideas-- so now it was welcoming another group that fled to the=
=3D
se
> blessed shores to escape extermination.
>
> There is a more in this this =3D93exchange=3D94 than meets the eye. But i=
t sh=3D
ould
> not be forgotten.
>
>
>
> Lili Krakowski
> Be of good courage
>
Lee Love on tue 11 aug 09
On Tue, Aug 11, 2009 at 2:06 PM, Randall Moody wro=
te:
> knowledge of the pottery tradition in the States. The Leachophiles will
> disagree of course. But they disagree with any criticism of Leach's
> writings.
I should add, that I am not a "Leachophile." I see him
pretty objectively and understand his strengths and weaknesses. I
speak up in the defense of the dead who cannot defend themselves, and
in reaction to those who are rabidly anti-leachopile. ;^)
--
Lee Love, Minneapolis
"The tea ceremony bowl is the ceramic equivalent of a sonnet: a
small-scale, seemingly constricted form that challenges the artist to
go beyond mere technical virtuosity and find an approach that both
satisfies and transcends the conventions." -- Rob Sliberman
full essay: http://togeika.multiply.com/journal/item/273/
Lee Love on tue 11 aug 09
If you go to Craft in America, you can see some video of the Owens
family, the N.Carolina pottery Leach thought was a "taproot."
http://www.craftinamerica.org/?
--
Lee Love, Minneapolis
"The tea ceremony bowl is the ceramic equivalent of a sonnet: a
small-scale, seemingly constricted form that challenges the artist to
go beyond mere technical virtuosity and find an approach that both
satisfies and transcends the conventions." -- Rob Sliberman
full essay: http://togeika.multiply.com/journal/item/273/
Karen Sullivan on tue 11 aug 09
I have some time this summer...
So...here goes.....
In thinking of Leach's comments,
I think the element he did not
Consider when advising artists
To work from their tap root,
Is the freedom of innovation of form
That became such a huge element of
Work in the 50's a la Peter Voulkos.
The thinking was more about
Innovation as an element of
Creativity.
The definition my teacher had
About the difference between
An Artist and a Craftsman was
A pretty high bar to reach...
Craftsmen work within existing traditions...
Artists' contribute a new definition to the
Paradigm of Art, thus extending the
Dialogue to new territory.
When you consider that it has all been
Done before...that means for the select
Few in history who somehow change the
Paradigm...it is a major contribution
To Art making.
So...Leach was somewhere back in history
Tapping into his world...to enrich how
The work of his world is seen.
I could get picky...and I think that when
Art Historians try to evaluate work as forgeries.
An element that goes into that study is the
Quality of the line....the thinking is that
We carry a sensibility of line that is a reflection
Of our time in history....think of handwriting....my
Mother's generation handwriting is very different than mine.
Extend that thinking to art....
Also I think about materials...and innovation...
The inclusion stains that were developed mean
I can not get bright canary yellow glazes at
Cone 10...not possible 10 years ago...so
Due to the innovation...my work will be placed
Into a specific time in the history of materials.
Karen
Randall Moody on tue 11 aug 09
On Tue, Aug 11, 2009 at 3:49 PM, Lee Love wrote:
> I beg to differ Randall. At the time, Leach mostly saw pots being
> made at universities and centers like Black Mountain where expression
> was everything and craftsmanship went begging.
>
>
Of course you disagree with me Lee. You are after all what has been termed =
a
"neo-Leachean" (no offense meant). You also prove my point. He made his
blanket statement about tap roots with only a narrow experience of a few
university pots and potters. It is like meeting someone from Rhode Island
and using that to formulate your entire concept of the United States of
America or meeting one cholo and writing a dismissal of the entire Hispanic
race. He wrote too broad a treatise on too narrow of an experience and was
rightly taken to task for it.
--
Randall in Atlanta
James Freeman on tue 11 aug 09
On Tue, Aug 11, 2009 at 3:06 PM, Randall Moody wro=
te:
...snip...
>
> I didn't find Leach's criticism to be well thought out or valid. It showe=
d a
> gross misunderstanding of America and Americans as well as only a cursory
> knowledge of the pottery tradition in the States.
Randall...
Leach's criticism also begs the question of the importance of a
tradition. This is certainly not a settled issue.
Take care.
...James
James Freeman
"All I say is by way of discourse, and nothing by way of advice. I
should not speak so boldly if it were my due to be believed."
-Michel de Montaigne
http://www.jamesfreemanstudio.com
http://www.flickr.com/photos/jamesfreemanstudio/
http://www.jamesfreemanstudio.com/clayart/
Lee Love on tue 11 aug 09
I beg to differ Randall. At the time, Leach mostly saw pots being
made at universities and centers like Black Mountain where expression
was everything and craftsmanship went begging.
We have a much stronger studio pottery situation now than we
did at the time. Folks have been "working toward a standard."
We have situations here that exist nowhere else in the pottery making
world because we have put craft and art in balance.
--
Lee Love, Minneapolis
"The tea ceremony bowl is the ceramic equivalent of a sonnet: a
small-scale, seemingly constricted form that challenges the artist to
go beyond mere technical virtuosity and find an approach that both
satisfies and transcends the conventions." -- Rob Sliberman
full essay: http://togeika.multiply.com/journal/item/273/
Randall Moody on tue 11 aug 09
On Tue, Aug 11, 2009 at 2:45 PM, ncwhite wrote:
> "Lee Love" wrote:
>
> "There is no need to take offense, unless you are insecure about your own
> work."
>
> What a nasty little addition to an otherwise adult comment.
>
> Neva, Yuma, AZ
>
>
True. It is akin to making sweeping racial generalizations and then saying
that if you aren't one of "those types" you shouldn't be offended. Leach's
criticism was too broad and came from too small of a sample to be taken as
valid.
--
Randall in Atlanta
Snail Scott on fri 14 aug 09
> On Tue, Aug 11, 2009 at 10:44 PM, Lee Love
> wrote:
>> ...The difference between a
>> craftless artist and an artist with a foundation is craft, is that the
>> mere artist is hostage to his inability to manifest his idea, because
>> he doesn't have the skill to do so...
>
On Aug 12, 2009, at 12:20 PM, James Freeman wrote:
> ...Skill seems no longer to be a necessary trait in a capital "A"
> Artist.
> All that is necessary today is chutzpah and a financial backer.
> Witness Koons and Hirst. Seems the more successful an Artist becomes,
> the less he or she needs to get their hands dirty to maintain their
> title...
I'd suggest, in the name of stirring the pot,
that the ability to manage employees and to
direct large-scale projects is also a skill. If
the concept is excellent, why not hire the best
craftspeople to execute it? While the result may
not show the results possible with an intimate
understanding of process and materials, that
may not be the most important aspect of the
project. Further, if the artist is willing to delegate
the actual fabrication, it allows the artist to choose
from among many media, selecting the one best
suited to the idea. It takes a long time to gain
even minimally adequate skill in some processes,
and to gain such skill in several would be nearly
impossible.
I prefer to do my own work. That's one of the
reasons I'm not in architecture anymore - I
wanted to be more than the designer; I wanted
to have a direct, tactile connection with the work.
But that's me. By working this way, I gain great
personal satisfaction, and I can make things that
could never be effectively outsourced.
I also know that I will not be able to do some
kinds of projects: those that are too large for a
single person to make: those requiring expert
outside assistance for some aspect, or those in
which execution by another person is integral
to the idea.
I try not to confuse my own preferences with
any innate moral superiority.
Work designed by one person and executed
by someone else may have different properties
than one designed and executed by the same
person, but that doesn't make it 'not art'. Work
can be made entirely by one person, and still
not qualify as art.
Gonna throw chum in the water, now...
If a person makes a piece in emulation of an
ancient or admired artwork, then the maker is
NOT the artist, but the craftsperson, just as if
they were an employee of Jeff Koons.
-Snail
Roland Beevor on fri 14 aug 09
lili krakowski wrote:
> Leach was incredibly rude to American potters, and as much to those who l=
ike Binns and Doat had come to the US years before.. But his remarks were =
outrageous towards the =E2EURoeintellectual migration=E2EUR=9D ...
> There is a more in this this =E2EURoeexchange=E2EUR=9D than meets the eye=
. But it should not be forgotten.=E3EUREUR
Dear Lili
I have always amused when this subject comes up, it seems that Americans
are very sensitive to Leach, especially the 'taproot' business, and when
you read about how rude Leach was about Harry Davis it is easy to jump
to the conclusion that he was the epitome of the unenlightened Engilsh
imperialist who went around the world upsetting people. Your insight
into the sensitivities of refugees is revealing, but does it reveal
Leach as rude, unaware or misunderstood?
It was very kind of James Freeman to post links to the original pieces
by Leach and Wildenhain, I am sure you are correct in your conclusion,
and I confess to finding it difficult to extract the deeper meaning from
what they wrote. When Wildenhain writes about "the voices that rose in
indignation and in doubt as the the value of what you were preaching
with the zeal and fervour of a missionary, were so many and came from so
many different sides of the world," it would be fascinating to know who
said what. And when you write that Leach was incredibly rude, it would
again be enlightening to know exactly how he was rude.
How far were Leach's remarks actually directed at America, Americans or
people who happened to be living in America, and how much they were
general thoughts that his visit gave him an opportunity to express?
When Leach writes, "It is a humbling fact that so few of _our_ evolved,
educated, self-conscious, world conscious potters can stand the test of
comparison" (with Pueblo Indians, or the unknown artisans of the past),
he is surely not making a criticism of Americans but western craft
potters in general (but excluding Cardew). It seems to me that his
point is that America should be able to produce and support craft
potters, and he proposes the sort of organisation that existed at St
Ives as a model. A lot of what he writes about the development of
potters could be written by Mel Jacobsen, and it would be good to have
the Widenhain response to him!
The more one reads the more this is a fascinating period of
international exchange and development. Leach wrote his piece in 1950.
In 1952 Leach and Wildenhain were at the Dartington conference, in 1953
Wildenhain wrote her open letter, presumably this was after Leach had
been at Black Mountain for the October seminar. Leach recommended
Mackenzie to Black Mountain, and Voulkos was there as well (and was
transformed by the exposure to the broader range of arts).
The more you have to tell us Lili, the more grateful I'll be.
Roly Beevor
Lee Love on fri 14 aug 09
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 8:26 AM, Snail Scott wro=
te:
> If a person makes a piece in emulation of an
> ancient or admired artwork, then the maker is
> NOT the artist, but the craftsperson, just as if
> they were an employee of Jeff Koons.
There are two ways things are deemed art. One, the perenial
measure, is the success of the application of a craft. And the
more modern way of using it: is what an artist makes regardless of its
success.
Rosanjin created, in the making of pots and glazes from different
kilns and eras, works of art. If you can make a pot that captures
the heart of a tradition. That is art in the truest sense.
If you are an artist that simply copies your own success
without any heart, you are neither an artist nor a craftsman. As
Hamada used to say, not every pot is a work of art, but you can eat
soup out of them anyways. The same cannot be said about most fine
art.
--
Lee Love, Minneapolis
"The tea ceremony bowl is the ceramic equivalent of a sonnet: a
small-scale, seemingly constricted form that challenges the artist to
go beyond mere technical virtuosity and find an approach that both
satisfies and transcends the conventions." -- Rob Sliberman
full essay: http://togeika.multiply.com/journal/item/273/
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