John Hesselberth on fri 18 sep 09
I have managed to stay out of this thread so far, but I can no longer
resist.
I agree with Lee. I am a craftsman and studio potter. I am not an
artist and don't want to be considered to be one because of the lack
of emphasis on (and sometimes disdain for) craftsmanship in many of
today's art schools and by prominent self-designated "artists".
John
On Sep 18, 2009, at 3:25 PM, Lee Love wrote:
> I am a studio potter. It pretty much covers all the aspects
> Elizabeth mentions. Artist doesn't cover the craftmaship
> perspective.
"If you eat a frog first thing in the morning, that will probably be
the worst thing you do all day." Mark Twain
John Hesselberth
john@frogpondpottery.com
Elizabeth Priddy on fri 18 sep 09
I am an artist because no other job-indicator describes me.
I paint and sell the work that I paint on paper.I teach design, painting, p=
=3D
ottery, and low-relief sculpture.I make and sell pots and sculpture.I make =
=3D
and sell painted pots.
So potter is insufficient, so is sculptor, so is craftsman, so is painter.A=
=3D
rtisan sounds super flakey and I do not really understand what the point of=
=3D
the-an instead of -t ending implies.
"An artisan (from artigiano) is a skilled manual worker=3DA0who crafts item=
s =3D
that may be functional or strictly decorative, including furniture ..."I do=
=3D
n't get the distinction between this and "craftsman."
So in the interest of brevity, I am left with "Artist".=3DA0=3DA0Good or ba=
d is=3D
relative to the day I am working,=3DA0but that distinction apples to a lot=
o=3D
f things!
E
Elizabeth Priddy
=3D0ABeaufort, NC - USA
=3D0A
=3D0A=3D0A=3D0A
Marcia Selsor on fri 18 sep 09
I think you are an artist because your work goes beyond highly skilled
work to become fluidly poetic. I also appreciate the sureness/mastery
(?) of your brush work and images.
Marcia
On Sep 18, 2009, at 10:23 AM, Elizabeth Priddy wrote:
> I am an artist because no other job-indicator describes me.
> I paint and sell the work that I paint on paper.I teach design,
> painting, pottery, and low-relief sculpture.I make and sell pots and
> sculpture.I make and sell painted pots.
> So potter is insufficient, so is sculptor, so is craftsman, so is
> painter.Artisan sounds super flakey and I do not really understand
> what the point of the-an instead of -t ending implies.
> "An artisan (from artigiano) is a skilled manual worker who crafts
> items that may be functional or strictly decorative, including
> furniture ..."I don't get the distinction between this and
> "craftsman."
> So in the interest of brevity, I am left with "Artist". Good or bad
> is relative to the day I am working, but that distinction apples to
> a lot of things!
> E
>
> Elizabeth Priddy
>
> Beaufort, NC - USA
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Marcia Selsor
http://marciaselsor.com
Lee Love on fri 18 sep 09
I am a studio potter. It pretty much covers all the aspects
Elizabeth mentions. Artist doesn't cover the craftmaship
perspective.
--
Lee Love, Minneapolis
"The tea ceremony bowl is the ceramic equivalent of a sonnet: a
small-scale, seemingly constricted form that challenges the artist to
go beyond mere technical virtuosity and find an approach that both
satisfies and transcends the conventions." -- Rob Sliberman
full essay: http://togeika.multiply.com/journal/item/273/
Marcia Selsor on sat 19 sep 09
On Sep 19, 2009, at 7:04 AM, Marcia Selsor wrote:
> John,
> I agree that craftsmanship is a key component of being a studio
> potter.
> My training emphasized craftsmanship as well as artistry. I believe
> one working in traditional mediums must know the craft first before
> they can excel to at artistic level. A superb craftsman may not be
> an artist. But an artist in clay must be a skilled craftsman first.
> IMHO. As for some contemporary mediums, there are times when the
> artist's concept does not rely on craftsmanship. I am thinking of
> the performance video in Penn Station or another at a station in
> Belgium where everyone starts singing Doe Re Me.
> I guess it is complex to label and define to categories within
> strict boundaries. I consider Elizabeth an Artist. She worked as a
> graphic artist and has applied that to her ceramics. I am not
> familiar with her work outside of clay. But I consider her work in
> clay to be very artistic and beautiful. Her skill/craftsmanship in
> the medium has allowed her to combine it with her abilitiy as an
> artist. I like that. There are also potters whose pots,
> sensibilities of form and glazes make their work stand out beyond
> others. The first coming to mind is Richard Aerni. Another would be
> Bacia. These potters appeal to me personally. And we all should
> realize "Art" is a subjective.
> Marcia
>
> On Sep 18, 2009, at 6:47 PM, John Hesselberth wrote:
>
>> I have managed to stay out of this thread so far, but I can no longer
>> resist.
>>
>> I agree with Lee. I am a craftsman and studio potter. I am not an
>> artist and don't want to be considered to be one because of the lack
>> of emphasis on (and sometimes disdain for) craftsmanship in many of
>> today's art schools and by prominent self-designated "artists".
>>
>> John
>> On Sep 18, 2009, at 3:25 PM, Lee Love wrote:
>>
>>> I am a studio potter. It pretty much covers all the aspects
>>> Elizabeth mentions. Artist doesn't cover the craftmaship
>>> perspective.
>>
>> "If you eat a frog first thing in the morning, that will probably be
>> the worst thing you do all day." Mark Twain
>>
>> John Hesselberth
>> john@frogpondpottery.com
>>
>
> Marcia Selsor
> http://marciaselsor.com
>
>
>
>
Marcia Selsor
http://marciaselsor.com
Marcia Selsor on sat 19 sep 09
John,
I agree that craftsmanship is a key component of being a studio potter.
My training emphasized craftsmanship as well as artistry. I believe
one working in traditional mediums must know the craft first before
they can excel to at artistic level. A superb craftsman may not be an
artist. But an artist in clay must be a skilled craftsman first. IMHO.
As for some contemporary mediums, there are times when the artist's
concept does not rely on craftsmanship. I am thinking of the
performance video in Penn Station or another at a station in Belgium
where everyone starts singing Doe Re Me.
I guess it is complex to label and define to categories within strict
boundaries. I consider Elizabeth an Artist. She worked as a graphic
artist and has applied that to her ceramics. I am not familiar with
her work outside of clay. But I consider her work in clay to be very
artistic and beautiful. Her skill/craftsmanship in the medium has
allowed her to combine it with her abilitiy as an artist. I like that.
There are also potters whose pots, sensibilities of form and glazes
make their work stand out beyond others. The first coming to mind is
Richard Aerni. Another would be Bacia. These potters appeal to me
personally. And we all should realize "Art" is a subjective.
Marcia
On Sep 18, 2009, at 6:47 PM, John Hesselberth wrote:
> I have managed to stay out of this thread so far, but I can no longer
> resist.
>
> I agree with Lee. I am a craftsman and studio potter. I am not an
> artist and don't want to be considered to be one because of the lack
> of emphasis on (and sometimes disdain for) craftsmanship in many of
> today's art schools and by prominent self-designated "artists".
>
> John
> On Sep 18, 2009, at 3:25 PM, Lee Love wrote:
>
>> I am a studio potter. It pretty much covers all the aspects
>> Elizabeth mentions. Artist doesn't cover the craftmaship
>> perspective.
>
> "If you eat a frog first thing in the morning, that will probably be
> the worst thing you do all day." Mark Twain
>
> John Hesselberth
> john@frogpondpottery.com
>
Marcia Selsor
http://marciaselsor.com
Vince Pitelka on sat 19 sep 09
John Hesselberth wrote:
"I agree with Lee. I am a craftsman and studio potter. I am not an
artist and don't want to be considered to be one because of the lack
of emphasis on (and sometimes disdain for) craftsmanship in many of
today's art schools and by prominent self-designated 'artists'."
John -
You are an artist. JOHN HESSELBERTH IS AN ARTIST. Okay, did everyone hear
that? Can we all agree on it?
With all due respect, your statement above is very sad, because as an
intelligent, informed, capable craftsperson, you are sacrificing the term
"artist" to people who do not deserve it as much as you do. Please don't d=
o
that, because it is the worst possible response to the current situation in
art academia. You provide exactly the reason why people like you and me and
James Freeman should proudly and boldly say that we are artists.
- Vince
Vince Pitelka
Appalachian Center for Craft
Tennessee Tech University
vpitelka@dtccom.net; wpitelka@tntech.edu
http://iweb.tntech.edu/wpitelka
Elizabeth Priddy on sun 20 sep 09
Lee's sort of implied that I am not a craftsman because I am an artist. =3D=
A0=3D
He probably didn't mean to say this because he frequently says things so va=
=3D
guely as to be inherently incorrect due to the imprecision of his word choi=
=3D
ces. =3DA0Or maybe he WAS actually trying to insult me.
Either way.
I would put my craftsmanship up against anyone's. =3DA0I did two years thro=
wi=3D
ng production for someone else and then 10 years doing it for myself. =3DA0=
I =3D
am a good craftsman.
While I was not a good craftsman when I was 19, I was already an artist, as=
=3D
I made worthy art even then. =3DA0But now I am both a good craftsman AND a=
n =3D
artist. =3DA0So, like I said, in the interest of brevity, I am an artist, a=
s =3D
it covers both. =3DA0Art without crafstmanship is impermanent and people do=
n'=3D
t tend to view it highly over time. =3DA0So good art tends to be well craft=
ed=3D
. =3DA0Thus the term "performance art", to describe things, events, happeni=
ng=3D
s, that do not persist after the event. =3DA0The qualifier is absolutely ne=
ce=3D
ssary for some "art". =3DA0Yet, Cristo is a legitimate artist.
Those of us who are artists should not be deprived of our titles in the wor=
=3D
ld just because there are people who are frauds who call themselves by our =
=3D
names.
A man that beats his wife and doesn't provide for his kids is still called =
=3D
a "husband" and "father". =3DA0It doesn't mean he is a good one of either. =
=3D
=3DA0Yet my Husband is a good one and an excellent father to my son and we =
ca=3D
ll him those names proudly.
If you are uncomfortable calling yourself an artist, don't claim it is beca=
=3D
sue of the frauds out there. =3DA0Because if that were true, no one could c=
al=3D
l themselves anything at all. =3DA0 Maybe you have other reasons that are m=
or=3D
e valid. =3DA0Because I have seenyour work, and while it is certainly not a=
va=3D
nt garde, it is definitely quality art. =3DA0More like Wyeth, less like Kan=
di=3D
nsky, still art as opposed to a toaster.
Elizabeth Priddy
=3D0ABeaufort, NC - USA
=3D0A
--- On Fri, 9/18/09, John Hesselberth wrote:
From: John Hesselberth
Subject: Re: why I am an artist and not an artisan
To: Clayart@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG
Date: Friday, September 18, 2009, 7:47 PM
I have managed to stay out of this thread so far, but I can no longer
resist.
I agree with Lee. I am a craftsman and studio potter. I am not an
artist and don't want to be considered to be one because of the lack
of emphasis on (and sometimes disdain for) craftsmanship in many of
today's art schools and by prominent self-designated "artists".
John
On Sep 18, 2009, at 3:25 PM, Lee Love wrote:
> I am a=3DA0 studio potter.=3DA0 =3DA0 It pretty much covers all the aspec=
ts
> Elizabeth mentions.=3DA0=3DA0=3DA0Artist doesn't cover the craftmaship
> perspective.
"If you eat a frog first thing in the morning, that will probably be
the worst thing you do all day."=3DA0 =3DA0 Mark Twain
John Hesselberth
john@frogpondpottery.com
=3D0A=3D0A=3D0A
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