Lee Love on wed 11 nov 09
On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 7:28 PM, Kelly Savino
wrote:
>I DO understand tool lust; I've gone crazy at NCECA buying one of these
> and one of those, myself.
I gotta ask, how many folks trim stiff porcelain? If I find
mine that hard, I wet it. The nice thing about porcelain is that it
is tight. You can re-wet bone dry work.
I can't comprehend needing a trimming tool 5 times as
expensive as a Dolan.
--
Lee, a Mashiko potter in Minneapolis
http://mashikopots.blogspot.com/
"Ta tIr na n-=3DF3g ar chul an tI=3D97tIr dlainn trina ch=3DE9ile"=3D97tha=
t is, "T=3D
he
land of eternal youth is behind the house, a beautiful land fluent
within itself." -- John O'Donohue
Kelly Savino on wed 11 nov 09
Tony, you make perfect sense -- but you are a potter for a living, walking =
the walk, and you earned your way there.
I am standing in a different place, and I see a different pattern: potters =
who are just getting started, buying top of the line, state of the art equi=
pment and every shiny gadget, including expensive stuff they barely have th=
e skill or ability to use.
Sometimes it's because they are spending someone else's money -- a guild, c=
ollege or art center's budget is big fun to shop with, and it's easy to get=
carried away.
Sometimes potters think it will be a shortcut to better work, if they buy t=
he better toys -- but if you put a thick, squatty, beginner dog dish in an =
expensive, state of the art kiln, you can still pound a nail with it once i=
t's fired. (ditto for anagamas, and other sexy firings: if a pot doesn't ha=
ve good bones, it doesn't matter how you glaze or fire it... it's still a d=
og.)
You can't buy skill. There is no substitute for sweat, repetition, failure,=
crit and improvement: and I am willing to bet a skilled potter could make =
a pot from creek mud, fire it in a trash can, and still have good work.
(Not saying, Tony, that it would make a good business plan! Apples and oran=
ges.)
I DO understand tool lust; I've gone crazy at NCECA buying one of these and=
one of those, myself.
Over the years I did a little starry-eyed shopping, and a little David Hend=
ley-style cobbling from scratch, and wound up with a lot of tools and gadge=
ts. When I started my MFA, I had two full toolboxes that I hauled to Michig=
an for every class.
After a month I left all that at home, kept one thin metal rib in my back p=
ocket, and that was it. I had a chamois and twisty wire on my wheel and "bo=
rrowed" Patrick's pin tool when necessary. :0) Hi Paddy.
When I remade my own studio space last summer I purged a ton of stuff. Not =
every goodwill find and garage sale doodad needs to be a clay tool, and who=
has room to store all that, or time to try it? I do have a big multidrawer=
bin full of bisque stamps and rollers, but my favorite thing to poke into =
clay these days ... is the end of a clothespin. Go figure.
Spending money to buy gear for the potter you hope to be one day just doesn=
't make sense, if you're not a business with a merchant number and a long =
term plan. We allow ourselves to be led by the nose. You don't need a Humme=
r or a 4WD SUV to take Sparky to the vet, but it looks so exciting on TV wh=
en they are climbing mountains and jumping rivers...
Yours
Kelly in Ohio... not trying to ruin things for the folks selling tools and =
equipment...commerce is good, and the right gadget at the right time can fi=
ll a need. But lord help me, every time Bill Van Gilder has a new idea, eve=
ry potter in my town buys a tool, and clones his pots...
http://www.primalpotter.com (website)
http://primalmommy.wordpress.com (blog)
http://www.primalpotter.etsy.com (store)
Des & Jan Howard on thu 12 nov 09
Kelly
Over the years the local tech college ceramics students
have done the occasional field trip to our workshop.
Each trip two or more students take me to one side &
ask me to make them chattering tools or extruder & dies
to match mine. Each time I tell them to bring the bits
with them another day & we'll make the tools together.
Sigh, only one ever took up the offer.
Des
Kelly Savino wrote:
> But lord help me, every time Bill Van Gilder has a new idea,
> every potter in my town buys a tool, and clones his pots...
--
Des & Jan Howard
Lue Pottery
Lue NSW
Australia
2850
02 6373 6419
www.luepottery.hwy.com.au
-32.656072 149.840624
Kelly Savino on thu 12 nov 09
--- cwiddershins@gmail.com wrote:
> I gotta ask, how many folks trim stiff porcelain? If I find
>mine that hard, I wet it. The nice thing about porcelain is that it
>is tight. You can re-wet bone dry work.
> I can't comprehend needing a trimming tool 5 times as
>expensive as a Dolan.
I never use porcelain but I LOVE my Bison tools. The cutting tool is a joy =
in the palm of my hand, and never dulls. The trimmers carve stoneware flawl=
essly if it's the right stage, and chatter beautifully if that's my goal. M=
y students are always asking to use my Bisons.
It's kind of like saying, "Why would anyone spend $100 for a teabowl? Walma=
rt has nice bowls that work just fine"... craftsmanship is craftsmanship. I=
t's worth it to me.
To each his own...
Kelly
http://www.primalpotter.com (website)
http://primalmommy.wordpress.com (blog)
http://www.primalpotter.etsy.com (store)
Lee Love on thu 12 nov 09
On Thu, Nov 12, 2009 at 8:02 AM, wrote:
> It's kind of like saying, "Why would anyone spend $100 for a teabowl? >Wa=
=3D
lmart has nice bowls that work just fine"... craftsmanship is >craftsmanshi=
=3D
p. It's worth it to me.
Dolan is not Walmart. $100.00 for a tea ceremony bowl is pretty
low actually. You say they trim well if the clay is "just
right." Sometimes we make stuff to justify the tools we use, rather
than buy the tools we need to make the stuff we need to make.
You are right, "to each his own."
--
Lee, a Mashiko potter in Minneapolis
http://mashikopots.blogspot.com/
"Ta tIr na n-=3DF3g ar chul an tI=3D97tIr dlainn trina ch=3DE9ile"=3D97tha=
t is, "T=3D
he
land of eternal youth is behind the house, a beautiful land fluent
within itself." -- John O'Donohue
steve graber on thu 12 nov 09
well i love tool gaget people!=3DA0 =3D0A=3D0Aactually my take on pottery c=
an use=3D
an example of boaters.=3DA0 having grown up just about on a sailboat, i kn=
ow=3D
how many boats sit in marina's mostly unused.=3DA0 meanwhile, they do stil=
l =3D
have a passion for the water and enjoy trying to relate to that water world=
=3D
, albiet in an office=3DA0cubical or via reading boating magazines.=3DA0 an=
d so=3D
me occassional saturday boat ride!=3DA0 =3D0A=3D0A=3D0Ai happen to have a n=
icely eq=3D
uipted pottery studio - and a kiln way bigger than=3DA0 what i need (now).=
=3DA0=3D
i look at it often and figure, if it was in a marina, people would walk by=
=3D
and say "why doesn't he take that thing out for a sail more often?"=3D0A=
=3D0A=3D
=3D0Aat least in the world of interesting hobbies we do have some of the lo=
we=3D
st price equipment!=3DA0 try getting hooked on golf?=3DA0 skiing?=3DA0 boat=
ing?=3D
=3DA0 photography?=3DA0 tool gagets are everywhere!=3DA0 at least ours are =
pretty=3D
low end priced.=3DA0 =3D0A=3D0A=3D0A~ and santa doesn't end up with a bust=
ed budge=3D
t!=3DA0 =3D0A=3D0A=3D0A=3DA0Steve Graber, Graber's Pottery, Inc=3D0AClaremo=
nt, Californ=3D
ia USA=3D0AThe Steve Tool - for awesome texture on pots! =3D0Awww.graberspo=
tter=3D
y.com steve@graberspottery.com =3D0A=3D0A=3D0AOn Laguna Clay's website=3D0A=
http://w=3D
ww.lagunaclay.com/blogs/ =3D0A=3D0A=3D0A=3D0A----- Original Message ----=3D=
0A> From: =3D
Kelly Savino =3D0A> To: Clayart@LSV.CERAMICS.O=
RG=3D
=3D0A> Sent: Wed, November 11, 2009 5:28:46 PM=3D0A> Subject: pennies and p=
ound=3D
s: another view=3D0A> =3D0A> Tony, you make perfect sense -- but you are a =
pott=3D
er for a living, walking the =3D0A> walk, and you earned your way there.=3D=
0A> =3D
=3D0A> I am standing in a different place, and I see a different pattern: p=
ot=3D
ters who =3D0A> are just getting started, buying top of the line, state of =
th=3D
e art equipment and =3D0A> every shiny gadget, including expensive stuff th=
ey=3D
barely have the skill or =3D0A> ability to use.=3D0A> =3D0A> Sometimes it'=
s beca=3D
use they are spending someone else's money -- a guild, =3D0A> college or ar=
t =3D
center's budget is big fun to shop with, and it's easy to get =3D0A> carrie=
d =3D
away.=3D0A> =3D0A> Sometimes potters think it will be a shortcut to better =
work=3D
, if they buy the =3D0A> better toys -- but if you put a thick, squatty, be=
gi=3D
nner dog dish in an =3D0A> expensive, state of the art kiln, you can still =
po=3D
und a nail with it once it's =3D0A> fired. (ditto for anagamas, and other s=
ex=3D
y firings: if a pot doesn't have good =3D0A> bones, it doesn't matter how y=
ou=3D
glaze or fire it... it's still a dog.)=3D0A> =3D0A> You can't buy skill. T=
here=3D
is no substitute for sweat, repetition, failure, crit =3D0A> and improveme=
nt=3D
: and I am willing to bet a skilled potter could make a pot from =3D0A> cre=
ek=3D
mud, fire it in a trash can, and still have good work.=3D0A> =3D0A> (Not s=
ayin=3D
g, Tony, that it would make a good business plan! Apples and oranges.)=3D0A=
> =3D
=3D0A> I DO understand tool lust; I've gone crazy at NCECA buying one of th=
es=3D
e and one =3D0A> of those, myself.=3D0A> Over the years I did a little star=
ry-e=3D
yed shopping, and a little David =3D0A> Hendley-style cobbling from scratch=
, =3D
and wound up with a lot of tools and =3D0A> gadgets. When I started my MFA,=
I=3D
had two full toolboxes that I hauled to =3D0A> Michigan for every class.=
=3D0A>=3D
=3D0A> After a month I left all that at home, kept one thin metal rib in m=
y =3D
back =3D0A> pocket, and that was it. I had a chamois and twisty wire on my =
wh=3D
eel and =3D0A> "borrowed" Patrick's pin tool when necessary. :0) Hi Paddy.=
=3D0A=3D
> =3D0A> When I remade my own studio space last summer I purged a ton of st=
uf=3D
f. Not every =3D0A> goodwill find and garage sale doodad needs to be a clay=
t=3D
ool, and who has room =3D0A> to store all that, or time to try it? I do hav=
e =3D
a big multidrawer bin full of =3D0A> bisque stamps and rollers, but my favo=
ri=3D
te thing to poke into clay these days =3D0A> ... is the end of a clothespin=
. =3D
Go figure.=3D0A> =3D0A> Spending money to buy gear for the potter you hope =
to b=3D
e one day just doesn't =3D0A> make sense, if you're not=3DA0 a business wit=
h a =3D
merchant number and a long term =3D0A> plan. We allow ourselves to be led b=
y =3D
the nose. You don't need a Hummer or a 4WD =3D0A> SUV to take Sparky to the=
v=3D
et, but it looks so exciting on TV when they are =3D0A> climbing mountains =
an=3D
d jumping rivers...=3D0A> =3D0A> Yours=3D0A> Kelly in Ohio... not trying to=
ruin =3D
things for the folks selling tools and =3D0A> equipment...commerce is good,=
a=3D
nd the right gadget at the right time can fill a =3D0A> need. But lord help=
m=3D
e, every time Bill Van Gilder has a new idea, every potter =3D0A> in my tow=
n =3D
buys a tool, and clones his pots...=3D0A> =3D0A> =3D0A> =3D0A> =3D0A> http:=
//www.prim=3D
alpotter.com (website)=3D0A> http://primalmommy.wordpress.com (blog)=3D0A> =
http=3D
://www.primalpotter.etsy.com (store)=3D0A=3D0A=3D0A=3D0A
Des & Jan Howard on fri 13 nov 09
Lee
Our white porcelaneous stoneware can be trimmed quite
nicely at cheese/leather hard. The porcelain we make
from the local hydrothermally altered rhyolite behaves
like the Jingdezhen porcelain & tears great chunks out
at cheese/leather hard. Dry trimming, which I extremely
detest, is essential. I spend as much time filing the
tool edge as I do trimming. So, depends on the clay.
I make my own tools, but a Bison sounds pretty cool.
Des
Lee Love wrote:
> I gotta ask, how many folks trim stiff porcelain? If I find
> mine that hard, I wet it. The nice thing about porcelain is that it
> is tight. You can re-wet bone dry work.
>
> I can't comprehend needing a trimming tool 5 times as
> expensive as a Dolan.
--
Des & Jan Howard
Lue Pottery
Lue NSW
Australia
2850
02 6373 6419
www.luepottery.hwy.com.au
-32.656072 149.840624
| |
|
