Lee Love on tue 24 nov 09
On Tue, Nov 24, 2009 at 6:19 PM, wrote:
> How hard is it to be recognized as a hobby potter or do you have to have =
=3D
a
> Phd in Ceramics?
Phd in recreation therapy? :^) I thought of doing grad work in that f=
=3D
ield.
In Japan, hobbies are very serious business.
--
Lee, a Mashiko potter in Minneapolis
http://mashikopots.blogspot.com/
"Ta tIr na n-=3DF3g ar chul an tI=3D97tIr dlainn trina ch=3DE9ile"=3D97tha=
t is, "T=3D
he
land of eternal youth is behind the house, a beautiful land fluent
within itself." -- John O'Donohue
Larry Kruzan on tue 24 nov 09
Hi Randy,
No Phd required but many say a MFA helps. (There is no Phd) That said, ther=
e
are a lot of hard working folks around here that have a degree BFA or BA in
art and work full time as potters and artists. There are more than a few wh=
o
have no degree in ceramics but have years of successful experience.
Recognition is a curious word that has a slippery meaning in the world of
art - I'm sure than some of our esteemed group that have much better skills
than I (queue Vince, Lee, and others please) who will join in on this. Who
do you seek recognition from? Your peers, the public or galleries? Are you
seeking publication or public speaking.
Several years ago I briefly spoke to a group of potters about photographing
their work. I had less than two years as a pottery student but 30 years as =
a
simi pro photographer. I knew so little about ceramics I was ashamed but
suddenly I was "recognized" (by a very few) and found my inbox jammed with
more questions than I could answer for a couple months. I have not sought
recognition since.
As a full time potter I achieve professional recognition each time a
knowledgeable customer drops in to my shop and buys one of my pieces. If
they are willing to tolerate one of my pieces in their house, I guess I hav=
e
arrived. THEY are my bosses and determine if I continue as a studio artist
or not.
My very simple understanding of recognition is simply stated as "you know
(understand) something that most do not". Let others know that you know it
and soon you will be recognized.
Larry Kruzan
Lost Creek Pottery
www.lostcreekpottery.com
-----Original Message-----
From: Clayart [mailto:Clayart@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG] On Behalf Of ranmcc@MSN.COM
Sent: Tuesday, November 24, 2009 6:19 PM
To: Clayart@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG
Subject: Question about Hobby Potters?
How hard is it to be recognized as a hobby potter or do you have to have a
Phd in Ceramics?
Randy
ranmcc@MSN.COM on tue 24 nov 09
How hard is it to be recognized as a hobby potter or do you have to have a
Phd in Ceramics?
Randy
Chris Campbell on wed 25 nov 09
No, you do not need a degree in ceramics
to be recognized as a hobby potter.
You do however need to spend years
learning your craft in order to produce
well crafted, well designed, food safe,
consumer friendly work.
You could accomplish this in university
but you can also learn through workshops,
arts/craft centers and apprenticeships.
If you want to teach ceramics in a formal
program, you will probably need the degree.
Chris Campbell - in North Carolina
Chris Campbell Pottery LLC
Designs in Colored Porcelain
www.ccpottery.com
http://neriagechris.blogspot.com/
PRE-NCECA WEEKEND WORKSHOP
March 26, 27 & 28, 2010
Creative Ways With Colored ClaysClay Art Center
40 Beech Street
Port Chester, NY 10573
914.937.2047 x222
http://www.clayartcenter.org
Snail Scott on wed 25 nov 09
On Nov 24, 2009, at 6:19 PM, ranmcc@MSN.COM wrote:
> How hard is it to be recognized as a hobby potter or do you have to
> have a
> Phd in Ceramics?
Recognized for what?
If you go to the supermarket with clay on your clothes,
you'll be recognized!
Seriously, what kind of recognition, and by whom?
Do you want recognition by scores of customers? by
the Museum of Modern Art? by YouTube watchers?
by your mom? by the editor of Ceramics Monthly?
Recognition in the form of money? Prizes? Adulation?
Paparazzi? the undying devotion of starstruck teenage
potters? the respect of your peers? for your friends to
stop making fun of you? the Turner Prize?
Recognition for thoughtful design? For skill in execution?
For efficient production? For innovation? Appealing
aesthetics? Practical function? Shock value?
For quality work? if so, it doesn't matter what your
primary source of income is, but only the merit of the
work. However...people who are full-time pros can
devote more time to their work, and this usually allows
them to produce better work through a combination of
practice (skill) and development (design). Time spent
cannot always be replaced by just thinking about it.
On the other hand, thoughtless repetition confers no
benefits except quantity. (Though that has its uses, too.)
None of these things differentiate whether the maker
is a hobbyist or a pro. If pros get more 'recognition' of
whatever sort, it's usually due to the results of time
spent, and the effect that has on the work, not due to
any exclusionary stance based on primary profession.
And academic credentials are meaningless outside
the academic world. The training they represent may
have innate value, but the degree itself has none.
-Snail
Mayssan Farra on wed 25 nov 09
Hello Randy
Hard is being recognized as a professional potter. hobby potter is easy.
Mayssan Shora Farra
http://www.clayvillepottery.com
http://clayette.blogspot.com
> How hard is it to be recognized as a hobby potter or do you have to have =
a
> Phd in Ceramics?
>
>
> Randy
Lis Allison on wed 25 nov 09
On Tuesday 24 November 2009, ranmcc@msn.com wrote:
> How hard is it to be recognized as a hobby potter or do you have to
> have a Phd in Ceramics?
What do you mean?
Lis
--
Elisabeth Allison
Pine Ridge Studio
www.Pine-Ridge-Studio.blogspot.com
A Buck on wed 25 nov 09
Randy,
1)=3DA0 Having a PhD in ceramics and being a Hobie potter aren't mutually e=
xc=3D
lusive.=3DA0 ;^)
2)=3DA0 Being recognized as a Hobie potter is hard to avoid.=3DA0 ;^)
3)=3DA0 To be recognized as a Potter, whether you are a hobbyist or profess=
io=3D
nal, all you have to do is go to the grocery store in the clothes you were =
=3D
wearing when you were throwing earlier in the day. ;^)
Sorry, I couldn't help myself. :D
Andy
Raincreek Pottery
Port Orchard, WA
--- On Tue, 11/24/09, ranmcc@MSN.COM wrote:
> From: ranmcc@MSN.COM
> Subject: Question about Hobby Potters?
> To: Clayart@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG
> Date: Tuesday, November 24, 2009, 4:19 PM
> How hard is it to be recognized as a
> hobby potter or do you have to have a
> Phd in Ceramics?
>=3D20
>=3D20
> Randy
>=3D20
=3D0A=3D0A=3D0A
A Buck on wed 25 nov 09
Randy,
In all seriousness, to be recognized as a Potter it is the same for a profe=
ssional and the hobbyist. One must produce a large enough body of work, of=
sufficient quality and noteworthiness, and present it in a manner that gat=
hers the attention of the public. The most important part of that being th=
e body of work. You just have to put in the time and produce enough stuff =
so that you get good enough. And then you show it to enough of the public =
so that they see you are good at what you do. Being recognized is real har=
d to do if you don't put in the work.
Andy
Raincreek Pottery
Port Orchard, WA
--- On Tue, 11/24/09, ranmcc@MSN.COM wrote:
> From: ranmcc@MSN.COM
> Subject: Question about Hobby Potters?
> To: Clayart@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG
> Date: Tuesday, November 24, 2009, 4:19 PM
> How hard is it to be recognized as a
> hobby potter or do you have to have a
> Phd in Ceramics?
>
>
> Randy
>
Lee Love on wed 25 nov 09
On Wed, Nov 25, 2009 at 9:26 AM, Mayssan Farra wrote:
> Hello Randy
>
> Hard is being recognized as a professional potter. hobby potter is easy.
>
A hobby potter pots for the love of potting. Some times the pro and
the hobbyist are not two.
--
Lee, a Mashiko potter in Minneapolis
http://mashikopots.blogspot.com/
"Ta tIr na n-=3DF3g ar chul an tI=3D97tIr dlainn trina ch=3DE9ile"=3D97tha=
t is, "T=3D
he
land of eternal youth is behind the house, a beautiful land fluent
within itself." -- John O'Donohue
Joseph Bennion on thu 26 nov 09
That, my friend, is when life begins to suck and you look for a real job.Jo=
=3D
e the Potter
Joseph Bennion=3D20
=3D0AHorseshoe Mountain Pottery
=3D0AMom's Stuff Healing Salve=3D20
=3D0APO Box 186 =3D20
=3D0ASpring City, Utah 84662 =
=3D
=3D20
=3D0A435-462-2708=3D20
=3D0Awww.horseshoemountainpottery.com
--- On Wed, 11/25/09, Lee Love wrote:
From: Lee Love
Subject: Re: Question about Hobby Potters?
To: Clayart@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG
Date: Wednesday, November 25, 2009, 10:31 AM
On Wed, Nov 25, 2009 at 9:26 AM, Mayssan Farra wrote:
> Hello Randy
>
> Hard is being recognized as a professional potter. hobby potter is easy.
>
A hobby potter pots for the love of potting.=3DC2=3DA0=3DC2=3DA0=3DC2=3DA0S=
ome times th=3D
e pro and
the hobbyist are not two.
--
Lee, a Mashiko potter in Minneapolis
http://mashikopots.blogspot.com/
"Ta tIr na n-=3DC3=3DB3g ar chul an tI=3DE2=3D80=3D94tIr dlainn trina ch=
=3DC3=3DA9ile"=3D
=3DE2=3D80=3D94that is, "The
land of eternal youth is behind the house, a beautiful land fluent
within itself." -- John O'Donohue
=3D0A=3D0A=3D0A
Eleanor on thu 26 nov 09
Oxymoron:
A hobby physicist with a PhD in Physics.
Eleanor
Lee Love on thu 26 nov 09
On Tue, Nov 24, 2009 at 6:19 PM, wrote:
> How hard is it to be recognized as a hobby potter or do you have to have =
=3D
a
> Phd in Ceramics?
Randy, here is another Randy who just received a teaching award in
craft (illustrating the main reason to get an MFA) :
http://uwrfvoice.com/index.php/etc/article/2568/
--=3D20
--
Lee, a Mashiko potter in Minneapolis
http://mashikopots.blogspot.com/
"Ta tIr na n-=3DF3g ar chul an tI=3D97tIr dlainn trina ch=3DE9ile"=3D97tha=
t is, "T=3D
he
land of eternal youth is behind the house, a beautiful land fluent
within itself." -- John O'Donohue
Lee Love on thu 26 nov 09
On Thu, Nov 26, 2009 at 9:03 AM, Eleanor wrote:
> Oxymoron:
>
> A hobby physicist with a PhD in Physics.
>
Not really. Not if they do it for the love of it.
--
Lee, a Mashiko potter in Minneapolis
http://mashikopots.blogspot.com/
"Ta tIr na n-=3DF3g ar chul an tI=3D97tIr dlainn trina ch=3DE9ile"=3D97tha=
t is, "T=3D
he
land of eternal youth is behind the house, a beautiful land fluent
within itself." -- John O'Donohue
Bonnie Staffel on thu 26 nov 09
There are many type of hobby potters. What the Clayarter gurus are =3D
asking is
in what format is the questioner referring. Many who do the "slip and =3D
dip"
decorating consider themselves hobby potters. There are also those that =3D
buy
the bisque ware and just decorate it as "hobby potters." And yes, they =3D
do
sell their production work. However, IMO they are still hobby potters as
they are not producing original work. Or what would their category be if
they were selling their work. Seems to me there is a fine line here =3D
where
recognition may be desired, but who makes the rules? The work is being
purchased by the public. It was mentioned that selling the work is a
criteria for being a professional potter.=3D20
I would like for the questioner to clarify what area he/she is working =3D
in
order to better give a good answer from those who gave so generously =3D
from
probably the point of view of a potter who produces original work..
Bonnie
http://webpages.charter.net/bstaffel/
http://vasefinder.com/bstaffelgallery1.html
DVD=3DA0 Throwing with Coils and Slabs
DVD=3DA0 Introduction to Wheel Work
Charter Member Potters Council
Terrance on fri 27 nov 09
Hello Snail;
You wrote:
However, the definition of a professional is a little
tougher to nail down. It is certainly not a function
of relative sources of income. Many people - artists,
musicians, writers, actors, clergy and others - are
genuine professionals working in fields with poor
financial compensation, and so gain the bulk of their
income elsewhere. They are still professionals. It is,
I will suggest, a matter of mindset and commitment
which goes beyond that of an amateur
Professional artists in Canada fall under a law defining what a professio=
=3D
nal=3D20
artist is;
You are considered a professional visual artist or craftsman if you fall =
=3D
under=3D20
the following definition:
3. Meet the four criteria of professionalism as defined by the Act Respec=
=3D
ting=3D20
the Professional Status of Artists in the Visual Arts, Arts and Crafts an=
=3D
d=3D20
Literature, and their Contracts with Promoters (R.S.Q., S-32.01), as list=
=3D
ed=3D20
below:=3D20
You are considered to be a professional artist if:=3D20
You declare yourself to be a professional artist;=3D20
you produce works on your own behalf;=3D20
your works are exhibited, produced, published, presented in public or mar=
=3D
keted=3D20
by a presenter;=3D20
you have been recognized by your peers as a professional artist by way of=
=3D
an=3D20
honourable mention, an award, a prize, a scholarship, an appointment to a=
=3D
n=3D20
adjudication committee or an invitation to participate in a salon of by a=
=3D
ny=3D20
other similar means.=3D20
Visual Artists who are gain professional recognition are eligible for var=
=3D
ious tax=3D20
breaks and grants.
This protection came about because the artists organized. Our associatio=
=3D
ns is=3D20
there to help the visual/craft artist with professional upgrading, assist=
=3D
with=3D20
copyright protection, help out when the tax man gets too smart and ensure=
=3D
s=3D20
that the government is aware of the social economic status of those who=3D2=
0=3D
make our culture what it is.
If you are interested in what our visual art association does for us go t=
=3D
o;
http://www.raav.org/pls/htmldb/f?p=3D3D105:34:0:::::
Food for thought=3D20
Terrance
Lee Love on fri 27 nov 09
On Fri, Nov 27, 2009 at 9:47 PM, David Woof wrote:
> Hobbyist and amateur are both honorable titles.
> There is no higher moral ground to be claimed by
> being a professional, but they are not the same thing.
They are when they are done right. Without doing the work "for the
love of it", the professional is just a high priced hooker.
--
Lee, a Mashiko potter in Minneapolis
http://mashikopots.blogspot.com/
"Ta tIr na n-=3DF3g ar chul an tI=3D97tIr dlainn trina ch=3DE9ile"=3D97tha=
t is, "T=3D
he
land of eternal youth is behind the house, a beautiful land fluent
within itself." -- John O'Donohue
David Woof on fri 27 nov 09
Snail=3D2C =3D20
so well said=3D2C I would only add to something you touched on in your obv=
io=3D
usly thought out post=3D3B =3D20
That the title "professional" comes with an expectation=3D2C by the people =
se=3D
rved=3D2C of the professional's duty and ethic to go above and beyond the o=
rd=3D
inary=3D2C to do it right=3D2C get it right=3D2C and be knowledgeable in th=
at fie=3D
ld so as to know the difference. =3D20
This is old school and I have noted that some degree programs no longer req=
=3D
uire ethics=3D2C statistical analysis and critical thinking as required cre=
di=3D
ts. These are most critical tools for the professional. With what else d=
=3D
o we think and act? =3D20
=3D20
Of course=3D2C as you also indicated=3D2C the hobbyist could cultivate this=
"pr=3D
ofessional" attitude and commitment to themselves=3D2C the craft=3D2C the p=
rofe=3D
ssion=3D2C and the people who would consider buying their work. In pursuit=
o=3D
f this aspiration they could indeed cross over.
=3D20
I like it that you defined "amateur". It clarifies "hobbyist" as the dif=
=3D
ferentiating term.
=3D20
David Woof Clarkdale Arizona
_______________________________________________________________
=3D20
3a. Re: Question about Hobby Potters?
Posted by: "Snail Scott" claywork@FLYING-SNAIL.COM=3D20
Date: Thu Nov 26=3D2C 2009 5:07 pm ((PST))
From: Lee Love
> A hobby potter pots for the love of potting. Some times the pro and
> the hobbyist are not two...
I would alter this: An _amateur_ potter pots for
the love of it. That is the meaning of the word
'amateur'. The term implies something done solely
for love=3D2C not for rent=3D2C food=3D2C adulation=3D2C etc. A pro may
love the craft=3D2C but is seldom an amateur. Most do
start that way - who would do this if they didn't love
it? - but they are not amateurs. And a pro is by any
definition not a hobbyist.
However=3D2C the definition of a professional is a little
tougher to nail down. It is certainly not a function
of relative sources of income. Many people - artists=3D2C
musicians=3D2C writers=3D2C actors=3D2C clergy and others - are
genuine professionals working in fields with poor
financial compensation=3D2C and so gain the bulk of their
income elsewhere. They are still professionals. It is=3D2C
I will suggest=3D2C a matter of mindset and commitment
which goes beyond that of an amateur.
An amateur may pick and choose their pursuits
freely=3D2C without external expectation or constraint. A
professional is part of a profession - a set of shared
standards or expectations which serve to define that
profession. While a professional may still challenge
those standards=3D2C they must be acknowledged
nonetheless. That is a part of professionalism.
A hobby is something done for entertainment=3D2C as a
break from working duties=3D2C undertaken freely when
inclination strikes=3D2C but capable of being abandoned
with equal freedom. There are hobbyists who make
more money on their hobby than some professionals
do in their profession. It's not money that defines it=3D2C
it's the commitment that professionals make to
their work which remains optional to a hobbyist. If
a hobbyist makes that type of commitment to their
work=3D2C they are no longer a hobbyist=3D2C regardless of the
financial remuneration. They may still be an amateur=3D2C
or a professional=3D2C but not a hobbyist.
Hobbyist and amateur are both honorable titles.
There is no higher moral ground to be claimed by
being a professional=3D2C but they are not the same thing.
-Snail
=3D20
=3D20
=3D20
=3D20
_________________________________________________________________
Windows 7: It works the way you want. Learn more.
http://www.microsoft.com/Windows/windows-7/default.aspx?ocid=3D3DPID24727::=
T:=3D
WLMTAGL:ON:WL:en-US:WWL_WIN_evergreen:112009v2=3D
Lee Love on sat 28 nov 09
A big influence on how we view our approach to our craft depends
upon how we initially approached it. While professionalism is
important, the labels that separate the different ways of approaching
the craft don't seem to be important to most folks, except those who
approach it from the academy.
My initial interest came from anthropology and archeology,
and not from the art world. If you look at the life of the
traditional potter, it was almost always a part time endeavor, often
being done during the slow agricultural times of the yearly cycle.
Paying attention to nature and the cycles, help folks have a
connection to their place, and it shows up in their work, which was
usually made from the materials of that place.
--
Lee, a Mashiko potter in Minneapolis
http://mashikopots.blogspot.com/
"Ta tIr na n-=3DF3g ar chul an tI=3D97tIr dlainn trina ch=3DE9ile"=3D97tha=
t is, "T=3D
he
land of eternal youth is behind the house, a beautiful land fluent
within itself." -- John O'Donohue
Vince Pitelka on sat 28 nov 09
Lee Love wrote:
"Without doing the work "for the
love of it", the professional is just a high priced hooker."
Vince replies:
AAAARRRRRGGGGGHHH! Let's see, how can I answer this message without
liberally sprinkling my response with profanity? Hmmmmm, nope, I can't do
it.
- Vince
Vince Pitelka
Appalachian Center for Craft
Tennessee Tech University
vpitelka@dtccom.net; wpitelka@tntech.edu
http://iweb.tntech.edu/wpitelka
Dennis Gerasimov on sat 28 nov 09
Lee Love wrote:
> They are when they are done right. Without doing the work "for the
> love of it", the professional is just a high priced hooker.
>
Not sure about "high price" part, considering how little some
professional artists make, but other then that right on.
Dennis
Randall Moody on sun 29 nov 09
If you do it for love you are a slut. If you do it for money you are a
hooker. :)
-----Original Message-----
From: Clayart [mailto:Clayart@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG] On Behalf Of Vince Pitelka
Sent: Saturday, November 28, 2009 8:43 PM
To: Clayart@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG
Subject: Re: Question about Hobby Potters?
Lee Love wrote:
"Without doing the work "for the
love of it", the professional is just a high priced hooker."
Vince replies:
AAAARRRRRGGGGGHHH! Let's see, how can I answer this message without
liberally sprinkling my response with profanity? Hmmmmm, nope, I can't do
it.
- Vince
Vince Pitelka
Appalachian Center for Craft
Tennessee Tech University
vpitelka@dtccom.net; wpitelka@tntech.edu
http://iweb.tntech.edu/wpitelka
Steve Slatin on sun 29 nov 09
Vince! Vince! Deep, cleansing breath ...=3D0Athere, now, isn't that bette=
r?=3D
=3D0A=3D0AWhat's offending you, probably, is the=3D0Anasty, snobbish, eliti=
st ton=3D
e of the message.=3D0ATo deal with the irritation, try substituting=3D0Aoth=
er o=3D
ccupations -- fer example ....=3D0A=3D0A"Any garbageman who picks up your t=
rash=3D
to=3D0Abe paid for it instead of for the love of=3D0Agarbage is just a hig=
h pr=3D
iced hooker."=3D0A=3D0AWorth a giggle, no?=3D0A=3D0AOr, possibly, "Any poli=
ceman wh=3D
o arrests=3D0Aa subject for a paycheck instead of for the=3D0Alove of the b=
eat-=3D
down is just a high priced=3D0Ahooker."=3D0A=3D0AJust try subbing a few oth=
er job=3D
s and you'll=3D0Aquickly recover normal blood pressure.=3D0A=3D0A=3D0ABest =
wishes -=3D
-=3D0ASteve Slatin =3D0A=3D0A=3D0A=3D0A=3D0A--- On Sat, 11/28/09, Vince Pi=
telka lka@DTCCOM.NET> wrote:=3D0A=3D0A=3D0A> Lee Love wrote:=3D0A> "Without doing=
the wor=3D
k "for the=3D0A> love of it", the professional is just a high priced=3D0A> =
hook=3D
er."=3D0A> =3D0A> Vince replies:=3D0A> AAAARRRRRGGGGGHHH!=3DA0 Let's see, h=
ow can I=3D
answer this=3D0A> message without=3D0A> liberally sprinkling my response w=
ith =3D
profanity?=3DA0=3D0A> Hmmmmm, nope, I can't do=3D0A> it.=3D0A> - Vince=3D0A=
> =3D0A> Vin=3D
ce Pitelka=3D0A> Appalachian Center for Craft=3D0A> Tennessee Tech Universi=
ty=3D
=3D0A> vpitelka@dtccom.net;=3D0A> wpitelka@tntech.edu=3D0A> http://iweb.tnt=
ech.ed=3D
u/wpitelka=3D0A> =3D0A=3D0A=3D0A
Barry Porter on sun 29 nov 09
Darn,
Guess its official then.... in my day job, I am a hooker!
Just wish I were highly paid..........
Would it not be a wonderful world though, if we able to get folks into=3D20=
=3D
vocations that they were in love with? My hat is off to anyone that can =
=3D
make=3D20
a living through their art, particularly in these trying financial times.=
=3D
Porter
www.cottagecrafter.com
David Woof on mon 30 nov 09
Lee=3D2C=3D20
I did not write what you quote below and as is usual when you selectively l=
=3D
ift something out of context and fire off another one liner it is usually o=
=3D
ff topic and certainly not profound.
=3D20
Folks usually distain who they fear. Where do hookers and professionals fi=
=3D
t in your view of the world? ancestery? present life?
=3D20
Perhaps you should take a break and sort some things out.
=3D20
David
=3D20
________________________________________________________________________
4b. Re: Question about Hobby Potters?
Posted by: "Lee Love" cwiddershins@GMAIL.COM=3D20
Date: Sat Nov 28=3D2C 2009 1:43 pm ((PST))
On Fri=3D2C Nov 27=3D2C 2009 at 9:47 PM=3D2C David Woof om> wr=3D
ote:
> Hobbyist and amateur are both honorable titles.
> There is no higher moral ground to be claimed by
> being a professional=3D2C but they are not the same thing.
They are when they are done right. Without doing the work "for the
love of it"=3D2C the professional is just a high priced hooker.
--
Lee=3D2C a Mashiko potter in Minneapolis
http://mashikopots.blogspot.com/
"Ta tIr na n-=3DF3g ar chul an tI=3D97tIr dlainn trina ch=3DE9ile"=3D97that=
is=3D2C "=3D
The
hand of eternal uncouth is behind the blouse=3D2C a bountiful hand fluent
within." -- yohhan Donnyhuey
=3D20
=3D20
=3D20
_________________________________________________________________
Hotmail: Trusted email with powerful SPAM protection.
http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/177141665/direct/01/=3D
Lee Love on mon 30 nov 09
On Mon, Nov 30, 2009 at 12:25 PM, David Woof wrote:
>> Hobbyist and amateur are both honorable titles.
>> There is no higher moral ground to be claimed by
>> being a professional, but they are not the same thing.
>
> They are when they are done right. Without doing the work "for the
> love of it", the professional is just a high priced hooker.
Hi David,
Yes, take a break if you must. It is better than doing childish
stuff to a signature line you don't understand. ;^)
--
Lee, a Mashiko potter in Minneapolis
http://mashikopots.blogspot.com/
"Ta tIr na n-=3DF3g ar chul an tI=3D97tIr dlainn trina ch=3DE9ile"=3D97tha=
t is, "T=3D
he
land of eternal youth is behind the house, a beautiful land fluent
within itself." -- John O'Donohue
Lee Love on mon 30 nov 09
On Sun, Nov 29, 2009 at 8:54 PM, Randall Moody wr=
=3D
ote:
> If you do it for love you are a slut. If you do it for money you are a
> hooker. :)
If you do it for love, you are a lover. If you do it for sex, you
are a slut. If you do it for money, you are a pro? ;^)
I heard an interview with the editor or writer of
SuperFreakenomics. He said pros that have pimps, make 20% more money
than independent street hookers. They worked less hours and were
safer too. Which made pimps a better deal that a Real Estate Agent vs.
selling your home on your own. He explained that the Agent just
makes enough over what you would selling on your own to cover his
commission. But I don't think that includes the unpaid work you
would do selling your own house.
--
Lee, a Mashiko potter in Minneapolis
http://mashikopots.blogspot.com/
"Ta tIr na n-=3DF3g ar chul an tI=3D97tIr dlainn trina ch=3DE9ile"=3D97tha=
t is, "T=3D
he
land of eternal youth is behind the house, a beautiful land fluent
within itself." -- John O'Donohue
Larry Kruzan on mon 30 nov 09
Unless you love it and get paid for it - then you're a politician......
There I go mentioning politics again, now we'll get another big batch of
hate mail, sorry Mel.
Larry
-----Original Message-----
From: Clayart [mailto:Clayart@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG] On Behalf Of Randall Moody
Sent: Sunday, November 29, 2009 8:54 PM
To: Clayart@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG
Subject: Re: Question about Hobby Potters?
If you do it for love you are a slut. If you do it for money you are a
hooker. :)
-----Original Message-----
From: Clayart [mailto:Clayart@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG] On Behalf Of Vince Pitelka
Sent: Saturday, November 28, 2009 8:43 PM
To: Clayart@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG
Subject: Re: Question about Hobby Potters?
Lee Love wrote:
"Without doing the work "for the
love of it", the professional is just a high priced hooker."
Vince replies:
AAAARRRRRGGGGGHHH! Let's see, how can I answer this message without
liberally sprinkling my response with profanity? Hmmmmm, nope, I can't do
it.
- Vince
Vince Pitelka
Appalachian Center for Craft
Tennessee Tech University
vpitelka@dtccom.net; wpitelka@tntech.edu
http://iweb.tntech.edu/wpitelka
Mike Gordon on tue 1 dec 09
"If you do it for love you are a slut." Gee....... I'm wearing my "CLAY
SLUT" T shirt, so I better get into my studio and do some love'n!! Mike
Gordon
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