Lee Love on sun 14 mar 10
I've never had problems with natural brushes in unwashed ash glazes,
shino or soda ash solution.But, from experience, I would not take
caustic solutions lightly, particularly if you have cuts on your hand,
or if you spill solution on a socked foot or other clothing.
Four years ago, I cut my right index finger with a pocket
knife.It was small but deep cut. I was mixing some soda ash solution
at the sink, checking with my bare right hand to see if I got all the
soda ash off the bottom of the bucket. In the past, it was fine to
do, if you rinsed right away. But this time it stung. And over the
next couple days, my skin started peeling of the entire end of my
finger. It is fine when I stop throwing, but when I start again, it
starts peeling agai I have the incredible
peeling finger! It is acting up right now. I bandage it and put a
finger cot on when I am doing wet work, but that usually causes "prune
finger" and that makes it start peeling again.
So be careful of cuts and getting solution on clothes next to the skin=
=3D
.
--
Lee, a Mashiko potter in Minneapolis
http://mashikopots.blogspot.com/
=3D93Observe the wonders as they occur around you. Don't claim them. Feel
the artistry moving through and be silent.=3D94 --Rumi
David Woof on sun 14 mar 10
Love you dearly Lili=3D2C
=3D20
Very good reminder re the natural hair brushes.=3D20
=3D20
But to take your skin off one would need to concentrate the ash water lye b=
=3D
y boiling it down to a concentrate and soaking in it. Folks are still m=
=3D
aking natural lye soap by this method and some hardy souls are washing thei=
=3D
r hair and bodies with it!!!
=3D20
In bare handing an ash glaze my experience has been like bare handing a 3:1=
=3D
fresh wet concrete mix or what a weakened chlorine bleach solution is like=
=3D
. Your skin gets a bit slippery feeling and=3D2C loooong before your skin=
s=3D
loughs off in strips and gobs=3D2C you feel uncomfortable enough so that an=
y =3D
rationally conscious person would stop doing what hurts. =3D20
=3D20
Actually it makes a good exfoliant if used with discretion and away from se=
=3D
nsitive tissue.(Not to be taken as Medical advice)
=3D20
I am more concerned with inhalation of the raw ash dust.
=3D20
AS always my point is Let's not fear monger! We need to eat more dirt and =
=3D
use less antibiotics=3D2C antibacterial soaps and sprays in/on our bodies a=
nd=3D
in our orifices.
=3D20
Our newest clay generation is getting paralyzed by fear of the clay=3D2C th=
e =3D
kilns=3D2C the chemical elements of the earth......Life and living itself. =
P=3D
ass the hemlock and be over it so the rest of us have space to get on with =
=3D
it!!!
=3D20
So I went back in the archives and found my full body condom post. I thoug=
=3D
ht a revisit might throw some fun but serious light on this subject. Of c=
=3D
ourse now the web is full of advertisements for products from folks who kno=
=3D
cked off my idea so just remember you heard it here first!!! Mi God I coul=
=3D
d have gotten wealthy in the debauchery market but that is not where my hea=
=3D
rt is even though I do cultivate myself as an aficionado of the sensual art=
=3D
s. Hell=3D2C I appreciate sun in my face=3D2C Mogollon wind in my hair=3D2=
C and =3D
always clay in my hands. Pass the ash glaze with caution but please leave=
=3D
off the fear.
=3D20
David Woof
=3D20
=3D20
________________________________________________________________________
6. Wet Ashes and Hairless Brushes
Posted by: "lili krakowski" mlkrakowski@CITLINK.NET=3D20
Date: Sat Mar 13=3D2C 2010 7:34 am ((PST))
=3D
s. Great idea...BUT remember the causticity of the wet ashes--soluble stuff=
=3D
like lye in the ash water--with take the hair off any natural hair brushes=
=3D
. (Also along with the skin=3D2C off your arms if you stir barehanded.)>
=3D20
See "Full body condoms" below =3D20
=3D20
=3D20
David Woof on sat 17 dec 05
Caroline=3D2C by all means take reasonable due caution but beware of the fe=
ar=3D
=3D20
mongers among us. They will die first and take all who follow with them as=
=3D
=3D20
all this unreasoned fear creates breaches in one's will to be healthy. The=
=3D
=3D20
really dangerous stuff isn't in the studio!!!=3D20
Last week=3D2C since they won't go away=3D2C I decided to capitalize on thi=
s fe=3D
ar=3D20
fad. I'm going to quit making pots and develope a full body condom for=3D20
studio work. I intend to mate kevlar with spandex/goretex for a form=3D20
fitting suit of protection. These suits will come in favorite animal prints=
=3D
=3D20
and designer colors so when one is finished with all the dangerous=3D20
activities in the studio a simple hop thru the shower will transform this=
=3D20
suit into the ultimate evening out debauchery gear. One has only to imagine=
=3D
=3D20
the few simple features and attachments that will revolutionize and=3D20
facilitate fear free living.=3D20
David Woof=3D20
peering over the edge=3D2C reverently taking an irreverent look at everythi=
ng=3D
.=3D20
marianne kuiper milks on sat 17 dec 05
Thanks for the wake-up chuckle=3D2C David. That was great. Humor is a rare =
th=3D
ing at times. Laugh=3D2C breathe deeper=3D2C feel better. Marianne=3D20
Gayle Bair on sat 17 dec 05
Hurry David.......=3D20
We can all wear them to NCECA!=3D20
=3D20
=3D20
_________________________________________________________________
Hotmail: Trusted email with Microsoft=3D92s powerful SPAM protection.
http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/210850552/direct/01/=3D
Vince Pitelka on sun 14 mar 10
David Woof wrote:
"In bare handing an ash glaze my experience has been like bare handing a 3:=
1
fresh wet concrete mix or what a weakened chlorine bleach solution is like.
Your skin gets a bit slippery feeling and, loooong before your skin sloughs
off in strips and gobs, you feel uncomfortable enough so that any rationall=
y
conscious person would stop doing what hurts. I am more concerned with
inhalation of the raw ash dust."
"As always my point is Let's not fear monger! We need to eat more dirt and
use less antibiotics, antibacterial soaps and sprays in/on our bodies and i=
n
our orifices. Our newest clay generation is getting paralyzed by fear of
the clay, the kilns, the chemical elements of the earth......Life and livin=
g
itself. Pass the hemlock and be over it so the rest of us have space to ge=
t
on with it!!!"
---------------------------------------
I could not agree more with David's post above. The paranoia and
fear-mongering about toxic possibilities in the clay studio is so
over-the-top. Reasonable and conscientious safety procedures in the clay
studio are absolutely necessary, but purging barium and always washing all
wood ash are absurd over-reactions.
I am currently using Mark Issenberg's 50-50 Redart and ash glaze on some of
my pots, and I used it on three large coil-built urns for my recent show in
Houston. I like this glaze, and you cannot achieve a glaze like this with
washed ash. I have sensitive skin, and frequent problems with dry, cracked
skin. When I am mixing this glaze I wear eye protection (we have very good
dust extraction), but while glazing I get it on my hands and arms all the
time. I rinse it off in a timely fashion, and after I am done glazing, I
thoroughly rub my hands with vinegar to neutralize the alkalinity, and then
I wash with soap and water. I have not experienced any skin problems with
this glaze, and it is 50% unwashed fireplace ash.
The water in an ash glaze is like a very weak lye solution. There are SO
MANY things far more dangerous in everyday life. My god, how do we even
survive a day in the real world, with so many dangers around us? The answe=
r
is reasonable safety precautions and common sense. For anyone who thinks
that unwashed ash glazes are a real danger, amidst so many things in
everyday life that are far more dangerous, the only real solution is to liv=
e
in a plastic bubble decked out in David's full-body condom.
- Vince
Vince Pitelka
Appalachian Center for Craft
Tennessee Tech University
vpitelka@dtccom.net; wpitelka@tntech.edu
http://iweb.tntech.edu/wpitelka
Edouard Bastarache on sun 14 mar 10
Hello,
once I dry-sieved wood ash without a dust mask and
ended up with a mild ocupational bronchitis which lasted
5 days.
Gis,
Edouard Bastarache
Spertesperantisto (Lernu-Paris)
Sorel-Tracy
Quebec
http://edouardbastarache.blogspot.com/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/30058682@N00/
http://www.facebook.com/edouard.bastarache
http://cerampeintures.blogspot.com/
http://albertpaintings.blogspot.com/
http://perso.wanadoo.fr/smart2000/index.htm
----- Original Message -----
From: "Vince Pitelka"
To: "'David Woof'" ;
Sent: Sunday, March 14, 2010 4:33 PM
Subject: RE: Wet Ashes and Hairless Brushes/ full body condom revisited
> David Woof wrote:
> "In bare handing an ash glaze my experience has been like bare handing a
> 3:1
> fresh wet concrete mix or what a weakened chlorine bleach solution is
> like.
> Your skin gets a bit slippery feeling and, loooong before your skin
> sloughs
> off in strips and gobs, you feel uncomfortable enough so that any
> rationally
> conscious person would stop doing what hurts. I am more concerned with
> inhalation of the raw ash dust."
>
> "As always my point is Let's not fear monger! We need to eat more dirt
> and
> use less antibiotics, antibacterial soaps and sprays in/on our bodies and
> in
> our orifices. Our newest clay generation is getting paralyzed by fear of
> the clay, the kilns, the chemical elements of the earth......Life and
> living
> itself. Pass the hemlock and be over it so the rest of us have space to
> get
> on with it!!!"
>
> ---------------------------------------
> I could not agree more with David's post above. The paranoia and
> fear-mongering about toxic possibilities in the clay studio is so
> over-the-top. Reasonable and conscientious safety procedures in the clay
> studio are absolutely necessary, but purging barium and always washing al=
l
> wood ash are absurd over-reactions.
>
> I am currently using Mark Issenberg's 50-50 Redart and ash glaze on some
> of
> my pots, and I used it on three large coil-built urns for my recent show
> in
> Houston. I like this glaze, and you cannot achieve a glaze like this wit=
h
> washed ash. I have sensitive skin, and frequent problems with dry,
> cracked
> skin. When I am mixing this glaze I wear eye protection (we have very
> good
> dust extraction), but while glazing I get it on my hands and arms all the
> time. I rinse it off in a timely fashion, and after I am done glazing, I
> thoroughly rub my hands with vinegar to neutralize the alkalinity, and
> then
> I wash with soap and water. I have not experienced any skin problems wit=
h
> this glaze, and it is 50% unwashed fireplace ash.
>
> The water in an ash glaze is like a very weak lye solution. There are SO
> MANY things far more dangerous in everyday life. My god, how do we even
> survive a day in the real world, with so many dangers around us? The
> answer
> is reasonable safety precautions and common sense. For anyone who thinks
> that unwashed ash glazes are a real danger, amidst so many things in
> everyday life that are far more dangerous, the only real solution is to
> live
> in a plastic bubble decked out in David's full-body condom.
> - Vince
>
> Vince Pitelka
> Appalachian Center for Craft
> Tennessee Tech University
> vpitelka@dtccom.net; wpitelka@tntech.edu
> http://iweb.tntech.edu/wpitelka
>
Vince Pitelka on sun 14 mar 10
Edouard Bastarache wrote:
"Once I dry-sieved wood ash without a dust mask and ended up with a mild
ocupational bronchitis which lasted
5 days."
Hi Edouard -
My point exactly. About three weeks ago I dry-sieved the fireplace ash use=
d
in the 30-30 Redart-ash glaze mentioned in my earlier post. I did it in ou=
r
spray booth without a dust mask, and of course the spray booth did its job
and I experienced no ill effects at all. Like I said, common sense and
reasonable safety practices. We sieve enough ash that I am going to build a
vibratory shaker to get the job done with a little less human intervention.
- Vince
Vince Pitelka
Appalachian Center for Craft
Tennessee Tech University
vpitelka@dtccom.net; wpitelka@tntech.edu
http://iweb.tntech.edu/wpitelka
Edouard Bastarache on sun 14 mar 10
Up here in steelmills. lectures are given to workers and managers
about using "GBS" which stands for "Gros Bon Sens",
"Plain Common Sense" !!!
And steelmaking is a risky business...
Gis,
Edouard Bastarache
Spertesperantisto (Lernu-Paris)
Sorel-Tracy
Quebec
http://edouardbastarache.blogspot.com/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/30058682@N00/
http://www.facebook.com/edouard.bastarache
http://cerampeintures.blogspot.com/
http://albertpaintings.blogspot.com/
http://perso.wanadoo.fr/smart2000/index.htm
----- Original Message -----
From: "Vince Pitelka"
To: "'Edouard Bastarache'" ; "'Clayart'"
Sent: Sunday, March 14, 2010 8:30 PM
Subject: RE: Wet Ashes and Hairless Brushes/ full body condom revisited
> Edouard Bastarache wrote:
> "Once I dry-sieved wood ash without a dust mask and ended up with a mild
> ocupational bronchitis which lasted
> 5 days."
>
> Hi Edouard -
> My point exactly. About three weeks ago I dry-sieved the fireplace ash
> used
> in the 30-30 Redart-ash glaze mentioned in my earlier post. I did it in
> our
> spray booth without a dust mask, and of course the spray booth did its jo=
b
> and I experienced no ill effects at all. Like I said, common sense and
> reasonable safety practices. We sieve enough ash that I am going to build
> a
> vibratory shaker to get the job done with a little less human
> intervention.
> - Vince
>
> Vince Pitelka
> Appalachian Center for Craft
> Tennessee Tech University
> vpitelka@dtccom.net; wpitelka@tntech.edu
> http://iweb.tntech.edu/wpitelka
>
>
>
>
>
>
Richard Aerni on sun 14 mar 10
Vince et al,
Common sense...what a concept! Read up on what you are about to do, and =
=3D
figure out what and how to do it, and how to do it safely.
I have been sieving unwashed, dry ash for over 30 years now, with no ill =
=3D
health effects. Nice to do it outside if you can. Spraybooth works =3D
too. Latex gloves a must, and in enclosed spaces, a mask as well. =3D20
When I was processing a lot of ash, I had a salvaged industrial =3D
shaker/sieve, which mounted onto a form much like those used to suspend =3D
Japanese temple bells. Put several baseballs in the hopper with the ash =
=3D
to break up clumps, use ear protection, and it works like a charm. =3D
Probably a good idea to rough sieve the ash first through a window =3D
screen or some such to remove staples, nails and the like. They can =3D
tear up a $150 screen in no time.
Best wishes,
Richard
Richard Aerni
Rochester, NY =3D20
www.richardaerni.com
Vince wrote:
Hi Edouard -
My point exactly. About three weeks ago I dry-sieved the fireplace ash =3D
used
in the 30-30 Redart-ash glaze mentioned in my earlier post. I did it in =3D
our
spray booth without a dust mask, and of course the spray booth did its =3D
job
and I experienced no ill effects at all. Like I said, common sense and
reasonable safety practices. We sieve enough ash that I am going to =3D
build a
vibratory shaker to get the job done with a little less human =3D
intervention.
- Vince
John Hesselberth on mon 15 mar 10
On Mar 14, 2010, at 9:53 PM, Richard Aerni wrote:
> Common sense...what a concept!
It is a great concept, but......
there is only one problem.
Very few people seem to have it. Don't believe me? Look around you.
It would seem to be common sense not to smoke yet some 20+% of Americans =
=3D
still do.
It would seem to be common sense not to eat yourself into obesity, yet =3D
40 million Americans are obese and 8 out of 10 over 25 are overweight =3D
and headed toward obesity.
I could go on, but I think I've made my point.
Such a wide spread lack of common sense and an overabundance of =3D
aggressive lawyers is the main reason companies feel they have to put =3D
guards on equipment that make them nearly unuseable and to have "safety" =
=3D
rules for their employees to follow that reduce productivity.
Yet it is a great concept, but.......
Regards,
John
Lee Love on mon 15 mar 10
On Mon, Mar 15, 2010 at 6:08 AM, John Hesselberth
wrote:
> It would seem to be common sense not to smoke yet some 20+% of Americans
Addiction and consumerism defies common sense.
>
> It would seem to be common sense not to eat yourself into obesity, yet 40=
=3D
>million Americans are obese and 8 out of 10 over 25 are overweight and
>headed toward obesity.
Please read Omnivore's dilemma and In Defense of Food. We've
become mouths and a**holes for the processed food industry. Just a
cog in the machinery to consume their goods.
Want a healthier society? Only eat food. This is really
related to using functional pottery in the cooking and presenting of
our meals:
1. Don't eat anything your great grandmother wouldn't recognize as
food. "When you pick up that box of portable yogurt tubes, or eat
something with 15 ingredients you can't pronounce, ask yourself, "What
are those things doing there?" Pollan says.
2. Don=3D92t eat anything with more than five ingredients, or
ingredients you can't pronounce.
3. Stay out of the middle of the supermarket; shop on the perimeter
of the store. Real food tends to be on the outer edge of the store
near the loading docks, where it can be replaced with fresh foods when
it goes bad.
4. Don't eat anything that won't eventually rot. "There are
exceptions -- honey -- but as a rule, things like Twinkies that never
go bad aren't food," Pollan says.
5. It is not just what you eat but how you eat. "Always leave the
table a little hungry," Pollan says. "Many cultures have rules that
you stop eating before you are full. In Japan, they say eat until you
are four-fifths full. Islamic culture has a similar rule, and in
German culture they say, 'Tie off the sack before it's full.'"
6. Families traditionally ate together, around a table and not a
TV, at regular meal times. It's a good tradition. Enjoy meals with the
people you love. "Remember when eating between meals felt wrong?"
Pollan asks.
7. Don't buy food where you buy your gasoline. In the U.S., 20% of
food is eaten in the car.
> Such a wide spread lack of common sense and an overabundance of >aggressi=
=3D
ve lawyers
Yeah, not being able to sue would usher in Utopia!
--
Lee, a Mashiko potter in Minneapolis
http://mashikopots.blogspot.com/
=3D93Observe the wonders as they occur around you. Don't claim them. Feel
the artistry moving through and be silent.=3D94 --Rumi
Rimas VisGirda on mon 15 mar 10
Thanks David and Vince! Yes, washing ashes takes away most of the character=
. In my 30's I was doing about 10-15 years of ash glazing. We used mostly o=
ak from a heater stove. We screened the dry ash through a window screen the=
n mixed the (wet) glaze. We would let the glaze settle and get some residue=
floating to the top which we would skim off. And yes, after mixing the gla=
ze by hand my arm would feel slippery when rinsed off -similar to the soft =
water feeling I get from our current Culligan softened well water... Occasi=
onally if mixing a bunch of glazes my arm would get red, I took this as a s=
ignal to apply some lotion and not keep my hand in the glaze as long. That =
was in my youth, now I am older and wiser and I would apply lotion BEFORE s=
ticking my arm into the glaze... I also tend to speed on the highway, but u=
sually try to stay under 10 miles over to avoid a ticket... -Rimas
p.s. Edouard, I didn't know dust masks existed in the 60's and 70's -just l=
ucky I guess...
Nancy Spinella on mon 15 mar 10
Doesn't the lotion react with the glaze and/or the clay if you apply it
beforehand?
Just curious...I've always worried about it, so I just wait until
afterward....
On Mon, Mar 15, 2010 at 10:39 AM, Rimas VisGirda wrote:
> Thanks David and Vince! Yes, washing ashes takes away most of the
> character. In my 30's I was doing about 10-15 years of ash glazing. We us=
ed
> mostly oak from a heater stove. We screened the dry ash through a window
> screen then mixed the (wet) glaze. We would let the glaze settle and get
> some residue floating to the top which we would skim off. And yes, after
> mixing the glaze by hand my arm would feel slippery when rinsed off -simi=
lar
> to the soft water feeling I get from our current Culligan softened well
> water... Occasionally if mixing a bunch of glazes my arm would get red, I
> took this as a signal to apply some lotion and not keep my hand in the gl=
aze
> as long. That was in my youth, now I am older and wiser and I would apply
> lotion BEFORE sticking my arm into the glaze... I also tend to speed on t=
he
> highway, but usually try to stay under 10 miles over to avoid a ticket...
> -Rimas
> p.s. Edouard, I didn't know dust masks existed in the 60's and 70's -just
> lucky I guess...
>
Lee Love on mon 15 mar 10
On Mon, Mar 15, 2010 at 9:39 AM, Rimas VisGirda wrote:
> Thanks David and Vince! Yes, washing ashes takes away most of the >charac=
=3D
ter.
This isn't necessarily true.
When mixing glazes in the tradition wet ladle measure way, washing
is important to keep the liquid ingredients consistent. (solubles
are taken out of the glaze at a higher rate than suspendeed
particles.) So you glaze changes as you use it, loosing some of the
original fluxing power of the diminished solubles.
--
Lee, a Mashiko potter in Minneapolis
http://mashikopots.blogspot.com/
=3D93Observe the wonders as they occur around you. Don't claim them. Feel
the artistry moving through and be silent.=3D94 --Rumi
Lee Love on mon 15 mar 10
On Mon, Mar 15, 2010 at 9:39 AM, Rimas VisGirda wrote:
>Occasionally if mixing a bunch of glazes my arm would get red, I took this=
=3D
as >a signal to apply some lotion and not keep my hand in the glaze as lon=
=3D
g.
Be careful about lotions on your hands while glazing. They can act
like resist on the bisque you touch. Eating greasy things like
potato chips before glazing can do the same thing.
--=3D20
--
Lee, a Mashiko potter in Minneapolis
http://mashikopots.blogspot.com/
=3D93Observe the wonders as they occur around you. Don't claim them. Feel
the artistry moving through and be silent.=3D94 --Rumi
Rimas VisGirda on mon 15 mar 10
I don't think there's a reaction... and I don't know what you would mean by=
a reaction, bubbling and fizzing of my skin?... glaze is just powder and w=
ater but I suppose (unwashed) ash glaze might be slightly basic... but so w=
hat... Lotion just moisturizes the skin and helps it from drying out, but I=
'm not a dermatologist... -Rimas
--- On Mon, 3/15/10, Nancy Spinella wrote:
Doesn't the lotion react with the glaze and/or the clay if you apply it bef=
orehand?
Just curious...I've always worried about it, so I just wait until afterward=
....
On Mon, Mar 15, 2010 at 10:39 AM, Rimas VisGirda wrote:
Thanks David and Vince! Yes, washing ashes takes away most of the character=
. In my 30's I was doing about 10-15 years of ash glazing. We used mostly o=
ak from a heater stove. We screened the dry ash through a window screen the=
n mixed the (wet) glaze. We would let the glaze settle and get some residue=
floating to the top which we would skim off. And yes, after mixing the gla=
ze by hand my arm would feel slippery when rinsed off -similar to the soft =
water feeling I get from our current Culligan softened well water... Occasi=
onally if mixing a bunch of glazes my arm would get red, I took this as a s=
ignal to apply some lotion and not keep my hand in the glaze as long. That =
was in my youth, now I am older and wiser and I would apply lotion BEFORE s=
ticking my arm into the glaze... I also tend to speed on the highway, but u=
sually try to stay under 10 miles over to avoid a ticket... -Rimas
p.s. Edouard, I didn't know dust masks existed in the 60's and 70's -just l=
ucky I guess...
Rimas VisGirda on mon 15 mar 10
OK, you've apparently thought about it more than I have. I just posted what=
=3D
I do from MY experience... -Rimas=3D0A=3D0A--- On Mon, 3/15/10, Lee Love <=
cwid=3D
dershins@gmail.com> wrote:=3D0A=3D0A> From: Lee Love m>=3D
=3D0A> Subject: Re: Wet Ashes and Hairless Brushes/ full body condom revisi=
te=3D
d=3D0A> To: "Rimas VisGirda" =3D0A> Cc: Clayart@lsv.cera=
mics=3D
.org=3D0A> Date: Monday, March 15, 2010, 1:13 PM=3D0A> On Mon, Mar 15, 2010=
at =3D
9:39 AM,=3D0A> Rimas VisGirda =3D0A> wrote:=3D0A> =3D0A>=
> Thank=3D
s David and Vince! Yes, washing ashes takes away=3D0A> most of the >charact=
er=3D
.=3D0A> =3D0A> =3DC2=3DA0=3DC2=3DA0=3DC2=3DA0This isn't necessarily true.=
=3D0A> =3D0A> =3DC2=3DA0 =3D
=3DC2=3DA0 When mixing glazes in the tradition wet ladle=3D0A> measure way,=
washi=3D
ng=3D0A> is important to keep the liquid ingredients=3DC2=3DA0=3D0A> consis=
tent.=3DC2=3D
=3DA0 (solubles=3D0A> are taken out of the glaze at a higher rate than=3D0A=
> susp=3D
endeed=3D0A> particles.)=3DC2=3DA0 So you glaze changes as you use it,=3D0A=
> loosin=3D
g some of the=3D0A> original fluxing power of the diminished solubles.=3D0A=
> =3D
=3D0A> --=3D0A> Lee, a Mashiko potter in Minneapolis=3D0A> http://mashikop=
ots.bl=3D
ogspot.com/=3D0A> =3D0A> =3DE2=3D80=3D9CObserve the wonders as they occur a=
round you.=3D
Don't=3D0A> claim them. Feel=3D0A> the artistry moving through and be sile=
nt.=3D
=3DE2=3D80=3D9D --Rumi=3D0A>
Rimas VisGirda on mon 15 mar 10
=3D0A=3D0AYes Lee, fried chicken also. Incidentally I like both the KFC gri=
lled=3D
chicken as well as the original recipe; never cared for the crispy. -Rimas=
=3D
=3D0A=3D0A--- On Mon, 3/15/10, Lee Love wrote:=3D0=
A=3D0A> =3D
From: Lee Love =3D0A=3D0A> Be careful about lotions=
on =3D
your hands while glazing.=3DC2=3DA0=3D0A> =3DC2=3DA0 They can act=3D0A> lik=
e resist on =3D
the bisque you=3D0A> touch.=3DC2=3DA0=3DC2=3DA0=3DC2=3DA0Eating greasy thin=
gs like=3D0A> po=3D
tato chips before glazing can do the same thing.=3D0A> =3D0A> -- =3D0A> --=
=3D0A> L=3D
ee, a Mashiko potter in Minneapolis=3D0A> http://mashikopots.blogspot.com/=
=3D0A=3D
> =3D0A> =3DE2=3D80=3D9CObserve the wonders as they occur around you. Don't=
=3D0A> cla=3D
im them. Feel=3D0A> the artistry moving through and be silent.=3DE2=3D80=3D=
9D --Rum=3D
i=3D0A>
Lee Love on mon 15 mar 10
On Mon, Mar 15, 2010 at 4:14 PM, Rimas VisGirda wrote:
> OK, you've apparently thought about it more than I have. I just posted wh=
=3D
at I do from MY >experience... -Rimas
Not much thinking involved. My main job was to sponge the bisque
ware and hand it to the head glazer or to my Sensei. If there were
finger print resist marks on the pot, I was asked if I had used lotion
or forgot to scrub my hands after lunch. Almost all the learning
was by doing and not by thinking.
When g $30,000.00 pots are being glazed. You try to pay attention.
--
Lee, a Mashiko potter in Minneapolis
http://mashikopots.blogspot.com/
=3D93Observe the wonders as they occur around you. Don't claim them. Feel
the artistry moving through and be silent.=3D94 --Rumi
Vince Pitelka on mon 15 mar 10
Lee Love wrote:
"When mixing glazes in the tradition wet ladle measure way, washing
is important to keep the liquid ingredients consistent. (solubles
are taken out of the glaze at a higher rate than suspendeed
particles.) So you glaze changes as you use it, loosing some of the
original fluxing power of the diminished solubles."
Lee -
If you keep your ash glaze in suspension, then solubles and solids will be
taken out of an ash glaze at the same rate, as is the case with shino
glazes. If solubles were taken out of the glaze faster, then it would
necessarily mean that water is removed from any glaze proportionally faster
than the solids, and all glazes would thicken considerably as they are used
up. That is not the case.
I have not seen the performance of either ash glazes or shinos change as th=
e
level gets lower in the bucket as long as they are used in a reasonable
amount of time. We get very consistent results from ash glazes made with
unwashed ash, and have never been able to reproduce the results with washed
ash.
- Vince
Vince Pitelka
Appalachian Center for Craft
Tennessee Tech University
vpitelka@dtccom.net; wpitelka@tntech.edu
http://iweb.tntech.edu/wpitelka
phil on tue 16 mar 10
The short and sweet, is that unwashed or raw Wood Ash, and Hardwood Ash the
more so, contain Alkalis which are more or less "Lye", aka Caustic Soda, ak=
a
Potassium Hydroxide.
Lye, whether dry or hydrated, in contact with Fats or Oils ( such as one ha=
s
in their skin ) will be trying to make Soap out of said Oils or Fats...whil=
e
incidentally dissolving anything else in it's ballywick, such as Skin
itself.
Vinegar or other Acids neutralize Caustic or Alkaline conditions....while
Water as such, even if washing most of an offending Lye solution away, does
not.
Very weak or residual Lye or Caustic Soda Solutions may not readily bother
one's skin enough to notice...while, stronger ones may, or, will.
Like that...
Randall Moody on tue 16 mar 10
Sorry, I didn't mean a light rinsing or waiting a while and rinsing. I mean=
t
a real rinsing directly after.
On Tue, Mar 16, 2010 at 9:05 PM, Vince Pitelka wrote:
> Randall Moody wrote:
> "Also, if you wash or even rinse your arm and hand in water following
> getting
> the ash and water mix on you, you will have nothing to worry about. No re=
al
> need to use vinegar or lemon etc. unless you like the smell."
>
> Randall -
> Having handled a great deal of ash and ash glazes, that's not my
> experience.
> I suppose it is true if you really flush your hand or arm thoroughly with
> clean water, but you can accomplish the same thing almost instantly by
> using
> vinegar, because it neutralizes the alkalinity. As you probably know, th=
e
> alkalinity is hard on your skin if present even in very low concentration=
,
> while the slight acidity is friendly to your skin.
> - Vince
>
> Vince Pitelka
> Appalachian Center for Craft
> Tennessee Tech University
> vpitelka@dtccom.net; wpitelka@tntech.edu
> http://iweb.tntech.edu/wpitelka
>
Randall Moody on tue 16 mar 10
I found this information from the Division of Agricultural Sciences and
Natural Resources of Oklahoma State University.
Type of wood K2O Total Soluble Salts pH*
Hickory 3.6 10 11.4
Mixture of hard 8.9 35 11.9
and soft woods
Elm 5.3 12 11.1
Oak 4.5 36 12.4
Mostly Oak 6.3 18 11.5
Average 6.0 22 11.6
*pH of a 1 percent solution of ashes in water
I also have to agree with Vince that if you keep the glaze ingredients in
suspension properly by stirring well before use the ingredients should come
out at more or less the same rate.
Also, if you wash or even rinse your arm and hand in water following gettin=
g
the ash and water mix on you, you will have nothing to worry about. No real
need to use vinegar or lemon etc. unless you like the smell. :)
--Randall in Atlanta--
Rimas VisGirda on tue 16 mar 10
=3D0A=3D0A--- On Mon, 3/15/10, Lee Love wrote:=3D0=
ALee, =3D
I try to pay attention regardless if it's a $5 pot or a $900 pot, I'm sorry=
=3D
to say I don't make any $30,000 pots, or did you mean yen? Another thought=
=3D
might be that seems like you wouldn't know it's worth 30,000 somethings un=
=3D
til AFTER the firing not before when it's bisqueware...=3D0A-Rimas=3D0A=3D0=
A> Fro=3D
m: Lee Love =3D0A=3D0A> Not much thinking involved.=
=3DC2=3D
=3DA0 =3DC2=3DA0 My main job was to=3D0A> sponge the bisque=3D0A> ware and =
hand it to=3D
the head glazer or to my=3D0A> Sensei.=3DC2=3DA0=3DC2=3DA0=3DC2=3DA0If the=
re were=3D0A> fi=3D
nger print resist marks on the pot, I was asked if I had=3D0A> used lotion=
=3D0A=3D
> or forgot to scrub my hands after lunch.=3DC2=3DA0 =3DC2=3DA0=3D0A> Almos=
t all the =3D
learning=3D0A> was by doing and not by thinking.=3D0A> =3D0A> =3DC2=3DA0 =
=3DC2=3DA0 When =3D
g $30,000.00 pots are being=3D0A> glazed.=3DC2=3DA0=3DC2=3DA0=3DC2=3DA0You =
try to pay att=3D
ention.=3D0A> =3D0A> --=3D0A> Lee, a Mashiko potter in Minneapolis=3D0A> h=
ttp://ma=3D
shikopots.blogspot.com/=3D0A> =3D0A> =3DE2=3D80=3D9CObserve the wonders as =
they occur=3D
around you. Don't=3D0A> claim them. Feel=3D0A> the artistry moving through=
and=3D
be silent.=3DE2=3D80=3D9D --Rumi=3D0A>
Lee Love on tue 16 mar 10
On Tue, Mar 16, 2010 at 8:52 AM, Rimas VisGirda wrote:
>
>
> --- On Mon, 3/15/10, Lee Love wrote:
> Lee, I try to pay attention regardless if it's a $5 pot or a $900 pot, I'=
=3D
m sorry to say I don't >make any $30,000 pots, or did you mean yen? Another=
=3D
thought might be that seems like
Dollars. If you handle $30,000.00 pots, you become aware of the differen=
=3D
ce.
>you wouldn't know it's worth 30,000 somethings until AFTER the firing not =
=3D
before when it's >bisqueware...
When you work this level, you pretty much know the outcome of the
bisqueware. You learn a level of care you didn't know you were
previously capable of. At first, it is very difficult. In the
beginning, I felt like a bull in a china shop. But everything in a
traditional apprenticeship is set up to make you become aware, rather
than convenience.
--
Lee, a Mashiko potter in Minneapolis
http://mashikopots.blogspot.com/
=3D93Observe the wonders as they occur around you. Don't claim them. Feel
the artistry moving through and be silent.=3D94 --Rumi
Randall Moody on tue 16 mar 10
Very true Rimas! The pot isn't worth 30000 yen or dollars until it is sold
for that much. Also if you don't pay attention to your 30 dollar bowl you
will never reach the point of selling a 30,000 dollar pot.
--Randall in Atlanta
On Tue, Mar 16, 2010 at 9:52 AM, Rimas VisGirda wrote:
>
>
> --- On Mon, 3/15/10, Lee Love wrote:
> Lee, I try to pay attention regardless if it's a $5 pot or a $900 pot, I'=
=3D
m
> sorry to say I don't make any $30,000 pots, or did you mean yen? Another
> thought might be that seems like you wouldn't know it's worth 30,000
> somethings until AFTER the firing not before when it's bisqueware...
> -Rimas
>
> > From: Lee Love
>
> > Not much thinking involved. My main job was to
> > sponge the bisque
> > ware and hand it to the head glazer or to my
> > Sensei. If there were
> > finger print resist marks on the pot, I was asked if I had
> > used lotion
> > or forgot to scrub my hands after lunch.
> > Almost all the learning
> > was by doing and not by thinking.
> >
> > When g $30,000.00 pots are being
> > glazed. You try to pay attention.
> >
> > --
> > Lee, a Mashiko potter in Minneapolis
> > http://mashikopots.blogspot.com/
> >
> > =3D93Observe the wonders as they occur around you. Don't
> > claim them. Feel
> > the artistry moving through and be silent.=3D94 --Rumi
> >
>
Lee Love on tue 16 mar 10
Because of the low bisque in the noborigama (warmest part is
dull red heat, other parts much cooler), every new apprentice I
watched do sponging, broke a ko-shigaraki tea bowl )when they
substituted for me bisque sponging), broke a tea ceremony bowl. I
broke two. They sold for about $6,000.00 each when finished, and I
can assure you, you'd be kicked out on your butt if you said, "Well,
it ain't worth $6,000.00 until it's sold."
I watched the 20 something young apprentices have these
break in their hands, and you'd swear they were going to kill
themselves over it. But after being there three years, I realized
that it was a sort of "rite of passage" for the new apprentices.
Nothing was laid out or organized for convenience. Spaces
were tight and work was often set on the ground. The sliding doors,
with paper windows were difficult to open and shut without damaging,
especially if you had $20,000.00 worth of pots on your shoulder on a
board while you were doing it, and you had to remove your shoes before
entering the building.
If you haven't trained it a traditional setting, it really is
pretty impossible to understand it. On one of Warren MacKenzie's
visits to Mashiko, when he was in a show in Tokyo for the first show
in the newly renovated home of Soetsu Yanagi, he asked SHimaoka Sensei
if he could watch the crew work. Shimaoka set up glazing so
MacKenzie could watch us do that. We worked for some time. Warren
told me later that it was pretty amazing, like everyone had telepathy
or something, because there was no talking, but when something needed
to be done, without a word, someone would stand up and do it.
Part of what is going on, is that all the workers are always
thinking ahead of the teacher, to be one step ahead of him or her.
It is the exact same method I have experience in Zen monasteries, both
in America and Japan.
--
Lee, a Mashiko potter in Minneapolis
http://mashikopots.blogspot.com/
=3D93Observe the wonders as they occur around you. Don't claim them. Feel
the artistry moving through and be silent.=3D94 --Rumi
Vince Pitelka on tue 16 mar 10
Randall Moody wrote:
"Also, if you wash or even rinse your arm and hand in water following
getting
the ash and water mix on you, you will have nothing to worry about. No real
need to use vinegar or lemon etc. unless you like the smell."
Randall -
Having handled a great deal of ash and ash glazes, that's not my experience=
.
I suppose it is true if you really flush your hand or arm thoroughly with
clean water, but you can accomplish the same thing almost instantly by usin=
g
vinegar, because it neutralizes the alkalinity. As you probably know, the
alkalinity is hard on your skin if present even in very low concentration,
while the slight acidity is friendly to your skin.
- Vince
Vince Pitelka
Appalachian Center for Craft
Tennessee Tech University
vpitelka@dtccom.net; wpitelka@tntech.edu
http://iweb.tntech.edu/wpitelka
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