Michael Wendt on wed 19 may 10
Why not split the kiln half way up and simply raise the
upper portion along with the lid?
That's what I have done for over 36 years with great
results.
Regards,
Michael Wendt
On May 19, 2010, at 12:58 PM, ELAINE CARROLL wrote:
> Ok, you'll can start throwing things at me, but I must say
> this, I
> think the top loading kilns are designed and built by men
> for men.
> If more women manufactured kilns, an easier way to make
> and load
> them would have been found a long time ago. Lili's idea
> sounds very
> doable. I can't afford any kind of new kiln, and
> therefore haven't
> started to investigate them much, but I do believe someone
> out there
> in clayland ( probably a smart engineer turned potter) can
> design
> and manufacture a front loading kiln for a price
> comparable to the
> top loading ones on the market today.
> Elaine Carroll
> Earth, Fire & Passion
> Baton Rouge, LA
ELAINE CARROLL on wed 19 may 10
Ok, you'll can start throwing things at me, but I must say this, I think th=
=3D
e top loading kilns are designed=3DA0 and built by men for men.=3DA0 If mor=
e wo=3D
men manufactured kilns, an=3DA0easier way to make and load them would have =
be=3D
en found a long time ago.=3DA0 Lili's idea sounds very doable.=3DA0 I can't=
aff=3D
ord any kind of new kiln, and therefore haven't started to investigate them=
=3D
much, but I do believe someone out there in clayland ( probably a smart en=
=3D
gineer turned potter) can design and manufacture a front loading kiln for a=
=3D
price comparable to the top loading ones=3DA0on the market today.=3D0AElai=
ne C=3D
arroll=3D0AEarth, Fire & Passion=3D0ABaton Rouge, LA
jonathan byler on wed 19 may 10
from a manufacturing and engineering standpoint, not much is easier or
cheaper to make than an oval or round top loader. very little in the
way of materials and support is needed to hold it all together, and it
is mostly built up of identical modules that stack together - all of
which =3D low prices. I suspect a person could produce a front loader
with elements in the door for a reasonable price if they made them in
quantity, but there are probably not enough people willing to pay even
a mere 25% or 50% premium over the price of the front loader, so they
are not made in quantity enough to drive the prices down.
On May 19, 2010, at 12:58 PM, ELAINE CARROLL wrote:
> Ok, you'll can start throwing things at me, but I must say this, I
> think the top loading kilns are designed and built by men for men.
> If more women manufactured kilns, an easier way to make and load
> them would have been found a long time ago. Lili's idea sounds very
> doable. I can't afford any kind of new kiln, and therefore haven't
> started to investigate them much, but I do believe someone out there
> in clayland ( probably a smart engineer turned potter) can design
> and manufacture a front loading kiln for a price comparable to the
> top loading ones on the market today.
> Elaine Carroll
> Earth, Fire & Passion
> Baton Rouge, LA
Mayssan Farra on thu 20 may 10
Hello all:
When I bought my current kiln. I thought long and hard about a front loader=
but decided on the top loader even with my head first in the bottom of it.=
I think it would be difficult to judge how to load from the front without =
being able to see the amount of space between freshly glazed pots. I think =
the best way is like the Raku kilns where you remove the whole kiln leaving=
just the base which you can load perfectly then lower the kiln on it, but =
then we get into pulleys and lifts and things I know not.
Mayssan, in foggy Charleston WV with a beautiful day in the forecast
Mayssan Shora Farra
http://www.clayvillepottery.com
http://clayette.blogspot.com
----- Original Message ----
> From: ELAINE CARROLL
> To: Clayart@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG
> Sent: Wed, May 19, 2010 1:58:51 PM
> Subject: [Clayart] Front Loading Kilns
>
> Ok, you'll can start throwing things at me, but I must say this, I think =
the top
> loading kilns are designed and built by men for men. If more women
> manufactured kilns, an easier way to make and load them would have been f=
ound a
> long time ago. Lili's idea sounds very doable. I can't afford any kind =
of new
> kiln, and therefore haven't started to investigate them much, but I do be=
lieve
> someone out there in clayland ( probably a smart engineer turned potter) =
can
> design and manufacture a front loading kiln for a price comparable to the=
top
> loading ones on the market today.
Elaine Carroll
Earth, Fire &
> Passion
Baton Rouge, LA
paul gerhold on thu 20 may 10
Michael,
How are you connecting the top half of the kiln to the lifting mechanism.
If your system has worked for 36 years it would be a great service to some
of us to know your method. The counterweighting and lifting is easy but
attaching to the soft brick is of interest and would keep us from having to
reinvent the wheel
Paul
On Thu, May 20, 2010 at 1:44 AM, Michael Wendt wrote:
> Why not split the kiln half way up and simply raise the
> upper portion along with the lid?
> That's what I have done for over 36 years with great
> results.
> Regards,
> Michael Wendt
>
>
> On May 19, 2010, at 12:58 PM, ELAINE CARROLL wrote:
>
> Ok, you'll can start throwing things at me, but I must say
>> this, I
>> think the top loading kilns are designed and built by men
>> for men.
>> If more women manufactured kilns, an easier way to make
>> and load
>> them would have been found a long time ago. Lili's idea
>> sounds very
>> doable. I can't afford any kind of new kiln, and
>> therefore haven't
>> started to investigate them much, but I do believe someone
>> out there
>> in clayland ( probably a smart engineer turned potter) can
>> design
>> and manufacture a front loading kiln for a price
>> comparable to the
>> top loading ones on the market today.
>> Elaine Carroll
>> Earth, Fire & Passion
>> Baton Rouge, LA
>>
>
Lis Allison on thu 20 may 10
On May 19, 2010, you wrote:
> .... I do believe someone out there
> in clayland ( probably a smart engineer turned potter) can design and
> manufacture a front loading kiln for a price comparable to the top
> loading ones on the market today.
Maybe they can get closer in price, but to make them the same you'd have
to rescind a few of the laws of physics. Hanging something off the side is
always going to take more structure than laying it on top....
Lis
--
Elisabeth Allison
Pine Ridge Studio
www.Pine-Ridge-Studio.blogspot.com
Vince Pitelka on thu 20 may 10
I think this has been touched upon in other messages, but people who have
never built a front-loading kiln with a hinged door rarely have a firm gras=
p
of how difficult it is to make a reliable and lasting design. Unless the
door is entirely fiber, with a minimal steel frame, it is very heavy.
Hanging it along one edge on hinges puts enormous stress on the kiln frame,
and many are the kilns that have failed because of an inadequate frame
supporting a hinged door. For larger gas kilns with hinged doors, I have
always built an all-welded steel frame constructed of 4x4x1/4" angle iron,
including the door frame. If you go to the "kilns" page of my website at
http://iweb.tntech.edu/wpitelka/studio/kilns.htm, the second kiln down on
the right with the red frame (sorry for the small picture) is our current
salt kiln when it was fairly new (but now after eight years of heavy use
about to get rebuilt). Some might say that these kilns are overbuilt, but
all I can say is that the frame does not shift or warp in the slightest ove=
r
time as a result of a heavy hinged door.
Shortly after arriving at the Craft Center in 1994 I built a 40 cubic foot
downdraft kiln with a hinged door, and while the brick lining has certainly
aged considerably over the intervening 15 years and will need replacement
soon, the kiln frame, door frame, and hinge mechanism are still in perfect
condition.
Some people have managed to avoid the necessity of a very heavy frame by
mounting the door on a moveable dolly, or hanging it from an overhead track
(or by building a car kiln), but on these designs you always have the
problem of the door coming up against the kiln body in a way that can
seriously damage both over time. If such a kiln is single-owner-operator,
then accommodations can be made to close the door with sufficient care to
eliminate any problems, but this kind of door rarely works well in an
institutional setting. It is true that a hinged door can also be closed
with excessive force, but it is easier to make accommodations for this
situation.
In making front-loader kilns with a hinged door, kiln manufacturers have to
expend considerable materials and labor on the frame, and as a result, they
generally do the same with the refractory and other components, and the
result is usually a more efficient, longer-lasting kiln. As is almost
always the case with studio equipment, you get what you pay for.
- Vince
Vince Pitelka
Appalachian Center for Craft
Tennessee Tech University
vpitelka@dtccom.net; wpitelka@tntech.edu
http://iweb.tntech.edu/wpitelka
Bonnie Staffel on fri 21 may 10
My interest in redesigning kilns is from my first experience back in the
70's when an "electric reduction production" kiln was designed with very
heavy 1" wound coils and with a box in the bottom to hold charcoal. I
purchased one as I was missing reduction firing after selling my Alpine =3D
to
move to northern Michigan . It worked quite well except for some design
flaws. Then the company went out of business because there were sales
problems, I think. Anyway, when I taught in Denmark, I loved their front
loading electric kilns that had those heavy 1" coiled elements with =3D
tunnels
under the floor in which to put wood or candles for introducing
combustibles. Perfect results. Potters that I visited all over Denmark =3D
had
variations on size of this kiln. There was no smoke, or flames, had =3D
latches
on the front door and a small opening in the roof which could be covered =
=3D
by
a brick. The kiln was a dream come true. And of course too expensive to =3D
have
shipped here to the US from England where they were made.
Seems to me that some company here in the US could come up with a =3D
variation
of such a kiln. The copper reds I and all my students got were just
delicious.=3D20
Bonnie Staffel
http://webpages.charter.net/bstaffel/
http://vasefinder.com/bstaffelgallery1.html
DVD=3DA0 Throwing with Coils and Slabs
DVD=3DA0 Introduction to Wheel Work
Charter Member Potters Council
Lee Love on fri 21 may 10
On Fri, May 21, 2010 at 7:54 AM, Bonnie Staffel wr=
=3D
ote:
> Seems to me that some company here in the US could come up with a variati=
=3D
on
> of such a kiln. The copper reds I and all my students got were just
> delicious.
Shimpo makes them. Folks just need to be made aware, be willing to
pay the higher price (about 5 grand), and let Shimpo know. We will
only have them if we demand them.
See photos here:
http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=3D3D4625720&l=3D3Dc72a6e24b7&id=3D3D5=
507270=3D
56
http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=3D3D4625719&l=3D3Dc256bfef33&id=3D3D5=
507270=3D
56
http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=3D3D4625718&l=3D3D35fb3da3d7&id=3D3D5=
507270=3D
56
--
Lee, a Mashiko potter in Minneapolis
http://mingeisota.blogspot.com/
=3D93Observe the wonders as they occur around you. Don't claim them. Feel
the artistry moving through and be silent.=3D94 --Rumi
Bonnie Staffel on sat 22 may 10
Lee, those photos were interesting, however I feel that reinstalling =3D
those
coils would be a nightmare. I also looked up Shimpo's website and could =3D
not
find any reference to that kiln. It is not offered for sale to the =3D
general
pottery makers. I have heard of introducing a Bunsen burner into the =3D
peep
hole to get the desired reduction. The tunnels under the floor with tiny
vents into the kiln interior seemed so simple in which to put a stick of
wood, or a short candle.
It is not that the heavy duty elements aren't available. Being thicker =3D
they
withstand the reduction by not losing as much of the oxide coating. Then
refiring oxidation in between times, helped to replace the coating that
protects the elements. The kiln that I purchased had such heavy =3D
elements. It
was a great kiln, but since the interior was a castable as well as the =3D
lid
rather than IFB, these cracked badly as they were contained in an iron
covering and couldn't expand or contract..=3D20
Bonnie Staffel
http://webpages.charter.net/bstaffel/
http://vasefinder.com/bstaffelgallery1.html
DVD=3DA0 Throwing with Coils and Slabs
DVD=3DA0 Introduction to Wheel Work
Charter Member Potters Council
Lee Love on sun 23 may 10
On Sat, May 22, 2010 at 10:03 PM, Bonnie Staffel w=
=3D
rote:
> Lee, those photos were interesting, however I feel that reinstalling thos=
=3D
e
> coils would be a nightmare.
The point is, they are not disposable like our cheap elements. But
you pay a premium for them. They are not available here, but in
Japan. If enough folks inquire about them, maybe we can get Shimpo
to sell them here.
I've never heard of anybody firing the bunsen burner/electric
hybrid conversions regularly. They are a gimmick. But the propane
conversions for raku are pretty common. And they can be fired to cone
10 with the right burner. I am making one of those.
--
Lee, a Mashiko potter in Minneapolis
http://mingeisota.blogspot.com/
=3D93Observe the wonders as they occur around you. Don't claim them. Feel
the artistry moving through and be silent.=3D94 --Rumi
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