phil on tue 22 jun 10
Hi Steve,
If wishing to use a Cutting Torch for removing the Drum Lid...
If the Drum is cool...just put in a few pieces of burning Newspaper, twiste=
d
up, and lit to a good burining, and put in through the Bung Hole...adding
more as you go.
By reducing the Oxygen content of the enclosed Air...any residual Alcohol
fumes would be rendered unable to ignite.
If the Drum is warm or hot from Sunshine or ambient Summer temps, you could
just fill the Drum 3/4rs full of Water...and be fine with the Torch then.
Alcohol fumes in a 55 Gallon Drum would not 'explode' anyway, the most they
would do, if ignited, is to make a soft if dramatic "whooosh".
If it was me, I would probably just use my late 1970s Variable Speed,
variable Pitch, 'BOSCH' Jig Saw, and, with a medium speed elected, press th=
e
once warmed Metal Cutting Blade into some Bees Wax every inch or two of
cutting so it can cut joyfully. This would make a very tidy job of it, and
not take long to do. Having make a small Cut with a Chisel or Flat Blade
Screwdriver to for the Jig Saw Blade to enter.
Wish I was closer...I would like one of those Drums!
Best wishes!
Phil
Lv
On Tue, Jun 22, 2010 at 10:37 PM, steve graber wrote:
> i work at a place now that throws out 55 gallon drums every few months.
> clean ones that used to hold alcohol. you still have to cut the lid off
> (which i haven't started yet on the one i took home). i think i'll make
> another raku kiln one day. either that or another bar-b-q smoker thing.
>
> if anyone has tips or tricks on cutting, of if anyone wants one in the
> claremont, california areea drop me a line.
steve graber on tue 22 jun 10
i work at a place now that throws out 55 gallon drums every few months.=3DA=
0 =3D
clean ones that used to hold alcohol.=3DA0 you still have to cut the lid of=
f =3D
(which i haven't started yet on the one i took home).=3DA0 i think i'll mak=
e =3D
another raku kiln one day.=3DA0 either that or another bar-b-q smoker thing=
.=3D
=3DA0 =3D0A=3D0Aif anyone has tips or tricks on cutting, of if anyone wants=
one i=3D
n the claremont, california areea drop me a line.=3DA0 =3D0A=3DA0Steve Grab=
er, Gr=3D
aber's Pottery, Inc=3D0AClaremont, California USA=3D0AThe Steve Tool - for =
awes=3D
ome texture on pots! =3D0Awww.graberspottery.com steve@graberspottery.com =
=3D0A=3D
=3D0A=3D0AOn Laguna Clay's website=3D0Ahttp://www.lagunaclay.com/blogs/ =3D=
0A=3D0A=3D0A=3D
=3D0A
James Freeman on tue 22 jun 10
On Tue, Jun 22, 2010 at 10:37 PM, steve graber wrote:
> i work at a place now that throws out 55 gallon drums every few months. =
=3D
clean ones that used to hold alcohol. you still have to cut the lid off (w=
=3D
hich i haven't started yet on the one i took home). i think i'll make anot=
=3D
her raku kiln one day. either that or another bar-b-q smoker thing.
>
> if anyone has tips or tricks on cutting, of if anyone wants one in the cl=
=3D
aremont, california areea drop me a line.
Steve...
The easiest and cleanest way to remove the top of the drum is with a
tool called a "de-header". It is like a giant can opener. You can
buy one here: http://www.amazon.com/Wesco-Drum-Deheader/dp/B000Z5E6DC
If you don't want to spend the $50, a cutting torch will zip right
through the thin steel, but I wouldn't do that on a drum from alcohol
unless I was VERY sure that ALL of the fumes were long gone.
Explosions can ruin your whole day. This is how I cut drums. Just
did one a few days ago. It used to contain compressor oil. Sizzled a
little, but that's all. ALL usual caveats apply!
I once tries to dehead a drum with a cold chisel and a hammer. Bad
idea. Took forever, and left a jagged, life-threatening mess.
Have fun!
...James
James Freeman
"All I say is by way of discourse, and nothing by way of advice. I
should not speak so boldly if it were my due to be believed."
-Michel de Montaigne
http://www.jamesfreemanstudio.com
http://www.flickr.com/photos/jamesfreemanstudio/
http://www.jamesfreemanstudio.com/resources
steve graber on wed 23 jun 10
i figured i could use this as a reason to buy a new cool tool! =3D0A=3DA0St=
eve =3D
Graber, Graber's Pottery, Inc=3D0AClaremont, California USA=3D0AThe Steve T=
ool =3D
- for awesome texture on pots! =3D0Awww.graberspottery.com steve@graberspot=
te=3D
ry.com =3D0A=3D0A=3D0AOn Laguna Clay's website=3D0Ahttp://www.lagunaclay.co=
m/blogs/=3D
=3D0A=3D0A=3D0A=3D0A----- Original Message ----=3D0A> From: James Freeman =
manstudio@gmail.com>=3D0A> To: steve graber =3D0A> Cc: =
Clay=3D
art@lsv.ceramics.org=3D0A> Sent: Tue, June 22, 2010 8:02:04 PM=3D0A> Subjec=
t: R=3D
e: 55 gallon drum=3D0A> =3D0A> On Tue, Jun 22, 2010 at 10:37 PM, steve grab=
er <=3D
> ymailto=3D3D"mailto:slgraber@yahoo.com" =3D0A> href=3D3D"mailto:slgraber@=
yahoo.=3D
com">slgraber@yahoo.com> wrote:=3D0A> i =3D0A> work at a place now that thr=
ows =3D
out 55 gallon drums every few months.=3DA0 =3D0A> clean ones that used to h=
old =3D
alcohol.=3DA0 you still have to cut the lid off =3D0A> (which i haven't sta=
rted=3D
yet on the one i took home).=3DA0 i think i'll make =3D0A> another raku ki=
ln o=3D
ne day.=3DA0 either that or another bar-b-q smoker =3D0A> thing.=3D0A>=3D0A=
> if any=3D
one has tips or tricks on cutting, of if anyone =3D0A> wants one in the cla=
re=3D
mont, california areea drop me a =3D0A> line.=3D0A=3D0A=3D0A=3D0A=3D0ASteve=
...=3D0A=3D0AThe=3D
easiest and cleanest way to remove =3D0A> the top of the drum is with a=3D=
0Ato=3D
ol called a "de-header".=3DA0 It is like a =3D0A> giant can opener.=3DA0 Yo=
u can=3D
=3D0Abuy one here:=3DA0 > href=3D3D"http://www.amazon.com/Wesco-Drum-Dehead=
er/dp/=3D
B000Z5E6DC" target=3D3D_blank =3D0A> >http://www.amazon.com/Wesco-Drum-Dehe=
ader=3D
/dp/B000Z5E6DC=3D0A=3D0AIf you don't =3D0A> want to spend the $50, a cuttin=
g torc=3D
h will zip right=3D0Athrough the thin steel, =3D0A> but I wouldn't do that =
on a=3D
drum from alcohol=3D0Aunless I was VERY sure that ALL =3D0A> of the fumes =
were=3D
long gone.=3D0AExplosions can ruin your whole day.=3DA0 This =3D0A> is how=
I cut=3D
drums.=3DA0 Just=3D0Adid one a few days ago.=3DA0 It used to =3D0A> contai=
n compre=3D
ssor oil.=3DA0 Sizzled a=3D0Alittle, but that's all.=3DA0 ALL =3D0A> usual =
caveats =3D
apply!=3D0A=3D0AI once tries to dehead a drum with a cold chisel and =3D0A>=
a ham=3D
mer.=3DA0 Bad=3D0Aidea.=3DA0 Took forever, and left a jagged, =3D0A> life-t=
hreateni=3D
ng mess.=3D0A=3D0AHave fun!=3D0A=3D0A...James=3D0A=3D0AJames =3D0A> Freeman=
=3D0A=3D0A"All I s=3D
ay is by way of discourse, and nothing by way of =3D0A> advice.=3DA0 I=3D0A=
should=3D
not speak so boldly if it were my due to be =3D0A> believed."=3D0A-Michel =
de M=3D
ontaigne=3D0A=3D0A> href=3D3D"http://www.jamesfreemanstudio.com" target=3D3=
D_blank =3D
=3D0A> >http://www.jamesfreemanstudio.com=3D0A> href=3D3D"http://www.flickr=
.com/p=3D
hotos/jamesfreemanstudio/" target=3D3D_blank =3D0A> >http://www.flickr.com/=
phot=3D
os/jamesfreemanstudio/=3D0A> href=3D3D"http://www.jamesfreemanstudio.com/re=
sour=3D
ces" target=3D3D_blank =3D0A> >http://www.jamesfreemanstudio.com/resources=
=3D0A=3D
=3D0A=3D0A
Clyde Tullis on wed 23 jun 10
A Sawsall should do it. They do cause sparks though.
James Freeman on wed 23 jun 10
On Wed, Jun 23, 2010 at 7:25 AM, steve hoffman wrote=
:
> Before I working with any container with flammable fumes I purge it by
> running a gas motor's exhaust into it .Or fill it with water. It displace=
s
> the oxygen.
Great idea, Steve! I thought of using nitrogen, but dismissed the
idea due to cost. The exhaust idea never occurred to me. Very
clever!
Take care.
...James
James Freeman
"All I say is by way of discourse, and nothing by way of advice. I
should not speak so boldly if it were my due to be believed."
-Michel de Montaigne
http://www.jamesfreemanstudio.com
http://www.flickr.com/photos/jamesfreemanstudio/
http://www.jamesfreemanstudio.com/resources
steve hoffman on wed 23 jun 10
I cut 55 @ 275 gal. oil drums in half for fire pits and many other uses ,
using a demolition saw (chain saw with a wheel). U can rent them .
Before I working with any container with flammable fumes I purge it by
running a gas motor's exhaust into it .Or fill it with water. It displaces
the oxygen. This has also worked when I needed to do some welding on a
tank.
Use all safety precautions!
Steve
On Tue, Jun 22, 2010 at 11:02 PM, James Freeman <
jamesfreemanstudio@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Tue, Jun 22, 2010 at 10:37 PM, steve graber wrote=
:
> > i work at a place now that throws out 55 gallon drums every few months.
> clean ones that used to hold alcohol. you still have to cut the lid off
> (which i haven't started yet on the one i took home). i think i'll make
> another raku kiln one day. either that or another bar-b-q smoker thing.
> >
> > if anyone has tips or tricks on cutting, of if anyone wants one in the
> claremont, california areea drop me a line.
>
>
>
>
> Steve...
>
> The easiest and cleanest way to remove the top of the drum is with a
> tool called a "de-header". It is like a giant can opener. You can
> buy one here: http://www.amazon.com/Wesco-Drum-Deheader/dp/B000Z5E6DC
>
> If you don't want to spend the $50, a cutting torch will zip right
> through the thin steel, but I wouldn't do that on a drum from alcohol
> unless I was VERY sure that ALL of the fumes were long gone.
> Explosions can ruin your whole day. This is how I cut drums. Just
> did one a few days ago. It used to contain compressor oil. Sizzled a
> little, but that's all. ALL usual caveats apply!
>
> I once tries to dehead a drum with a cold chisel and a hammer. Bad
> idea. Took forever, and left a jagged, life-threatening mess.
>
> Have fun!
>
> ...James
>
> James Freeman
>
> "All I say is by way of discourse, and nothing by way of advice. I
> should not speak so boldly if it were my due to be believed."
> -Michel de Montaigne
>
> http://www.jamesfreemanstudio.com
> http://www.flickr.com/photos/jamesfreemanstudio/
> http://www.jamesfreemanstudio.com/resources
>
David Hendley on wed 23 jun 10
Maybe my fear is irrational, but I would never remove a lid
from a barrel with a cutting torch. The potential danger has
been drummed into my brain by my welding teacher,
textbooks, and how-to articles. They all say to never, ever
take a chance because fumes can linger for years and an
explosion can be fatal.
I regularly remove drum heads with a cold chisel and
hammer (I go through at least one trash barrel every year).
It takes about 10 or 15 minutes of rigorous work. Any
jagged edges can be easily hammered back against the
body of the barrel. Wear earplugs as well as goggles!
David Hendley
david@farmpots.com
http://www.farmpots.com
----- Original Message -----
> i work at a place now that throws out 55 gallon drums every few months.
> clean ones that used to hold alcohol. you still have to cut the lid off
> (which i haven't started yet on the one i took home). i think i'll make
> another raku kiln one day. either that or another bar-b-q smoker thing.
>
> if anyone has tips or tricks on cutting, of if anyone wants one in the
> claremont, california areea drop me a line.
phil on wed 23 jun 10
As long as it is not running rich...
Don't forget, Carbon Monoxide is flammible...
> On Wed, Jun 23, 2010 at 7:25 AM, steve hoffman
> wrote:
>
>> Before I working with any container with flammable fumes I purge it by
>> running a gas motor's exhaust into it .Or fill it with water. It
>> displaces
>> the oxygen.
David Woof on fri 25 jun 10
I think Ivor mentioned this deadly incident back in 06 in his warnings when=
=3D
this barrel cutting subject went round and around.=3D20
Archives are full and I don't want to spend time on repetition but this is =
=3D
serious!!!=3D20
=3D20
Read the archives!! some smart experienced people wrote some good stuff!!!
=3D20
So listen up folks=3D2C and fools soon to be dead or maimed for your disbel=
ie=3D
f or lack of attention.
=3D20
just one thing to add here: there may not be perceptible gasses until the h=
=3D
eat from a torch "awakens" and gassifies them from the metal surface=3D2C t=
he=3D
n boom.... as far as exhaust gasses=3D3B someone mentioned carbon monoxide=
a=3D
s flammable and so are unburned gasses from fuels and solvents in other for=
=3D
ms.=3D20
=3D20
Certainly a water hose is less fuss than rigging up an auto exhaust system =
=3D
to deliver it to the barrel!!! Water is the one totally safe method and if=
=3D
you are going to fill it 2/3 full=3D2C fill it full to the top.=3D20
I'm getting "old dog" practical here and if someone after being warned is s=
=3D
till going to act stupid I only then plead don't have an innocent and likel=
=3D
y ignorant loved one watching you do your dumb stuff. The man Ivor mention=
=3D
ed had his wife and son attend him helplessly while he died. They could ha=
=3D
ve also been killed or maimed.
=3D20
Woofin in Clarkdale=3D2C Az
=3D20
18. : Re: 55 gallon drum
Posted by: "ivor and olive lewis" iandol@WESTNET.COM.AU=3D20
Date: Wed Jun 23=3D2C 2010 11:21 am ((PDT))
To reinforce James Freeman note about removing the top=3D2C or base for a l=
ar=3D
ge
metal drum use a cold chisel=3D2C heavy duty shears or something that will =
no=3D
t
give sparks or a flame. Very little flammable gas is needed in an enclosed
space to be highly dangerous when ignited. If oxycuutting is the only
solution=3D2C fill the drum to the brim with water
About ten years ago a farmer local to Redhill was almost decapitated and
died before the ambulance could get to the scene when a drum he was dealing
with=3D2C using an angle grinder=3D2C exploded.
Take great care in unfamiliar circumstances.
Best regards=3D2C
Ivor Lewis=3D2C
REDHILL=3D2C
South=3D20
=3D20
=3D20
_________________________________________________________________
The New Busy is not the old busy. Search=3D2C chat and e-mail from your inb=
ox=3D
.
http://www.windowslive.com/campaign/thenewbusy?ocid=3D3DPID28326::T:WLMTAGL=
:O=3D
N:WL:en-US:WM_HMP:042010_3=3D
phil on fri 25 jun 10
Hi David,
Oh yeah...'The Water Method' would be easy and safe for anyone...just
filling 7/8ths would be plenty...and one's Back to the Wind at that.
Too, regardless, one never knows what a 55 Gallon Steel Drum or Barrel may
have contained...Chloridane ( Mmmm! Smells 'spicey!' ) , Hexane ( ...ahhhh,
refreshing! Nice clear Sinuses! ) , Benzine, Dioxin, Tributyltin,
S-2-(diisopropylamino)ethyl O-ethyl methylphosphonothioate aka 'vx', ( "Hey
honey, come look! Some kinda pretty 'green' slime in this Drum! ) or Lord
knows what weird or exotic Chemicals of major 'seriousness', whose residual
or fumes could mess with you pretty bad, let alone once heating up and
releasing them right under your nose.
Oye...( shudder...)
Been there, done that...
Lol...
Phil
Lv
----- Original Message -----
From: "David Woof"
I think Ivor mentioned this deadly incident back in 06 in his warnings when
this barrel cutting subject went round and around.
Archives are full and I don't want to spend time on repetition but this is
serious!!!
Read the archives!! some smart experienced people wrote some good stuff!!!
So listen up folks, and fools soon to be dead or maimed for your disbelief
or lack of attention.
just one thing to add here: there may not be perceptible gasses until the
heat from a torch "awakens" and gassifies them from the metal surface, then
boom.... as far as exhaust gasses; someone mentioned carbon monoxide as
flammable and so are unburned gasses from fuels and solvents in other forms=
.
Certainly a water hose is less fuss than rigging up an auto exhaust system
to deliver it to the barrel!!! Water is the one totally safe method and if
you are going to fill it 2/3 full, fill it full to the top.
I'm getting "old dog" practical here and if someone after being warned is
still going to act stupid I only then plead don't have an innocent and
likely ignorant loved one watching you do your dumb stuff. The man Ivor
mentioned had his wife and son attend him helplessly while he died. They
could have also been killed or maimed.
Woofin in Clarkdale, Az
Carl Cravens on sat 26 jun 10
On 06/26/2010 01:23 AM, phil wrote:
> ( "Hey honey, come look! Some kinda pretty 'green' slime in this
> Drum! )
Heh. In my case, that was Mt Dew syrup. :)
('twasn't a metal drum, but plastic. Those are harder to come by since the=
local bottling plant closed.)
--
Carl D Cravens (raven@phoenyx.net)
Bad Command! Bad, Bad Command! Sit! Staaaaay...
Sam or Mary Yancy on sat 26 jun 10
If you want a open mouthed drum you can BUY a cleaned one for about $25 aro=
=3D
und here.
When I was painting motorcycles many years ago I used to acquire many 55 ga=
=3D
l drums - had lacquer thinner, acetone. and other solvents including some v=
=3D
ery caustic dipping paint strippers - (One reason that I have COPD). I alwa=
=3D
ys brought them to a barrel cleaning place to be cleaned and reused.
=3DA0=3DA0=3DA0=3DA0=3DA0=3DA0=3DA0=3DA0=3DA0=3DA0=3DA0 Why take a chance? =
And this is from a do =3D
it myself person.
Many years ago, I met a Englishman who was horribly burned. He had been a '=
=3D
desert rat" fighting the Germans in WW2 in Africa. He said that water was s=
=3D
o scarce that they washed their clothes in gasoline. Anyway during the fore=
=3D
word and back attacks they came across a abandoned fuel dump with empty bar=
=3D
rels of fuel oil that has been in the desert for YEARS. Since where they we=
=3D
re had water, he decided to cut one open to make a bathtub for his group.=
=3D
=3DA0remember - this was a open diesel fuel barrel that had been in=3DA0the=
=3DA0d=3D
esert for several years. Anyway as soon as he started to torch cut the barr=
=3D
el, it exploded and=3DA0the resulting metal and blast mutilated him. I know=
o=3D
f a couple of other cases in my experience.
=3DA0
PLEASE _ IT IS NOT WORTH IT. LEAVE IT TO THE EXPERTS.=3DA0If you need a=3DA=
0ope=3D
n mouth barrel BUY ONE.. Sam in=3DA0Daly City. Ca=3DA0=3DA0=3DA0
Joseph Herbert on sun 27 jun 10
Phil and others have written on the subject. It is a fact that the outside
of a barrel quickly weathers until all the identification tags, warning
labels, DOT placards, etc are gone. During that time whatever the contents
were has not changed, except for the worse. Just to add a little thought,
chlorinated hydrocarbons (CFC's are not usually found in barrels) can, when
exposed to a heated surface, produce phosgene gas. This gas gained some
fame in WWI and infamy in WWII. Try to find a source that allows you to
identify the former contents of the barrel before you decide to risk your
life and limb for the sake of a "cheap" resource.
Joe
Joseph Herbert
Training Developer
phil on sun 27 jun 10
Hi Joe,
Oh yea...for sure...
Those paper Labels or stencilling or whatever, fade or weather with UV or
when out
doors...
A friend of mine and I opened a Recycling Business in 1970, or maybe it was
1971. Anyway, we used lots of 55 Gallon Drums, we probably had a hundred of
them, and used to go out scrounging
not only for Drums, but, for anything else of interest.
This is when I first began feeling amused with the adventures of prior-use
industrial things, containers, abandonded materials, and so on.
There were nice enough ready to go Drums we passed on! too...Lol.
Knowing how to 'sniff' without breathing anything 'in'...is a good skill to
have...
We never bothered with any Barrels, Drums only for what we were doing.
I remember various images, photographs I have seen through the years.
One, a group of 55 Gallon Barrels, sitting on the ground in a normal
way...maybe a few dozen
of them.
All empty, but, they'd been 'full' when set there. They did not get used in
a timely way when they had been delivered, they sat, on the dirt, and slowl=
y
rusted out from the bottoms, and drained their contents into the Soil.
They had held 'DDT', shipped to some slightly arid African Country, when we
got the Ban going over here.
Likewise 'AEC' used to put everything in 55 Gallon Drums and Barrels, and,
let 'em sit and rot and rust through, or, warehouse them, or bury them
shallowly, lose track of
them, or their sub-contractors would, etc, or load Barges and push them off
the sides once out at Sea a 1/2 mile or so.
A story also, uhhhh, who was it...Richard L. Kuklinski I think, 'The Ice
Man'...anyway, some guy pissed him off, so, he killed the guy, folded him
up, and stuffed him into a 55 Gallon Drum, and,
left the Drum sitting behind a local Bar there. The Drum sat there for
years, and, one day, finally...disappeared.
Drums are so easy to find, I never saw any reason to cut a Lid off a Barrel
to get a make-do 'Drum'.
Complimentary use is also a factor - if a good Barrel had held Acetone or
MEK or Benzine or Hexane or Alcohol or Lacquier Thinner, and, one wished to
use it to store Gasolene, all is well...they are compatible...any residu
would merely meld and be no worse than what is already in Gasolene anyway,
for doing so. Might even get slightly better milliage...Lol...
If to store Potable Water, not so compatible...of course.
Endless...
We also used to use Cardboard 55 Gallon Drums, and, we'd get those from
'Spice Islands' and Ooooooo, they were nice, had previously held ground
Cinnimon, Cloves, Garlic Powder, Thyme, Sage, Terragon, always a pleasure
with those....yummy...
Phil
Lv
----- Original Message -----
From: "Joseph Herbert"
> Phil and others have written on the subject. It is a fact that the
> outside
> of a barrel quickly weathers until all the identification tags, warning
> labels, DOT placards, etc are gone. During that time whatever the
> contents
> were has not changed, except for the worse. Just to add a little thought=
,
> chlorinated hydrocarbons (CFC's are not usually found in barrels) can,
> when
> exposed to a heated surface, produce phosgene gas. This gas gained some
> fame in WWI and infamy in WWII. Try to find a source that allows you to
> identify the former contents of the barrel before you decide to risk your
> life and limb for the sake of a "cheap" resource.
>
> Joe
>
> Joseph Herbert
> Training Developer
Eric Hansen on sun 27 jun 10
The EPA-approved hazmat barrel has a removable lid, gloss black on the
outside, and matte iron red (like Golden Gate bridge) on the inside. They
are usually new & unused when you get them & they are fine barrels. I don't
know what they cost you, but the unused EPA barrel with removable lid would
be my choice. They are very heavy steel too, heavier than the average
chemical barrel.
h a n s e n , e r i c
On Sat, Jun 26, 2010 at 11:11 AM, Sam or Mary Yancy wro=
te:
> If you want a open mouthed drum you can BUY a cleaned one for about $25
> around here.
> When I was painting motorcycles many years ago I used to acquire many 55
> gal
>
David Woof on mon 28 jun 10
Phil=3D2C=3D20
I always get a kick out of the way you think and say things=3D2C so what th=
e =3D
hell! 7/8 or full? have it your way with your barrels=3D2C but when you tea=
ch=3D
or advise you must always consider that the "impossible" outcome will beco=
=3D
me possible for someone. Take no chances with chances because as any insur=
=3D
ance attorney or actuarial will tell you=3D2C the devil hides in these unli=
ke=3D
ly and "acts of God" details. I certainly would not wish to blame god for =
=3D
my negligent stupidity. Interestingly there are more laws appearing that =
=3D
address and punish people for gross stupidity. Gotts to love it!!!
=3D20
Some barrels should not be cut because of the list of toxic stew you just s=
=3D
ummarized.=3D20
=3D20
I make sure to get get barrels that still have the label=3D2C or I know the=
s=3D
ource=3D2C and if relatively non toxic=3D2C Phil (fill) them with water to =
the =3D
top and cut happily away by the means and method at my disposal.(I splash o=
=3D
ut a bit of water if my torch sputters).=3D20
A hammered chisel cut can cause sparks as well as the saws=3D2C grinders=3D=
2C c=3D
utoff wheels=3D2C plasma cutters and torches.=3D20
=3D20
Where would one in good conscience dump the contents or polluted water fill=
=3D
from a barrel that contained toxic material? We all live up hill or up wi=
=3D
nd from someone!!!
=3D20
If it doesn't interfere with my design needs=3D2C leaving an inch or so of =
ba=3D
rrel top still connected to the rim greatly strengthens the open end of the=
=3D
barrel.
=3D20
Disclaimer: I speak only from my limited experience as if participating i=
=3D
n a friendly discussion and do not offer it as advice to anyone. Reader=
=3D
=3D2C seek advice and assistance from a professional licensed to cut barrel=
s!=3D
! =3D20
=3D20
David Woof...Clarkdale=3D2C Arizona......had a u-joint go out in Phoenix to=
da=3D
y=3D2C 115 degrees and hauling a load of 0M4 etc. ???Abandon truck until=
M=3D
onday and have a mechanic do it by next Friday?... or... buy a couple wrenc=
=3D
hes from walMart=3D2C remove the offending rear drive shaft=3D2C shift to 4=
whe=3D
el drive and carefully let the front wheels pull for home? what would you =
=3D
do? well I made the 120 miles and up hill 3=3D2C500 feet elevation change=
t=3D
o home=3D2C back wheels just happily following along holding up the load. =
I=3D
t took longer in WalMart than it did to remove the eight bolts and clean my=
=3D
hands. A good day after all is said. Now over a glass of wine I'm goin=
=3D
g to call my fav cougar and blow some good Irish silver tongue blarney in h=
=3D
er cute little ear!!!
=3D20
See: we can do a FB-Twitter-Blog on Clayart!!!! and reach thousands of clay=
=3D
minded "friends" in seconds.
_____________________________________________________________________=3D20
Date: Fri=3D2C 25 Jun 2010 23:23:53 -0700
From: phil
Subject: Re: 55 gallon drum
Hi David=3D2C
Oh yeah...'The Water Method' would be easy and safe for anyone...just
filling 7/8ths would be plenty...and one's Back to the Wind at that.
Too=3D2C regardless=3D2C one never knows what a 55 Gallon Steel Drum or Bar=
rel =3D
may
have contained...Chloridane ( Mmmm! Smells 'spicey!' ) =3D2C Hexane ( ...ah=
hh=3D
h=3D2C
refreshing! Nice clear Sinuses! ) =3D2C Benzine=3D2C Dioxin=3D2C Tributylti=
n=3D2C
S-2-(diisopropylamino)ethyl O-ethyl methylphosphonothioate aka 'vx'=3D2C ( =
"H=3D
ey
honey=3D2C come look! Some kinda pretty 'green' slime in this Drum! ) or Lo=
rd
knows what weird or exotic Chemicals of major 'seriousness'=3D2C whose resi=
du=3D
al
or fumes could mess with you pretty bad=3D2C let alone once heating up and
releasing them right under your nose.
=3D20
Oye...( shudder...)
Been there=3D2C done that...
=3D20
=3D20
Lol...
Phil
Lv
=3D20
=3D20
_________________________________________________________________
Hotmail is redefining busy with tools for the New Busy. Get more from your =
=3D
inbox.
http://www.windowslive.com/campaign/thenewbusy?ocid=3D3DPID28326::T:WLMTAGL=
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N:WL:en-US:WM_HMP:042010_2=3D
phil on tue 29 jun 10
Hi David,
Below...amid...
----- Original Message -----
From: "David Woof"
> Phil,
> I always get a kick out of the way you think and say things, so what the
> hell! 7/8 or full? have it your way with your barrels,
> but when you teach or advise you must always consider that the
> "impossible" outcome will become possible for someone.
> Take no chances with chances because as any insurance attorney or
> actuarial will tell you, the devil hides in these unlikely
>and "acts of God" details. I certainly would not wish to blame god for my
>negligent stupidity. Interestingly there are more
> laws appearing that address and punish people for gross stupidity. Gotts
> to love it!!!Oh, okay, 15/16ths then...
Ohhhh...there is always room to learn, or, learn more.
I always had access to Drums of Barrels if I needed one of either, so
cutting or modifying one to make a poor version of the other, never was
necessary, nor
have I ever wished to make a Bar-B-Que.
Just been around others who had or did.
No one can cover every possibly contingency, let alone, in five or eight
sentences.
Lol...
If to be using a Cutting Torch...then as one please I suppose.
Or 7/8ths but with Dry Ice tossed in.
Or 'Full'...
Or 7/8ths but with a Shop Vac Hose blowing a positive pressure Air Flow int=
o
one Bung Hole, venting out the other...
Depends on the Molecules, but, if from Alcohol or Acetone or the likes, wit=
h
open Bung Holes, and 7/8ths full of Water, I do not see how anything
remarkable could happen if some old 'flamible' Molecules cook out of the
top-most portion and were to flash...it'd just be a lttle soft "Mooof", and
no big deal.
Too, I was kinda getting mixed up with memories of a place a couple doors
down ( long gone now ) who used to repair Gas Tanks from Cars and Trucks an=
d
so on, Old Tanks which had got lots of 'pin holes' in their bottoms and so
on, and they'd Acid Wash them, then, open Flame Soldered them and or
Soldered Patches on.
They filled the Tanks about 7/8ths, maybe a litle more...and they needed to
have an Air Space in the Tank for the Steel to get hot enough. Maybe they
threw in some Dry Ice also ( I would, for that...) but not that I ever saw.
If the they'd filled them up full, there'd be no way for the Torch Flame to
heat the Steel enough for the Solder to flow.
I never saw anyone Torch Cut a Barrel lid off with the Barrel filled up wit=
h
Water, to know if the Torch would manage alright, but, I guess it would.
There are exceptions to any generality, which is part of why generalities
are so much fun.
> Some barrels should not be cut because of the list of toxic stew you just
> summarized.
Yeah, or, as may be...or if one even knows at all of what had been in there=
.
Some nasty things are odorless and colorless, so, kinda hard to tell with
those if any residu is present or in the 'pores' of the Steel.
So tell me, if someone obligingly fills a Drum with Water, to cut the Lid
off with a Torch...than makes a Raku Kiln out of it, where, the uncut 'end'
is
'up'...the
Molecules will not cook out then, once it is being fired???
And could they not 'flash'?
Lol...
> I make sure to get get barrels that still have the label, or I know the
> source, and if relatively non toxic, Phil (fill) them
> with water to the top and cut happily away by the means and method at my
> disposal.(I splash out a bit of water if my torch sputters).
Well...yes, I imagine it would....which was some of why I settled on
7/8ths, but, as is so often the case, I err on being generous.
15/16ths is available if anyone prefers to elect it.
33/32nds, also.
> A hammered chisel cut can cause sparks as well as the saws, grinders,
> cutoff wheels, plasma cutters and torches.
How about is one hold a 'sparkler' into one of the open Bungs, as a light
source, for seeing inside the Barrel?
( Sorry...feeling playful...)
> Where would one in good conscience dump the contents or polluted water
> fill from a barrel that contained toxic material?
Well, it would kind of depend on what it was, wouldn't it?
If a warm or hot day, and a Drum had contained Alcohol, or Acetone or
Benzine or Hexane or anything Aeromatic and fast evaporating, just dump the
Water on the grass or in the Street or in some Gravel and what
minute amount of Alcohol or whatnot as may be bound to the Water, will
merely evaporate
with no harm to anything.
Just deal with things according to the actual specifics of the actual
thing...and what it does or will do.
I thought we already covered the part about not electing Barrels which
appear to have contained truely nasy chemicals?
> We all live up hill or up wind from someone!!!
More likely, down hill and down wind...
> If it doesn't interfere with my design needs, leaving an inch or so of
> barrel top still connected to the rim greatly strengthens the open end of
> the barrel.
Yes.
Or just get a length of wide Steel Pipe, and fit whatever 'ends' on one
needs.
> Disclaimer: I speak only from my limited experience as if participating
> in a friendly discussion and do not offer it as
> advice to anyone. Reader, seek advice and assistance from a professiona=
l
> licensed to cut barrels!!
It's just a friendly and casual conversation...not a Doctoral Thesis or OSH=
A
manual of protocol.
> David Woof...Clarkdale, Arizona......had a u-joint go out in Phoenix
> today, 115 degrees and hauling a load of 0M4 etc.
> ???Abandon truck until Monday and have a mechanic do it by next
> Friday?... or... buy a couple wrenches from walMart,
> remove the offending rear drive shaft, shift to 4 wheel drive and
> carefully let the front wheels pull for home? what would you do?
If it is an open Drive Line, I would go to 'Pep Boys' and buy a new
Universal Joint,
and, install it.
> well I made the 120 miles and up hill 3,500 feet elevation change to home=
,
> back wheels just happily following along holding up the load.
Oh, okay...well, nothing wrong with that! Well done..!
> It took longer in WalMart than it did to remove the eight bolts and clean
> my hands. A good day after all is said.
> Now over a glass of wine I'm going to call my fav cougar and blow some
> good Irish silver tongue blarney in her cute little ear!!!
Sounds good...
Glad that worked out so well!
Thanks for the fun on Barrel adventure things...I love stuff like that.
Best wishes!
Phil
Lv
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