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## i am math impaired....

### Kris Bliss on wed 30 jun 10

i have a funery jar to make, and after checking james freemans site=
etc...
i know i need 150 cubic inches of volume.

but .... damn , how big is that?

thanks,
kris bliss

### figglywig@COMCAST.NET on thu 1 jul 10

I googled cube root of 150, and got this=3D20

cube root(150) =3D3D 5.31329285=3D20

Gail, Indy=3D20

----- Original Message -----=3D20
From: "Kris Bliss" =3D20
To: Clayart@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG=3D20
Sent: Wednesday, June 30, 2010 10:00:01 PM=3D20
Subject: I am math impaired....=3D20

=3DC2=3DA0=3DC2=3DA0 =3DC2=3DA0 =3DC2=3DA0 =3DC2=3DA0i have a funery jar to=
make, and after che=3D
cking james freemans site etc...=3D20
=3DC2=3DA0=3DC2=3DA0 =3DC2=3DA0 =3DC2=3DA0 =3DC2=3DA0i know i need 150 cubi=
c inches of volume.=3D
=3D20

=3DC2=3DA0=3DC2=3DA0 =3DC2=3DA0 =3DC2=3DA0 =3DC2=3DA0but .... damn , how bi=
g is that?=3D20

=3DC2=3DA0=3DC2=3DA0 =3DC2=3DA0 =3DC2=3DA0 =3DC2=3DA0thanks,=3D20
=3DC2=3DA0=3DC2=3DA0 =3DC2=3DA0 =3DC2=3DA0 =3DC2=3DA0kris bliss=3D20

### Jeff Jeff on thu 1 jul 10

Hey Kris,

150 cu.in. is about the size of a upright Kleenex box. 5 x 5 x 6

The deceased weighed about 150 lbs. I take it?

Jeff Longtin
Memorial Impressions
Minneapolis

In a message dated 7/1/2010 10:57:47 A.M. Central Daylight Time,
blisspots@GCI.NET writes:

i have a funery jar to make, and after checking james freemans site etc...
i know i need 150 cubic inches of volume.

but .... damn , how big is that?

thanks,
kris bliss

### Ted Fussell on thu 1 jul 10

--=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3DAVGMAIL-2A6C0C13=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
Content-Type: text/plain;
format=3Dflowed;
charset=3D"iso-8859-1";
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

How big that is depends on the shape.
A cylinder, 6" diameter, would need to be 5 1/3" tall.
Visualize about half the length of a roll of paper towels.

A rectangular box shape could be 5" wide x 5" tall x 6" long.
Visualize square box of tissues.

These are INTERNAL finished dimensions.

height)
For the box: length x width x height.

The one I made for my Mom's cremins was the cylindrical shape, about 8"
tall, not including the lid.

Thanks,
Ted Fussell
Aiken, SC

----- Original Message -----
From: "Kris Bliss"
To:
Sent: Wednesday, June 30, 2010 10:00 PM
Subject: I am math impaired....

> i have a funery jar to make, and after checking james freemans sit=
e
> etc...
> i know i need 150 cubic inches of volume.
>
> but .... damn , how big is that?
>
> thanks,
> kris bliss

---------------------------------------------------------------------------=
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Content-Type: multipart/alternative;
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=3D"

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No virus found in this outgoing message.
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:=3D
35:00

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--=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3DAVGMAIL-2A6C0C13=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D--

### steve graber on thu 1 jul 10

pick your diameter, find the height.=3DA0 =3D0A=3D0Aassuming you do a 5 inc=
h diam=3D
eter (inside) cylinder, make sure you get 7.6 inches of height.=3DA0 =3D0A=
=3D0AH =3D
=3D3D 4V/piD^2=3D0A=3DA0=3D0Aheight =3D3D 4 times the volume, divided by pi=
times the=3D
diameter squared.=3DA0 =3D0A=3DA0=3D0Athis comes from the=3DA0calculation =
of the are=3D
a of a circle times the length to get the volume.=3DA0 pi times the diamete=
r =3D
squared is the area.=3DA0 times the length (or height) of the cylinder to g=
et=3D
the volume.=3DA0 =3D0A=3DA0=3D0A=3DA0=3D0Avolume =3D3D 150in^3=3D0Adia hei=
ght=3DA0=3DA0=3DA0=3DA0=3D
=3DA0=3DA0=3DA0=3DA0=3DA0 =3D0A3=3DA0 =3DA0=3DA021.2=3DA0=3DA0=3DA0=3DA0=3D=
A0=3DA0=3DA0=3DA0=3DA0=3DA0=3DA0 =3D0A4=3DA0=3D
=3DA0=3DA011.9=3DA0=3DA0=3DA0=3DA0=3DA0=3DA0=3DA0=3DA0=3DA0=3DA0=3DA0 =3D0=
A5=3DA0 =3DA0=3DA07.6=3DA0 =3D0A6 =3DA0=3D
=3DA0=3DA05.3=3DA0 =3D0A7=3DA0 =3DA0=3DA03.9=3DA0 =3D0A=3D0A=3D0A.....plus =
shrinkage......=3D0A=3D0A=3D
=3D0A=3DA0Steve Graber, Graber's Pottery, Inc=3D0AClaremont, California USA=
=3D0AThe=3D
Steve Tool - for awesome texture on pots! =3D0Awww.graberspottery.com stev=
e@=3D
graberspottery.com =3D0A=3D0A=3D0AOn Laguna Clay's website=3D0Ahttp://www.l=
agunacla=3D
y.com/blogs/ =3D0A=3D0A=3D0A=3D0A----- Original Message ----=3D0A> From: Kr=
is Bliss <=3D
blisspots@GCI.NET>=3D0A> To: Clayart@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG=3D0A> Sent: Wed, June=
30,=3D
2010 7:00:01 PM=3D0A> Subject: I am math impaired....=3D0A> =3D0A> =3DA0 =
=3DA0 =3DA0 =3D
=3DA0 i have a funery jar to make, and after checking =3D0A> james freemans=
sit=3D
e etc...=3D0A=3DA0 =3DA0 =3DA0 =3DA0 i know i need 150 =3D0A> cubic inches =
of volume.=3D
=3D0A=3D0A=3DA0 =3DA0 =3DA0 =3DA0 but .... damn , how =3D0A> big is that?=
=3D0A=3D0A=3DA0 =3DA0 =3D
=3DA0 =3DA0 thanks,=3D0A=3DA0 =3DA0 =3DA0 =3D0A> =3DA0 kris bliss=3D0A=3D0A=
=3D0A

### Janine in Tacoma on thu 1 jul 10

I have to convert unfamiliar number to familiar ones.. so being familiar=
=3D
with=3D20
the volume of cups and quarts...1 quart =3D3D 57.75 cubic inches. Thus 150=
=3D
cubic=3D20
inches =3D3D 2.597 quarts, or about 9 cups. There are loads of converters =
=3D
on the=3D20
web. You can convert to anything that's familiar to you.

Best of luck!
Janine

### phil on thu 1 jul 10

Hi Kriss,

Well, a Litre is right on to about 61 Cubic Inches.

2-1/2 Litres then, would be 152.5 Cubic Inches.

I do not know the proportions of the form you have in mind, but, if you loo=
k
around and find a prospective Can or Jar as guide, pouring in a tad under
2-1/2 Litres of Water, will show you where the 150 Cubic Inches is at with
that shape/proportion test.

Phil
Lv

----- Original Message -----
From: "Kris Bliss"

> i have a funery jar to make, and after checking james freemans sit=
e
> etc...
> i know i need 150 cubic inches of volume.
>
> but .... damn , how big is that?
>
> thanks,
> kris bliss

### Kris Bliss on thu 1 jul 10

THank you all so much !!

Kris in alaska, where there is a big fat black bear hanging out
in the neighborhood. Last evening in MY yard !

-----Original Message-----
From: Clayart [mailto:Clayart@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG]On Behalf Of Kris Bliss
Sent: Wednesday, June 30, 2010 6:00 PM
To: Clayart@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG
Subject: I am math impaired....

i have a funery jar to make, and after checking james freemans site
etc...
i know i need 150 cubic inches of volume.

but .... damn , how big is that?

thanks,
kris bliss

### James Freeman on thu 1 jul 10

Kris...

The pot volume calculator on the "Resources" page of my website can be
used to back into the answer you need.
www.jamesfreemanstudio.com/resources

To solve your problem, we first need to decide on the relative
proportions of your vessel (the relationship of height to width, or in
our case diameter). Let's assume you have decided on classic
proportioning system favored by the ancient Greeks and by mother
nature. The Golden Mean is roughly 1.618 to 1, which means that the
height will be 1.618 times the diameter. Note: You may use any
proportions you find pleasing. There is no requirement to use any
given system. 3:2 or 2:1 work, or whatever floats your boat.

An easy way to come up with proportions is to simply draw a rectangle
that you find to be visually balanced and pleasing. Measure the width
and the height. Divide the height by the width to yield your personal
proportioning system. For example, if one starts with a standard 3 x
5 file card, one finds that 5 divided by 3 equals 1.667 to 1. As an
aside, notice how close this is to the Golden Mean. It is curious
that in a large number of cases, when we ask a person with a
reasonably good eye for proportion to draw a pleasing rectangle, the
resulting proportion will be very close to the Golden Mean. It seems
to be some deep limbic thing that is simply hard wired into our brain.
Cool stuff, but I digress.

Now that we have decided on proportions, we have to make a guess as to
dimensions in order to have a starting point. We know that a box 5" x
5" x 6" is 150 cubic inches (5 x 5 =3D3D 25, 150 / 25 =3D3D 6), so let's st=
art
with a guess of a 5" internal diameter. Using the Golden Mean, 5 x
1.618 gives us a height of 8.09 inches. We can plug those inside
dimensions into the "inside dimensions" fields of the top, "final
dimensions" section of the pot volume calculator. Let's assume that
we want the pot to be thick and sturdy, so we will go with 1/4" walls.
We also plug this dimension (.25") into the final dimensions section.
If we know the fired shrinkage of our clay, we can enter that figure.
If not, the spreadsheet defaults to 12%, which is a reasonable
estimate for a stoneware type clay.

As soon as our final dimensions are entered, the spreadsheet
calculates the internal volume. In our case, our first guess yielded
a volume of 158 cubic inches. Personally, I would stop right there.
I think it would be better to have a little more room in the jar than
grandma needs rather than a little more grandma than we have room for
in the jar. In any case, once one determines the volume of our
initial guess, the dimensions can be tweaked upward or downward as
necessary, keeping the proportions constant or not, as one chooses.
For instance, one could drop the diameter to 4.75", thereby dropping
the height to 4.75 x 1.618, or 7.68". This yields a volume of 136
cubic inches.

Once you have settled on the desired fired interior dimensions, the
pot volume calculator gives you the required wet outside and inside
dimensions, and a rough approximation of the weight of clay required
to throw the form. First, enter the desired diameter of the top
opening of the jar. If we want a straight walled cylinder, just enter
the finished inside diameter as the opening diameter. If you plan to
neck in the opening, enter whatever dimension you desire. In our
case, the calculator tells us that our fired 5 x 8 interior
dimensioned straight walled cylinder with 1/4" fired walls requires a
wet outside diameter of about 6 1/4", a wet height of roughly 9 3/4
inches, and wet wall thickness of .28 inches, or just a hair thicker
than 1/4". It also tells us that this cylinder will require roughly 3
3/4 pounds of clay, so we need to start with something more than that
to account for trimming, loss of clay while throwing, et cetera.

Of course, things in real life are never quite so simple. As it is
doubtful that you will make a simple, straight sided cylinder, you
need to fudge the dimensions a bit to accommodate your design. If,
for example, you were making a classic ginger jar shape, one could
probably assume that the bulged out parts would be made up for by the
necked in parts, so would likely need little adjustment in dimensions.
If one were making an exaggerated shape like the Greek amphora-like
forms I throw, with their very small feet in relation to the major
diameter, one would have to scale the entire vessel up a fair bit in
order to have enough volume in the bulbous top portion of the vessel
to make up for all of the lost volume in the very small foot. With
this in mind, one should use the figures determined by the pot volume
calculator as a starting point and a rough guide. As stated earlier,
when making a cinerary (cremation) urn, I would err on the side of
excess volume rather than take a chance of having left over grandma.
Also, feel free to round the wet dimensions. This is clay, after all,
not precision machinery.

I hope this explanation helps. Let me know if you need any clarification.

All the best.

...James

James Freeman

"All I say is by way of discourse, and nothing by way of advice. I
should not speak so boldly if it were my due to be believed."
-Michel de Montaigne

http://www.jamesfreemanstudio.com
http://www.flickr.com/photos/jamesfreemanstudio/
http://www.jamesfreemanstudio.com/resources

On Wed, Jun 30, 2010 at 10:00 PM, Kris Bliss wrote:
> =3DA0 =3DA0 =3DA0 =3DA0i have a funery jar to make, and after checking ja=
mes free=3D
mans site etc...
> =3DA0 =3DA0 =3DA0 =3DA0i know i need 150 cubic inches of volume.
>
> =3DA0 =3DA0 =3DA0 =3DA0but .... damn , how big is that?
>
> =3DA0 =3DA0 =3DA0 =3DA0thanks,
> =3DA0 =3DA0 =3DA0 =3DA0kris bliss
>

### Lee Love on thu 1 jul 10

Calculate the volume of a cylinder here:

http://www.calculatoredge.com/enggcalc/volume.html#cylinder

5" diameter
8" tall
=3D3D 157.14 C"

--=3D20
--
Lee, a Mashiko potter in Minneapolis
http://mingeisota.blogspot.com/

=3D93Observe the wonders as they occur around you. Don't claim them. Feel
the artistry moving through and be silent.=3D94 --Rumi

### Steve Slatin on fri 2 jul 10

Steve -- done right, described wrong.

It's pi times radius squared, not diameter
squared. Else excellent description.

Steve S

--- On Thu, 7/1/10, steve graber wrote:

> pick your diameter, find the
> height.=3DA0=3D20
>=3D20
> assuming you do a 5 inch diameter (inside) cylinder, make
> sure you get 7.6 inches of height.=3DA0=3D20
>=3D20
> H =3D3D 4V/piD^2
> =3DA0
> height =3D3D 4 times the volume, divided by pi times the
> diameter squared.=3DA0=3D20
=3D0A=3D0A=3D0A

### ivor and olive lewis on fri 2 jul 10

Dear Kris Bliss,

As a former Remedial Mathematics Teacher I appreciate your situation.

Suspecting that, as an Artist, you wish to be a little more adventurous wit=
h
your design and go beyond a cubical box or a plain upright cylinder, a
sphere that is about seven inches across its internal diameter will give yo=
u
what you require. Throwing to Eight Inches inside diameter will allow for
drying and firing shrinkage.

Best regards,

Ivor Lewis,
REDHILL,
South Australia

### steve graber on fri 2 jul 10

diameter area equations are=3DA0both pi radius squared;=3DA0OR pi diameter =
squa=3D
red=3DA0divided by 4.=3DA0 both approaches get the same answer, but the use=
of =3D
the diameter instead of the radius is more handy and more available in alot=
=3D
of applications.=3DA0=3DA0=3D0A=3D0A=3DA0Steve Graber, Graber's Pottery, I=
nc=3D0AClare=3D
mont, California USA=3D0AThe Steve Tool - for awesome texture on pots! =3D0=
Awww=3D
.graberspottery.com steve@graberspottery.com =3D0A=3D0A=3D0AOn Laguna Clay'=
s webs=3D
ite=3D0Ahttp://www.lagunaclay.com/blogs/ =3D0A=3D0A=3D0A=3D0A----- Original=
Message -=3D
---=3D0A> From: Steve Slatin =3D0A> To: Clayart@LSV=
.CER=3D
AMICS.ORG; steve graber =3D0A> Sent: Fri, July 2, 2010 =
9:=3D
29:30 AM=3D0A> Subject: Re: I am math impaired....=3D0A> =3D0A> Steve -- do=
ne rig=3D
ht, described wrong.=3D0A=3D0AIt's pi times radius squared, not =3D0A> diam=
eter=3D
=3D0Asquared.=3DA0 Else excellent description.=3D0A=3D0ASteve =3D0A> S=3D0A=
=3D0A=3D0A=3D0A=3D0A=3D
--- On Thu, 7/1/10, steve graber <> ymailto=3D3D"mailto:slgraber@YAHOO.COM"=
=3D
=3D0A> href=3D3D"mailto:slgraber@YAHOO.COM">slgraber@YAHOO.COM> wrote:=3D0A=
=3D0A> =3D
=3D0A> pick your diameter, find the=3D0A> height.=3DA0 =3D0A> =3D0A> assumi=
ng you do =3D
=3D0A> a 5 inch diameter (inside) cylinder, make=3D0A> sure you get 7.6 inc=
hes =3D
of =3D0A> height.=3DA0 =3D0A> =3D0A> H =3D3D 4V/piD^2=3D0A> =3DA0=3D0A> hei=
ght =3D3D 4 times =3D
the =3D0A> volume, divided by pi times the=3D0A> diameter squared.=3DA0 =3D=
0A=3D0A=3D0A=3D