gary navarre on mon 26 jul 10
Well so hey Crew,=3D0A=3D0A Mom was the first to say something about trying=
ano=3D
ther firing in the Autumn or next Spring if the results of the first two we=
=3D
re so unexpected and it might take me a while to accept something I've not =
=3D
seen myself make until now. After doing Art For All I left the priced piece=
=3D
s packed and set them up out of the way in the rafters along with a bunch o=
=3D
f the under-fired pots. Then it seems like I took a good long snooze after =
=3D
running a 6 year marathon or finishing one of those degrees I wish someone =
=3D
would give me if I had the money. That was a good thing to do because every=
=3D
time I got out of bed it seemed like it was raining and kept raining every=
=3D
day for the last 2 months so working in the woods or on the kiln wasn't ha=
=3D
ppening until now so I started a new album ...=3D0A=3D0Ahttp://public.fotki=
.com=3D
/GindaUP/ca/kpap/uphwfkl3/=3D0A=3D0A Their are some issues I need to think =
abou=3D
t before the next fire the main being how to keep the front from getting to=
=3D
hot before the tail can catch up (^13<^4) The only suggestion I've had so =
=3D
far is to cover the chamber with 8-10" dirt, fireclay, straw, and Portland =
=3D
cement to even it out but I have a few problems with that mix. I think it w=
=3D
ould be better to invest in a roll or two more of ceramic blanket ($200) an=
=3D
d a pallet of good IFB ($?) instead of something I might leave behind if I =
=3D
need to move the kiln (ya right). =3D0A=3D0A One thing I decided to change =
is a=3D
dd more room to the Bourry box so it will hold log size fuel on one side an=
=3D
d take the thinner blasting sticks above the throat arch. My intent is to e=
=3D
xpand the open grate area to about 590sq.in instead of 409sq.in as it is no=
=3D
w...=3D0A=3D0Ahttp://public.fotki.com/GindaUP/ca/kpap/uphwfkl3/open-grate-a=
rea.=3D
html=3D0A=3D0AThis will also move a large portion of the coal pile back awa=
y fr=3D
om the throat arch so the enlarged mousehole can do it's job...=3D0A=3D0Aht=
tp:/=3D
/public.fotki.com/GindaUP/ca/kpap/uphwfkl3/mousehole-change-jpg.html=3D0A=
=3D0A =3D
The throat arch might be an issue of using a pumpable refractory caulk to s=
=3D
eal the loose bricks in place...=3D0A=3D0Ahttp://public.fotki.com/GindaUP/c=
a/kp=3D
ap/uphwfkl3/firing-damage-jpg.html=3D0A=3D0A... or remove and replace the a=
rch =3D
with a slightly larger opening. I don't know the exact math for the area of=
=3D
the throat arch now but it is 16" high and 26" across the floor. My guess =
=3D
was about 401sq.in. but some math whiz is welcome to correct me. I really d=
=3D
on't think it needs to be bigger, yet.=3D0A=3D0A Well the sun is finally sh=
inni=3D
ng so I can dry and pulverize the recycled lag mix, find a few more sticks =
=3D
of kiln fuel in the woods, and maybe I'll run across some of that wild U.P.=
=3D
Bud I heard about so stay in there eh. =3D0A=3DA0=3DA0=3DA0=3D0AGary Navar=
re=3D0ANavar=3D
re Pottery=3D0ANavarre Enterprises=3D0ANorway, Michigan, USA=3D0Ahttp://www=
.youtu=3D
be.com/GindaUP=3D0Ahttp://public.fotki.com/GindaUP/=3D0A=3D0A=3D0A=3D0A
Doug Trott on tue 27 jul 10
Gary -
I use fiber blanket over my hardbrick kiln, and it works well though it
doesn't seal the cracks the way an adobe does. I have also been figuring
out my kiln, and fired it for the second time this past weekend, after
adding to the chimney, buying better steel bars for the grate, and covering
the top with adobe. I had better results than the first firing, but still
only reached cone 5 or 6 (5 was down, 7 was starting to lean).
I found that the adobe I added tended to crumble and then bits would fall
into the kiln whenever I pulled out a softbrick to check the cones. I need
to change the recipe and perhaps include more cement and vermiculite and
less sawdust. I am convinced that I need more/better insulation though.
Instead of the adobe, an outer wall of soft brick would probably work
better, but of course that's a much greater expense. I had a thermometer i=
n
the kiln shed, and pegged it at 140 (before it melted). I need to keep tha=
t
heat inside the kiln.
I also am going to have to get a digital pyrometer. I was trying to make d=
o
with analog, but I couldn't get good feedback on what I was doing. I
eventually figured out that I was frequently under-stoking. My firebox is
somewhat oversized (on purpose), and I need to use it! I also believe that
I need to split my wood even thinner, which will allow the grate to clear
faster.
So for my next attempt I'll use smaller pieces of wood and more insulation.
The good news is that it fired very evenly, top to bottom and side to side =
-
I was concerned that the design might cause the top to fire hotter.
Ought to have a web site in a few weeks - I'll post a photo or two.
Doug
On Mon, Jul 26, 2010 at 2:50 PM, gary navarre
wrote:
> Well so hey Crew,
> ...
>
> Their are some issues I need to think about before the next fire the mai=
n
> being how to keep the front from getting to hot before the tail can catch=
up
> (^13<^4) The only suggestion I've had so far is to cover the chamber with
> 8-10" dirt, fireclay, straw, and Portland cement to even it out but I hav=
e a
> few problems with that mix. I think it would be better to invest in a rol=
l
> or two more of ceramic blanket ($200) and a pallet of good IFB ($?) inste=
ad
> of something I might leave behind if I need to move the kiln (ya right).
> ...
>
>
douglas fur on tue 27 jul 10
gary navarre
well so hey Crew, (sew hay crew?)
Remind us of the proportions of the kiln ...
Three theories
1. Hay this is the way it is so figger how to make it work for you.
2. There's a constriction in the throat,,,the cinder pile speaks to this
theory
3. are you burning a short burning wood -oak etc - or a long flame pine
cedar?
DRB
Seola Creek
gary navarre on wed 28 jul 10
Ya Douglas,=3D20
I don't know the math for proportions. Guess I should have a new go making=
=3D
a drawing in Paint of how the kiln looks with improvements. I wish I knew =
=3D
how to use one of those CAD programs so I could plug in measurements and ge=
=3D
t a 3D line drawing. Then we could use some fancy thermodynamic formulas to=
=3D
calculate heat generation, build up, insulation, and loss.=3D20
--- On Tue, 7/27/10, douglas fur <23drb50@GMAIL.COM> wrote:
> From: douglas fur <23drb50@GMAIL.COM>
> Subject: Re: [Clayart] Upper Michigan Wood Fired Kiln Load #3
> To: Clayart@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG
> Date: Tuesday, July 27, 2010, 1:54 PM
> gary navarre
> well so hey Crew, (sew hay crew?)
> Remind us of the proportions of the kiln ...
> Three theories
>=3D20
> =3DA0=3DA0=3DA01. Hay this is the way it is so figger
> how to make it work for you.
About the only feature that is carved in stone is the chamber. I made the =
=3D
firebox and stack so they could be adjusted or repaired, although the stack=
=3D
is the way it is and I'm not taking the top half apart to make a more pref=
=3D
ect taper.=3D20
> =3DA0=3DA0=3DA02. There's a constriction in the
> throat,,,the cinder pile speaks to this
> =3DA0=3DA0=3DA0theory
This was obvious in the first firing. Over stoking hardwoods contributed t=
=3D
o coals building up and the damaged mousehole stopped air to control the co=
=3D
als at the throat arch. The partial success of the mousehole fix in the sec=
=3D
ond firing lead me to expand the opening under the coal pile even more. Mov=
=3D
ing the primary air hole wall will also move the coal pile back from the th=
=3D
roat arch allowing the entire flame area access to the chamber.
> =3DA0=3DA0=3DA03. are you burning a short burning wood
> -oak etc - or a long flame pine
> =3DA0=3DA0=3DA0cedar?
For the third firing the fuel will be mostly Balsam, Spruce, Poplar, Hemlo=
=3D
ck, White Pine, Red Pine slab wood split to fit, and Cedar. I don't like th=
=3D
e Red Pine because it smokes like hell so after it is used up I might skip =
=3D
renewing that supply.
No Oak, however other hard woods like Maple, Ironwood, Basswood 5" and und=
=3D
er from logging slash are available. I might be able to make better use of =
=3D
the hardwoods after making the adjustments to the firebox. In the first fir=
=3D
ing I used way too much and that also contributed to coal build up. Hardwoo=
=3D
ds might be more useful at the end of the firing to hold a clean burning hi=
=3D
gh soaking heat to smooth the glazes without adding a lot more ash action. =
=3D
Secondary stoking could then be more productive at pulling the heat toward =
=3D
the tail.
=3D20
> DRB
> Seola Creek
A lot to think about eh? Thanks for getting me to write some of it down.
Gary Navarre
Navarre Pottery
Navarre Enterprises
Norway, Michigan, USA
http://www.youtube.com/GindaUP
http://public.fotki.com/GindaUP/ =3D0A=3D0A=3D0A
Patty on wed 28 jul 10
Gary,
I've been told that Google has a great free program called sketch-up. Dead
easy to use. You will need a google account which is free and so far seems
harmless. Go to Google.com. At the very top left of the page click on
more. At the bottom of that drop down menu click on "even More". Then on
the right side of the page under "Communicate, Show and Share" scroll down
to "sketch-up". I have friends who swear by this program.
Patty Kaliher
ivor and olive lewis on thu 29 jul 10
Dear Gary Navarre,
You say "I don't know the math for proportions. Guess I should have a new g=
o
making a drawing in Paint of how the kiln looks with improvements. I wish I
knew how to use one of those CAD programs so I could plug in measurements
and get a 3D line drawing."
Easy to do with a program such as "Rhinoceros" for producing three
dimenensional line drawings which can be rotated and inverted Yes, you tel=
l
the machine how long lines must be and the angles at which they should meet=
.
It's a lot simpler to use than Cinema 4D. All of the usual geometric object=
s
are included and some Boolean processes as well. Ask around and you may fin=
d
someone with a demo disc.
Best regards,
Ivor Lewis,
REDHILL,
South Australia
James Freeman on thu 29 jul 10
On Thu, Jul 29, 2010 at 2:28 AM, ivor and olive lewis
wrote:
>
> Easy to do with a program such as "Rhinoceros" for producing three
> dimenensional line drawings which can be rotated and inverted Yes, you t=
=3D
ell
> the machine how long lines must be and the angles at which they should me=
=3D
et.
Rhino is indeed an incredible program, but with a pretty steep
learning curve and a $1000 price tag. Might be overkill just to
sketch a kiln!
I posted to my flickr page an image of a 3D model of a motorcycle that
my son designed (www.flickr.com/photos/jamesfreemanstudio/). He built
the model in Rhino, then rendered it in Bunkspeed, another $1000
program. If one had the right programs, one can rotate the drawing
any which way and view the motorcycle from any angle, and all of the
rendering stays correct. Pretty cool.
...James
James Freeman
"All I say is by way of discourse, and nothing by way of advice.=3DA0 I
should not speak so boldly if it were my due to be believed."
-Michel de Montaigne
http://www.jamesfreemanstudio.com
http://www.flickr.com/photos/jamesfreemanstudio/
http://www.jamesfreemanstudio.com/resources
gary navarre on thu 29 jul 10
Holy Wuhu Ivor, that looks like fun ...=3D0A=3D0Ahttp://www.rhino3d.com/=3D=
0A=3D0A.=3D
.. but like someone told me after I said the price of a bowl, "Sorry, I'm o=
=3D
n a potters income so I'll have to pass on that for now." Learning all that=
=3D
is in their demo download could take me more time than it's worth when pas=
=3D
t experience, meditation, and intuition solved the similar firing problem i=
=3D
n the '86-90' Mini-Hobagama. About all that is different is this version is=
=3D
twice as big inside and I get Social Security. Maybe that free Google 3-D =
=3D
feature would be a better starter if I wanted to sit at the computer foolin=
=3D
g with the design of my dream kiln. I was hoping some of the more experienc=
=3D
ed wood burners or a smarter college student had been keeping attention of =
=3D
all the features and measurements I've posted over the last 6 years, if onl=
=3D
y to prove the inefficiency of the design, but I guess, like me, they are t=
=3D
oo busy getting their kilns firing right to bother with plugging the firing=
=3D
logs into a fancy program. =3D0A =3D0A So that reminds me, I still have ab=
out =3D
half a mud bucket of recycled lag mix to pulverize. I got inspired by seein=
=3D
g African chicks on TV pounding Millet in a stump and stood on the porch st=
=3D
eps with a Cedar log and pounded the high, medium, low, and no-fired scrap =
=3D
in a wheel barrow into powder. I saved about 125lbs. so far. Add a little f=
=3D
ire clay and its good to put the firebox back together. I wonder what the m=
=3D
ath for the formula for work is on busting this stuff up by hand is compair=
=3D
ed to the bicycle powered contraption my pal Rick was trying to figure up? =
=3D
=3D0A=3D0A Later eh and stay in there eh?=3D0A =3D0AGary Navarre=3D0ANava=
rre Potter=3D
y=3D0ANavarre Enterprises=3D0ANorway, Michigan, USA=3D0Ahttp://www.youtube.=
com/Gi=3D
ndaUP=3D0Ahttp://public.fotki.com/GindaUP/=3D0A=3D0A=3D0A--- On Thu, 7/29/1=
0, ivor =3D
and olive lewis wrote:=3D0A=3D0A> From: ivor and ol=
ive =3D
lewis =3D0A> Subject: Re: [Clayart] Upper Michigan W=
oo=3D
d Fired Kiln Load #3=3D0A> To: Clayart@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG=3D0A> Date: Thursda=
y, J=3D
uly 29, 2010, 1:28 AM=3D0A> Dear Gary Navarre,=3D0A> =3D0A> You say "I don'=
t know=3D
the math for proportions. Guess I=3D0A> should have a new go=3D0A> making =
a dr=3D
awing in Paint of how the kiln looks with=3D0A> improvements. I wish I=3D0A=
> kn=3D
ew how to use one of those CAD programs so I could plug=3D0A> in measuremen=
ts=3D
=3D0A> and get a 3D line drawing."=3D0A> =3D0A> Easy=3DA0 to do with a prog=
ram such=3D
as "Rhinoceros" for=3D0A> producing three=3D0A> dimenensional line drawing=
s wh=3D
ich can be rotated and=3D0A> inverted=3DA0 Yes, you tell=3D0A> the machine =
how lo=3D
ng lines must be and the angles at which=3D0A> they should meet.=3D0A> It's=
a l=3D
ot simpler to use than Cinema 4D. All of the usual=3D0A> geometric objects=
=3D0A=3D
> are included and some Boolean processes as well. Ask around=3D0A> and you=
m=3D
ay find=3D0A> someone with a demo disc.=3D0A> =3D0A> Best regards,=3D0A> =
=3D0A> Ivor =3D
Lewis,=3D0A> REDHILL,=3D0A> South Australia=3D0A> =3D0A=3D0A=3D0A
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