Philip Poburka on thu 14 oct 10
Modern
Hi Steve, all...
I think the whole premise relies on people reading ideas into it which are
not ( otherwise ) present.
I myself read quite a few ideas into it, which possibly were present, as
well.
Possibly, setting only one such Porcelain likeness-of-a Sunflower 'Seed'
onto some part of the Museum floor, would have been enough...and, thusly,
even more subtle, vastly more lovely, possibly mysterious or slightly
self-conscious in it's way, and entirely and enormously more
interesting...as well as that it would 'invite' a likely finer and higher
sphere or order of ideas to be read into the then lightness and delicacy of
it's presence.
Oh well...
As it is...the figure of `100,000,000 ( One Hundred Million ) is about how
many Chineese People chairman Mao and his cohorts and successors murdered
for political dominance assertions/exemplars.
The Sunflowers who demurred to unambiguously keep their faces turned toward
the 'Sun' ( 'Mao' ).
Maybe that was part of the 'idea' which is present...
There's a lotta 'Seeds' that never got to grow, a lotta 'Sunflowers' that
got rubbed out.
I sure wish I could know what Chiang Kai-shek had been privy to at that God
forsaken 'Yalta' meeting/conference/pow-wow.
...sigh...
Phil
Lv
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Slatin"
It also makes one think about numbers and scale,
and the efforts of the people who made the seeds.
Of course not everyone will find these things in
the presentation, and possibly I'm just reading
in ideas that really are not present.
Steve Slatin --
N48.0886450
W123.1420482
--- On Thu, 10/14/10, May Luk wrote:
> "Sunflower Seeds invites us to look
> more closely at the =E2=80=98Made in
> China=E2=80=99 phenomenon ...
Steve Slatin on thu 14 oct 10
Modern
It also makes one think about numbers and scale,
and the efforts of the people who made the seeds. =3D20
Of course not everyone will find these things in
the presentation, and possibly I'm just reading
in ideas that really are not present. =3D20
Steve Slatin --=3D20
N48.0886450
W123.1420482
--- On Thu, 10/14/10, May Luk wrote:
> "Sunflower Seeds invites us to look
> more closely at the =3DE2=3D80=3D98Made in
> China=3DE2=3D80=3D99 phenomenon ...=3D0A=3D0A=3D0A
May Luk on fri 15 oct 10
Modern
Steve,
I think most people would.
At any rate, the artist's intention has no relation to how the viewers
react to the work. This we all know.
I read it from a point of view of a ceramicist. For the material, the
idea for the execution is brilliant. Over at the V&A, I would have to
make an appointment to touch a porcelain object. Here at this
exhibition, I could sink my feet and lie on the work, listen to and
interact with it and connect with all the "foreign" artisans who made
and painted them.
The Chinese comment quoted in Gail's post is interesting. The reminder
that Mao was regarded as the Sun in China. I don't think that young
Chinese person knows about the 45 million deaths during the Great
Famine under Mao's rule.
Best Regards
May
Brooklyn NY
On Thu, Oct 14, 2010 at 1:21 PM, Steve Slatin wrot=
=3D
e:
> It also makes one think about numbers and scale,
> and the efforts of the people who made the seeds.
> Of course not everyone will find these things in
> the presentation, and possibly I'm just reading
> in ideas that really are not present.
>
>
>
> Steve Slatin --
>
> N48.0886450
> W123.1420482
>
>
> --- On Thu, 10/14/10, May Luk wrote:
>
>
>> "Sunflower Seeds invites us to look
>> more closely at the =3D91Made in
>> China=3D92 phenomenon ...
>
>
>
>
--=3D20
http://twitter.com/MayLuk
http://www.ceramicsbrooklyn.com/
Frank Gaydos on fri 15 oct 10
Modern
Steve,=3D20
Seems like=3DC2=3DA0he could have used real seeds and donated them to some =
farm=3D
ers after. I feel it is a waste of manpower, fuel, time etc.=3D20
I understand there is a '=3DC2=3DA0concept ' behind it but jeez, 100=3DC2=
=3DA0 mill=3D
ion?=3DC2=3DA0Two years of labor?=3D20
Then the lady in the video is worried that folks will steal=3DC2=3DA0a few=
=3DC2=3D
=3DA0seeds.=3DC2=3DA0 "It won't be the same experience for others" Are you =
kiddin=3D
g me?=3D20
Frank=3D20
----- Original Message -----=3D20
From: "Steve Slatin" =3D20
To: Clayart@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG=3D20
Sent: Thursday, October 14, 2010 1:21:46 PM=3D20
Subject: Re: Millions of Hand-crafted Porcelain Sunflower Seeds At the Tate=
=3D
Modern=3D20
It also makes one think about numbers and scale,=3D20
and the efforts of the people who made the seeds. =3DC2=3DA0=3D20
Of course not everyone will find these things in=3D20
the presentation, and possibly I'm just reading=3D20
in ideas that really are not present. =3DC2=3DA0=3D20
Steve Slatin --=3D20
N48.0886450=3D20
W123.1420482=3D20
--- On Thu, 10/14/10, May Luk wrote:=3D20
> "Sunflower Seeds invites us to look=3D20
> more closely at the =3DE2=3D80=3D98Made in=3D20
> China=3DE2=3D80=3D99 phenomenon ...=3D20
Philip Poburka on fri 15 oct 10
Modern
Hi Frank, all,
I believe any 'Installation' is automatically consigned or destined to
succeed, no matter what, since no matter what happens, no matter what anyon=
e
says or thinks, it is thereby succeeding to invite or occasion various
orders of interest and or involvement.
In this instance, people stealing a few 'Seeds' would be just part of it,
and, besides, is someone going to count them after the exhibit closes, to
see how many were pilfered?
Lol...
As for me, if leaving aside all other considerations or tangents or
associations, I think just intrinsically, it is very cool these 'Seeds' wer=
e
made of Porcelain.
I would like to know how they made them ( Slip Cast Mould? Press Mould?
Or? ) and what Glaze or Oxide generally, was used to create the colors and
striated lines...and...how fired.
I might even like to know how much they weigh individually, and or all
tolled.
Phil
l v
----- Original Message -----
From: "Frank Gaydos"
Steve,
Seems like he could have used real seeds and donated them to some farmers
after. I feel it is a waste of manpower, fuel, time etc.
I understand there is a ' concept ' behind it but jeez, 100 million? Two
years of labor?
Then the lady in the video is worried that folks will steal a few seeds. "I=
t
won't be the same experience for others" Are you kidding me?
Frank
Fabienne McMillan on fri 15 oct 10
Modern
There is probably more waste considering all those bad pots out there;
nobody seems to mind those.
Real seeds obviously didn't fulfill the artist's intent. I can thing
of a few things that would make the real seeds a problem to start
with: they go rancid, the smell (!) and wouldn't sound the same; once
trampled by an ocean of visitors, doubt a farmer would be able to use
them for planting or oil (health).
Fabienne
"We never touch people so lightly that we do not leave a trace." ~
Peggy Tabor Millin
On Oct 15, 2010, at 12:18 AM, Frank Gaydos wrote:
> Steve,
>
> Seems like he could have used real seeds and donated them to some
> farmers after. I feel it is a waste of manpower, fuel, time etc.
>
> I understand there is a ' concept ' behind it but jeez, 100
> million? Two years of labor?
>
> Then the lady in the video is worried that folks will steal a few
> seeds. "It won't be the same experience for others" Are you kidding
> me?
>
> Frank
Karen Gringhuis on sun 17 oct 10
Modern
Having lived in China, most recently this past winter, a couple of commen=
=3D
ts:
I can't speak for the awareness of young people of recent history. But th=
=3D
e
relationship betw. the Chinese people and Mao is, to say the least,
"complicated." While I worked in Jingdezhen, it was fascinating to watch=
=3D
statues of Mao in many sizes being glazed directly across from Pottery
Workshop. The expert artisan even looked a bit like Mao! complete w/
cigarette hanging from his mouth. And at the end of the street is a small=
=3D
studio making repros of figurines depicting the excesses of the Cultural
Revolution - beheadings, dunce caps, placards around the neck, etc. All =
=3D
of
these for selling today presumably NOT primarily to tourists=3D20=3D20=3D20
When an Italian friend and I first encountered the figurines in a nearby
village museum of the ceramic process, our jaws dropped and our cameras c=
=3D
ame
out. As we wandered the lanes of this village, we saw banners w/ pictures=
=3D
of
Mao hanging on the interior walls of homes. Again, we were flabbergasted.=
=3D
=3D20
Creeped out really. To us, it seemed like putting a poster of Hitler in =
=3D
the
living room or bringing home a figurine of Joe Stalin. But it made us thi=
=3D
nk
well beyond Porcelain and Kaolin Mtn.=3D20
As for the labor which went into making the sunflower seeds, it could onl=
=3D
y
happen in China. For another more beautiful example, google Caroline Chen=
=3D
g
(CEO of PWS) and look at her "clothing" covered w/ porcelain butterflies.=
=3D
=3D20=3D20
Watching a hole being torn in a newly paved parking lot, my husband
commented that a major step for China will be to stop doing so much w/ hu=
=3D
man
labor.=3D20
"Complicated" - a wonderful people, fascinating country. I'd go back in =
=3D
a
heartbeat!
Karen Gringhuis
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