Lili Krakowski on sat 29 jan 11
Ok. Those seeds were made (or to be contemporary "crafted") by people =3D
who were paid very little. And as the project moved up the ladder--as =3D
it were--the people working/related to it made more money. And as the =3D
project goes on the market as a unit, every seed becomes costlier and =3D
costlier.
People live in the reality of their time and situation, cruel as it may =
=3D
be. The seed-makers earned the most they could earn in their time, =3D
place, and circumstance, just as the Thai or Viet shrimp fishermen who =3D
"provide" the $15+ shrimp cocktail at the SnootyTootyBar & Grill make =3D
like 25 cents a day!
We have people on this list, bears of great brain, who make very little =3D
money because they are potters. What distinguishes them/us
from the seedmakers is that we can choose what we want to do, how much =3D
or little money we make, and they cannot.
THAT is the point of free societies. The injustice is not that the =3D
seedmakers make little and the artist and museum folk make a lot. The =3D
injustice is that some of those seedmakers well might be doctors, =3D
professors and so on...were they in a free society, and able to choose =3D
their occupation.
Lili Krakowski
Be of good courage
Dannon Rhudy on sat 29 jan 11
Lili said:
Ok. Those seeds were made .......as the project goes on the market as a
unit,
every seed becomes costlier and costlier........
People live in the reality of their time and situation,
......The seed-makers earned the most they could earn in their time,
place, and circumstance, just as the Thai or Viet shrimp fishermen
who "provide" the $15+ shrimp cocktail
at the SnootyTootyBar & Grill make like 25 cents a day........!
Lili, the analogy between the "seeds" and the
shrimp in the shrimp cocktail (or shrimp scampi
or shrimp- anything-edible) is a pretty good one.
I can buy for instance a tomato seed for perhaps
a penny; grow a seedling and sell it for $2; grow
a plant and pick the tomato and sell it for $4 a
pound (more or less, depending on whatever) or what
the market will bear. I don't have to to survive,
but I can choose to if I want. Someone(s)
grew the plant that made the seed/collected the
seed/dried/stored it for a very small amount of
money per seed. But, obviously, it is worth it
to them - or there would be only the seeds I save
and store for myself; none available on the open
market.
We all do indeed live in the reality of our time
and situation. Boom, bust, lots, little. We on
this list choose our occupation(s). In that, we are
absolutely the fortunate of the world. If we were
not, we would not be sitting at our computers having
this conversation.
On a slightly oblique note, I have often wondered
what people with the bare minimum to survive would
think of these kinds of conversations. Likely, they
wouldn't think of them at all, or if they did, then
with absolute disbelief that folk could use their
time on things unproductive of food or shelter. Nothing
as odd as folk.........
regards
Dannon Rhudy
Stephani Stephenson on sun 30 jan 11
the other way to do it is go big.=3D20
hire others.
then you have to look at bringing in $300,000 -$800,000 i would say.
that's brings another skill set into play, besides the clay and business =
=3D
skills.
(and perhaps not so different than smaller scale studio entrepeneur,)
gusto, people skills and an ability to weather income fluctuations,=3D20
just with more zeros on the end of the numbers .
Stephani Stephenson on sun 30 jan 11
Ok, let's do a little math, kind of generalized, but let's do it.
lets say you want to support yourself with your claywork, from a home bas=
=3D
ed
studio
Now the following numbers don't include procuring or establishing that ho=
=3D
me,
or studio or equipment. More on that later.
So, income and expenditures for a home based business, using a business
model of 4 sales per year.=3D20
i'm going to give a range "Low" -"High", though of course , lots of peopl=
=3D
e
will be higher. if you are lower, ...well, remember this is assuming that=
=3D
you are making your entire income from your work.So ,you are making enoug=
=3D
h
work to accomplish this. no subsidies.
studio/shop monthly expenditures, .
utilities,includes heating cooling, firing :$100-$500
part of mortgage or rent allotted to shop 20%: 0-$500
supplies, including everything from clay to sponges:100-1,000 (though if =
=3D
you
are making enough pots, sculpture or tile, you are definitely spending mo=
=3D
re
on supplies than this minimum)
Insurance, and since health insurance is still deductible we include that=
=3D
@
$400/month and business insurance at $20/month=3D3D $420 per month
subtotal $620-$2420
X 12 months =3D3D$7,440- $28,800 per year for your basic shop expenses
that isn't including anything for equipment, licenses, travel, packing,
shipping, advertising, etc.
now for your living expenses.
Lets say for your food, rent or mortgage, transportation, utilities, car
insurance and everything you need to live on is $1,000-$ 3,000 per month=
=3D
.
that's $12,000-$36,000 per year
and that doesn't include anything for any medical or dental expenses, vis=
=3D
its
or travel, replacing that car or refrigerator, or putting anything away i=
=3D
n
savings.
SO, you will need to bring in between $20,000 and $65,000 /year to make
ends meet.
Oops, wait, i forgot about self employment taxes .=3D20
to compensate for that 30% to allow for taxes, you will really need to
bring in about $25,000 to meet the lowest level of expenses.
and you will need to bring in $80,300 to meet the second level of expendi=
=3D
tures.
so ,if you have 4 sales per year, you will need to bring in an average =
=3D
of
$6,250-$20,075 for each sale. Pretty big numbers for a yard sale.
I think mel's plan for running a business is ideal, if you own your home =
=3D
and
equipment and have been at it for some time and are pretty well set. If y=
=3D
ou
know how to weld and wire, and plumb, you'll save some money, good, but=
=3D
likely as not , if you are just starting out you'll have to meet stricter=
=3D
building codes and zoning guidelines for your locale. still doable.
What I am trying to do is get through to some heads out there what =
=3D
it
is like trying to start up these days. If you are 20 or 30 or 40 years ol=
=3D
d,
actually any age..and are trying to start from scratch? the costs of livi=
=3D
ng
have gone up astronomically since many of the venerable potters on this l=
=3D
ist
started up.=3D20
This isn't taking anything away from anyone. The work ethic is clea=
=3D
rly
evident for those who have survived and thrived.The ability to stick wit=
=3D
h
it decade after decade, also a huge factor. HUGE!
A real problem I see is housing and workspace. I see a lot of younge=
=3D
r
folks who are trying to get by in ridiculously inadequate situations fo=
=3D
r
doing a full time business.=3D20
The level of grubstake you need these days is higher than the level of
grubstake you use to need. No GI bill, high rents, higher home prices, e=
=3D
ven
after the crash, high costs of health care and insurance, jobs not keepin=
=3D
g
up with expenses, all those things.
So, the reality is, if you want to make even the barest living wage=3D20=
=3D
nowadays, not only are you going to have to hardbutt it , as mel says, bu=
=3D
t
you are going to need to understand it will take more than a few hard cas=
=3D
h
dollars to make it work.
Many of the potters we hear from had a good job which provided them
steady income, benefits such as health insurance and even that old fashio=
=3D
ned
thing known as a retirement pension. Even middle age potters started out =
=3D
in
a day when everything was far less expensive. Thise who got established t=
=3D
hen
and have kept with it are hopefully reaping the rewards, after years of
dedication and hard, repeated work.
Things are different for many just entering or re-entering the job mark=
=3D
et.
=3D20
I am not making excuses. I am just saying that before we get too self=
=3D
congratulatory
take a good hard look at how those who work with clay make a living at i=
=3D
t
and think what it is like for someone who is trying to start up.
There is no paycheck in the mail unless you make pots or tile or sculpt=
=3D
ure
to put it there. there is no unemployment, there is no union to lobby on
your behalf. There is no 'crop subsidy', there is no local tax benefit. y=
=3D
ou
are the lonest entrepeneur that ever was in this big land. and so you nee=
=3D
d
not oinly to be the best potter you can be, but , frankly, you have to be=
=3D
able to succeed in business, and provide an income that let's you at lea=
=3D
st
feel like you can consort with other Americans occasionally, (and I say t=
=3D
hat
not remembering the exact meaning of consort!haha!)
It is very easy to sit back and say, 'its a choice'. People who do so ,do=
=3D
so
because they believe that the love they have for the craft and hard work =
=3D
and
perserverence will get them through. They are resourceful, energetic peop=
=3D
le,
but to say that these people could just as easily be doctors or bankers a=
=3D
nd
make the 'big' money ignores something essential about their nature. Mayb=
=3D
e
it's more of a calling than a choice.
I see more than a few who work long and hard at trying to make that choi=
=3D
ce
work , every day, and i mean every day. I think that 'reality paycheck'
arrives pretty much every day, thank you.
so if this group cares at all about this craft, then we have got to find=
=3D
a
way to address economic survival, and better than that, economic success=
=3D
,=3D20
as we educate those coming up.
Michael Wendt on sun 30 jan 11
"Things were far cheaper in the past than they are today."
This is a fallacy.
I was there in the past and know that things were far more
expensive
in the past than they are today.
A few examples:
in 1973, the year I started, a modest new car cost a little
more than $2000
Gasoline was $0.65/ gallon.
We bought an old fixer upper house for $8000 (which sold in
2000 for $100,000)
I was paid prior to that a teacher's salary of $5700/year.
Today a mid priced car costs about $20,000 (10 X 1973
price).
Gas for that car is now $3.18/gallon here in Lewiston,
Idaho, USA (4.8 x 1973 price).
Houses like the one we bought then sell for $125,000 (15 x
what we paid in '73).
Why?
The systematic printing of money that results in inflation.
It was harder then to get started than it is today.
We did without many years because everything cost so much
more
even though the dollar amounts were nominally smaller.
Those dollars were worth far more than today's dollars
and much harder to come by.
Consider, a Brent potter's wheel cost about $350 then and
costs less
than $1000 now ( about 2.9 time more).
From the house cost figures we can clearly see that real
estate prices due to inflation have gone up in this area by
a factor of 15 but manufactured goods prices have
not remotely kept pace with this figure and energy costs
have steadily declined over the same time period when
adjusted for inflation.
For many manufactured items, the actual costs adjusted for
inflation are
lower today than they were 30-40 years ago.
Still...
starting even a small home business hinges on treating it
like a business.
Do some planning,
things like finding out if you have a market for what you
make.
Many potters frankly said to customers;
"If you don't like it, don't buy it! I'm no a sell out! I
don't do orders!"
That rang like a bell in my mind.
People want what they want. That would be my niche. I do not
regret doing
orders and still refuse to do some orders, but over all if
you want a stable
year in year out income, that is certainly an option.
Next:
Be sure you get a cash register and ring every penny through
it and report
all income. Never pocket any cash. This may sound tempting
but it actually
cuts your throat at bank loan time if you want to grow or
buy a needed piece
of equipment.
Think about it...
the bank wants to know you will pay them back
but your records indicate you make too little money to live
on (because
you pocket all the cash you can).
You can't then say... but I really make $20,000 a year more
than my records
indicate. That is after all a crime.
Finally:
pay all your bill the minute they come.
Keep you checking account balance current so that you have a
good
picture of how much cash you really have to spend and only
take cash
from the business by writing checks to your personal account
for
the amounts that you need provided they don't deplete you
business
account so low that you cannot pay your business bills.
Avoid borrowing... do without instead.
A lesson to the Federal and state governments...
YOU CAN'T BORROW YOURSELF RICH!
my 30 cents worth (2 cents adjusted for inflation).
Michael Wendt
Stephani S wrote in part:
I think mel's plan for running a business is ideal, if you
own your home and
equipment and have been at it for some time and are pretty
well set. If you
know how to weld and wire, and plumb, you'll save some
money, good, but
likely as not , if you are just starting out you'll have to
meet stricter
building codes and zoning guidelines for your locale. still
doable.
What I am trying to do is get through to some heads
out there what it
is like trying to start up these days. If you are 20 or 30
or 40 years old,
actually any age..and are trying to start from scratch? the
costs of living
have gone up astronomically since many of the venerable
potters on this list
started up.
This isn't taking anything away from anyone. The work
ethic is clearly
evident for those who have survived and thrived.The ability
to stick with
it decade after decade, also a huge factor. HUGE!
A real problem I see is housing and workspace. I see a
lot of younger
folks who are trying to get by in ridiculously inadequate
situations for
doing a full time business.
Lee on sun 30 jan 11
Stephani, thanks for explaining from a real world perspective.
It really tough for young folks to get started in these times.
When I started school at a State university, credit hours were only
$12.00 a semester hour. Before I left Grad school, undergrad was up
to $32.00
I always worked a couple jobs and only ended up
having to pay back $5,000.00 in loans, mostly from my last years.
I think the most important thing to do is stay away
from debt. If you are working now, build your studio and equipment
while you don't have to depend on it for a living.
--
=3DA0Lee Love in Minneapolis
http://mingeisota.blogspot.com/
=3DA0"Ta tIr na n-=3DF3g ar chul an tI=3D97tIr dlainn trina ch=3DE9ile"=3D9=
7that is, =3D
"The
land of eternal youth is behind the house, a beautiful land fluent
within itself." -- John O'Donohue
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