KATHI LESUEUR on tue 1 nov 11
On Nov 1, 2011, at 1:35 PM, Lili Krakowski wrote:
> So I called Poison Control who basically said NO to burning Styrofoam, =
=3D
foam rubber and like that. A little bit--as a foam "peanut" in the burn =
=3D
barrel-- is no big deal, BUT do not elect to burn that stuff......
>=3D20
> Anyway. An electric knife or similar works well.
>=3D20
> What I would be concerned about is little bitsies of that nastiness =3D
falling into the clay, or floating about (very very lightweight) and =3D
falling in later.
>=3D20
> I would cut outdoors, or far from the clay studio, I would experiment =3D
with wetting the foam down. =3D20
>=3D20
> As to making the edges smooth so they don't produce crumbs (that will =3D
fall into the clay)--I would try several coats of paint, I would try =3D
duct or adhesive tape, I even would try gauze bandage and cover that =3D
with paint or polyurethane.
>=3D20
Folks, I think you are making this foam cutting stuff too hard. A band =3D
saw or jig saw gives very clean cuts and doesn't burn the foam so =3D
cutting it inside is fine. I've never had a problem with "little =3D
bitsies" coming off of the pieces. And, as for getting a smooth edge, =3D
just sand the stuff. I've made forms with this method for years. All of =3D
my slab work is done with foam hump forms. They are made in two pieces. =3D
The outer edge of the piece is done with a straight cut. Then I cut a =3D
second piece one inch smaller all around beveled at about a 45 degree =3D
angle. I glue the two pieces together with wood glue.
Make sure you buy a quality foam product. I prefer the blue foam( I =3D
think Dupont makes it). The pink is not dense enough.
KATHI LESUEUR
http://www.lesueurclaywork.com
Lili Krakowski on tue 1 nov 11
So I called Poison Control who basically said NO to burning Styrofoam, =3D
foam rubber and like that. A little bit--as a foam "peanut" in the burn =
=3D
barrel-- is no big deal, BUT do not elect to burn that stuff.
Anyway. An electric knife or similar works well.
What I would be concerned about is little bitsies of that nastiness =3D
falling into the clay, or floating about (very very lightweight) and =3D
falling in later.
I would cut outdoors, or far from the clay studio, I would experiment =3D
with wetting the foam down. =3D20
As to making the edges smooth so they don't produce crumbs (that will =3D
fall into the clay)--I would try several coats of paint, I would try =3D
duct or adhesive tape, I even would try gauze bandage and cover that =3D
with paint or polyurethane.
And I would report results to ClayArt!
Lili Krakowski
Be of good courage
Randall Moody on tue 1 nov 11
I would agree that burning styrofoam in the burn barrel would be ill
advised but using a hotwire is standard practice and does not produce
anywhere near the fumes that would be an issue if the cutting was done
in an well ventilated area.
From TerraGenesis.com:
Hot Wire Cutters - Safety
Hot wire cutters use low voltage electricity to heat a wire thus
allowing it to melt its way through=3DA0polystyrene foam. Because a low
voltage is used there is no risk of electric shock. Neither is the
wire capable of cutting your fingers, but it will burn them and
anything else that you allow to come into contact with it.
The main issue with=3DA0hot wire cutter=3DA0safety relates to the toxic fum=
es
which can be given off when=3DA0polystyrene foam(Styrofoam) is melted. We
have tracked down some definitive advice about this and we present it
below. The bottom line seems to be that in hobby use, with sensible
ventilation, the risks are manageable.
Source
This information is from 'Risk Assessments for Secondary Schools' and
is published by the Consortium of Local Education Authorities for the
Provision of Science Services (CLEAPPS), Brunel University, Uxbridge,
England UB8 3PH. Brunel is one of the premier technological
universities in the UK. This is a publication advising English science
teachers about classroom hazards.
Process:=3DA0The cutting of expanded polystyrene by means of a wire heated
to about 300 degrees C.
Hazards:=3DA0Harmful: hazardous by inhalation; Irritant:=3DA0Styrene=3DA0fu=
mes ca=3D
n
irritate the eyes.
Risk Assessment:=3DA0Harmful:=3DA0Styrene=3DA0fumes are produced as the mat=
erial
degrades when overheated. Styrene has a MEL (Maximum Exposure Limit)
of 100ppm (parts per million, 8 hour Time Weighted Average) and 250ppm
(15 minute reference period). However, the process is safe with up to
5 cutters in simultaneous use in a well-ventilated workshop. Irritant:
The eye irritation becomes severe only at exposures of 200ppm and
above but eyes may water at levels below the MEL.
Control measures:=3DA0Small, hand-held cutters may be used in well
ventilated conditions. Large, bench-mounted types may require local
exhaust ventilation: a special assessment is necessary. The
ventilation required to control the toxic hazard will also control the
irritant one.
On Tue, Nov 1, 2011 at 1:35 PM, Lili Krakowski wr=
=3D
ote:
>
> So I called Poison Control who basically said NO to burning Styrofoam, fo=
=3D
am rubber and like that. =3DA0A little bit--as a foam "peanut" in the burn =
ba=3D
rrel-- is no big deal, BUT do not elect to burn that stuff.
>
> Anyway. =3DA0An electric knife or similar works well.
>
> What I would be concerned about is little bitsies of that =3DA0nastiness =
fa=3D
lling into the clay, or floating about (very very lightweight) and falling =
=3D
in later.
>
> I would cut outdoors, or far from the clay studio, I would experiment wit=
=3D
h wetting the foam down.
>
> As to making the edges smooth so they don't produce crumbs (that will fal=
=3D
l into the clay)--I would try several coats of paint, I would try duct or a=
=3D
dhesive tape, I even would try gauze bandage and cover that with paint or p=
=3D
olyurethane.
>
> And I would report results to ClayArt!
>
>
> Lili Krakowski
> Be of good courage
--
Randall in Atlanta
http://wrandallmoody.com
Michael Wendt on tue 1 nov 11
Styrene foam dissolves easily in lacquer thinner...
makes great sculpture armatures
Regards,
Michael Wendt
Randall Moody on wed 2 nov 11
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3D3DW3TYhDJNcyY
Here is a short video on hot wire cutting of styrofoam.
On Tue, Nov 1, 2011 at 10:16 PM, KATHI LESUEUR
wrote:
> On Nov 1, 2011, at 1:35 PM, Lili Krakowski wrote:
>
>> So I called Poison Control who basically said NO to burning Styrofoam, f=
=3D
oam rubber and like that. =3DA0A little bit--as a foam "peanut" in the burn=
b=3D
arrel-- is no big deal, BUT do not elect to burn that stuff......
>>
>> Anyway. =3DA0An electric knife or similar works well.
>>
>> What I would be concerned about is little bitsies of that =3DA0nastiness=
f=3D
alling into the clay, or floating about (very very lightweight) and falling=
=3D
in later.
>>
>> I would cut outdoors, or far from the clay studio, I would experiment wi=
=3D
th wetting the foam down.
>>
>> As to making the edges smooth so they don't produce crumbs (that will fa=
=3D
ll into the clay)--I would try several coats of paint, I would try duct or =
=3D
adhesive tape, I even would try gauze bandage and cover that with paint or =
=3D
polyurethane.
>>
>
> Folks, I think you are making this foam cutting stuff too hard. A band sa=
=3D
w or jig saw gives very clean cuts and doesn't burn the foam so cutting it =
=3D
inside is fine. I've never had a problem with "little bitsies" coming off o=
=3D
f the pieces. And, as for getting a smooth edge, just sand the stuff. I've =
=3D
made forms with this method for years. All of my slab work is done with foa=
=3D
m hump forms. They are made in two pieces. The outer edge of the piece is d=
=3D
one with a straight cut. Then I cut a second piece one inch smaller all aro=
=3D
und beveled at about a 45 degree angle. I glue the two pieces together with=
=3D
wood glue.
>
> Make sure you buy a quality foam product. I prefer the blue foam( I think=
=3D
Dupont makes it). The pink is not dense enough.
>
> KATHI LESUEUR
> http://www.lesueurclaywork.com
>
--=3D20
Randall in Atlanta
http://wrandallmoody.com
Edouard Bastarache on wed 2 nov 11
From :
http://glasscellisofab.com/sheets/polystyrene/msds/styrofoam_msds.pdf
HAZARDOUS
COMBUSTION
PRODUCTS:
Upon burning the product generates dense black smoke with small
amounts of hydrogen bromide, -chloride, and -fluoride. Studies have
shown that the products of combustion of this foam are not more acutely
toxic than the products of combustion of common building materials
such as wood.
FIRE FIGHTING
EQUIPMENT:
Wear positive-pressure, self contained breathing apparatus.
SPECIFIC METHODS
OF FIRE FIGHTING:
Large volume of water directly on flame or burning surface. Soak
thoroughly with water to cool and prevent re-ignition.
REACTIVITY
DATA
CHEMICAL
STABILITY:
Stable under normal handling and storage conditions.
INCOMPATIBILITY: Materials to avoid: organic solvents, esters, amines,
aldehydes, oils,
petrols.
DECOMPOSITION
PRODUCTS:
Under high heat, non flaming conditions, small amounts of aromatic
hydrocarbons, predominantly styrene and ethyl benzene are generated..
OTHER SAFE
HANDLING
INFORMATION:
Exposed to intense sunlight over prolonged periods, the surface of the
boards degrades into fine dust.
This material contains a brominated flame retardant additive to inhibit
accidental ignition from small fire sources. During shipment, storage,
installation and use, this material should not be exposed to flame or
other ignition sources.
Gis,
Edouard Bastarache
Spertesperantisto
Sorel-Tracy
Quebec
http://www.flickr.com/photos/30058682@N00/
http://edouardbastarache.blogspot.com/
http://edouardbastaracheblogs2.blogspot.com/
http://www.facebook.com/edouard.bastarache
jonathan byler on wed 2 nov 11
hot cutters do not get hot enough to burn the stuff, or at least they
shouldn't if working properly. they melt it. this is fine, works
great. you can also cut on a table saw or whatever.
you can use a soldering iron to melt styrene plastic back together,
works surprisingly well. they want $100 for that taillight cover on
your car that just got smashed? not a problem, pick up the pieces and
put them back together.
the foam, especially the white stuff that they use for cups, etc. is
bad in the sense that it does not break down through any biological
means in the environment. it persists for a long time, washing up on
beaches and being consumed by birds, etc. it kills them, not through
acute toxicity, but I guess it fills up their gut or something?
apparently the white stuff does not contain chlorine and does not
produce dioxin when burned (cancer causing bad stuff). the pink
board, etc. is more likely to cause problems since it is made (or was
made) using cfc's as an expanding agent. this would be a good source
of chlorine that is what bonds with the hydrocarbons to form in
dioxins. but remember your bleached paper plates also contain small
amounts of chlorine from the bleaching process and can also form
dioxins when burned.
if you burn the stuff hot enough and with enough oxygen for complete
combustion, your byproducts are CO2 and water vapor and heat. the
sooty, nasty flame you get from burning it at lower temperatures and
without enough oxygen.
On Nov 2, 2011, at 9:39 AM, Edouard Bastarache wrote:
> From :
>
> http://glasscellisofab.com/sheets/polystyrene/msds/styrofoam_msds.pdf
>
> HAZARDOUS
>
> COMBUSTION
>
> PRODUCTS:
>
> Upon burning the product generates dense black smoke with small
>
> amounts of hydrogen bromide, -chloride, and -fluoride. Studies have
>
> shown that the products of combustion of this foam are not more
> acutely
>
> toxic than the products of combustion of common building materials
>
> such as wood.
>
> FIRE FIGHTING
>
> EQUIPMENT:
>
> Wear positive-pressure, self contained breathing apparatus.
>
> SPECIFIC METHODS
>
> OF FIRE FIGHTING:
>
> Large volume of water directly on flame or burning surface. Soak
>
> thoroughly with water to cool and prevent re-ignition.
>
> REACTIVITY
>
> DATA
>
> CHEMICAL
>
> STABILITY:
>
> Stable under normal handling and storage conditions.
>
> INCOMPATIBILITY: Materials to avoid: organic solvents, esters, amines,
> aldehydes, oils,
>
> petrols.
>
> DECOMPOSITION
>
> PRODUCTS:
>
> Under high heat, non flaming conditions, small amounts of aromatic
>
> hydrocarbons, predominantly styrene and ethyl benzene are generated..
>
> OTHER SAFE
>
> HANDLING
>
> INFORMATION:
>
> Exposed to intense sunlight over prolonged periods, the surface of the
>
> boards degrades into fine dust.
>
> This material contains a brominated flame retardant additive to
> inhibit
>
> accidental ignition from small fire sources. During shipment, storage,
>
> installation and use, this material should not be exposed to flame or
>
> other ignition sources.
>
> Gis,
>
> Edouard Bastarache
> Spertesperantisto
>
> Sorel-Tracy
> Quebec
>
> http://www.flickr.com/photos/30058682@N00/
> http://edouardbastarache.blogspot.com/
> http://edouardbastaracheblogs2.blogspot.com/
> http://www.facebook.com/edouard.bastarache
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