Clay art on tue 28 feb 12
Hi Guys,
I read an interesting article about branding this morning and was wondering
how many of you pay attention to this aspect of marketing and how do you do
it?
Antoinette Badenhorst
www.porcelainbyAntoinette.com
tony clennell on tue 28 feb 12
Antoinette: I think the first one to brand their pottery was "Thomas Toft"
with his English slipware. His name was prominent on the plate. Those
plates are worth a fortune because of that branding.
ciao,
Tony
On Tue, Feb 28, 2012 at 10:58 AM, Clay art wrote=
:
> Hi Guys,
>
> I read an interesting article about branding this morning and was wonderi=
ng
> how many of you pay attention to this aspect of marketing and how do you =
do
> it?
>
> Antoinette Badenhorst
>
> www.porcelainbyAntoinette.com
>
--
http://smokieclennell.blogspot.com
Frances Howard on tue 28 feb 12
Hi Tony,
Thomas Toft (d. 1698) and his signatures! I have a theory about that
though you can shoot me down if you like. He was the last of the real
English medieval potters, trying to keep alive while Ming porcelain flooded
Europe, ship after ship, and swept the old timers into oblivion. He
couldn't rival their glazes, their colours, their shapes, but did what he
could by improving local slipware in a truly flamboyant way. And he signe=
d
his name with great flourish on the front of his plates .
I think he must have heard that the Chinese potters signed their names (or
something) on their work but had never actually picked up a piece and
examined it himself. So he didn't know it was back stamped. How could he?
When you signed anything you wrote on the front so that was the obvious
place for him too. Only later with Meissen and so on was pottery signed
where the Chinese signed theirs.
He should get some credit I think for signing his name at all, no one had
done it before. And it's interesting that he was making plates, something
no medieval European or English potter had done before either. They were
never able to break into the tableware trade, apart from jugs. That was
their downfall. All their pots were really kitchen ware often crude at
that, nobody wanted them anywhere near their dining tables. So T Toft was
trying really very hard to do something which actually was too late, it
should have been done 300 years before, before the exquisite Chinese
porcelains became so fashionable. But he lived before the Bottgers and
Wedgwoods so didn't have a saviour. He died a pauper.
I couldn't imagine not signing your pottery. Everything in your house has =
a
name, a brand, firms live by brands, so I don't see why potters should be
any different.
Frances Howard
Original Message-----
From: tony clennell
Sent: Tuesday, February 28, 2012 6:57 PM
To: Clayart@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG
Subject: Re: branding your product.
Antoinette: I think the first one to brand their pottery was "Thomas Toft"
with his English slipware. His name was prominent on the plate. Those
plates are worth a fortune because of that branding.
ciao,
Tony
On Tue, Feb 28, 2012 at 10:58 AM, Clay art wrote=
:
> Hi Guys,
>
> I read an interesting article about branding this morning and was
> wondering
> how many of you pay attention to this aspect of marketing and how do you
> do
> it?
>
> Antoinette Badenhorst
>
> www.porcelainbyAntoinette.com
>
--
http://smokieclennell.blogspot.com
-----
No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 2012.0.1913 / Virus Database: 2114/4837 - Release Date: 02/28/12
Clay art on wed 29 feb 12
I think for sure a handle can be a brand Tony. So can a glaze be a brand.
That is what put Malcolm Davis on the map. Where will you find a more
defined brand than the Melon Jugs of Steven Hill. Frank Boyden and Ron
Myers have their marks on their work. The newest CAP has an article about
the work of George Ohr. All of these are like signatures over and over.
So now we threw out many famous names, but there are potters that are not
published that also brand their works and become successful in their own
way.
Then there are potters that do thought provoking, often shocking work.
Branding (according to what I read) are supposed to connect emotionally wit=
h
clients or audiences. Interesting thoughts. .
Antoinette Badenhorst
www.porcelainbyAntoinette.com
From: tony clennell [mailto:tony.clennell@gmail.com]
Sent: Wednesday, February 29, 2012 11:26 AM
To: Clay art
Subject: Re: branding your product.
Antoinette: Can a handle be a brand? If so that is what I have branded my
pots with for over 30 years. My pots are recognizable by the handle or lug.
I am now in a direct location, using pretty colour values but the handle
remains the constant and perhaps the give away. They that know my work will
be immediately stumped by the new look but the handle is still there.
I saw some pots the other day by Wayne Branim of MN. I recognized the X and
the O immediately as his brand.
Robin Hopper's floral brushwork is a brand that I recognize.
I don't think you need to brand with a signature as Toft did but it does
make pots more recognizable to people that are not the students of pots as
many of us potters are.
I still think the best business card is a good cup.
ciao,
Tc
On Wed, Feb 29, 2012 at 10:09 AM, Clay art
wrote:
Frances this is a very interesting piece of history that you presented.
Thank you for you and Tony to bring this to us. This history fits with what
I understand branding should involve and offers a huge lesson to me. Many
think it is just about making presentable work, signing it, business cards,
social media etc.
I always preach to anyone that wants to listen: "be honest to yourself in
what you do". "Like your own work". "Believe in your own work" It seems tha=
t
this is just what Thomas Loft did.
From what I understand one has to connect on a personal level with your
product. I made a test yesterday to ask my children to describe my work
without complimenting me. One of them came up with a very personal answer.
The other gave a sophisticated answer and the other still owe me an answer:
she is stuck.
You men recognizes a Toyota from anywhere ( to me they are all smiley
faces!) We recognize several potters that really made it big in this world
from a distance. Can we say that from all successful potters?
Also is it just the style of the pot that makes it recognizable, or may it
be that the potter has a community that is sensitive about the work and
message of the potter. Mel often says one should sell to your own
neighborhood. Where are the boundaries of our neighborhoods?
Every once in a while and as of right now there are discussions about
likability of work and whether one should fire certain pots or not. If I
knew how people would "label" me and my work 30 years ago, I would have bee=
n
much more careful about what I put out there into this world.
After I made a study of the work of Richard Notkin ( see my review of his
show in Tampa Fl. last year in 2011 issue 86 Ceramics Art and Perception) I
could see how he build his career from one stepping stone to the other and
although there will be people that will disagree with his believes, his wor=
k
draws a line right through his life, his activities and his believes.
So maybe with this explanation there might be more of you that will respond
to my question: Do you use branding in your work and if so, how do you do
it?
Best wishes
Antoinette Badenhorst
www.porcelainbyAntoinette.com
-----Original Message-----
From: Clayart [mailto:Clayart@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG] On Behalf Of Frances Howard
Sent: Tuesday, February 28, 2012 8:18 PM
To: Clayart@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG
Subject: Re: branding your product.
Hi Tony,
Thomas Toft (d. 1698) and his signatures! I have a theory about that
though you can shoot me down if you like. He was the last of the real
English medieval potters, trying to keep alive while Ming porcelain flooded
Europe, ship after ship, and swept the old timers into oblivion. He
couldn't rival their glazes, their colours, their shapes, but did what he
could by improving local slipware in a truly flamboyant way. And he signe=
d
his name with great flourish on the front of his plates .
I think he must have heard that the Chinese potters signed their names (or
something) on their work but had never actually picked up a piece and
examined it himself. So he didn't know it was back stamped. How could he?
When you signed anything you wrote on the front so that was the obvious
place for him too. Only later with Meissen and so on was pottery signed
where the Chinese signed theirs.
He should get some credit I think for signing his name at all, no one had
done it before. And it's interesting that he was making plates, something
no medieval European or English potter had done before either. They were
never able to break into the tableware trade, apart from jugs. That was
their downfall. All their pots were really kitchen ware often crude at
that, nobody wanted them anywhere near their dining tables. So T Toft was
trying really very hard to do something which actually was too late, it
should have been done 300 years before, before the exquisite Chinese
porcelains became so fashionable. But he lived before the Bottgers and
Wedgwoods so didn't have a saviour. He died a pauper.
I couldn't imagine not signing your pottery. Everything in your house has =
a
name, a brand, firms live by brands, so I don't see why potters should be
any different.
Frances Howard
Original Message-----
From: tony clennell
Sent: Tuesday, February 28, 2012 6:57 PM
To: Clayart@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG
Subject: Re: branding your product.
Antoinette: I think the first one to brand their pottery was "Thomas Toft"
with his English slipware. His name was prominent on the plate. Those plate=
s
are worth a fortune because of that branding.
ciao,
Tony
On Tue, Feb 28, 2012 at 10:58 AM, Clay art wrote=
:
> Hi Guys,
>
> I read an interesting article about branding this morning and was
> wondering how many of you pay attention to this aspect of marketing
> and how do you do it?
>
> Antoinette Badenhorst
>
> www.porcelainbyAntoinette.com
>
--
http://smokieclennell.blogspot.com
-----
No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 2012.0.1913 / Virus Database: 2114/4837 - Release Date: 02/28/12
--
http://smokieclennell.blogspot.com
ivor and olive lewis on wed 29 feb 12
Dear Antoinette,
I did a Google search for "Creating a Brand". There is wealth of informatio=
n
out there in cyber space. I would imagine that the first thing to do is to
update your Business Plan, clarifying your goals and take it from there.
Cheers and best wishes for a career as an entrepreneur
Sincerely,
Ivor Lewis,
REDHILL,
South Australia
Clay art on wed 29 feb 12
Frances this is a very interesting piece of history that you presented.
Thank you for you and Tony to bring this to us. This history fits with what
I understand branding should involve and offers a huge lesson to me. Many
think it is just about making presentable work, signing it, business cards,
social media etc.
I always preach to anyone that wants to listen: "be honest to yourself in
what you do". "Like your own work". "Believe in your own work" It seems tha=
t
this is just what Thomas Loft did.
From what I understand one has to connect on a personal level with your
product. I made a test yesterday to ask my children to describe my work
without complimenting me. One of them came up with a very personal answer.
The other gave a sophisticated answer and the other still owe me an answer:
she is stuck.
You men recognizes a Toyota from anywhere ( to me they are all smiley
faces!) We recognize several potters that really made it big in this world
from a distance. Can we say that from all successful potters?
Also is it just the style of the pot that makes it recognizable, or may it
be that the potter has a community that is sensitive about the work and
message of the potter. Mel often says one should sell to your own
neighborhood. Where are the boundaries of our neighborhoods?
Every once in a while and as of right now there are discussions about
likability of work and whether one should fire certain pots or not. If I
knew how people would "label" me and my work 30 years ago, I would have bee=
n
much more careful about what I put out there into this world.
After I made a study of the work of Richard Notkin ( see my review of his
show in Tampa Fl. last year in 2011 issue 86 Ceramics Art and Perception) I
could see how he build his career from one stepping stone to the other and
although there will be people that will disagree with his believes, his wor=
k
draws a line right through his life, his activities and his believes.
So maybe with this explanation there might be more of you that will respond
to my question: Do you use branding in your work and if so, how do you do
it?
Best wishes
Antoinette Badenhorst
www.porcelainbyAntoinette.com
-----Original Message-----
From: Clayart [mailto:Clayart@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG] On Behalf Of Frances Howard
Sent: Tuesday, February 28, 2012 8:18 PM
To: Clayart@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG
Subject: Re: branding your product.
Hi Tony,
Thomas Toft (d. 1698) and his signatures! I have a theory about that
though you can shoot me down if you like. He was the last of the real
English medieval potters, trying to keep alive while Ming porcelain flooded
Europe, ship after ship, and swept the old timers into oblivion. He
couldn't rival their glazes, their colours, their shapes, but did what he
could by improving local slipware in a truly flamboyant way. And he signe=
d
his name with great flourish on the front of his plates .
I think he must have heard that the Chinese potters signed their names (or
something) on their work but had never actually picked up a piece and
examined it himself. So he didn't know it was back stamped. How could he?
When you signed anything you wrote on the front so that was the obvious
place for him too. Only later with Meissen and so on was pottery signed
where the Chinese signed theirs.
He should get some credit I think for signing his name at all, no one had
done it before. And it's interesting that he was making plates, something
no medieval European or English potter had done before either. They were
never able to break into the tableware trade, apart from jugs. That was
their downfall. All their pots were really kitchen ware often crude at
that, nobody wanted them anywhere near their dining tables. So T Toft was
trying really very hard to do something which actually was too late, it
should have been done 300 years before, before the exquisite Chinese
porcelains became so fashionable. But he lived before the Bottgers and
Wedgwoods so didn't have a saviour. He died a pauper.
I couldn't imagine not signing your pottery. Everything in your house has =
a
name, a brand, firms live by brands, so I don't see why potters should be
any different.
Frances Howard
Original Message-----
From: tony clennell
Sent: Tuesday, February 28, 2012 6:57 PM
To: Clayart@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG
Subject: Re: branding your product.
Antoinette: I think the first one to brand their pottery was "Thomas Toft"
with his English slipware. His name was prominent on the plate. Those plate=
s
are worth a fortune because of that branding.
ciao,
Tony
On Tue, Feb 28, 2012 at 10:58 AM, Clay art wrote=
:
> Hi Guys,
>
> I read an interesting article about branding this morning and was
> wondering how many of you pay attention to this aspect of marketing
> and how do you do it?
>
> Antoinette Badenhorst
>
> www.porcelainbyAntoinette.com
>
--
http://smokieclennell.blogspot.com
-----
No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 2012.0.1913 / Virus Database: 2114/4837 - Release Date: 02/28/12
plasterjfl@AOL.COM on thu 1 mar 12
Antoinette,
I think the use of the term, as it applies to what we do, is misplaced. (or
calls into question the meaning of "branding".)
I think it really only applies to companies that have a large market share
and want to protect that market share. As none of us really have a large
"market" I don't think we need to worry about protecting it.
(Yes, people are "known" for the look of this, or the look of that, but
that's more of an aesthetic brand and not so much a market brand.)
Additionally, I think a market brand requires a degree of repetition that
I'm not sure all potters want to embrace. If you are a manufacturer, and
someone else is making your work, it's probably easy to tell that person,
"Make this exact same form, or something similar, for the next 20 years."
I think most of us like the fact that we have THE OPTION to adapt new ideas
and new techniques into our work.
take care
Jeff Longtin
Minneapolis
_www.jefflongtin.etsy.com_ (http://www.jefflongtin.etsy.com)
Clay art on thu 1 mar 12
Ahh, but if I understand the term correctly, that is another thing about
branding Jeff: the ability to stay fresh and in the forefront. Maybe we wil=
l
use different words from "branding". It is interesting how we as artists
often times will excuse ourselves from the rest of the world, believing tha=
t
many things do not apply to us.
Some years back the Potters Council realized that they needs to get young
people on board to bring them to full life and bring young ( with new
concepts and technology knowledge) and older memberships. They know it will
necessarily bring changes and today it pays off. That is part of branding, =
I
think.
I have to admit it is a totally new concept for me to think that I should
see myself and my work as a brand and maybe I will find somewhere in future
that I do not want to do that, but maybe, if I do not pay attention to it, =
I
might miss something that could have been a huge gain for me.
I have a very dear friend ( Hi Lynn!) that do very special packaging with
huge bows during holidays and weddings for people buying gifts from her.
She makes her showroom into a little haven right throughout the year and
every time I walk in there one feel welcome and ready to browse for new
things. I think that is a way of branding yourself.
Best wishes.
Antoinette Badenhorst.
www.porcelainbyAntoinette.com
-----Original Message-----
From: Clayart [mailto:Clayart@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG] On Behalf Of
plasterjfl@AOL.COM
Sent: Thursday, March 01, 2012 6:51 AM
To: Clayart@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG
Subject: Re: branding your product.
Antoinette,
I think the use of the term, as it applies to what we do, is misplaced. (or
calls into question the meaning of "branding".)
I think it really only applies to companies that have a large market share
and want to protect that market share. As none of us really have a large
"market" I don't think we need to worry about protecting it.
(Yes, people are "known" for the look of this, or the look of that, but
that's more of an aesthetic brand and not so much a market brand.)
Additionally, I think a market brand requires a degree of repetition that
I'm not sure all potters want to embrace. If you are a manufacturer, and
someone else is making your work, it's probably easy to tell that person,
"Make this exact same form, or something similar, for the next 20 years."
I think most of us like the fact that we have THE OPTION to adapt new ideas
and new techniques into our work.
take care
Jeff Longtin
Minneapolis
_www.jefflongtin.etsy.com_ (http://www.jefflongtin.etsy.com)
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