mel jacobson on tue 28 feb 12
mike gordon dropped me a line and was in
disagreement with my line about not firing those
early pots.
he does have a point. and, i respect that.
but, i am very firm about not letting those
really dorky early pots become a part of the
land fill of life.
the pots they make after the first five weeks are
really the `unskilled` first pots...not the ones
made the first day.
my students made hundreds of pots a semester.
it was just the way we did things....they learned
with mass.
once a student masters just the early stages of
clay they can make a rather nice `replica` of a
decent pot.
i have always said...`like love, you will know when
your first savers are ready to fire.`
you cannot believe the thrill when the kid comes running
across the room with a pot in their v shaped fingers..dripping
water.
`hey, mel, look, look, i can make pots`.
we keep those.
mel
http://www.visi.com/~melpots/
clayart page below:
http://www.visi.com/~melpots/clayart.html
Ben Morrison on tue 28 feb 12
One college instructor had a quota which they felt would bring students alo=
ng at a decent pace. They encouraged us to reuse the clay from pots we felt=
didn't represent the quality of work we wanted to be graded on in the midt=
erm and final quota. A dozen pots over all for a mid-term and another dozen=
for the final. These would be 4 bowls, 4 cylinders and 4 closed forms for =
instance might be a beginners quota for a final. I liked this idea, which h=
elped the students get comfortable with smashing their beloved work that be=
ginning students struggle to overcome. We had to fire our best dozen pots t=
o avoid getting an incomplete.
In contrast another instructor I took only for one term in college had no r=
eal incomplete grading method. He would give a story to the beginners about=
a student he had which used the same bag of clay over and over never keepi=
ng work. He gave the student an A for his learning efforts, but also in par=
t for his conservation effort. I personally find that this method does not =
lend to the formation of good potters.
-Ben
________________________________
From: mel jacobson
To: Clayart@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG
Sent: Tuesday, February 28, 2012 12:16 PM
Subject: firing everything.
mike gordon dropped me a line and was in
disagreement with my line about not firing those
early pots.
he does have a point. and, i respect that.
but, i am very firm about not letting those
really dorky early pots become a part of the
land fill of life.
the pots they make after the first five weeks are
really the `unskilled` first pots...not the ones
made the first day.
my students made hundreds of pots a semester.
it was just the way we did things....they learned
with mass.
once a student masters just the early stages of
clay they can make a rather nice `replica` of a
decent pot.
i have always said...`like love, you will know when
your first savers are ready to fire.`
you cannot believe the thrill when the kid comes running
across the room with a pot in their v shaped fingers..dripping
water.
`hey, mel, look, look, i can make pots`.
we keep those.
mel
http://www.visi.com/~melpots/
clayart page below:
http://www.visi.com/~melpots/clayart.html
Snail Scott on wed 29 feb 12
Throwing isn't the only part of the process that needs practice.
Why wait for excellent throwing (which takes a while) before
learning to glaze well, or discuss the design and function of
the finished work? Less-than-aequate thrown forms can still
offer a vehicle for all those other skills to be developed in
tandem. Then, when the throwing is up to snuff, the glaze
and design skills are there to meet it.
-Snail
Bruce on wed 29 feb 12
You forgot the other important skill - hammer wielding :) That should
NOT wait for adequacy in forms.
... Bruce (who should do better at that last skill)
On Wed, Feb 29, 2012 at 10:07 AM, Snail Scott w=
=3D
rote:
> Throwing isn't the only part of the process that needs practice.
> Why wait for excellent throwing (which takes a while) before
> learning to glaze well, or discuss the design and function of
> the finished work? =3DA0Less-than-aequate thrown forms can still
> offer a vehicle for all those other skills to be developed in
> tandem. Then, when the throwing is up to snuff, the glaze
> and design skills are there to meet it.
>
> =3DA0 =3DA0 =3DA0 =3DA0 =3DA0 =3DA0 =3DA0 =3DA0 =3DA0 =3DA0 =3DA0 =3DA0 =
=3DA0 =3DA0-Snail
Dale Neese on wed 29 feb 12
Waiting for excellent throwing skills won't make them come any sooner. If
you want to be a thrower of good pots then you have to throw a lot of pots.
I mean produce identical items over and over as a production potter would.
Might seem boring but you learn so much not only throwing skills but
trimming, glazing and firing. Strive to wedge, weigh each ball of clay to
the same amount. Measure for consistency of size. Put handles on dozens of
mugs. Make bowl after bowl. Pick a few glaze combinations and work
exclusively with those until you determine thickness and glaze quality.
Bisque fire the same, glaze fire, hit your marks for reduction or just rate
of temperature climb. Map it out. Afterwards you will begin to be able to
throw any shape with any amount of clay. Tweak the forms to a more pleasing
shape. Know what works for glazes in a more dependable firing kiln.
I've eliminated my hammer time. Of course I am not perfect and there are
those one or two boo-boos over time that do need to be smashed and I am OK
with that now.
Dale Tex
"Across the Alley from the Alamo"
Helotes, Texas USA
www.daleneese.com
Snail Scott on wed 29 feb 12
On Feb 29, 2012, at 9:22 AM, Bruce wrote:
> You forgot the other important skill - hammer wielding :) That should
> NOT wait for adequacy in forms...
No, those inadequate forms used for glaze practice,
etc, aren't meant to be kept. But not everything should
be slagged as greenware, either.
And it won't hurt to let beginners keep a few precious
achievements. If they continue, those early efforts will
be purged as soon as they see their improved results.
If they don't, they will still think fondly of their pottery
experience and appreciate greater skill when they see
it at art fairs, shops, and galleries. Possibly with cash
in hand.
-Snail
David Woof on thu 1 mar 12
Hi All=3D2C=3D20
=3D20
I so totally agree with what Snail is saying about first pots and the first=
=3D
glazing learning curve.
=3D20
I would only add=3D3B that once a student has gotten past the mud pie stage=
a=3D
nd can throw the rudiments of a cylinder=3D3B a good exercise is to first t=
hr=3D
ow ten 1lb cylinders in thirty minutes.(you may only get to five the first =
=3D
time but keep at it)
then when ten are mastered=3D3B do twenty in thirty minutes=3D2C and subseq=
uent=3D
ly do thirty 1lb cylinders in thirty minutes using all the clay=3D3B pulled=
u=3D
pward into the cylinder form.
=3D20
There is no point in making beginning pottery forms from anything but a goo=
=3D
d uniform cylinder. It also teaches to begin to think ahead about where to =
=3D
leave or put the clay in the cylinder for the form you have in mind as you =
=3D
advance.
=3D20
After one has finished the disciplined exercise=3D3B then and only then=3D2=
C it=3D
is time out to take a relaxing=3D2C rewarding and learning diversion to ex=
pe=3D
riment=3D2C pay attention=3D2C and push your limits to the point of or beyo=
nd c=3D
ollapse.
=3D20
Cut up half of each learning production set in the vertical to see the trut=
=3D
h of your progress and save half for bisque and glazing. Small cylinders m=
=3D
ake efficient test pieces for glaze testing and learning about the overall =
=3D
character of a glaze and one's glazing techniques. In measured strokes or p=
=3D
ours on the interior one can safely find how thick a particular glaze will =
=3D
hold on a vertical surface etc.
=3D20
An outstanding example: "Ernie" a retired Gov. official had taken some cla=
=3D
sses and became proficient in making some pretty decent pots but had never =
=3D
attempted to glaze any and "now" these good pots had become too good and pr=
=3D
ecious in his minds eye to "ruin" by poor glazing technique.
=3D20
Stumped and frustrated=3D2C in May 1981=3D2C Ernie showed up at Pigeon Lake=
for=3D
kURT Wild's Primative Firing workshop.
=3D20
He told us of his frustration of having over 400 unglazed pots filling his =
=3D
shelves.
=3D20
After the workshop=3D2C Kurt and mel=3D2C and maybe Bob=3D2C went over to E=
rnie's=3D
to teach him to glaze=3D2C and glazed pots with him until he was comfortab=
le=3D
with doing it himself.
=3D20
Be well all=3D2C
=3D20
David Woof...
=3D20
and taking my own advice...when keyboard and monitor=3D2C or the Tv and the=
c=3D
ouch look more attractive than the stool at the potters wheel=3D3B go for a=
w=3D
alk=3D2C exercise=3D2C go "twitter" with a real face to face local friend=
=3D2C ma=3D
ke love with someone special=3D2C eat some really really healthy food=3D2C =
and =3D
hike your now trim and fine ass back into the studio to make some equally t=
=3D
rim and fine pots!!!
____________________________________________________-=3D20
=3D20
5a. Re: firing everything.
Posted by: "Snail Scott" claywork@FLYING-SNAIL.COM=3D20
Date: Wed Feb 29=3D2C 2012 7:15 am ((PST))=3D20
=3D20
Throwing isn't the only part of the process that needs practice.Why wait fo=
=3D
r excellent throwing (which takes a while) beforelearning to glaze well=3D2=
C =3D
or discuss the design and function ofthe finished work? Less-than-aequate t=
=3D
hrown forms can stilloffer a vehicle for all those other skills to be devel=
=3D
oped intandem. Then=3D2C when the throwing is up to snuff=3D2C the glazeand=
des=3D
ign skills are there to meet it.-
=3D20
Snail =3D20
________________________________________________________________________it.=
=3D
>> 5d. Re: firing everything.Posted by:
"Snail Scott" claywork@FLYING-SNAIL.COM=3D20
Date: Wed Feb 29=3D2C 2012 5:18 pm ((PST))=3D20
=3D20
On Feb 29=3D2C 2012=3D2C at 9:22 AM=3D2C Bruce wrote:> You forgot the other=
impor=3D
tant skill - hammer wielding :)=3D20
=3D20
That should> NOT wait for adequacy in forms... No=3D2C those inadequate fo=
rm=3D
s used for glaze practice=3D2Cetc=3D2C aren't meant to be kept. But not eve=
ryth=3D
ing shouldbe slagged as greenware=3D2C either. And it won't hurt to let beg=
in=3D
ners keep a few preciousachievements. If they continue=3D2C those early eff=
or=3D
ts willbe purged as soon as they see their improved results.If they don't=
=3D
=3D2C they will still think fondly of their potteryexperience and appreciat=
e =3D
greater skill when they see it at art fairs=3D2C shops=3D2C and galleries. =
Poss=3D
ibly with cash in hand.=3D20
=3D20
Snail =3D
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