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mochaware

updated wed 5 jan 05

 

Elizabeth A. Ringus on fri 6 feb 98

Hey y'all!, I'm looking for information regarding mochaware.
Especially how the
"sea weed" effect is created. Is it possible to add vinegar to small
amounts of glaze to get the effect?. Most articles I have read are very
vague about the whole process - they seem to leave out key info such as
recipes and firing temps etc. Any UK potters imput would be
appreciated, since that's where mochaware originated.
Thanking you in advance for the help!
Liz :-) <><
SC
USA

Lili Krakowski on sat 7 feb 98

There was stuff on mochaware in Ceramcis Monthly some years ago--sorry I
did not keep track. Then last year on CLAYART there was more. HOWEVER:
I have found (though it smells awful) that if I boil two tea bags in 1/2
c. or so of vinegar --just bring to the boil and let steep I get a good
base. The tinting is another matter
One has to test to get the amounts one wants; I often use Shapiro Black
Stain I got out of one of E. Copper's books. The wetness of the slip one
puts the mocha on is important. Test test test. LaST: DOUBLE CHECKL THAT
YOUR GLAZE DOES NOT DISOLVE/OBLITERATE YOUR mocha. As to seaweed? I do
not know what it looks like, so cannot help. And I ahve found an
eyedropper from and India Ink bottle the best applicator. Lili Krakowski

Joyce Lee on sat 7 feb 98

This is a Robiny Hoppery sort of description of how I learned to do
mochaware. Robin probably wouldn't recognize it.

1) On a leatherhard pot add liquid engobe, rather runny, in shape of
your choice (or, in my case, Fate's choice.)
2) Shake the pot lightly, sort of like dancing with the pot. Like
marbling. Direct the liquid engobe where you want it to go.
3) When engobe is slightly set, add another engobe if you'd like. Same
directions. Shape, dancing, marbling, making engobe run where you like.
4) Have ready apple-cider vinegar pre-mixed with manganese dioxide. (I
used 2 teaspoons of manganese to 1/2 cup a.c. vinegar.
5) Dip a brush into the prepared mix, twirl brush about to get a full
load, and apply lightly to wet engobe. This should result in fernlike
or treelike patterns. Must be done rapidly and smoothly, but lightly is
the key word here.

I practice on tiles or dumpy pots. Practice was important to help
discover what patterns I liked. Most of my trees looked upside down so
I now hold the pot upside down to apply the manganese mixture. Robin
didn't have this problem. Keep in mind that I am NOT one of the
experienced, gifted potters on Clayart...but my mocha diffusion looks
pretty good.

Joyce
In the Mojave in awe of wet stuff falling from the heavens.

Stephen Mills on sun 8 feb 98

Liz,
The original Mochaware process was a complicated ritual involving stewed
tobbacco!!
A lad who worked for us wanted to have a go and more by accident than
design found that vinagar was the answer (here I go again!!)
particularly cider vinagar. This was mixed with small amounts of
Manganese Dioxide and dripped onto freshly applied white slip. The
article being treated had to be held horizontally to get the true "tree"
effect. Andy found that the best results came from Manganese, though
other finely ground oxides worked reasonably well. The process worked
because of the reaction between the acid liquid and the slip. We never
tried it with glaze, too runny, though current polymer laden brush-on
glazes which can behave like slips might prove receptive. Worth a try I
think.
Steve
Bath
UK


In message , "Elizabeth A. Ringus" writes
>----------------------------Original message----------------------------
>Hey y'all!, I'm looking for information regarding mochaware.
>Especially how the
>"sea weed" effect is created. Is it possible to add vinegar to small
>amounts of glaze to get the effect?. Most articles I have read are very
>vague about the whole process - they seem to leave out key info such as
>recipes and firing temps etc. Any UK potters imput would be
>appreciated, since that's where mochaware originated.
>Thanking you in advance for the help!
>Liz :-) <><
>SC
>USA
>

--
Steve Mills
Bath
UK
home e-mail: stevemills@mudslinger.demon.co.uk
work e-mail: stevemills@bathpotters.demon.co.uk
BPS website: http://www.bathpotters.demon.co.uk

Joyce Lee on fri 24 apr 98

This is a rerun of a post I sent back in February. Too busy with shinos
right now to refine it, but received lots of favorable response from
those who tried the process. Thanks for all the shino recipes. I'll
report later. (Karen Gringhuis, I found yours in the archives from last
June. Don't need to send unless you have new info. Thanks, friend.)

"This is a Robin Hoppery sort of description of how I learned to do
mochaware. Robin probably wouldn't recognize it.

1) On a leatherhard pot add liquid engobe, rather runny, in shape of
your choice (or, in my case, Fate's choice).
2) Shake the pot lightly, sort of like dancing with the pot. Like
marbling. Direct the liquid engobe where you want it to go.
3) When engobe is slightly set, add another engobe if you'd like. Same
directions. Shape, dancing, marbling, making engobe run where you
please.
4) Have ready apple-cider vinegar pre-mixed with manganese dioxide. (I
used 2 teaspoons of manganese to 1/2 cup a.c. vinegar.)
5) Dip a brush into the prepared mix, twirl brush about to get a full
load, and apply lightly to wet engobe. (Use a good brush OR one of those
cheapy, smallest size, foam throwaway paint things applying with edge.)
This should result in fernlike or treelike patterns. Must be done
rapidly and smoothly, but lightly is the key word here.

I practice on tiles or dumpy pots (no shortage of such in my studio).
PRACTICE was important to help discover what patterns I liked. Most of
my trees looked upside down so I now hold the pot upside down to apply
the manganese mixture. Robin didn't have this problem. Keep in mind that
I am NOT one of the experienced, gifted potters on Clayart...but my
mocha diffusion looks pretty good. In fact, I've sold all of it.

Joyce
In the Mojave

Patty Zawadzki on fri 22 jan 99

I have only recently learned about mocha ware from a book I found at =
Borders.
Unfortunately, it only told me about the general procedure and gave no
specifics. I have been unable to turn up any information locally. Does =
anyone
know anything about the specifics of the ratio of iron oxide to tobacco =
juice,
the strength of the tobacco juice, the best slip to use, turning machines or=
the
tools used to incorporate different colors of slip for cat's eyes? My =
attempts
at trouble shooting mocha ware have only resulted in streaked pots and
indistinct blotches under the celedon glaze I used. I would really =
appreciate
any help.

Erin Hayes on sat 23 jan 99

Patty,

Instead of messing with icky tobacco juice *shudder* - try using
cider vinegar instead. It smells wierd but it works great.

Erin.

Earl Brunner on sun 24 jan 99

Robin Hopper shows the process on the third video of his Making Marks series.
does not use tobacco juice, he uses vinegar, personally I think it seems a littl
cleaner.
I think he mixes some manganese dioxide, or iron or cobalt directly with the vin
into an ink type liquid and then applies that on top of colored slips that he ha
laid down first. Someone else may be able to be a little more specific.
Earl Brunner

Patty Zawadzki wrote:

> ----------------------------Original message----------------------------
> I have only recently learned about mocha ware from a book I found at Borders.
> Unfortunately, it only told me about the general procedure and gave no
> specifics. I have been unable to turn up any information locally. Does anyone
> know anything about the specifics of the ratio of iron oxide to tobacco juice,
> the strength of the tobacco juice, the best slip to use, turning machines or t
> tools used to incorporate different colors of slip for cat's eyes? My attempts
> at trouble shooting mocha ware have only resulted in streaked pots and
> indistinct blotches under the celedon glaze I used. I would really appreciate
> any help.

Ben Shelton on sun 24 jan 99

The way I learned to do this technique envolved using acetic acid(pronounced
vinegar) in one of te two colored slips. We also made our slips from the
clay body we used by passing the slip through a sieve of about 60 mesh. The
process was called mocha diffusion.. Good luck and it was real easy, Ben
-----Original Message-----
From: Patty Zawadzki
To: CLAYART@LSV.UKY.EDU
Date: Friday, January 22, 1999 9:47 AM
Subject: Mochaware


----------------------------Original message----------------------------
I have only recently learned about mocha ware from a book I found at
Borders.
Unfortunately, it only told me about the general procedure and gave no
specifics. I have been unable to turn up any information locally. Does
anyone
know anything about the specifics of the ratio of iron oxide to tobacco
juice,
the strength of the tobacco juice, the best slip to use, turning machines or
the
tools used to incorporate different colors of slip for cat's eyes? My
attempts
at trouble shooting mocha ware have only resulted in streaked pots and
indistinct blotches under the celedon glaze I used. I would really
appreciate
any help.

C. A. Sanger on mon 25 jan 99

Use coffee or tobacco to make 'tea.' (Cigar stubs are good.) Shread
the tobacco in a small pot. Add just enough boiling water to cover.
Steep an hour. Strain and discard the residue. Add a dark ceramic
colorant or underglaze. (Don't use copper--it diffuses in firing.) To
apply, dip the greenware in a contrasting slip. Immediately sponge
surplus slip from pot base. Holding the piece inverted, very lightly
touch a tea-charged, large, soft banding brush to it. With good brush
control and deft pot minipulation, the fluid runs fown to form
bare-tree-like forms. A quick, sideways stroke joins 'trees' with
'hedgerows.'

Assumption Abbey on mon 25 jan 99

At 23:59 1/24/99 EST, you wrote:
>----------------------------Original message----------------------------
>The way I learned to do this technique envolved using acetic acid(pronounced
>vinegar) in one of te two colored slips. We also made our slips from the
>clay body we used by passing the slip through a sieve of about 60 mesh. The
>process was called mocha diffusion.. Good luck and it was real easy, Ben
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Patty Zawadzki
>To: CLAYART@LSV.UKY.EDU
>Date: Friday, January 22, 1999 9:47 AM
>Subject: Mochaware
>

Dear Ben,

I tried this mocha process a year ago maybe two years ago and while it did
turn out lovely on the bisque ware when i high fired it- burned off. I
guess it is not a process for cone 9 and am still waiting to try it some
other time at a lower cone. Any input on what temp and this must make a
difference as it is sublte and will 'fire out' if too hot.

Llewellyn







>
>----------------------------Original message----------------------------
>I have only recently learned about mocha ware from a book I found at
>Borders.
>Unfortunately, it only told me about the general procedure and gave no
>specifics. I have been unable to turn up any information locally. Does
>anyone
>know anything about the specifics of the ratio of iron oxide to tobacco
>juice,
>the strength of the tobacco juice, the best slip to use, turning machines or
>the
>tools used to incorporate different colors of slip for cat's eyes? My
>attempts
>at trouble shooting mocha ware have only resulted in streaked pots and
>indistinct blotches under the celedon glaze I used. I would really
>appreciate
>any help.
>

Gregory D Lamont on mon 25 jan 99

Hi Patty,

When doing mochaware, I found a big difference between vinegars. The
diffusions are MUCH better when the oxide or stain is mixed with natural
vinegar--the kind with the "mother" at the bottom of the bottle--than the
typical vinegar from the grocery store. Natural vinegar is available at
health food stores.


At 07:33 AM 1/22/99 -0500, you wrote:
>----------------------------Original message----------------------------
>I have only recently learned about mocha ware from a book I found at =
>Borders.
>Unfortunately, it only told me about the general procedure and gave no
>specifics. I have been unable to turn up any information locally. Does =
>anyone
>know anything about the specifics of the ratio of iron oxide to tobacco =
>juice,
>the strength of the tobacco juice, the best slip to use, turning machines or=
> the
>tools used to incorporate different colors of slip for cat's eyes? My =
>attempts
>at trouble shooting mocha ware have only resulted in streaked pots and
>indistinct blotches under the celedon glaze I used. I would really =
>appreciate
>any help.

Greg Lamont
gdlamont@iastate.edu
http://www.ourwebpage.net/greglamont/

Lili Krakowski on mon 25 jan 99

there was a lot on this last year BUT FORGET THE TOBACCO BIT BECAUSE THAT
IS POISONOUS. VINEGAR WORKS EXTREMELY WELL. I TRY FOR A 5 OR 7% VINEGAR
which may require a more gourmetsy kind than usual supermarket type. Or
you can put regualr vinegar in dish let evaporate a bit. Add colorants
test. I drop with eyedropper onto still shiny slip. AS EVER; TEST TEST
TEST till you hand and your eye cooperate for the look you want.

Lili Krakowski

Schapansky on mon 25 jan 99

One thing that doesn't seem to work for me is to use a clear glaze over the
mocha decorations.....this always results in some rather unattractive brown
streaks and little else. So if you are doing the mocha ware and want the
piece to be functional (as in food safe)....glaze the inside with a food
safe glaze and leave the decoration unglazed on the outside.

Elizabeth

the cat lady on tue 26 jan 99

Assumption Abbey wrote:

> Dear Ben,
>
> I tried this mocha process a year ago maybe two years ago and while it did
> turn out lovely on the bisque ware when i high fired it- burned off. I
> guess it is not a process for cone 9 and am still waiting to try it some
> other time at a lower cone. Any input on what temp and this must make a
> difference as it is sublte and will 'fire out' if too hot.
>
> Llewellyn

Mocha diffusion pattern fade is not governed by heat - it is a factor of the
colourant used; and what/if any, glaze is used over top.

I experimented for quite a while with mocha diffusion. Manganese with no
overglaze works wonderfully, as does RIO. If you want to put a clear glaze over
I suggest using cobalt oxide as the colourant, and a non-zinc containing clear
glaze over top. Even so, the cobalt will bleed a bit into the glaze.

I've used stains, oxides and carbonates in the vinegar. All have diffused
equally well in the slip. All have survived pattern clearly intact to a hard ^1
firing (I fire to ^10 almost touching.) BTW, copper burns out :-(

Hope some of this helps. Doesn't pay to invent the wheel twice ;-)

--
sam - alias the cat lady
Melbourne, Ontario
SW Ontario CANADA
http://www.geocities.com/paris/3110
scuttell@odyssey.on.ca

"Thousands of years ago, cats were worshipped as gods.
Cats have never forgotten this."

MR WENDELL R RIDENOUR on tue 2 feb 99

Thank you very much for the Mocha Glaze rec. I have to do this for A
class project..
Do you know if this will be safe to eat or drink out of it after it
is fired? or should it be for a decorative pot.(like the outside)?

Also what cone? gas or electric etc! etc!......Thanks again

Carenza Hayhoe on wed 20 oct 99

------------------
I want to say a big thank you to you all - at the end of the day when the =
house
is quiet I come and open my mail and suddenly the world seems to be full of
friendly people. I'm pretty new to this www stuff and getting a web page =
sorted
has been quite a tough assignment (I was determined to do it myself) so I =
really
would be very grateful for criticisms and suggestions. I have noted every
mention of mochaware in the last few months and I would love to hear from =
anyone
who is interested in it, both the history and contemporary practice.

I can't claim to be a new kid on the block, I'm not a kid anymore even if I
often feel like one, and I have looked over the wall a couple of times =
already.
I just wanted to say it's just wonderful to know that you are all out there =
- if
any of you are ever passing this way you would be very welcome, the kettle =
is
always on.

Best wishes to you all - Carenza
www.mochaware.com

Karen Hein on thu 21 oct 99

I've worked with Mochaware for the past year or so. Love the results. I
have used it on mainly functional ware. A few pieces that hang on the wall,
as well. I attended a workshop of Irma Starr doing 17th century slip
decorating and picked it up there, along with lots of other things.
You're welcome to get in touch off clayart for deeper discussion.
Karen

Marie Tedesco Folderman on sun 21 jul 02


Hello from steaming NC.,

Have been surfing the web and came upon "mochaware".
THere is a fellow named Carpentier, which was very
interesting , as that was my grandfather's
surname...any way, from what I read this is a
technique that he does.
The base glaze of the pot is beautiful...creamy....can
not find this receipe anywhere though. John or
Ron...would this be similar to your bone glaze in your
book? It looks abit more "pearly" looking to me
though.
Any info that you can send my way would be
appreciated.

Be blessed, Marie

=====
Walk in Beauty.......always

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Health - Feel better, live better
http://health.yahoo.com

Dorie Mickelson on sat 1 jan 05


Hey Kate, I recently saw a demonstration by a wonderful potter who makes
a lot of mochaware and he used a fresh bag of chewing tobacco as his
source. Don't know if an old dried out cigarette would work or not, but
the fresh chewing tobacco (I think it was Redman) worked wonders...I
think it would be worth the extra couple of bucks to go that
route...also, a cool test he did was to dip a rib into white slip and
then apply the mocha solution to that first to see how it worked...so
you don't have to test your solution on an actual pot...

Dorie Mickelson in Ann Arbor, Michigan, wishing everyone a happy New
Year!

www.FreeSpiritCreations.com

From: Kate Johnson

Subject: another arcane question...mochaware

I'm getting ready to try some mochaware, with those interesting mossy
shapes in the glaze made with tobacco juice, among other things. Any
reason why this needs to be a FRESH cigarette, do you suppose? I bought
a pack around 6 years ago to do another weird craft thing with, still
have them. Has anyone tried this? I don't want to be penny wise and
pound foolish here...a pack of cigarettes doesn't cost THAT much.

pam on sat 1 jan 05


I did my first round of mochaware today. (Funny how several of us can be
testing the same waters at the same time!) I used white vinegar, as that
was what was on hand, and for colorants in my mocha teas, I did one with a
green mason stain tempered with pinches of rutile, RIO, and titanium just
to get it to a shade I liked. Then I did strait titanium, and strait rutile.
The diffusion was not bad for a first attempt; I think it will turn out
well.
BUT! Do not do what I did. I put nice pulled handles on my cups before I
dipped them in the slip. For about an hour all was well, I had finished all
the playing with the mocha, and was on
to throwing more pots, with my creations in front of my wheel, when the
handles started breaking apart and falling off. One by one, all seven
handles fell.
All is not lost, I will clean them up and put new handles on when they are
dry enough, but
man! What a lame thing for me to do, I should know better, but I was just so
eager to play!

Pam, bringing in the new year with a kiln load firing and pulling (more)
handles and playing with new (old) techniques

Meg Smeal on sun 2 jan 05


There is a fabulous article entitled "slip decoration in the age of
industrialization" written by Donald Carpentier and Jonathan Rickard in the book
CERAMICS IN AMERICA edited by Robert Hunter and published by the Chipstone
Foundation -

Donald is a master in researching and reproducing ALL the early slipware
techniques including Mochaware and the book contains step-by-step photos of the
process - a must read if you are interested in any of these procedures -

Meg Smeal

Kate Johnson on sun 2 jan 05


Meg, another question...

> There is a fabulous article entitled "slip decoration in the age of
> industrialization" written by Donald Carpentier and Jonathan Rickard in
> the book
> CERAMICS IN AMERICA edited by Robert Hunter and published by the Chipstone
> Foundation -

There appears to have been a yearly publication of this...the 2003 edition
doesn't mention Don Carpentier. Could you have the 2002 or another year?

Many thanks...

Best--
Kate

Meg Smeal on mon 3 jan 05


oops - sorry I didn't clarify that - the Ceramics in America with the
slipware info is 2001! has it been that long? wow - sorry about the incomplete
info -

Another article in this issue that may be of interest is "Dots, Dashes, and
Squiggles: Early English Slipware Technology" - the rest of the issue is
mostly devoted to ceramic history -

There appears to have been a yearly publication of thisIn a message dated
1/3/2005 12:13:09 AM Eastern Standard Time, LISTSERV@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG writes:

...the 2003 edition
doesn't mention Don Carpentier. Could you have the 2002 or another year?

Kate Johnson on tue 4 jan 05


Hi Pam!


> I did my first round of mochaware today. (Funny how several of us can be
> testing the same waters at the same time!) I used white vinegar, as that
> was what was on hand, and for colorants in my mocha teas, I did one with a
> green mason stain tempered with pinches of rutile, RIO, and titanium just
> to get it to a shade I liked. Then I did strait titanium, and strait
> rutile.
> The diffusion was not bad for a first attempt; I think it will turn out
> well.

I didn't get much effect with the vinegar, almost no branching or
spreading--tobacco tea really did the job for me, FWIW. And the amount of
colorant given in the recipes wasn't enough--things looked very pale and
uninteresting. I know they'll show up more when fired, because the gray
earthenware will fire white, but still, pretty wuusy.

> BUT! Do not do what I did. I put nice pulled handles on my cups before I
> dipped them in the slip. For about an hour all was well, I had finished
> all
> the playing with the mocha, and was on
> to throwing more pots, with my creations in front of my wheel, when the
> handles started breaking apart and falling off. One by one, all seven
> handles fell.

Oooooh, no! And yes, slip makes things VERY wet again, and heavy as well.
I've run into problems not allowing things to dry properly or trying to move
them too quickly when they're still quite wet. sometimes they develop big
wet cracks, sometimes elements fall off, sometimes they collapse altogether.

Had to laugh at Tony Clennell's post tonight, where he wrote "The trick with
colouring slips is to use the phrase "excess is never enough".

Glad you clarified that to mean the colorant, Tony! Excess turns things
almost into soup, if you mean a really wet, thick slip layer.

Good luck with the mochaware, Pam, we'll have to keep one another up on how
it goes!

Best--
Kate