Sumi von Dassow on wed 22 aug 12
Neil
can't get gillespie hereabouts right now since gerstley is available
again. I came up with recipes using it and now I can't make them! Laguna
doesn't stock it, apparently, or perhaps it isn't being made currently?
Sumi
> Stop using Gerstley! It has been too inconsistent and problematic for too=
long,
> and will continue to do so until it runs out. Switch to Gillespie Borate.=
It is a frit,
> so it's 100% consistent. You may have to make some small adjustments to y=
our
> formula, but once you do it's good to go forever.
>
>
Carl Ross on wed 22 aug 12
Those of you on facebook and part of the "Clay and Glaze Recipe Sharing"=3D=
20=3D
group, have likely seen the pictures of floating blue that has been actin=
=3D
g up....=3D20
I posted some, and then another potter (Libby Hoffman) mentioned the same=
=3D
=3D20
sorts of trouble.... Could Gerstley be ghastly once again?? I remember h=
=3D
earing=3D20
the troubles people were having due to it a number of years ago and paid =
=3D
little=3D20
attention because glaze mixing was well beyond my budget and usage.=3D20=3D=
20=3D
So, now that I've acquired enough ingredients, it just so happens that th=
=3D
e first=3D20
batch of glaze I chose, was floating blue...=3D20
Nepheline Syenite: 48.00
Gerstley Borate: 26.00
Flint: 20.00
EPK: 6.00
Total: 100.00=3D20
Add:
Rutile: 4.00 %
Red Iron Oxide: 2.00 %
Cobalt Oxide: 1.00 % (Used 1.6% cobalt Carb)
I went light on the coat I put on there. I know from other studios I've =
=3D
worked=3D20
at, floating blue was a runner to begin with.... so I stuck with a singl=
=3D
e coat a=3D20
little thick on the rims for effect
One of my bowls you can see that on the outer wall, the thick part slid d=
=3D
own=3D20
on parts and has thick drops still clinging to the bowl... other chunks d=
=3D
ripped=3D20
on the shelf thick ~1/8" thick drop the size of a quarter... beautiful=3D20=
=3D
decoration... I overall went light on the glaze compared to the pics Libb=
=3D
y=3D20
posted... hers=3D20
Not sure if this link will work in here, but these are some pics I put on=
=3D
FB
https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?
set=3D3Da.4092543365325.155525.1635025595&type=3D3D1&l=3D3Dad7183c5b0
others online said slightly increasing the other clay and decreasing the =
=3D
gerstley=3D20
might help
Any thoughts??
-Carl
Neil Estrick on wed 22 aug 12
Stop using Gerstley! It has been too inconsistent and problematic for too=
=3D
long,=3D20
and will continue to do so until it runs out. Switch to Gillespie Borate.=
=3D
It is a frit,=3D20
so it's 100% consistent. You may have to make some small adjustments to y=
=3D
our=3D20
formula, but once you do it's good to go forever.
Paul Herman on wed 22 aug 12
Regarding Gerstle borate:
On Aug 22, 2012, at 7:40 AM, Neil Estrick wrote:
> Stop using Gerstley! It has been too inconsistent and problematic
> for too long,
> and will continue to do so until it runs out. Switch to Gillespie
> Borate. It is a frit,
> so it's 100% consistent. You may have to make some small adjustments
> to your
> formula, but once you do it's good to go forever.
Neil, this is baloney. GB is a fine naturally occurring mineral that
has boron in a mostly insoluble form, just like frits do. I have used
it for more than 40 years with good consistent results. Laguna has a
ten year stockpile of one run from the mine. It's good stuff! If you
are worried about consistency, get yourself 50 or 100 pounds and you
can have a consistent supply for many years.
You think Gillespie borate will be available forever? Trusting, aren't
you?
Best wishes,
Paul Herman
Great Basin Pottery
Doyle, California US
www.greatbasinpottery.com/
Steve Slatin on wed 22 aug 12
Carl -- that's not the recipe that I use, but I note several things --=3D0A=
=3D
=3DA0=3D0A1 - the clay you're using may be an issue; the groggier, less smo=
oth =3D
=3D0Aclays often do that kind of thing with some FB recipes=3D0A=3DA0=3D0A2=
- tryin=3D
g to apply too thin a layer of glaze can be an issue.=3DA0 If=3D0Ayou don't=
use=3D
a suspension agent, settling with a thin-mix glaze=3D0Acan do this sort of=
t=3D
hing=3D0A=3DA0=3D0A3 - Gerstley has reportedly been an issue.=3DA0 I'm doin=
g some t=3D
ests=3D0Anow with new gerstley, old gerstley that I got from a nearby =3D0A=
pott=3D
er, Gillespie Borate and Frit 3134.=3DA0 the last two are extremely=3D0Acon=
sist=3D
ent, in my experience.=3D0A=3D0ASteve Slatin -- =3D0A=3D0A=3D0AN48.0886450=
=3D0AW123.142=3D
0482=3D0A=3D0A=3D0A________________________________=3D0AFrom: Carl Ross ross.az@=3D
GMAIL.COM>=3D0ATo: Clayart@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG =3D0ASent: Tuesday, August 21, =
2012=3D
10:52 PM=3D0ASubject: Is Gerstley ghastly once again??? got them Floating =
Bl=3D
ues=3D0A=3D0AThose of you on facebook and part of the "Clay and Glaze Recip=
e Sh=3D
aring" =3D0Agroup, have likely seen the pictures of floating blue that has =
be=3D
en acting up.... =3D0AI posted some, and then another potter (Libby Hoffman=
) =3D
mentioned the same =3D0Asorts of trouble....=3DA0 Could Gerstley be ghastly=
onc=3D
e again?? I remember hearing =3D0Athe troubles people were having due to it=
a=3D
number of years ago and paid little =3D0Aattention because glaze mixing wa=
s =3D
well beyond my budget and usage.=3DA0 =3D0A=3D0ASo, now that I've acquired =
enough=3D
ingredients, it just so happens that the first =3D0Abatch of glaze I chose=
, =3D
was floating blue... =3D0A=3D0ANepheline Syenite: 48.00=3D0AGerstley Borate=
: 26.0=3D
0=3D0AFlint: 20.00=3D0AEPK: 6.00=3D0ATotal: 100.00 =3D0A=3D0AAdd:=3D0A=3D0A=
Rutile: 4.00 %=3D
=3D0ARed Iron Oxide: 2.00 %=3D0ACobalt Oxide: 1.00 % (Used 1.6% cobalt Carb=
)=3D0A=3D
=3D0A=3D0AI went light on the coat I put on there.=3DA0 I know from other s=
tudios=3D
I've worked =3D0Aat, floating blue was a runner to begin with....=3DA0 so =
I st=3D
uck with a single coat a =3D0Alittle thick on the rims for effect=3D0A=3D0A=
One of=3D
my bowls you can see that on the outer wall, the thick part slid down =3D0=
Ao=3D
n parts and has thick drops still clinging to the bowl... other chunks drip=
=3D
ped =3D0Aon the shelf thick ~1/8" thick drop the size of a quarter... beaut=
if=3D
ul =3D0Adecoration... I overall went light on the glaze compared to the pic=
s =3D
Libby =3D0Aposted... hers =3D0A=3D0ANot sure if this link will work in here=
, but =3D
these are some pics I put on FB=3D0A=3D0Ahttps://www.facebook.com/media/set=
/?=3D
=3D0Aset=3D3Da.4092543365325.155525.1635025595&type=3D3D1&l=3D3Dad7183c5b0=
=3D0A=3D0Aoth=3D
ers online said slightly increasing the other clay and decreasing the gerst=
=3D
ley =3D0Amight help=3D0A=3D0AAny thoughts??=3D0A=3D0A-Carl
Steve Slatin on thu 23 aug 12
Sumi --=3D0A=3DA0=3D0AI've had similar problems when I've been out of Washi=
ngton =3D
state.=3D0ASome local dealers become wholly reliant on a single supplier --=
=3D
=3D0Aand if that supplier is Laguna, for example, and they decide to=3D0Aca=
rry =3D
just a few dry materials for a particular class of work, and=3D0Athey decid=
e =3D
(understandably) what they supply is best, other =3D0Athings won't be avail=
ab=3D
le.=3D0A=3DA0=3D0AIf you push your supplier over a period of months to obta=
in the=3D
=3D0Amaterial you want, and find for them a source, you may be able=3D0Ato =
get =3D
them to carry it for you.=3DA0 I discovered that by being=3D0Asociable with=
the=3D
manager, at the supplier in San Antonio=3D0Ayou can get Alberta Slip if yo=
u =3D
remind them they can get it=3D0Afrom Armadillo ... though it is a little co=
st=3D
ly.=3DA0 (The people at=3D0AClayWorld are extremely helpful.)=3D0A=3DA0=3D0=
AEspeciall=3D
y when dealing with a only-game-in-town supplier,=3D0Asome 'management up' =
ma=3D
y be necessary.=3D0A=3D0ASteve Slatin -- =3D0A=3D0A=3D0AN48.0886450=3D0AW12=
3.1420482=3D0A=3D
=3D0A=3D0A________________________________=3D0A=3D0ANeil=3D0A=3D0Acan't get=
gillespie h=3D
ereabouts right now since gerstley is available=3D0Aagain. I came up with r=
ec=3D
ipes using it and now I can't make them! Laguna=3D0Adoesn't stock it, appar=
en=3D
tly, or perhaps it isn't being made currently?=3D0A=3D0ASumi=3D0A> Stop usi=
ng Ger=3D
stley! It has been too inconsistent and problematic for too long,=3D0A> and=
w=3D
ill continue to do so until it runs out. Switch to Gillespie Borate. It is =
=3D
a frit,=3D0A> so it's 100% consistent. You may have to make some small adju=
st=3D
ments to your=3D0A> formula, but once you do it's good to go forever.=3D0A
Julie Brooks on thu 23 aug 12
Hello All,
You can find the pertinent information about the present chemical
composition of Gerstley Borate and pictures of pieces glazed with the
traditional =3DE2=3D80=3D9CFloating Blue=3DE2=3D80=3D9D glaze formulated wi=
th the cur=3D
rent supply* of
Gerstley and the results were excellent.
http://www.lagunaclay.com/support/
then choose "Chemical Composition of Gerstley Borate"
The supply* will last for many years, and because it is a stockpile (not =
=3D
a
changing source from an active mine) the chemical analysis will remain qu=
=3D
ite
consistent.=3D20
*3000 tons or 6,000,000 pounds as of 6/18/2011
Since the chemical composition will remain consistent...it is worth you=
=3D
r
time to tweek the formula for your desired result...if you need help cont=
=3D
act
Juan@lagunaclay.com
Thanks,
Julie
Neil Estrick on thu 23 aug 12
You can get Gillespie Borate from Ceramic Supply Chicago, Standard, Highw=
=3D
ater,=3D20
Continental and others.
Neil Estrick on thu 23 aug 12
I've got 3 different entries in my glaze calculation software for Gerstle=
=3D
y Borate,=3D20
dated 1989, 1992 and 1997. All 3 are different. Substantially so in some =
=3D
areas of=3D20
content. So no, Gerstley is not a consistent material. And if you want=3D20=
=3D
consistency in your work, you should not be using it IMHO. Gillespie Bora=
=3D
te is=3D20
consistent, like any Frit. It doesn't match up exactly with any of the Ge=
=3D
rstley=3D20
formulas I have, but it's in their range. The Gillespie is slightly lower=
=3D
in boron=3D20
the the Gerstleys, and higher in calcium. Of course, they probably tested=
=3D
their=3D20
own supply of Gerstley, which was different than the 3 batches my numbers=
=3D
=3D20
came from.
Hamill and Gillespie did tests with their borate on Floating Blue. The re=
=3D
sults can=3D20
be found at:
http://www.hamgil.com/assets/documents/GB_fact_sheet.pdf
Like with most glazes I have tested, the Gillespie Borate causes a bit mo=
=3D
re=3D20
fluidity in the glaze. So I generally back it off by 2% or so.
ronroy@CA.INTER.NET on thu 23 aug 12
Hi Carl,
Here are a couple I reformulated years ago - I never tested them but =3D20
- if I remember correctly - they work - but do test a small amount =3D20
first to see if they are suitable.
NEPH SY..................... 28.00
F3278....................... 13.50
F3134....................... 22.00
TALC........................ 4.00
EPK......................... 19.50
SILICA...................... 13.00
=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3=
D
100.00
NEPH SY..................... 26.00
F3278....................... 13.50
F3134....................... 21.00
TALC........................ 4.00
OM-4........................ 27.00
SILICA...................... 8.50
=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3D=3D3=
D
100.00
RR
> From: Carl Ross
> To: Clayart@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG
> Sent: Tuesday, August 21, 2012 10:52 PM
> Subject: Is Gerstley ghastly once again??? got them Floating Blues
>
> Those of you on facebook and part of the "Clay and Glaze Recipe Sharing=
=3D
"
> group, have likely seen the pictures of floating blue that has been =3D20
> acting up....
> I posted some, and then another potter (Libby Hoffman) mentioned the sa=
=3D
me
> sorts of trouble....=3DA0 Could Gerstley be ghastly once again?? I =3D20
> remember hearing
> the troubles people were having due to it a number of years ago and =3D20
> paid little
> attention because glaze mixing was well beyond my budget and usage.=3DA0
>
> So, now that I've acquired enough ingredients, it just so happens =3D20
> that the first
> batch of glaze I chose, was floating blue...
>
> Nepheline Syenite: 48.00
> Gerstley Borate: 26.00
> Flint: 20.00
> EPK: 6.00
> Total: 100.00
>
> Add:
>
> Rutile: 4.00 %
> Red Iron Oxide: 2.00 %
> Cobalt Oxide: 1.00 % (Used 1.6% cobalt Carb)
>
>
> I went light on the coat I put on there.=3DA0 I know from other studios =
=3D20
> I've worked
> at, floating blue was a runner to begin with....=3DA0 so I stuck with a =
=3D20
> single coat a
> little thick on the rims for effect
>
> One of my bowls you can see that on the outer wall, the thick part slid=
=3D
down
> on parts and has thick drops still clinging to the bowl... other =3D20
> chunks dripped
> on the shelf thick ~1/8" thick drop the size of a quarter... beautiful
> decoration... I overall went light on the glaze compared to the pics Li=
=3D
bby
> posted... hers
>
> Not sure if this link will work in here, but these are some pics I put =
=3D
on FB
>
> https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?
> set=3D3Da.4092543365325.155525.1635025595&type=3D3D1&l=3D3Dad7183c5b0
>
> others online said slightly increasing the other clay and decreasing =3D2=
0
> the gerstley
> might help
>
> Any thoughts??
>
> -Carl
>
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