Foresthrt on thu 23 apr 98
I'm far from expert or even experienced at such things, but I have had no
problems with glaze samples chips I cut from my white, tan, and dark brown
clays made into a loaf, so that each slice had 1/3 of each color clay on which
to test glazes. All the clays involved have highly similar shrinkage rates,
which I would expect to be essential, as well as the amount of water in the
clay/softness needing to be relatively alike.
I have also wedged scraps of these clays together, stopping before they are
blended, and have thrown and fired the resulting marbled clay without trouble.
If you don't know any better, sometimes that really helps!
Mary
foresthrt@aol.com
Barney Adams on fri 28 aug 98
Hi,
The subject line probably misleads the direction of this
question. I threw two pots the other night. Each of a diffrent
clay body. Nothing special about the pots themselves. It was
more therapy throwing. As the two pots sat bside one another
on their bats I thought the two would fit togeather nicely
to make a very nice pot. I know the problem of joining the
two diffrent clay bodies, but just because I should'nt does'nt
always stop me.... I joined them and used some of each body
inside and out to help smooth the join. I have the pot covered
in plastic to slow the drying. If the shrinkage is'nt too diffrent
and they appear to dry okay is there any suggestions on firing.
I really like what I got out of two very mediocre pieces. It's
also the first time I've tried joining two pieces.
Barney
Andrew Buck on sat 29 aug 98
Barney,
Whatever anyone tells you on this subject, remember, what works, works.
In this, as well as most things in life, good judgement comes from
experience. And the most useful experience usually comes from something
less than the best judgement. Good for you. In trying something you are
not sure of, you are gaining the best kind of knowledge.
In answer to your question though, I join different clay bodies quite a
bit. I generally have pretty good success and don't give the pots any
special handling. The difference in shrinkage of the clays seems to be
the key though.
Andy Buck
Raincreek Pottery
Port Orchard, Washington
On Fri, 28 Aug 1998, Barney Adams wrote:
> ----------------------------Original message----------------------------
> Hi,
> The subject line probably misleads the direction of this
> question. I threw two pots the other night. Each of a diffrent
> clay body. Nothing special about the pots themselves. It was
> more therapy throwing. As the two pots sat bside one another
> on their bats I thought the two would fit togeather nicely
> to make a very nice pot. I know the problem of joining the
> two diffrent clay bodies, but just because I should'nt does'nt
> always stop me.... I joined them and used some of each body
> inside and out to help smooth the join. I have the pot covered
> in plastic to slow the drying. If the shrinkage is'nt too diffrent
> and they appear to dry okay is there any suggestions on firing.
> I really like what I got out of two very mediocre pieces. It's
> also the first time I've tried joining two pieces.
>
> Barney
>
marc mancuso on sat 29 aug 98
>----------------------------Original message----------------------------
>I threw two pots [of] diffrent
>clay [bodies and] I joined them and used some of each body
>inside and out to help smooth the join....
Hi Barney,
Sounds very interesting. Good luck keeping the shouldnts and cants at
arm's length. What's amazing is that just this past week, I made plans to
try similar two-body experiments on the wheel. I'm thinking of something
different from the wedge and swirl affair. This weekend should be busy for
me, trying things out.
I'm tempted to ask *which* clay bodies you're combining. My initial
thought was to grog up both bodies I have (one light and one dark) to
lessen any existing physical differences, with the hopes that it wouldn't
interfere with the glaze relationship. Never mind the fact that to add
enough grog into really incompatible bodies, hoping to convince them to
play nice together, you'd end up with bodies that tear your hands up at the
wheel.
Of course, cooling glaze might cause cracks in what was a solid bisqued
pot. If we let go of the idea of making foodsafe and waterproof vessels in
this way, some cracks and other "strata" between clay seams might be
attractive, so long as the pot holds itself together.
Good luck, and I'll share results if you will (grin).
bye
Marc
Marc Mancuso
mmancuso@mit.edu
http://web.mit.edu/mmancuso/www/
"Never wrestle with a pig: You both get all dirty, and the pig likes it."
Milton Markey on sun 30 aug 98
Hi Barney!
I've been mixing clay bodies to make sculptures and handbuilt wares. I either
wedge the two bodies together well, or I wedge lightly and let the marbled
effect show.
There are some caveats in mixing clay bodies:
Many porcelans and whiteware clays don't mix well together, with other types
of clay. I think this might be related to the kaolin content of these clays.
Mix high-fire with high-fire! Mixing an earthenware clay with a high-fire clay
is risky--and may cause your piece to bloat.
My successful mixtures(I "guesstimate" the amount of each clay to wedge
together) : Rods Bod with Black Mountain, Soldate 60 with Black Mountain,
Soldate 60 and Rods Bod. And, you guessed it, Rods Bod, Soldate 60, and Black
Mountain. These are all cone 10 clays, which are available in California, at
the major suppliers.
In general, stay with "yellow" and "brown" clays for best mixing results.
Others reading this string may want to contribute other clay bodies which mix
well together.
The best word in my clay vocabulary is EXPERIMENT. Letting a prohibiting inner
voice rule robs one of the delights in ceramics. It's best to try out an
unknown combination in small pieces, such as test tiles or, like you did, with
pots made for experimentation.
Best wishes to you!
Milton MiltonsLin@AOL.COM
A truly hot day. I'm waiting for sundown, by the swamp cooler!
Barney Adams on sun 30 aug 98
Thanks to all who responded,
I threw 4 other pots and joined them to form 2 tall forms, but used the same
body. They
dont look as nice as the first one. The unplanned forms always seem to end up
the best.
They are bisque firing now. I'll let you know how it works out.
Barney
Christie Lucero on mon 7 jun 04
I'm having great luck with reclaimed clay from scraps from three =
low-fire clay bods, really produced the clay of my dreams. Yup, probably =
non-exactly repeatable... but I'm enjoying it while I can. Several 5 =
gallon scrap buckets were aged/frozen/infused w. flora and fauna on my =
porch, then soaked in a pillowcase and dried out on the cement slab over =
the old septic tank. A stately version of the Hokey-Pokey was used to =
foot-wedge them. Nothing's been glazed yet but the stuff threw like a =
dream and came through a bique firing, which included a power outage, =
like champs.
I had just about steeled myself to buying a pug mill this last winter =
when the sales force at New Mexico Clay gave me a stern talking-to about =
the economics of even a used mill for the amount of clay I was using. =
Anyway, just musing.
We stopped by Horseshoe Lake on the White Mountain Apache Res yesterday =
, the trout were biting even in the afternoon. Fishing looks very good.
Christie Lucero
Snowlion Fine Arts
Coyote Creek, NM
Deborah Thuman on sun 1 jun 08
I've done that when I wanted to throw marble type things. I've mixed a
white body with the Laguna brown both ^6. Turned out fine. Years ago,
I mixed two ^6 bodies so I could get a brown and white marble - worked
out fine.
Just make sure the clays are all the same ^ temp.
Deb Thuman
http://debthumansblog.blogspot.com/
Eric Hansen on mon 2 jun 08
Dina: Grogged clay seems to mix well just by wedging. Porcelain scrap I'd hold for porcelain scrap projects, like handbuilding or making small animal figurines, something of that order, until you get the pug mill.
I've done this: Cedar Heights Gold Art can be used 100% for a cone 5 clay body, just add grog. 5%? If you get the water to clay ratio right you don't even have to pug. You can throw your B-mix scrap, etc., in there too. Or some good local clay. You can mix your clay in a mortar mixing pan available from the hardware store, with a shovel. About 50 # bag of clay & 25 pounds of water or something like that. It stiffens overnight. Steven Hill used to use an old bath tub to make up his stoneware this way, just mixing dry clay & adding water. Wear a NIOSH breathing respirator tho. The next step was that he pugged all his clay the following day. I think he made like a 1000#'s each time this way. Cedar Heights recommends a clay called Roseville for a single component body, however. Gold Art is just easier to buy. Without a pug mill you will have to wedge the clay. For cone 9 electric clay about 50% gold art and 50% good fireclay. One of the advantages to mixing
your own clay is that you know the formula so that when you go to testing glazes you aren't dealing with all these unknowns. And you save money too. XX Sagger makes a good cone 10 body, as does Hawthorn Bond Clay, both without too much shrinkage. (So I'm told) If you are making a coil pot you just mix the clay and water with your fingers as you make your coils. This is the Standard Operating Proceedure in the Southwest and across the border.
H A N S E N
DIY Potter/Free Glazer/Crazed Dripster/& Wandering Poet
americanpotter.blogspot.com
--- On Sat, 5/31/08, D Barnese wrote:
> From: D Barnese
> Subject: [CLAYART] Mixing clay bodies
> To: CLAYART@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG
> Date: Saturday, May 31, 2008, 1:41 PM
> Hi folks,
>
> Good to have Clayart back.
>
> I use two different cone 5 clay bodies, both from Laguna:
> B-Mix and
> Dover White.
>
> Right now, I keep my trim scraps in separate buckets, with
> the plan to
> mix them back into clay someday in the future when I am
> feeling
> especially motivated, or when I finally have a pugmill. I
> am wondering
> what you think about mixing the scraps, combining the clay
> bodies.
>
> I know I'll need to test it, but don't want to
> bother if I hear that it
> will likely fail (although I think it'll be fine).
>
> Thanks,
>
> Dina Barnese
> Zizziba Studio
> Flagstaff, Arizona
> http://www.zizziba.com
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