the cat lady on wed 13 may 98
Leslie:
This is NOT a flame, or meant to be an angry response, so please
don't read as such. I'm addressing your note in kind of a point
form, and :) is implied/meant with all questions/comments.
I am addressing this because I obviously wasn't clear - and if
you have mis-interpreted what I said, then others did also, and
I want to be clear (she said waving her hands wildly in the air!)
>----------------------------Original message----------------------------
>Sam, I didn't mean to be undermining galleries- but I also wouldn't charge
>what a gallery would charge.
You say in your 1st note that you don't have work for sale in a gallery,
yet say in this note you "wouldn't charge what a gallery would charge".
I think if you checked out some galleries that sell the kind of work
I sell, their prices and my prices are on a par. Have you indeed checked
comparable pieces to your own? Do you think a gallery charges a high
mark up? On one-of-a-kinds, yes the pieces are probably high priced...
but then again, probably would be at the artist's studio as well.
>I understand your point to mean that we
>should'nt degrade our work by complying with the "discount" notion.
Nope, not what I meant at all. I was _trying_ to say that your
comment to the public gives them the (false) notion that by buying
directly from the artist, they are paying a lesser price. In MOST
cases, the potters *I* know sell at one set retail price. Yes, I
know most people automatically expect a discount when they visit
the studio, but this ain't necessarily so. The reason I was trying
to get you to stop saying this is to end the public perception.
Think of it - every time the potter has to stop and talk and sell
their work, they are losing time/money. So the pieces should sell
at the same rate the retail outlet is selling them at to make up
for the interruption in their day. Am I clearer this time?
An example. I was doing the guild sale last year, when a customer
called me over to my table. She said she wanted 6 mugs. I offered
to carry them to the cash. She said no, she wanted directions to
my house. I asked her "why" since I had a full selection of work
out and there was nothing different or special about the work still
left at home - just more of the same. She told me flat out that
it would be cheaper to buy from me direct. I stared, and said no,
it would be 6 times $14. Then she says "surely they'd be a discount,
no tax?" I said no, 6 times $14 plus PST. She got angry at this.
Told me she expected that if she was going to drive all the way out
to my house, she was *going* to get a discount. She was red! I
got pissed, and said "wholesale starts at $1000 minimum order" and
turned my back on her before I used nasty language.
So this is why I ask you to stop saying it's cheaper than a gallery.
I've stopped allowing all but friends to buy from my home. If a person
calls and wants a specific item, I'll send it UPS (using their credit
card number to cover item/shipping costs). Otherwise, no browsing. I
tried it for a year, and people think nothing of taking up an hour or
2 looking at the studio, the kiln, the cats, and buying a less than
$10 item. In the meanwhile I've lost 2 hours on the wheel!!
>Unfortunately, it would take a great deal of time to appropriately
>educate someone as to the nature of pottery, and not all customers are
>asking for an indepth answer to their questions.
You're right there of course. I hand out my "making a mug" sheet to
the pushiest ones and stand over them while they read. This accomplishes
1 of 2 things. Either they don't want to take the time to read it and
walk away (relieving me of their company) or they read it and don't ask
again for a discount.
"These pieces are discounted, youre buying directly from
>me" would be your remark- I'd vary it to something like "I don't
>participate in the "sale and discount" thing, I just start off with a fair
>price and stick to it."
>
Thank you!!!
sam - from broken toe, ontario :(
PS my horse thought it would be great fun to stomp on my left foot
on Saturday. My 2nd toe snapped!
Jennifer Boyer on thu 14 may 98
Hi All,
I think this issue needs more clarification> I, like Sam, have one
retail price for a item, whether someone buys from me or a gallery i
sell to. The gallery gets a 50 percent discount off retail and then
marks it back up, hopefully 100 percent, to my retail price. Here is my
rational: Sam articulated the issue of customer trying to get the
cheapest price very well. It's much easier to educate them that they
needn't try to find the cheapest price on my work: all prices are the
same. The gallery will feel better about me if I don't undercut their
prices. But the crux of the matter to me is what is represented by the
difference between wholesale and retail. If I only sold to galleries, I
wouldn't need to pay for booths at retail shows, gas, motels, food, etc
for being at the retail show. I wouldn't need to send out mailings to my
retail customers or spend time with them at my studio as I do now. I
consider that if I get 7.00 wholesale for a mug and 14.00 retail, MY
marketing and promotion expenses involving retail customers comes out of
the 7.00 difference. If the gallery sells my mug they get 7.00 to spend
on marketing, promotion etc. So whoever sells the mug, 7.00 of it payed
for the mug itself and 7.00 payed for the cost of promotion etc. Of
course this is simplistic, but if I sell a mug for my wholesale price
at a craft show, where do i recoup the money for the expenses involved
with doing the show? How about an hourly wage for sitting there for 10
hours a day? That can't come out of a wholesale price....wholesale
prices take care of overhead, my time making the piece, materials, etc
etc. , not promotion and marketing. So I figure I have just as much of a
right to 14.00 for a mug as the gallery that sells it . I hope this is
clear.....It's so clear in my head, but I don't know if i've said it
right. This has NOTHING to do w/ customers asking for discounts. The
only customers I give discounts to are the ones that bring my LOTS of
business and promote me to their friends.
Take Care
Jennifer
the cat lady wrote:
> ----------------------------Original
> message----------------------------
> Leslie:
>
> This is NOT a flame, or meant to be an angry response, so please
> don't read as such. I'm addressing your note in kind of a point
> form, and :) is implied/meant with all questions/comments.
>
> I am addressing this because I obviously wasn't clear - and if
> you have mis-interpreted what I said, then others did also, and
> I want to be clear (she said waving her hands wildly in the air!)
>
> >----------------------------Original
> message----------------------------
> >Sam, I didn't mean to be undermining galleries- but I also wouldn't
> charge
> >what a gallery would charge.
>
> You say in your 1st note that you don't have work for sale in a
> gallery,
> yet say in this note you "wouldn't charge what a gallery would
> charge".
> I think if you checked out some galleries that sell the kind of work
> I sell, their prices and my prices are on a par. Have you indeed
> checked
> comparable pieces to your own? Do you think a gallery charges a high
> mark up? On one-of-a-kinds, yes the pieces are probably high
> priced...
> but then again, probably would be at the artist's studio as well.
>
> >I understand your point to mean that we
> >should'nt degrade our work by complying with the "discount" notion.
>
> Nope, not what I meant at all. I was _trying_ to say that your
> comment to the public gives them the (false) notion that by buying
> directly from the artist, they are paying a lesser price. In MOST
> cases, the potters *I* know sell at one set retail price. Yes, I
> know most people automatically expect a discount when they visit
> the studio, but this ain't necessarily so. The reason I was trying
> to get you to stop saying this is to end the public perception.
> Think of it - every time the potter has to stop and talk and sell
> their work, they are losing time/money. So the pieces should sell
> at the same rate the retail outlet is selling them at to make up
> for the interruption in their day. Am I clearer this time?
>
> An example. I was doing the guild sale last year, when a customer
> called me over to my table. She said she wanted 6 mugs. I offered
> to carry them to the cash. She said no, she wanted directions to
> my house. I asked her "why" since I had a full selection of work
> out and there was nothing different or special about the work still
> left at home - just more of the same. She told me flat out that
> it would be cheaper to buy from me direct. I stared, and said no,
> it would be 6 times $14. Then she says "surely they'd be a discount,
> no tax?" I said no, 6 times $14 plus PST. She got angry at this.
> Told me she expected that if she was going to drive all the way out
> to my house, she was *going* to get a discount. She was red! I
> got pissed, and said "wholesale starts at $1000 minimum order" and
> turned my back on her before I used nasty language.
>
> So this is why I ask you to stop saying it's cheaper than a gallery.
> I've stopped allowing all but friends to buy from my home. If a
> person
> calls and wants a specific item, I'll send it UPS (using their credit
> card number to cover item/shipping costs). Otherwise, no browsing. I
>
> tried it for a year, and people think nothing of taking up an hour or
> 2 looking at the studio, the kiln, the cats, and buying a less than
> $10 item. In the meanwhile I've lost 2 hours on the wheel!!
>
> >Unfortunately, it would take a great deal of time to appropriately
> >educate someone as to the nature of pottery, and not all customers
> are
> >asking for an indepth answer to their questions.
>
> You're right there of course. I hand out my "making a mug" sheet to
> the pushiest ones and stand over them while they read. This
> accomplishes
> 1 of 2 things. Either they don't want to take the time to read it and
>
> walk away (relieving me of their company) or they read it and don't
> ask
> again for a discount.
>
>
> "These pieces are discounted, youre buying directly from
> >me" would be your remark- I'd vary it to something like "I don't
> >participate in the "sale and discount" thing, I just start off with a
> fair
> >price and stick to it."
> >
> Thank you!!!
>
> sam - from broken toe, ontario :(
>
> PS my horse thought it would be great fun to stomp on my left foot
> on Saturday. My 2nd toe snapped!
--
~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*
Jennifer Boyer jboyer@plainfield.bypass.com
Thistle Hill Pottery
Vermont USA
~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*
Leslie Ihde on thu 14 may 98
Sam-
Only one question, if your pieces are the same price in a gallery as you
sell
them for, doesn't that have to mean you are charging the gallery less then
you would other direct customers? How else would the gallery make money?
I remember one potter whose name I unfortuantely don't remember, but it
was a famous person, said that he sold pieces to gallerys and individuals
from his studio and didn't mind at all if the gallery marked them up for
sale. I guess that would suit me because I could charge what I believe
I am comfortable with and whatever happens next is up to the purchaser.
By the way, I think is is perfectly reasonable for a gallery to charge
more for pottery than I might- but then I sell pottery only twice a year
and from my home. In any case, I appreciate your views. I guess we all
have to work out our own ways of marketing.
Leslie
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