David Hendley on sat 23 may 98
At 12:24 PM 5/22/98 EDT, you wrote:
>----------------------------Original message----------------------------
>Is anyone willing to describe his particular clay aesthetic?
Joyce, my clay aesthetic, described in one word, is 'honesty'.
Honesty to material,
honesty to technique,
honesty of intention.
To make an honest pot takes years of work. Technique has to
mastered so it is not given a thought. As natural as breathing.
The piece will also be natural, and not attempt to be more than it is.
After reading the above, Marilyn Levine's bags, and the wooden-looking
bridge piece, discussed on Clayart last year, come to mind.
Are they honest to the material? Sure, clay can 'look like' anything.
What is not honest is a cast vase with built-in throwing rings.
I could, of course, go on, but this is 90% of it, and I don't
spend hours every day thinking about things while working the
garden, like the loquatious Mr. McDowell.
David Hendley
Maydelle, Texas
hendley@sosweb.net
http://www.farmpots.com
D. Kim Lindaberry on tue 26 may 98
David Hendley wrote:
>
> ----------------------------Original message----------------------------
> At 12:24 PM 5/22/98 EDT, you wrote:
> >----------------------------Original message----------------------------
> Marilyn Levine's bags, and the wooden-looking
> bridge piece, discussed on Clayart last year, come to mind.
> Are they honest to the material? Sure, clay can 'look like' anything.
> What is not honest is a cast vase with built-in throwing rings.
David,
I'm not sure I completely understand how you split hairs like this. What
is the difference in making clay look like leather or wood, or making
clay look like another kind of clay process? Aren't both kinds of pieces
"honest" to the nature and versatility of clay? I don't have any
intentions of ever making a slip cast piece that looks like it had
throwing rings, but if I came up with an idea requiring it, I certainly
wouldn't think that I was being untrue to the clay.
cheers
Kim
--
D. Kim Lindaberry
Johnson County Community College
12345 College Blvd.
ATB 115
Overland Park, KS 66210-1299
USA
to visit my web site go to: http://www.johnco.cc.ks.us/~klinda
to send e-mail to me use: mailto:klinda@johnco.cc.ks.us
David Hendley on wed 27 may 98
At 08:29 AM 5/26/98 EDT, you wrote:
>> >----------------------------Original message----------------------------
>
>> Marilyn Levine's bags, and the wooden-looking
>> bridge piece, discussed on Clayart last year, come to mind.
>> Are they honest to the material? Sure, clay can 'look like' anything.
>> What is not honest is a cast vase with built-in throwing rings.
>
>David,
>
>I'm not sure I completely understand how you split hairs like this. What
>is the difference in making clay look like leather or wood, or making
>clay look like another kind of clay process? Aren't both kinds of pieces
>"honest" to the nature and versatility of clay? I don't have any
>intentions of ever making a slip cast piece that looks like it had
>throwing rings, but if I came up with an idea requiring it, I certainly
>wouldn't think that I was being untrue to the clay.
>
Hello Kim,
Both are honest to the material or 'nature and versitility of clay',
but one is not honest to intention.
Making a cast vase with throwing rings is an attempt to make something
look like 'more than it is'.
Making a clay suitcase is nothing of the kind. In fact, making a suitcase
out of clay makes a pretty worthless suitcase, in a purely practical sense.
My original statement:
---------------------------------------
>Joyce, my clay aesthetic, described in one word, is 'honesty'.
>Honesty to material,
>honesty to technique,
>honesty of intention.
>To make an honest pot takes years of work. Technique has to
>mastered so it is not given a thought. As natural as breathing.
>The piece will also be natural, and not attempt to be more than it is.
---------------------------------------
I'm trying to think of what you might come up with that would
require you to slip cast a vase with throwing rings, and would also satisify
'my personal clay aesthetic', and I can't. But I'm open to the possibility.
Meanwhile, my clay aesthetic can, of course, be anything I want
it to be. I replied to Joyce, who was asking for people to tell her their
personal clay aesthetic, hoping that it would spark others to do the same.
A disappointing 'zero' responses, so far.
How 'bout it, Kim?
Anyone?
There are no wrong answers, it's YOUR personal clay aesthetic.
David Hendley
Maydelle, Texas
hendley@sosweb.net
http://www.farmpots.com
D. Kim Lindaberry on wed 27 may 98
David Hendley wrote:
>
> At 08:29 AM 5/26/98 EDT, you wrote:
> >> >----------------------------Original message----------------------------
> Hello Kim,
> Both are honest to the material or 'nature and versitility of clay',
> but one is not honest to intention.
> Making a cast vase with throwing rings is an attempt to make something
> look like 'more than it is'.
> Making a clay suitcase is nothing of the kind. In fact, making a suitcase
> out of clay makes a pretty worthless suitcase, in a purely practical sense.
>
> My original statement:
> ---------------------------------------
> >Joyce, my clay aesthetic, described in one word, is 'honesty'.
> >Honesty to material,
> >honesty to technique,
> >honesty of intention.
> >To make an honest pot takes years of work. Technique has to
> >mastered so it is not given a thought. As natural as breathing.
> >The piece will also be natural, and not attempt to be more than it is.
> ---------------------------------------
> I'm trying to think of what you might come up with that would
> require you to slip cast a vase with throwing rings, and would also satisify
> 'my personal clay aesthetic', and I can't. But I'm open to the possibility.
>
> Meanwhile, my clay aesthetic can, of course, be anything I want
> it to be. I replied to Joyce, who was asking for people to tell her their
> personal clay aesthetic, hoping that it would spark others to do the same.
> A disappointing 'zero' responses, so far.
> How 'bout it, Kim?
> Anyone?
> There are no wrong answers, it's YOUR personal clay aesthetic.
>
-----------
David,
I agree with you completely when you say there are no wrong answers when
it comes to aesthetics. My own personal aesthetics are constantly being
reevaluated, changing, developing and evolving. I would hope that they
are changing for the better, but who's to say?
When it comes to talking about aesthetics maybe people should talk about
the types of things they look for in a form or object. Among other
things, I look to see if there unity and harmony in the form? Are the
proportions correct to the ideal in my mind? Do the parts add up to more
than their sum? Do the individual parts, "relate positively with all of
the other parts to create a total form that is perceived as something
more than that which could be expected if the parts were examined
separately or assembled in a different manner."...from The Nature of
Art, Joseph H. Krause. Does the object have a function, and if it does,
is it successful performing that function?
It's all very subjective; from person to person, culture to culture,
generation to generation and century to century.
It isn't my intention to beat the idea of slip casting a vase with
"throwing rings" into the ground, but I'd like to go back to this for a
moment. When an individual throws a pot, and leaves the throwing rings
highly visible, is that a conscious aesthetic decision on the part of
the potter? Personally, at times I leave throwing rings on
intentionally. I leave them there NOT to signify that the piece is hand
thrown, but because of the rhythm and motion they bring into the piece.
I like the way they bring a unity and harmony into the piece (at least
in my own mind). I like the way that certain glazes break over the
rings, the fluidity and the visual effect this causes. I don't leave the
rings to indicate it's handmade, but because of an aesthetics choice. In
much the same way someone might choose to place "throwing rings" into a
slip cast vase. The purpose not being to deceive people into thinking
it's handmade, but for the pure visual impact. The aesthetics, if you
will.
Cheers
Kim
--
D. Kim Lindaberry
Johnson County Community College
12345 College Blvd.
ATB 115
Overland Park, KS 66210-1299
USA
to visit my web site go to: http://www.johnco.cc.ks.us/~klinda
to send e-mail to me use: mailto:klinda@johnco.cc.ks.us
Lorca Beebe on fri 29 may 98
Where I am at now in clay:
I like to let clay be clay, although I'm a control freak, I am paying much
more attention to the marks I make with my hands and tools, Drawing is always
a component of my work, although lately I am struggling between "less is more"
and "less is a bore", I am using different clay bodies to smear on to the
piece, I am paying more attention to the actual form and construction of the
clay piece, rather than just think of the frosting, I really "get off"
glazing, I have really "lost" it, I am know melting glass, and pouring
plaster-clay unto my pieces, Like a painting that builds up layers I have
discovered a new experience of multiple firings, the way I paint on the
canvas and the way I glaze are becoming one (My process involves a series of
adding and subtracting, "Wipe On...Wipe Off")...I help cracks develope in the
proper places....
Lorca
Lorca Beebe on fri 29 may 98
I think the question of honesty in Levines' work is irrelevant. The "material
imperative" (another issue in late twentieth century aesthetics and very
Greenbergian I might add) is present because she denies the material. I think
one has to keep into account other styles and issues in art at the time when
she made those pieces, correct me if I am wrong but I believe she made those
pieces somewhere in the 70's?, in which case there was an exploration at that
time of hyperealism, even Arneson had a little bit of it in the way he handled
the anatomy of the "figure", but departs from it in everything else, more in
line with Levine is Duane Hanson, William Beckman, Chuck Close, (if you dont
know them look them up so you can see the parallels in aesthetic delivery)...
Okay since I did it again (name dropped), and before I get blasted by all the
phillistines on the list, I want you to know that I have been involved in
writting a paper (this is not a class asssignment but something I really want
to do, {yes I'm goofy}), on Greenbergs "The Avant-Guarde and Kitcsh", I am
attempting to analyze issues that deal with ceramics, as I was writting
yesterday I was suddenly struck with terror at the thought of submitting it to
this list. I really need help on this from a clay perspective, if it were
merely to show off my MFA (MOE FOE...)
I think I would have preffered to watch TV, I think that I was overwhelmed by
all the issues and trying to but them in there proper perspective, so I guess
when I finish I'll ask you what to do.
Lorca
| |
|
