Chris Schafale on sat 20 jun 98
Dear Clayart folk,
I've wanted to ask this for awhile, but hesitated because I know none
of you have ever had this problem . Nonetheless, perhaps
some of you could share stories, wisdom, encouragement you've gleaned
from other people's experience.
The short version of the problem is this:
I love making pots. But when I've tried selling (to buy more clay to
make more pots) at public events, the response is underwhelming (not
disastrous, just disappointing). I can come up with various
explanations (the specific venues weren't right, my work is too
"quiet", etc.), but the worst part is the effect on my morale. After
one of these events, I have a really hard time getting back to work,
even though I'm miserable when I'm not doing pottery. At this point
I'm wondering if I should back off from doing public sales and
concentrate on doing what I love and improving my skills, or if I
should put more energy into the marketing end and try to find the
places where my work will find its home. Although selling is not the
most important thing to me (except insofar as it allows me to keep
buying clay), it does seem as if the work has to have someplace to
go in order for it to keep flowing through me. Making pots and
cutting them up, as I've been doing lately, just doesn't seem to do
it.
Any thoughts?? Thanks in advance,
Chris
Marcia Selsor on sun 21 jun 98
I never liked selling at public events.(Rhinebeck in '73 was the last time and
that was fun.) Perhaps you should try marketing your work through other
places. Depending on the type of work, maybe your work would do well in the
atmosphere of a local bakery, bookstore or flower shop. Just try to find your
niche. Let others deal with the public for you. I think it saves you the time
and anguish. Maybe at a later date you can get back to selling at the public
events. But keep cutting some pots up at regular intervals. It keeps them fresh.
Best wishes,
Marcia in Montana
Chris Schafale wrote:
>
> ----------------------------Original message----------------------------
> Dear Clayart folk,
>
> I've wanted to ask this for awhile, but hesitated because I know none
> of you have ever had this problem . Nonetheless, perhaps
> some of you could share stories, wisdom, encouragement you've gleaned
> from other people's experience.
>
> The short version of the problem is this:
> I love making pots. But when I've tried selling (to buy more clay to
> make more pots) at public events, the response is underwhelming (not
> disastrous, just disappointing). I can come up with various
> explanations (the specific venues weren't right, my work is too
> "quiet", etc.), but the worst part is the effect on my morale. After
> one of these events, I have a really hard time getting back to work,
> even though I'm miserable when I'm not doing pottery. At this point
> I'm wondering if I should back off from doing public sales and
> concentrate on doing what I love and improving my skills, or if I
> should put more energy into the marketing end and try to find the
> places where my work will find its home. Although selling is not the
> most important thing to me (except insofar as it allows me to keep
> buying clay), it does seem as if the work has to have someplace to
> go in order for it to keep flowing through me. Making pots and
> cutting them up, as I've been doing lately, just doesn't seem to do
> it.
>
> Any thoughts?? Thanks in advance,
>
> Chris
Ilene Mahler on sun 21 jun 98
Please do not give up there are many philistines out there concontrate on
your work stick the old work in the basement etc.and someday sell them for
seconds when you become famous there is a pot for everone you just haven't
found them yet good luck. (working 18 years and is still playing) Ilene
At 10:14 AM 6/20/98 EDT, you wrote:
>----------------------------Original message----------------------------
>Dear Clayart folk,
>
>I've wanted to ask this for awhile, but hesitated because I know none
>of you have ever had this problem . Nonetheless, perhaps
>some of you could share stories, wisdom, encouragement you've gleaned
>from other people's experience.
>
>The short version of the problem is this:
>I love making pots. But when I've tried selling (to buy more clay to
>make more pots) at public events, the response is underwhelming (not
>disastrous, just disappointing). I can come up with various
>explanations (the specific venues weren't right, my work is too
>"quiet", etc.), but the worst part is the effect on my morale. After
>one of these events, I have a really hard time getting back to work,
>even though I'm miserable when I'm not doing pottery. At this point
>I'm wondering if I should back off from doing public sales and
>concentrate on doing what I love and improving my skills, or if I
>should put more energy into the marketing end and try to find the
>places where my work will find its home. Although selling is not the
>most important thing to me (except insofar as it allows me to keep
>buying clay), it does seem as if the work has to have someplace to
>go in order for it to keep flowing through me. Making pots and
>cutting them up, as I've been doing lately, just doesn't seem to do
>it.
>
>Any thoughts?? Thanks in advance,
>
>Chris
>
>
Sheilah Bliss on sun 21 jun 98
In a message dated 6/20/98 6:30:07 AM, you wrote:
<
I've wanted to ask this for awhile, but hesitated because I know none
of you have ever had this problem . Nonetheless, perhaps
some of you could share stories, wisdom, encouragement you've gleaned
from other people's experience.
The short version of the problem is this:
I love making pots. But when I've tried selling (to buy more clay to
make more pots) at public events, the response is underwhelming (not
disastrous, just disappointing). I can come up with various
explanations (the specific venues weren't right, my work is too
"quiet", etc.), but the worst part is the effect on my morale. After
one of these events, I have a really hard time getting back to work,
even though I'm miserable when I'm not doing pottery. At this point
I'm wondering if I should back off from doing public sales and
concentrate on doing what I love and improving my skills, or if I
should put more energy into the marketing end and try to find the
places where my work will find its home. Although selling is not the
most important thing to me (except insofar as it allows me to keep
buying clay), it does seem as if the work has to have someplace to
go in order for it to keep flowing through me. Making pots and
cutting them up, as I've been doing lately, just doesn't seem to do
it.
Any thoughts?? Thanks in advance,
Chris
>>
Hi Chris -
I do only one public sale a year -- partly because of feeling emotionally
vulnerable to direct public opinion, partly because of the amount of time and
grunt work involved. I do, however, enjoy sales from consignment shops and
galleries where, generally I do fairly well. (And I don't have to have a
memory of someone who walks up to my piece and goes "Eeewwww!")
Don't give up -- your market is out there ...
Sheilah
BlissPots@aol.com
Tom Wirt on mon 22 jun 98
-----Original Message-----
From: Chris Schafale
The short version of the problem is this:
I love making pots. But when I've tried selling (to buy more clay to
make more pots) at public events, the response is underwhelming (not
disastrous, just disappointing). I can come up with various
explanations (the specific venues weren't right, my work is too
"quiet", etc.), but the worst part is the effect on my morale. After
Chris.....
Two thoughts. One. Do some customer research. Pick an unsuspecting
customer at one of the shows, and get into a conversation. Say what you
just said to us, to him or her. "You're looking, why aren't you buying?"
Find just one or two people who are willing to talk and you'll probably have
clues. Your friends and relatives for the most part are no good for this
exercise. They have to continue to be your friend and color their response
to please you. A stranger doesn't have to.
And or, look hard at your pots and then look hard at the work around you
that is selling. Not to copy, but to try to determine what it is that makes
the other work different and maybe, thus, sell. Quality, utility, price,
colors, shapes, and on and on. All the millions details that make up a
sale. You MUST look at your work, and the presentation of it, from the
customers viewpoint IF you want to sell.
Some people, I assume, have bought your work. Mentally try to profile them.
Age, income, where they might shop. Ask some what other shows/fairs they go
to to buy work. You may truly be at the wrong venue. You didn't say what
type of work you do, but, for example, if the fair is primarily a craft
fair, it will probably be hard to sell large sculptures. How far will
people have to carry their purchases? I think we see an inverse relation
between size of purchase and distance to the car.
As to getting yourself back up...there was a wonderful article a few years
back in CM about a monk (sorry I don't remember his name) who was bothered
by folks who said they didn't like his work. On meditating on this, he
began to realize such rejection does not tell you about your work, but about
the person doing the judging. The potential buyer doesn't know you, may
have never seen your work and thus knows nothing about it. The ARE telling
you about their experience, their tastes, their knowledge, etc. So such
rejection is not about you, it's about them. If you get this a lot at the
type of shows you are doing, then go back to the first and second
paragraphs. You can learn just as much about your work and its place in the
market from rejecters as from buyers...maybe more.
Also, always remember that many of the ups and downs of sales at shows have
nothing it do with you. Weather, the economy, why the shows exists (is it a
local celebration or an art show, for example), the booth next to you, and,
again, a thousand unfathomables, all influence sales.
Just keep doing what you really, really want to do. Get excellent at it,
maybe you already are, and then go find where people like you might buy work
like yours. You are out there somewhere.
Hope this helps.
Tom Wirt
Clay Coyote Pottery
Hutchinson, MN
claypot@hutchtel.net
D. McDysan on mon 22 jun 98
Chris,
What part of the country do you live in? What kind of places have you
tried selling your work? Some one told me that you have to stay in a
show for 3 years before you start selling well. This is because people
need to see your work a few times before they can make a descision to
purchase. I wonder if there is any truth in this and has anyone else had
that experience?
Debbie
dmcdysan@onramp.net
Cindy on mon 22 jun 98
Chris,
Just because you don't sell at shows, that doesn't mean your work isn't any
good, and it doesn't mean it won't sell. Try wholesaling to gift shops,
etc. I like doing shows because I team up with my best friend to do them
and enjoy spending time goofing off and chatting. We always make our booth
fee and some extra, but maybe we should go hiking instead. We both make a
living at art, but most of the money comes from wholesale.
Cindy Strnad
Earthen Vessels
Custer, SD
USA http://blackhills-info.com/a/cindys/menu.htm
Marni Turkel on tue 23 jun 98
Debbie McDysan wrote:
> Some one told me that you have to stay in a
>show for 3 years before you start selling well. This is because people
>need to see your work a few times before they can make a descision to
>purchase. I wonder if there is any truth in this and has anyone else had
>that experience?
Debbie,
For most of the last 30 years, I have been making my living selling the
pots I make. At every bad show I've ever done there is someone who will
tell you that if you do that show for a few years it will get better.
Personal experience tells me that this is generally not so. If the
community was in the depths of a recession or if unseasonal bad weather
affected attendance I might try it again. But if I don't find something
encouraging after the first year, I don't go back.
Marni
Marni Turkel
Stony Point Ceramic Design
Sonoma County, California
Ray Carlton on tue 23 jun 98
every one of us have been here...the greatest accolade you get is when
somebody goes wow!! hands over the folding stuff and walks away smiling
with your pot under their arm. It is easy to get depressed and feel that
your work will never pay for itself let alone pay you. The challenge is to
keep it up and eventually the work will become more saleable as you learn
to sell better. In my experience it has always been harder to make them
than sell them..So I guess you had better look at your pricing and selling
techniques [marketing:)]
This is where the biggest challenges lie in surviving as a potter these
days...
good luck don't despair, become positive and just do it!!
At 14:54 21/06/98 EDT, you wrote:
>----------------------------Original message----------------------------
>
>In a message dated 6/20/98 6:30:07 AM, you wrote:
>
><>
>I've wanted to ask this for awhile, but hesitated because I know none
>of you have ever had this problem . Nonetheless, perhaps
>some of you could share stories, wisdom, encouragement you've gleaned
>from other people's experience.
>
>The short version of the problem is this:
>I love making pots. But when I've tried selling (to buy more clay to
>make more pots) at public events, the response is underwhelming (not
>disastrous, just disappointing). I can come up with various
>explanations (the specific venues weren't right, my work is too
>"quiet", etc.), but the worst part is the effect on my morale. After
>one of these events, I have a really hard time getting back to work,
>even though I'm miserable when I'm not doing pottery. At this point
>I'm wondering if I should back off from doing public sales and
>concentrate on doing what I love and improving my skills, or if I
>should put more energy into the marketing end and try to find the
>places where my work will find its home. Although selling is not the
>most important thing to me (except insofar as it allows me to keep
>buying clay), it does seem as if the work has to have someplace to
>go in order for it to keep flowing through me. Making pots and
>cutting them up, as I've been doing lately, just doesn't seem to do
>it.
>
>Any thoughts?? Thanks in advance,
>
>Chris
>
>>>
>
>Hi Chris -
>I do only one public sale a year -- partly because of feeling emotionally
>vulnerable to direct public opinion, partly because of the amount of time and
>grunt work involved. I do, however, enjoy sales from consignment shops and
>galleries where, generally I do fairly well. (And I don't have to have a
>memory of someone who walks up to my piece and goes "Eeewwww!")
>
>Don't give up -- your market is out there ...
>Sheilah
>BlissPots@aol.com
>
cheers :) Ray Carlton
McMahons Creek Victoria Australia
Virginia Virkus on wed 24 jun 98
Hello to All,
I am new to Clayart, having read for about a month, I'd like to attempt my
first post in response to Debbie's question about 3 years at an event before
folks start buying-
I run a one woman studio, producing production pottery for what amounts to a
niche market- I sell at Celtic festivals & Scottish games- this grew out of
an interest in (& participation in other ways before I started to sell my
pottery)in those subcultures. Basically, I had a chance to observe this
market & my potential customers before I started to try to sell them my
pots. I do cater to my market somewhat, but I also manage to make I work I
love & am passionate about as well.
I have had a few experiences of seeing a new potter trying to come into this
market & failing rather spectacularly- I am thinking especially of a
medieval fair, which is my best money making event of the year. I saw three
talented potters come into this market with BEAUTIFUL wood & salt fired
functional ware which was much more appropriate to the setting than my
colorful oxidation cone 6 work. Their stuff failed miserably in a market
where it should have flourished. I was at a loss to explain this- except
for the fact that these folks weren't medievalists, had never been to this
(or any medieval) festival before, didn't have a customer base, didn't make
an attempt to educate or interact with their potential customers, didn't
display their work very well, etc. I got some beautiful pots from them for
cheap. They had a hard time getting gas money to go home.
What I am trying to say is that I do think it takes time to build up a
market & a following (I know about 1/3 of my customers by sight now) but
three years is too long for anyone to wait for decent sales. If you are
going to take a long range approach, go to shows in your area as a customer
first, and scope them out before you try to sell there. It isn't always
possible, but when you can , I think it is definitely worth a day out of the
studio to see what a potential market is like. If you can't go to the
precise event, try to get to one that is run by the same folks in a
different location. TALK to the potters who are there, most folks are
happy to talk shop- in my experience, most (dare I use the term?) crafters
are happy to tell you more than you wanted to know about anything you ask
them.
I did some awful shows at first. Ones where I wanted to go home & break
every pot I had ever made. But I managed to convince myself that it wasn't
my pots that were at fault, it was the venue I was trying to sell them in.
I just had an amazing show this weekend, where I got all sorts of validation
(and money) for my work. I felt like dancing all the way to the bank. I
know my ego & self opinion shouldn't be tied as closely as it is to my pots,
but it is. If it weren't, I wouldn't be doing this. Hang in there, keep
making pots that are true to you and do the work & take the risks necessary
to find the places where they are appreciated (& bought)- I think
interacting directly with your customers is one of the scariest & most
rewarding parts of what we do. It is like talking to young children- The
honesty and directness is at once wonderful and terrifying.
Virginia
Dancing Pig Pottery
Damascus, Maryland, USA
Date: Mon, 22 Jun 1998 13:08:57 EDT
From: "D. McDysan"
Subject: Re: Making, marketing & morale
----------------------------Original message----------------------------
Chris,
What part of the country do you live in? What kind of places have you
tried selling your work? Some one told me that you have to stay in a
show for 3 years before you start selling well. This is because people
need to see your work a few times before they can make a descision to
purchase. I wonder if there is any truth in this and has anyone else had
that experience?
Debbie
dmcdysan@onramp.net
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