Elizabeth Hewitt on sun 4 oct 98
>Observers. We notice the subtle designs our crunched cans end up in.
>We sometimes marvel on the 300th mug that has just a little bit
different
>personality than all the rest. We can get caught up watching the
>streaking lines our sponge has just made go from wet to dry. We notice
>these things, and take note of them, and get enjoyment, pleasure,
>satisfaction, feeling of being a part of greater humanity, etc., from
>them.
words before. I think I went from being a craftsman to an artist at the
time I began observing much more closely. My husband laughs at me when I
stop transfixed by patterns on bark, the roots on trees, the colors and
positioning of lichen on tree trunks, shadow/light interactions....>
This spoke to me also. I see _art_ in everything. Even _whte_. I love to watch
sun on something that is white with texture. I love to watch the shades of whit
change as the sun moves across it. It's art to me. I somehow want to reproduce i
The bubbles in my tub are love birds, hearts, animals, ever changing designs. A
is all around me. My daughter thinks I'm nuts when I stop mid-sentence and say,
"Look, the reflection of the trees outside on the glass of that picture intermin
and make a whole new picture....a centurion, see his helmet?" She gives me one
those looks. But...........I love it that all my world around me gives me ar
Elizabeth
Don & Isao Morrill on fri 10 sep 99
13:10 9/9/99 EDT, you wrote:
>----------------------------Original message----------------------------
>I might easily regret wading into this. "Art is the outward physical
>expression of the inner life of a person."
>So if something inside me needs to get out and my handmade item hits it real
>close ,it is an artistic expression. If my item is only an attempt and
>doesn't come close enough,then I'm an art student. I bet everybody has done
>some of both.
>Sometimes I have doodeled and accedentally made a fun item. I don't really
>have a good idea about these items.
>I mean whether they are art or not. I never really need to decide, so I
don't.
>It's interesting to hear others thoughts,I think.
>Steve Yahn
> Art is property for its purchasers. Art is a superior kind of
nonsense for the Artist.Its product is the way an artist has of solving
problems of light and shadow becoming the illusion of reality.Don M.
Tamara Reid on fri 10 sep 99
Stephen:
Although I agree with your definition of art (to a
certain degree), I have a question for you
Is anyone out there really ready to experience my
inner world? Or any artist's for that matter?
Tamara
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com
Vince Pitelka on sun 12 sep 99
>> Art is property for its purchasers. Art is a superior kind of
>nonsense for the Artist. Its product is the way an artist has of solving
>problems of light and shadow becoming the illusion of reality.
Don -
Hoo boy. What IS this?? Anyone can string together a bunch of esoteric
stream-of-consciousness drivel, but this is profoundly pessimistic. It is
sad that you have so little understanding or appreciation of the value and
purpose of art. And yet you put such opinions forth in an international
forum like Clayart. I wonder why???
- Vince
Vince Pitelka - vpitelka@DeKalb.net
Home 615/597-5376, work 615/597-6801 ext. 111, fax 615/597-6803
Appalachian Center for Crafts
Tennessee Technological University
1560 Craft Center Drive, Smithville TN 37166
Vince Pitelka on sun 12 sep 99
>Although I agree with your definition of art (to a
>certain degree), I have a question for you
>Is anyone out there really ready to experience my
>inner world? Or any artist's for that matter?
YES!! There are many ways to interpret art. You can interpret art in terms
of the baggage you bring with you - your personal life experience - apply
the content and meaning of the art to your own experience. You can
interpret contextually, learn about the artist and his/her time and culture,
appreciate the circumstance of its creation. Or, you can try to put
yourself in the artist's shoes and appreciate his/her personal experience
and vision. All three are worthwhile, and the way we each interpret art
usually includes some of each. Some see art as decoration, but as a
component of culture and society art is most valuable in its experiential
power and content, and to fully appreciate it we must willingly open
ourselves to the experience.
- Vince
Vince Pitelka - vpitelka@DeKalb.net
Home 615/597-5376, work 615/597-6801 ext. 111, fax 615/597-6803
Appalachian Center for Crafts
Tennessee Technological University
1560 Craft Center Drive, Smithville TN 37166
Don & Isao Morrill on mon 13 sep 99
At 11:22 9/12/99 EDT, you wrote:
>----------------------------Original message----------------------------
>>> Art is property for its purchasers. Art is a superior kind of
>>nonsense for the Artist. Its product is the way an artist has of solving
>>problems of light and shadow becoming the illusion of reality.
>
>Don -
>Hoo boy. What IS this?? Anyone can string together a bunch of esoteric
>stream-of-consciousness drivel, but this is profoundly pessimistic. It is
>sad that you have so little understanding or appreciation of the value and
>purpose of art. And yet you put such opinions forth in an international
>forum like Clayart. I wonder why???
>- Vince
>
>Vince Pitelka - vpitelka@DeKalb.net
>Home 615/597-5376, work 615/597-6801 ext. 111, fax 615/597-6803
>Appalachian Center for Crafts
>Tennessee Technological University
>1560 Craft Center Drive, Smithville TN 37166
>
Gee,vince, sorry to rub your fur the wrong way. I continue to believe my
remarks quite honest and hardly pessimistic and hardly worthy of personal
attack. Esoteric? I must have missed something.
Disillusioned? One hopes.....if this indicates lack of illusions
about the illusions of art. As a technologist,one might expect a greater
breadth of understanding from the A .C.for Crafts and from T.T.U. However,
I forgive you'all and hope for broader understanding. Don M.
Peter Jones on mon 13 sep 99
Hello clayarters.
I read the post (below) with interest.
It made me think of how i appreciate art, (that is, unconsciously
rather than consciously). Art which moves me is using a
mechanism of which i am not aware and personally i would not try to
define this process or channel in words, for fear of spoiling what
effect the art has had on me.
A bit like explaining a magic trick, so then the magic goes.
I wonder how many people there are who, like me, avert their eyes
from the title of a piece of artwork on show, in order to prolong the
magic of the work's non-verbal expression.
I recall seeing the Howard Hodgkin exhibition at the Hayward Gallery,
London where the paintings were at eye level but all the labels
had been placed way down at floor level.
I like the invitation to "willingly open ourselves to the experience"
and I would add that the more artwork i do over the years (the more i
draw and carve) the more open, the more sensitive to the work of
others i've become. I don't think i'll ever be sensitive enough to
actually *see* someone else's "inner world" but it's enough for me
right now to be moved by the physical manifestations of an artist's
inner world focussed externally through their own craft of making.
Just a thought....
Peter
> Date: Sun, 12
Sep 1999 11:22:30 EDT
> Reply-to: Ceramic Arts Discussion List
> From: Vince Pitelka
> Subject: Re: art
> To: CLAYART@LSV.UKY.EDU
> ----------------------------Original message----------------------------
> >Although I agree with your definition of art (to a
> >certain degree), I have a question for you
> >Is anyone out there really ready to experience my
> >inner world? Or any artist's for that matter?
>
> YES!! There are many ways to interpret art. You can interpret art in terms
> of the baggage you bring with you - your personal life experience - apply
> the content and meaning of the art to your own experience. You can
> interpret contextually, learn about the artist and his/her time and culture,
> appreciate the circumstance of its creation. Or, you can try to put
> yourself in the artist's shoes and appreciate his/her personal experience
> and vision. All three are worthwhile, and the way we each interpret art
> usually includes some of each. Some see art as decoration, but as a
> component of culture and society art is most valuable in its experiential
> power and content, and to fully appreciate it we must willingly open
> ourselves to the experience.
> - Vince
>
> Vince Pitelka - vpitelka@DeKalb.net
> Home 615/597-5376, work 615/597-6801 ext. 111, fax 615/597-6803
> Appalachian Center for Crafts
> Tennessee Technological University
> 1560 Craft Center Drive, Smithville TN 37166
>
>
Peter Jones
peter@artists.u-net.com
Artwork may be viewed at
http://www.artists.u-net.com/pj-index.htm
Maybe you would like to be added to my Artists directory?
http://www.artists.u-net.com/
Jeremy/Bonnie Hellman on mon 5 jun 00
Hi Nils,
My perspective is a little different since I earn my living as a CPA and tax
preparer.
The REASON artists can only deduct the cost of materials on work they create
is the same reason that NO ONE gets a charitable deduction for the value of
their time. If I prepare a tax return or donate several hours of my time to
prepare a tax return for a charitable organization, my only possible
charitable deductions are for my out of pocket expenses, such as my mileage,
parking and postage to pick up information and deliver the finished tax
return, or the cost of toll calls I make. I do not get a deduction for the
fair market value of my time, or the money I might have earned if I'd spent
the time preparing a tax return for a paying customer. Same thing for
spending a few hours working at a food bank, attending a board meeting of a
non-profit organization, or teaching a class (unpaid) at a not-for-profit
school or for another non-profit organization.
In the last 15 years in the United States, all income tax legislation has
needed to be "revenue neutral", meaning that the total revenue collection
does not change. So if congress increases some deductions, they will also
make offsetting changes to increase the amount of tax money they expect to
collect. They giveth and taketh in approximately equal amounts!
Yes, as artists we would like to see the market value of our efforts
publicly recognized when we donate our work to a non-profit organization,
but we do have the option of declining to donate our work or of selling our
work and donating money to our favorite charities, or we can just feel good
about helping our favorite charities.
Bonnie
Bonnie Hellman, CPA in PA & CO
> TimesWe need your help!
>
>
> As you are probably aware artists cannot take a fair market value
> deduction for a donation of artwork to charity. They can only deduct
> the cost of materials. Owners of artwork not their own can take an
> appreciated full market value deduction.
>
>
> There is currently a bill which has been introduced into congress by
> Amo Houghton to allow artists to take an income tax deduction for
> donations of their artwork. It is Bill HR3249.
>
>
> I hope you feel as I do that it is extremely important to get
> this law changed now. It has been in existence since 1970. Numerous
> attempts to modify it have been unsuccessful. We can only do this if
> we all support it as vocally as possible. As artists we tend to work
> isolated from each other with the result that our political influence
> is not as strong as other groups. This is a time when we need to come
> together and let congress know this bill is important to us.
>
>
> I've enclosed a sample letter which you are welcome to copy, use,
> modify or whatever to send to your congressman, Please send a note,
> call, or email to your representative now. If you don't know who your
> congressman is visit:
> 0000,0000,00FFhttp://www.house.gov> nderline>.
>
>
> In addition I ask you to please pass this information and letter
> on to as many people as you possibly can. We can make a difference.
>
>
> Thank you,
>
> Judy Onofrio
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Dear
>
>
> We need your help! Please sign on as a co-sponsor or vote for Bill
> HR3249, which has been introduced in congress by Amo Houghton.
>
>
> As artists and supporter of the arts, we feel strongly that the current
> law that does not allow artists to take a fair market value deduction
> for a charitable donation of their work is unfair. Owners of artwork
> not their own can take an appreciated full
> market value deduction but the artist cannot. The new bill HR3249
> would rectify that inequity.
>
>
> It is important and helpful for charitable organizations to be able to
> raise money through auctions of artwork. Museums need to add to their
> current collections. By amending this law, artists would be willing to
> donate work of higher quality to these organizations, which in the end
> would benefit everyone.
>
>
> Please help us to change this double standard and make it equal for
> both artist and patron. Vote for HR3249.
>
>
> Thank you for your consideration and representing our needs.
>
>
> Sincerely,
>
>
>
>
> email: judyland@judyonofrio.com
>
> ______________________________________________________________________________
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
> melpots@pclink.com.
>
Earl Brunner on tue 6 jun 00
If I remember right, I can donate a Tom Coleman pot, (I'm
not Tom Coleman) of a Mel or Clennell pot to charity and
deduct that, right? So what I propose is this, I give a pot
to Fred, He donates it and takes the credit. Fred gives a
pot to Mary and Mary donates it and takes the credit. Mary
gives a pot to Jose and Jose donates it and takes a
credit.......
Jeremy/Bonnie Hellman wrote:
>
> Hi Nils,
>
> My perspective is a little different since I earn my living as a CPA and tax
> preparer.
>
> The REASON artists can only deduct the cost of materials on work they create
> is the same reason that NO ONE gets a charitable deduction for the value of
> their time. If I prepare a tax return or donate several hours of my time to
> prepare a tax return for a charitable organization, my only possible
> charitable deductions are for my out of pocket expenses, such as my mileage,
> parking and postage to pick up information and deliver the finished tax
> return, or the cost of toll calls I make. I do not get a deduction for the
> fair market value of my time, or the money I might have earned if I'd spent
> the time preparing a tax return for a paying customer. Same thing for
> spending a few hours working at a food bank, attending a board meeting of a
> non-profit organization, or teaching a class (unpaid) at a not-for-profit
> school or for another non-profit organization.
>
> In the last 15 years in the United States, all income tax legislation has
> needed to be "revenue neutral", meaning that the total revenue collection
> does not change. So if congress increases some deductions, they will also
> make offsetting changes to increase the amount of tax money they expect to
> collect. They giveth and taketh in approximately equal amounts!
>
> Yes, as artists we would like to see the market value of our efforts
> publicly recognized when we donate our work to a non-profit organization,
> but we do have the option of declining to donate our work or of selling our
> work and donating money to our favorite charities, or we can just feel good
> about helping our favorite charities.
>
> Bonnie
>
> Bonnie Hellman, CPA in PA & CO
>
> > TimesWe need your help!
> >
> >
> > As you are probably aware artists cannot take a fair market value
> > deduction for a donation of artwork to charity. They can only deduct
> > the cost of materials. Owners of artwork not their own can take an
> > appreciated full market value deduction.
> >
> >
> > There is currently a bill which has been introduced into congress by
> > Amo Houghton to allow artists to take an income tax deduction for
> > donations of their artwork. It is Bill HR3249.
> >
> >
> > I hope you feel as I do that it is extremely important to get
> > this law changed now. It has been in existence since 1970. Numerous
> > attempts to modify it have been unsuccessful. We can only do this if
> > we all support it as vocally as possible. As artists we tend to work
> > isolated from each other with the result that our political influence
> > is not as strong as other groups. This is a time when we need to come
> > together and let congress know this bill is important to us.
> >
> >
> > I've enclosed a sample letter which you are welcome to copy, use,
> > modify or whatever to send to your congressman, Please send a note,
> > call, or email to your representative now. If you don't know who your
> > congressman is visit:
> > 0000,0000,00FFhttp://www.house.gov> > nderline>.
> >
> >
> > In addition I ask you to please pass this information and letter
> > on to as many people as you possibly can. We can make a difference.
> >
> >
> > Thank you,
> >
> > Judy Onofrio
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Dear
> >
> >
> > We need your help! Please sign on as a co-sponsor or vote for Bill
> > HR3249, which has been introduced in congress by Amo Houghton.
> >
> >
> > As artists and supporter of the arts, we feel strongly that the current
> > law that does not allow artists to take a fair market value deduction
> > for a charitable donation of their work is unfair. Owners of artwork
> > not their own can take an appreciated full
> > market value deduction but the artist cannot. The new bill HR3249
> > would rectify that inequity.
> >
> >
> > It is important and helpful for charitable organizations to be able to
> > raise money through auctions of artwork. Museums need to add to their
> > current collections. By amending this law, artists would be willing to
> > donate work of higher quality to these organizations, which in the end
> > would benefit everyone.
> >
> >
> > Please help us to change this double standard and make it equal for
> > both artist and patron. Vote for HR3249.
> >
> >
> > Thank you for your consideration and representing our needs.
> >
> >
> > Sincerely,
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > email: judyland@judyonofrio.com
> >
> > ______________________________________________________________________________
> > Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
> >
> > You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> > settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
> >
> > Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
> > melpots@pclink.com.
> >
>
> ______________________________________________________________________________
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at melpots@pclink.com.
--
Earl Brunner
http://coyote.accessnv.com/bruec
mailto:bruec@anv.net
Cyberpotter@AOL.COM on tue 12 dec 00
In a message dated 12/12/00 4:15:52 PM Eastern Standard Time,
stairs@STAIRS.ON.CA writes:
<< This talk of the MFA has me thinking about art. >>
Thank you for sharing your apparently well earned, deeply considered and
cogently expressed thoughts on the subject! I feel better about myself as a
person who is often called "artistic" by others, but knows she's not an
"artist" just from reading it.
Nancy in Cincinnati, where they keep threatening that it's gonna snow.
Eventually they will be right.
(It's ok to be kinda artistic even if you're not an artist... it's ok... it's
ok...)
Carol Sandberg on tue 12 dec 00
Bravo ! Vince and Gavin.....you both have articulated beautifully on this
subject.....Thank You.
Carol ....in a shakingly cold, bone-quaking, skin-shrivelling, goose- bumpy
winter Indiana (yes, I too am aware of the energy rate increase)
----- Original Message -----
From: vince pitelka
To:
Sent: Tuesday, December 12, 2000 9:20 PM
Subject: Re: Art
> > If your mind and hands simply make pots while you live life; if you see
> > pots wherever you go, you are a potter. If you see things not quite as
> > others do, you may be an artist. Wonderful. You have my sympathy.
It's
> > your life; live it.
> > The best advice I know is this: don't try to be what you are not. Just
> be
> > yourself. It's called life.
>
> Gavin -
> Your wonderful post is filled with intelligence and wisdom and fire, but
you
> are confusing "artist" with "great artist." Every one of us has an artist
> in us when we are young, but as I have said many times before on Clayart,
> the educational system and/or close-minded family/peers usually break us
of
> the inclination. Being an artist does not imply the ability to make great
> or even good art. Few are capable of great art, but everyone is capable
of
> making art, and therefore can be an artist. What is art? That's probably
> more than we want to get into here, but my favorite interpretation is that
> art is original visual expression, conceived and created by an individual
> according to their own experience and vision. It may not be good art, but
> it is still art. The term "artist" is not qualitative; it references
> involvement and commitment.
>
> If the work is not original, it is not art. Some people who fancy
> themselves fine artists are just fine craftspeople adept at creating exact
> copies of what they see. There's no art in that. Many craftspeople who
> never call themselves artists are, because they make very fine original
> artwork. And many who claim to be visual "artists" aren't at all.
>
> I don't want to sound like a broken record, but it is such a shame that as
a
> society we tend to feel that "artist" implies some kind of elevated status
> earned by those making great art or else claimed by those underserving of
> the appellation in an attempt to boost their own ego. What a
> misinterpretation of the term and the concept. We all have the ability to
> be visual artists, and we all SHOULD be visual artists, because it is a
> fundamental and intuitive means of human communication.
> End of rant.
> - Vince
>
> Vince Pitelka
> Home - vpitelka@dekalb.net
> 615/597-5376
> Work - wpitelka@tntech.edu
> 615/597-6801 ext. 111, fax 615/597-6803
> Appalachian Center for Crafts
> Tennessee Technological University
> 1560 Craft Center Drive, Smithville TN 37166
> http://www.craftcenter.tntech.edu/
>
>
____________________________________________________________________________
__
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
melpots@pclink.com.
Snail Scott on tue 12 dec 00
>Gavin -
>Your wonderful post is filled with intelligence and wisdom and fire, but you
>are confusing "artist" with "great artist." Every one of us has an artist
>in us when we are young, but as I have said many times before on Clayart,
>the educational system and/or close-minded family/peers usually break us of
>the inclination. Being an artist does not imply the ability to make great
>or even good art. Few are capable of great art, but everyone is capable of
>making art, and therefore can be an artist.
>- Vince
On this topic: my book recommendation du jour:
Art & Fear
by David Bayles and Ted Orland
I'm no fan of mushy-minded new-age inspiration books,
(e.g. I can't stand Bruce Holly's ArtCalendar column),
and this isn't one of those. It's a sensible, direct,
and insightful book about all the mental issues that
get in the way of making the work you want to make.
Here is an excerpt from the introduction:
This is a book about making art. Ordinary art. Ordinary
art means something like: all art NOT made by Mozart.
After all, art is rarely made by Mozart-like people -
essentially (statistically speaking) there aren't any
people like that. But while geniuses get made once-a-
century or so, good art gets made all the time. Making
art is a common and intimately human activity, filled
with all the perils (and rewards) that accompany any
worthwhile effort...
If you're anyone other than the natural self-created
genius in Gavin's post, this book is worth reading.
-Snail
Gavin Stairs on tue 12 dec 00
Hi everybody,
This talk of the MFA has me thinking about art.
When I was very young, I was passionately interested in everything. I
drew, read, modelled things of plasticene, carved wood, photographed,
painted, you name it. I revelled in nature. We used to spend summers by a
lake in the sparsely populated countryside, and I was in heaven in my
wilderness, with a convenient kitchen and warm bed.
I didn't like school much. It's true that some of the teachers were
sympathetic and knowledgeable, but what I burned to understand never seemed
to be on the curriculum. So I got through it, but my mind was often
elsewhere. By the time I was about to graduate from high school, I had a
dilemma. Would I go on to study art or science?
What decided me for science, more or less, were three things. First, I
never found my voice in art. I didn't have anything to say. Nothing worth
my own interest, much less worth inflicting on others. I could see that
other artists weren't much concerned over this conundrum, but it was more
than I could deal with. The second thing was that I couldn't see how to
make a living in art. It didn't seem practical. Third, I needed answers
to some questions, and it seemed to me in my naivete that science would
answer them. These were philosophical and psychological questions. I
thought, well, in university I will finally get answers to my deepest
questions. That's where the great minds hang out. They'll know.
So, I went to university in science, and almost immediately got so
disillusioned that I ended up in the deepest depression in my life, and
became a dropout. The akademe was not what I dreamed of. I had gone from
high school to higher school, nothing more. So I was not to be a
scientist, either.
I ended up, after much turmoil, learning engineering, although I never
completed my course of study. I found myself a designer at yet another
university, of value because of my eclectic mix of learning, my native wit
and my willingness to accept less than the going rate. It was only when I
found myself in this dead end that my true education began. That true
education was self examination, and I spent over a decade immersed in it.
So passes a lifetime. I count myself lucky, because I actually came to the
point of examining my own condition, which is more than most ever
achieve. But in the achievements of the world, I've not been conspicuous.
From this perspective, I am beginning to see what an artist is, and I am
not one of them. I have a close friend, a life partner, who is an
artist. A poet. I am beginning to recognize a few others. They are
different from the rest of us. They see differently, by different
means. They are not suited to ordinary life. They do art because it is as
natural to them as speaking. They spend their lives, as we do, sharpening
their skills, but they are born what they are.
Me, I'm a life student, a philosopher. I can turn my hand to just about
anything, and I can make a fine pot, a beautiful book, a physics
experiment, a kiln, a house...you name it. But I do not see the way an
artist sees. I see my way. I'm done being an engineer now. I'm making
fine things with my hands. Books of poetry just at the moment. I'll get
to pots in a bit. They'll be fine pots, beautiful pots. But they won't be
an artist's pots, because I'm not an artist, but a craftsman.
Now, there are perhaps a fraction of a percent of all of us who are true
artists, who can't do anything else, because we aren't built for it. What
are all the rest of these people doing in MFA programs? Obviously, they
are preparing themselves for a social role. They are preparing to become
something other than artists. Will they ever see as an artist sees? No,
they won't. If they are very diligent and lucky, they may in the end find
a way to comprehend what a true artist sees, but that is not the same as
being it.
My dear friend the poet has spent her entire life on the fringes of
society, eking out a church-mouse living. She went to university, studied
literature, got a masters degree in education, but she is fitted best to be
a poet, and that is what she has done with her life. Poets don't make a
lot of money. Nor do painters, sculptors, musicians, actors. There are
the stars, but most just get by, barely.
For the most part, on this list, we are not artists. We are
crafts-people. We can make fine objects. We can sell them. We can make a
living. We live within the confines of our societies, and we must bend to
the markets. If we see clearly enough, we can do well.
What does an MFA have to do with this? Not much. If you want to teach in
an accredited school, you probably need one. If you need a structured
environment to force you to work, you may find it there. If you need
criticism and development, be careful: remember that most of the rest of
the students will not be there for that. The question will not have
occurred to them. If you want to work with certain professors, artists;
fine. If you need to learn the basic techniques, what on earth have you
been doing all this time? Go and apprentice with a potter. Go take Ron
Roy's glaze course. Go watch Dannon Rhudy throw a pot. Go make terra sig
with Vince. Go invest in a studio. US$30,000 buys quite a lot of studio
equipment. Go learn from anyone and everyone. Open your mind and see. Go
to libraries, museums and galleries. Travel to places where pots are being
made the same way they have been made for generations. DO something!
If your mind and hands simply make pots while you live life; if you see
pots wherever you go, you are a potter. If you see things not quite as
others do, you may be an artist. Wonderful. You have my sympathy. It's
your life; live it.
The best advice I know is this: don't try to be what you are not. Just be
yourself. It's called life.
Gavin
Gavin Stairs
Stairs Small Systems
921 College St., # 1-A
Toronto, Ontario, Canada M6H 1A1
phone: (416)530-0419 stairs@stairs.on.ca
vince pitelka on tue 12 dec 00
> If your mind and hands simply make pots while you live life; if you see
> pots wherever you go, you are a potter. If you see things not quite as
> others do, you may be an artist. Wonderful. You have my sympathy. It's
> your life; live it.
> The best advice I know is this: don't try to be what you are not. Just
be
> yourself. It's called life.
Gavin -
Your wonderful post is filled with intelligence and wisdom and fire, but you
are confusing "artist" with "great artist." Every one of us has an artist
in us when we are young, but as I have said many times before on Clayart,
the educational system and/or close-minded family/peers usually break us of
the inclination. Being an artist does not imply the ability to make great
or even good art. Few are capable of great art, but everyone is capable of
making art, and therefore can be an artist. What is art? That's probably
more than we want to get into here, but my favorite interpretation is that
art is original visual expression, conceived and created by an individual
according to their own experience and vision. It may not be good art, but
it is still art. The term "artist" is not qualitative; it references
involvement and commitment.
If the work is not original, it is not art. Some people who fancy
themselves fine artists are just fine craftspeople adept at creating exact
copies of what they see. There's no art in that. Many craftspeople who
never call themselves artists are, because they make very fine original
artwork. And many who claim to be visual "artists" aren't at all.
I don't want to sound like a broken record, but it is such a shame that as a
society we tend to feel that "artist" implies some kind of elevated status
earned by those making great art or else claimed by those underserving of
the appellation in an attempt to boost their own ego. What a
misinterpretation of the term and the concept. We all have the ability to
be visual artists, and we all SHOULD be visual artists, because it is a
fundamental and intuitive means of human communication.
End of rant.
- Vince
Vince Pitelka
Home - vpitelka@dekalb.net
615/597-5376
Work - wpitelka@tntech.edu
615/597-6801 ext. 111, fax 615/597-6803
Appalachian Center for Crafts
Tennessee Technological University
1560 Craft Center Drive, Smithville TN 37166
http://www.craftcenter.tntech.edu/
Gavin Stairs on wed 13 dec 00
At 09:20 PM 12/12/00, Vince Pitelka wrote:
>...
>Gavin -
>Your wonderful post is filled with intelligence and wisdom and fire, but you
>are confusing "artist" with "great artist." ...
Dear Vince,
Picky picky. My "wonderful post" is my art. So I embellish a bit.
I don't mean to deny folks who want to dabble, nor to demean those who want
to make a living. I do want to deflate those who think that art is
something to aspire to. It's not. It's just part of life. Some people
have it running in their veins, and they can't escape it. Others can aspire.
In former times (way, waaay back) when everyone did every essential task
for themselves, and there was no such thing as an artist, every hunter
could paint the game he hunted, and everyone could also paint the gods and
the creation tales and the hero tales. That was just part of life. But
who did the first creation tale, the first culture hero tale? Those people
were special then, and they are special now. It's important that the rest
of us realize that we are not as they, because it is necessary for us to
find our own special nature, and follow that. There used to be elders,
grandfathers and grandmothers who could see, and who would help children to
find their path in life. We don't have that wisdom any more, more's the
pity, so we have to discover it ourselves, which is a much more difficult
task.
If you look the thing square in the face and see it for what it is, you
will have much less difficulty seeing what you yourself are doing. There
is no dishonor in solid craftsmanship, and I don't care what you call
yourself. Just don't get too attached to the idea that you are special.
If I may harken back to another thread, the mingei ideal is just this. If
you can stop thinking that you have to do all the hard, artistic stuff, and
just lose yourself in the work, let the pot happen, you will produce
beautiful work. That is of course not easy, but that is what we can all
aspire to.
Please note that this is a discussion, not a prescription. You know
there's a lot of doing behind this simple aphorism. But thinking of being
an artist, great or small, gets in the way, rather than helping. Most true
artists I know call themselves writers, not authors, and painters, not artists.
Gavin
PS: Concerning originality: I have found that it is impossible to be
truly original. All my best thoughts turn out to have been thought before,
usually in ancient times. Those old paleolithic buggers were pretty
bright, it turns out. Or I'm pretty dull. I've tried to understand how
some so-called great original thinkers came up with their gems. I always
find that they took a bit from here and a bit from there, smacked them
together, hit the result once or twice with a bit mallet, and Bob's your
uncle. That takes nothing away from them, but it does take the mickey out
of this originality game, doesn't it?
Gavin Stairs
Stairs Small Systems
921 College St., # 1-A
Toronto, Ontario, Canada M6H 1A1
phone: (416)530-0419 stairs@stairs.on.ca
the NAP on wed 13 dec 00
gavin-
Your post is probably the single best commentary I've ever read on this
subject. It should be required reading in every studio and school that
teaches pots or art, and all of us on this list should read it every day,
first thing in the morning, and consider who and what we are and why.
thanks for taking the time to post such an articulate and thoughtful piece.
the NAP
Karen Sullivan on wed 13 dec 00
Welcome to the dialogue!
bamboo karen
on 12/13/00 6:26 AM, the NAP at nap_pots@YAHOO.COM wrote:
> gavin-
>
> Your post is probably the single best commentary I've ever read on this
> subject. It should be required reading in every studio and school that
> teaches pots or art, and all of us on this list should read it every day,
> first thing in the morning, and consider who and what we are and why.
>
> thanks for taking the time to post such an articulate and thoughtful piece.
>
>
> the NAP
>
> ______________________________________________________________________________
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
> melpots@pclink.com.
>
vince pitelka on wed 13 dec 00
> Please note that this is a discussion, not a prescription. You know
> there's a lot of doing behind this simple aphorism. But thinking of being
> an artist, great or small, gets in the way, rather than helping. Most
true
> artists I know call themselves writers, not authors, and painters, not
artists.
Gavin -
"Thinking of being an artist gets in the way" only if we misunderstand and
misuse the term "artist." That was the primary point of my post. It
dismays me that the "artist" has become someone different or even suspect in
our contemporary culture. As you point out, in prehistoric and tribal
cultures no one was singled out as being an artist, because everyone was an
artist, and art was a part of daily life. That was true to some extent
through a good part of human history. The Industrial Revolution changed
that once and for all, and art became something to hang on the wall or place
on a pedestal, while craft was largely absorbed by factory production, and
craftspeople became product designers or machine operators. Fine craft has
been restored in our culture, but we still have this problem trying to
distinguish between art and craft, and we still have trouble with the
appellation "artist."
There is nothing at all lofty or special about being an artist. It is a
perfectly natural thing for humans to do, and somehow we need to get back to
that notion. Part of that plan involves de-mystifying the word "artist." I
know I am often guilty of idealism, but better that than pessimism or
separatism. We all have an artist within us, and we should all be perfectly
comfortable with that notion.
> PS: Concerning originality: I have found that it is impossible to be
> truly original. All my best thoughts turn out to have been thought
before,
> usually in ancient times.
Goodness Gavin. You generally seem very optimistic, but this is rather
grim. I do not know your work, but you probably deserve a lot more credit.
I have found that once one releases oneself from immitation, it is almost
impossible to not be original. Originality is not the problem. Confidence
in one's original expression is the challenge, because our society teaches
us to be suspicious of original work. The status quo is always acceptable,
and it is far safer to immitate what has been previously accepted as valid.
So, to many people, the search for originality implies a dissatisfaction
with that which has been accepted and proven. Conservatism vs. change.
Artists through human history have barely scratched the surface of visual
possibility.
Best wishes -
- Vince
Vince Pitelka
Home - vpitelka@dekalb.net
615/597-5376
Work - wpitelka@tntech.edu
615/597-6801 ext. 111, fax 615/597-6803
Appalachian Center for Crafts
Tennessee Technological University
1560 Craft Center Drive, Smithville TN 37166
http://www.craftcenter.tntech.edu/
vince pitelka on thu 14 dec 00
> for the rest of you out there, karen already knows I'm the quiet type.
so
> she's jerking my chain a bit (deservedly so).
> I find this whole thread fascinating...finally wrote an "artist's
statement"
> this past year, it's more like an unstatment..
Nap -
Your reference to an "unstatement" reminds me that most people who are
writing an artist's statement usually end up writing an "overstatement" when
they would be far better off to write an "understatement."
Best wishes -
- Vince
Vince Pitelka
Home - vpitelka@dekalb.net
615/597-5376
Work - wpitelka@tntech.edu
615/597-6801 ext. 111, fax 615/597-6803
Appalachian Center for Crafts
Tennessee Technological University
1560 Craft Center Drive, Smithville TN 37166
http://www.craftcenter.tntech.edu/
the NAP on thu 14 dec 00
bk, you make me blush...
for the rest of you out there, karen already knows I'm the quiet type. so
she's jerking my chain a bit (deservedly so).
I find this whole thread fascinating...finally wrote an "artist's statement"
this past year, it's more like an unstatment..
following karen's lead of the cups, I am off to make bowls
simple
plain
tea
soup
are they art? who knows...for certain,
they're bowls....
----- Original Message -----
From: Karen Sullivan
To:
Sent: Wednesday, December 13, 2000 3:11 PM
Subject: Re: Art
> Welcome to the dialogue!
> bamboo karen
>
> on 12/13/00 6:26 AM, the NAP at nap_pots@YAHOO.COM wrote:
>
> > gavin-
> >
> > Your post is probably the single best commentary I've ever read on this
> > subject. It should be required reading in every studio and school that
> > teaches pots or art, and all of us on this list should read it every
day,
> > first thing in the morning, and consider who and what we are and why.
> >
> > thanks for taking the time to post such an articulate and thoughtful
piece.
> >
> >
> > the NAP
> >
> >
____________________________________________________________________________
__
> > Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
> >
> > You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> > settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
> >
> > Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
> > melpots@pclink.com.
> >
>
>
____________________________________________________________________________
__
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
melpots@pclink.com.
Lee Love on fri 31 aug 01
I should be in bed, but I had to share this quote that my wife Jean found
for me:
"The essence of all beautiful art, all great art, is gratitude."
- Friedrich
Nietzche
--
Lee Love
Mashiko JAPAN Ikiru@kami.com
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Rebecca P on thu 10 oct 02
Hi all!
I recently returned from the Geraldine R dodge Poetry Festival and have been
lurking for a few days. I would like to share a couple of things with you.
One is the way all forms of art seem to overlap. In the sessions I attended,
the speakers invariably used the word art interchangeably with the word
poetry unless, of course, he/she was speaking to a specific poetry concept.
Another treasure I found there was a featured poet named Taha Muhammad Ali.
He is elderly, an Arab living in Israel, a seller of souvenirs. His poetry
is simple but he has a way of making one gasp at the insights he writes. A
line from one of his poems: "Art is worthless unless it plants a measure of
splendor in people's hearts."
Cheers!
Rebecca Pierre
P.S. (The poetry festival? Waterloo Village, NJ, beautiful weather, Paul
winter music, an historic village, What more could one ask except pottery!)
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Bill Merrill on thu 30 dec 10
=3D20
=3D20
=3D20
=3D20
=3D20
The important thing is to do, and nothing else; be what it may.=3D20
=3D20
=3D20
ART WASHES AWAY FROM THE SOUL THE DUST OF EVERYDAY LIFE.
Picasso
=3D20
Stephani Stephenson on mon 4 jul 11
from word origins.com
I like to discover connections
I like that the root word for art means to 'put things together, to joi=
=3D
n'
and it is related to arm, and, of course it would follow that there is =
=3D
an
immediate connection to.....arthritis! my world is definitely filled wi=
=3D
th Art!
*
Art Date of Origin 13th c.
Like arm, arthritis, and article, art goes back to an Indo-European=
=3D
root *ar-, which meant =3D91put things together, join=3D92. Putting things =
to=3D
gether
implies some skill: hence Latin ars =3D91skill=3D92. Its stem art- produced=
O=3D
ld
French art, the source of the English word. It brought with it the notion=
=3D
of
=3D91skill=3D92, which it still retains; the modern association with painti=
ng=3D
,
sculpture, etc did not begin until the mid 17th century. Latin derivative=
=3D
s
of ars include the verb artīre =3D91instruct in various skills=3D92,=
=3D
from which
ultimately English gets artisan (16th c.); and artificium, a compound for=
=3D
med
with a variant of facere =3D91do, make=3D92, from which we get artificial (=
14=3D
th c.).
Stephani S.
where it finally rained a few days ago. oh the lovely smell of the creoso=
=3D
te
bush, the spectacular lightening, the dancing clouds and lovely wet drops=
=3D
.
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