DAN JOHNSTON on wed 14 oct 98
I plan to saggar fire to achieve primitive/pit firing look. I have a
few "beginner" questions.
1. How much sawdust (I realize that makes the black look)?
2. If I use banana peals (or other fruit), do they have to be dry or
fresh?
3. How much copper sulfate ( and how close to the pot)?
4. What other ingredients produce colors?
5. If I use copper wire to make black squiggles what gauge wire and
where do I get it?
6. What cone do I fire to?
Thanks!
Dan Johnston
Farmington, MO
danj@ldd.net
Barney Adams on thu 15 oct 98
For the copper wire I have a large amount of electronic parts I have
salvaged. The yoke off the back of a CRT (TV or computer monitor) has a
smaller guage that is nice and some motor windings (the smaller motors).
If you have trouble finding some copper wire let me know I could probably
scape some up for you. I've just put a loosely wadded strand on a bottle and
it gives nice gray loops.
Barney
>
> ----------------------------Original message----------------------------
> I plan to saggar fire to achieve primitive/pit firing look. I have a
> few "beginner" questions.
>
> 1. How much sawdust (I realize that makes the black look)?
>
> 2. If I use banana peals (or other fruit), do they have to be dry or
> fresh?
>
> 3. How much copper sulfate ( and how close to the pot)?
>
> 4. What other ingredients produce colors?
>
> 5. If I use copper wire to make black squiggles what gauge wire and
> where do I get it?
>
> 6. What cone do I fire to?
>
> Thanks!
>
> Dan Johnston
> Farmington, MO
> danj@ldd.net
>
Donn Buchfinck on thu 15 oct 98
You can use a lot of things to sagger fire
Fab cloths washing detergent
works great, you get a real great blue
cat food dry kind
dog food dry kind
rock salt
copper carb
copper wire thin and thick home depot sells different guages
broken up charcole briqets gives you the black
chicken wire is great
a great thing to do is roll out a slab of clay about 1/2 thick
then cut a piece of chichen wire to the same size, or roll out a slab to the
chicken wire, roll the chichen wire into the slab, then take the stuff I
listed up top and create a painting with the stuff on the slab, cover with a
canvas and roll this into the slab, be generous with the materials.
you can take a 5 gallon bucket and fill 2/3 with water and put salt in it,
soak straw in the water and put the straw on the slab, but do not cover the
slab all over with straw just in some places,lay your piece on the slab and
roll the slab up like a burrito, I used to wire mine up stiching it with
bailing wire,
you can put this into a sealed container if you want or if you have a hard
brick kiln then put it on a used scrap of kilnshelf,
fire the kiln to cone 014
if you fire any hotter, the color you will be getting will start to burn off.
this is the way Iv'e done it.
Iv'e probably done it WRONG but I feel there is no wrong way to do a thing,
do not fire this combination in an electric kiln.
a gas kiln is best
the worst part about it is that the best looking thing will be the slab after
you take your piece out of it
good luck
Donn Buchfinck
Charlie and Linda on thu 15 oct 98
DAN JOHNSTON wrote:
>
> ----------------------------Original message----------------------------
> I plan to saggar fire to achieve primitive/pit firing look. I have a
> few "beginner" questions.
>
> 1. How much sawdust (I realize that makes the black look)?
>
> 2. If I use banana peals (or other fruit), do they have to be dry or
> fresh?
>
> 3. How much copper sulfate ( and how close to the pot)?
>
> 4. What other ingredients produce colors?
>
> 5. If I use copper wire to make black squiggles what gauge wire and
> where do I get it?
>
> 6. What cone do I fire to?
>
> Thanks!
>
> Dan Johnston
> Farmington, MO
> danj@ldd.net
Hi Dan
The answer to your question is there are lots of right answers..but here
is what we are doing today...ask tomorrow and, well...
Loading a saggar-We place our terra sig'ed bisqued pieces into planter
shaped saggers that have approx. 1/2 the space filled with coarse red
oak sawdust. This is packed in tightly. We sprinkle in 1-2 tablespoons
of table salt and the same amount of copper carbonate (sulfate works the
same for us) then add more sawdust to keep chemicals from touching the
sides of the piece. Fine copper wire found in "bell ringer wire" can be
stripped of plastic and then draped over the pot. We also use a few
strands of coarse steel wool for a orange blush (less is more with steel
wool, too much will blacken the pot). Then lid of the saggar is set in
place. Our lastest firings show that having a tiny air gap will help
color development.
Firing-We are firing in our fiber raku kiln which leads to quick heat up
and cool down...times will vary in different kilns. 20-30 mins is spent
heating the kiln to 1500-1600f. An additional 20-25 mins is spent
continuing to reach and stay at 1850f. The kiln is then shut off and
left until it has cooled. The pots are then removed.
Trouble shooting this technique-
Pot too black-Too much sawdust or too little time at 1850f or too tight
of a saggar container.
Pot too light in color-Fired too long or too much air let into saggar by
too large of an air gap or saggar spilt open or kiln too hot.
If you want an example of the results of this technique---go to this
site and look at the second pic. Black lines are copper wire and they
resist the black smoke! The red/brown squigglies are from steel wool
(use less than you think you need). Copper carb and salt was added into
the saggar also.
http://www.cclay.com/criggs/index.htm
Two last things. We prop our pieces up in the saggar with bits of brick
or pieces of kiln shelf to keep the piece out of the chemicals.
We throw our saggars out of grogged raku clay to make them last longer.
We are experimenting with using higher fired saggars but the jury is
still out. (Anyone out there in Clayart land with a great saggar clay
that they would like to share?)
Happy firing,
Charlie and Linda Riggs.
Dannon Rhudy on thu 15 oct 98
----------
> From: DAN JOHNSTON
>
>
> 1. How much sawdust (I realize that makes the black look)?
>
You will have to experiment with amounts of any materials.
Try varying things, and keep notes of what you like.
2. If I use banana peals (or other fruit), do they have to be dry or
> fresh?
>
It does not matter whether they are dry or fresh, except if they
are fresh it will take them a bit longer to dry out so that they
burn.
3. How much copper sulfate ( and how close to the pot)?
If you use copper sulfate, why not dissolve it in water, then
dip the pot or brush it on? Works well that way, but keep it
off your skin - wear rubber gloves. If you use it dry, right
next to/against the pot.
> 4. What other ingredients produce colors?
Manure, salts (table salt, epsom salts) seaweed,
bird seed, dog/cat food, twinkies...most anything.
5. If I use copper wire to make black squiggles what gauge wire and
> where do I get it?
I get mine from engine-rewind shops. I get the finest
they have, which is very fine indeed. About the consistency
of coarse hair.
6. What cone do I fire to?
That can vary a lot. I like to go to about cone 010, but many
fire to much lower temperatures. Experiment.
Regards,
Dannon Rhudy
potter@koyote.com
> danj@ldd.net
Rafael Molina-Rodriguez (Rafael Molina-Rodriguez) on thu 15 oct 98
------------------
Dan :
=3E3. How much copper sulfate ( and how close to the pot)?
Caveat Emptor=21 Take extreme care when using any of the sulfates and for =
that
matter any of the materials that are used in saggar/primitive firing. Use a
NIOSH approved respirator and rubber gloves when handling this material and =
I
would use the respirator when firing and unloading. And, be sure your kiln =
is
well ventilated, preferably in an outdoor area.
I say this because a few years ago when I was doing alot of saggar firing I
developed some health problems. Specifically, I had uncontrollable or
involuntary muscle spasms. My arms, legs, and sometimes torso would just =
move
by themselves. No kidding=21 I mentioned this to the college nurse and she
suggested I go be tested for metal poisoning. Well, I never got tested and
after ceasing to use those particular materials and firing processes the
symptoms subsided and eventually disappearred altogether.
I attributed the symptoms to the materials I was using (I think it was the
metallic sulphates, but it could have been the sodium chloride or maybe the
sawdust had some type of chemicals), but it may well have been something =
else.
I just think it was too coincidental for the spasms and twitching to subside
when I changed the way I was working.
Rafael
=3E=3E=3E DAN JOHNSTON =3Cdanj=40ldd.net=3E 10/14/98 08:18am =3E=3E=3E
----------------------------Original message----------------------------
I plan to saggar fire to achieve primitive/pit firing look. I have a
few =22beginner=22 questions.
1. How much sawdust (I realize that makes the black look)?
2. If I use banana peals (or other fruit), do they have to be dry or
fresh?
3. How much copper sulfate ( and how close to the pot)?
4. What other ingredients produce colors?
5. If I use copper wire to make black squiggles what gauge wire and
where do I get it?
6. What cone do I fire to?
Thanks=21
Dan Johnston
Farmington, MO
danj=40ldd.net
Nancy Jonnum on sat 24 oct 98
Dear Dan,
I have saved your letter about saggar firing for a while, because I wanted to
think about my answer. I have been saggar firing for some time and I have
some suggestions.
I use banana peels and other organic materials both fresh and dried. I have
used sawdust and frequently use the chips that the tree trimmer left behind.
In our area we have some trees called Arizona Cypress. The green branches
from them make very striking black, white and gray markings. I have really
good results with seaweed. If I want dark brown, gray and black, I use lots
of these materials. Less organic matter means a lighter result.
I sometimes use copper carbonate and when I feel wealthy a little cobalt
carbonate. I place these on pot shards from un glazed broken pots. These
shards can be used time and again. A copper scrubber for cleaning pots and
pans can be stretched over a pot. Steel wool sometimes gives a blush.
Different colored clays give different results.
You can mask parts of your pots so that they get less color. If your pots
have been bisque fired, you can make a slip from water and the same clay as
the pot. Paint it on wherever you want to protect the pot from the smoke.
Because the slip will not "fit" on your pot, it will peel off after the pots
are cool. You can also prop pot shards against your pots to shield them.
I use ^5 or ^10 clay and I usually fire them to ^05. Sometimes I bisque
first and sometimes not. Sometimes I fire them to maturity first. This makes
them stronger, but they will absorb less color.
I hope this gives you some ideas to experiment with. I would be interested
to hear ideas from other people.
Nancy
John Guerin on mon 26 oct 98
In a message dated 10/24/98 9:45:04 AM PST, JONNUM2@AOL.COM writes:
<< Dear Dan,
I have saved your letter about saggar firing for a while, because I
wanted to
think about my answer. I have been saggar firing for some time and I have
some suggestions.
I use banana peels and other organic materials both fresh and dried.
I have
used sawdust and frequently use the chips that the tree trimmer left behind.
In our area we have some trees called Arizona Cypress. The green branches
from them make very striking black, white and gray markings. I have really
good results with seaweed. If I want dark brown, gray and black, I use lots
of these materials. Less organic matter means a lighter result. >>
Hi Nancy,
I don't know where you are located, but you mentioned Arizona Cypress in your
area. If you are near Tucson Arizona, Tim Kapral is giving a Pit Firing
Workshop on December 5th and 6th. Tim really gets some good color in his
firings. I have attended two of his workshops and am looking forward to the
third one. It is forty dollars for the two day workshop and he demonstrates
pitfiring and garbage can firing. If you are interested, let me know and I'll
give you the details.
John Guerin
Tucson, AZ
Chris Leake on tue 27 oct 98
John,
This message wasn't directed to me, but my husband and I would like some
more information on Tim Kapral's workshop. Unfortunately I will be out
of town for a week and temporarily off the clayart board. Would it be
possible for you to send us some information directly to my e-mail?
Thanks in advance,
Chris Leake
John Guerin wrote:
> ----------------------------Original
> message----------------------------
> In a message dated 10/24/98 9:45:04 AM PST, JONNUM2@AOL.COM writes:
>
> << Dear Dan,
> I have saved your letter about saggar firing for a while,
> because I
> wanted to
> think about my answer. I have been saggar firing for some time and I
> have
> some suggestions.
> I use banana peels and other organic materials both fresh and
> dried.
> I have
> used sawdust and frequently use the chips that the tree trimmer left
> behind.
> In our area we have some trees called Arizona Cypress. The green
> branches
> from them make very striking black, white and gray markings. I have
> really
> good results with seaweed. If I want dark brown, gray and black, I
> use lots
> of these materials. Less organic matter means a lighter result. >>
>
> Hi Nancy,
>
> I don't know where you are located, but you mentioned Arizona Cypress
> in your
> area. If you are near Tucson Arizona, Tim Kapral is giving a Pit
> Firing
> Workshop on December 5th and 6th. Tim really gets some good color in
> his
> firings. I have attended two of his workshops and am looking forward
> to the
> third one. It is forty dollars for the two day workshop and he
> demonstrates
> pitfiring and garbage can firing. If you are interested, let me know
> and I'll
> give you the details.
>
> John Guerin
> Tucson, AZ
Chess Denman on fri 30 oct 98
I have aquired a large oil drum and am all keen to fill it up with gunk and
fire things in it.
As I understand it you pack the drum with sawdust and wood and organic
matter and copper or cobalt oxides and metal fragments or shells etc. With
your pots in amongst these.
What I don't understand are the following.
1 can I use stoneware clay which has been first fired to maturity.
2 are there glazes used as well
3 how should the drum be prepared (holes? lid?)
4 how is the whole thing lit and kept burning (fire lighters at the top with
very dry wood/sawdust burner playing in the bottom through a hole)?
Yours in massive ignorance
Chess
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