eden@sover.net on wed 25 aug 99
Well here is the whole story. As I was going to sell at Coconut Grove in
Miami in Feb '98 I was uneasy about the save-them-till-later plan I'd been
using successfully for charge slips in the past. Miami seemed home of the
professional thieves and I wanted protection. We made a big effort to get
the suppliers to help us devise a system to use a cell phone hooked up to
the card reader and were told universally that we couldn't do it.
So we gave up. Many of you will probably recall I was posting alot about
the subject at that time, hoping somebody else was doing it. I only came
up with a device being energetically flogged by salespeople at the Coconut
Grove fair with a pricetag of $2000. Efficient, but dear.
Well, my very last sale of the fair was a professional rip job and I was a
sitting duck. To complicate the aftermath it was my cousin in my booth
doing the sale and I was keeping my hands off as he was so excited to be
making a big sale. So whatever antennae I might have had on the job I was
purposely trying not to butt in.
There was a team of two with a baby carriage full of purchases. He had an
injured arm that he was kinda making a big deal about. Later I figured it
was probably a result of what he did to steal the credit card he used, and
of course the baby buggy was another device to put you at ease, filled
with stuff purchased with the stolen card. He went straight to one of the
most expensive pieces and then diddled around awhile deciding. I didn't
have a clue.
Afew months ago I happened to notice a list of stuff to watch out for with
professional stolen card users and just about everything was listed. A
couple to make you think it is normal. An injury to talk about and put
your mind off the sale. Of course the baby buggy was a real nice touch.
So I got stuck for an expensive vase in just the way I had tried to protect
myself against. It was at the very next fair I did that I saw Josh
Simpson's rig and the rest is history. So I have got to say that it is
great to be trusting til you walk straight into it. I don't wish that on
anybody. Maybe if you never do fairs in Miami you don't have to worry
about it. But it is so easy to use, such a pleasure to see the thing spit
out the receipt just like at the convenience store, and I know the
customers like it. Looks professional.
Keep on trucking. Off to Bennington today.......beautiful day for a drive.
I told this story to Bonnie and Jeremy Hellman when we were visiting them
and she has urged me to share it with the group. So, Bonnie, if you have
anything to add that I left out please feel free.
Eleanora
............
Eleanora Eden 802 869-2003
Paradise Hill
Bellows Falls, VT 05101 eden@sover.net
Dale A. Neese on thu 26 aug 99
Yes Eleanora,
I have been stung once at a fair. I knew better, but not wanting to keep the
customers waiting and run up a substantial roaming cellular phone bill, I
didn't call to get authorization until I returned to my room. By then it was
too late. The very well dressed beautiful lady made off with a nice set of
goblets. There is really no way of telling if it is a stolen card before
hand. Now I know that the card company would have paid me $50 if I had kept
the stolen card after calling for authorization. You may have to pay a
little more for your phone service and have a few customers wait a few extra
minutes, (chances are they will see something else to buy while waiting),
but it is a part of doing business. If a potential rip-off thief just sees
that you are going to call the card in, they will change their minds and
walk off. And when they see your machine with instant verification, they
won't even stop in.
It is hard enough to make a living from pottery without having someone try
and steal it from you.
Novus-Discover has the best rates I have found so far.
Dale Tex
Lori Lynn & Robert J on thu 26 aug 99
Eleanora,
Sorry about the rip off. Maybe this can help you in future. We use a cell
phone interface made by Motorola. You hook it to cell phone and the to your
charge card swiper. Works great for us. I t cost me about $150. from
Motorola direct. They make different ones depending upon the type and model
of cell phone you have. Ours is a #SLN3032A. Naturally you do incur any
roam fees for the area your in and your per minute fee but no long distance
charges as you are calling an 800#. For us it is well worth the price.
Lori Lynn
In the AZ desert, where the hot sun meets the cool Colorado.
S.K. Tesar on thu 26 aug 99
I do not wish to make a plug for any one, however....I purchased my edt
machine, a portable battery powered rechargeable, for approximately 850
and the connecting device between the machine and the cell phone for 150
and the cell phone for 50. The service for $15 a month gives me the
Mississippi River to the Atlantic Ocean with no roaming
charges....14cents a minute long distance connection...but local charges
when I am in a place with a local access. I have a business net set up
which includes 3 phones and a mock land line set up so that the 3 phones
can talk to the land line at 8 cents a minute in the home calling area.
I live in Alabama. I did the Ann Arbor Summer Fair. My base rate is $40 a
month ( with the business net....$15 for the Regional coverage for the
main bag phone)....my charges for the entire month of July after a very
successful fair were $74.63 cents. My rate, based on my sales of
$10-$400 is 1.9 for MC/V 2,2 for AMEX and 2.4 for Discover...anyone
interested should contact me off list as I feel that half of the list or
better would not be interested in the commerce of living by clay. I can
supply a name that will work for east of the Mississippi.....I do not
know about west of the Mississipi but it may be worth a call.
I too, did two shows in Miami.....in the days of the knuckle buster
paper charges. I received one counterfeit card for $19. In 16 years of
making a living doing shows I only received one other counterfeit card
and it was in Pensacola for $19....in the 80's both of them. They are
the only bad charges of any kind ( and no bad checks) I have ever
received. That is all I have to say about the matter.
On Wed, 25 Aug 1999 16:48:32 EDT eden@sover.net writes:
> ----------------------------Original
> message----------------------------
> Well here is the whole story. As I was going to sell at Coconut
> Grove in
> Miami in Feb '98 I was uneasy about the save-them-till-later plan
> I'd been
> using successfully for charge slips in the past. Miami seemed home
> of the
> professional thieves and I wanted protection. We made a big effort
> to get
> the suppliers to help us devise a system to use a cell phone hooked
> up to
> the card reader and were told universally that we couldn't do it.
>
> So we gave up. Many of you will probably recall I was posting alot
> about
> the subject at that time, hoping somebody else was doing it. I only
> came
> up with a device being energetically flogged by salespeople at the
> Coconut
> Grove fair with a pricetag of $2000. Efficient, but dear.
>
> Well, my very last sale of the fair was a professional rip job and I
> was a
> sitting duck. To complicate the aftermath it was my cousin in my
> booth
> doing the sale and I was keeping my hands off as he was so excited
> to be
> making a big sale. So whatever antennae I might have had on the
> job I was
> purposely trying not to butt in.
>
> There was a team of two with a baby carriage full of purchases. He
> had an
> injured arm that he was kinda making a big deal about. Later I
> figured it
> was probably a result of what he did to steal the credit card he
> used, and
> of course the baby buggy was another device to put you at ease,
> filled
> with stuff purchased with the stolen card. He went straight to one
> of the
> most expensive pieces and then diddled around awhile deciding. I
> didn't
> have a clue.
>
> Afew months ago I happened to notice a list of stuff to watch out
> for with
> professional stolen card users and just about everything was listed.
> A
> couple to make you think it is normal. An injury to talk about and
> put
> your mind off the sale. Of course the baby buggy was a real nice
> touch.
>
> So I got stuck for an expensive vase in just the way I had tried to
> protect
> myself against. It was at the very next fair I did that I saw Josh
> Simpson's rig and the rest is history. So I have got to say that it
> is
> great to be trusting til you walk straight into it. I don't wish
> that on
> anybody. Maybe if you never do fairs in Miami you don't have to
> worry
> about it. But it is so easy to use, such a pleasure to see the
> thing spit
> out the receipt just like at the convenience store, and I know the
> customers like it. Looks professional.
>
> Keep on trucking. Off to Bennington today.......beautiful day for a
> drive.
>
> I told this story to Bonnie and Jeremy Hellman when we were
> visiting them
> and she has urged me to share it with the group. So, Bonnie, if you
> have
> anything to add that I left out please feel free.
>
> Eleanora
>
> ............
> Eleanora Eden 802 869-2003
> Paradise Hill
> Bellows Falls, VT 05101 eden@sover.net
Sandra K. Tesar
1170 Keel Mountain Rd.
Gurley, AL 35748-9165
___________________________________________________________________
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Anji Henderson on fri 27 aug 99
In a message dated 8/26/99 11:44:38 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
D.Neese@worldnet.att.net writes:
<< You may have to pay a little more for your phone service and have a few
customers wait a few extra minutes, (chances are they will see something else
to buy while waiting), but it is a part of doing business. >>
Just wondering... Cant you deduct the cell phone bill on taxes??
And I agree there are soooo many impulse shoppers out there.
Anji
http://www.angelfire.com/md/Anji/
Olivia T Cavy on sat 28 aug 99
Anji,
Yes, any "ordinary and necessary" business expense is deductible.
However, in order to deduct it you have to spend the money.
Even if you were in the highest federal tax bracket, and fully subject to
social security (self-employment) taxes on all of your Schedule C income,
you would not pay more than 55% in taxes, meaning that you would still be
out of pocket 45% of the expense. Most of us are not in that 39.6% tax
bracket. We pay tax at 15% or 28% plus the effective 13% or so self
employment rate, for a total tax of 28% or 41% on our net self-employment
income.
This means that for most of we get back only 72% or 59% for every dollar
we spend. So if there is a cheaper way to do that works for you, by all
means take that cheaper route.You'll come out ahead in the long run.
Bonnie
Bonnie D. Hellman, CPA in PA & CO
PA work email: oliviatcavy@juno.com (NO attachments please to this
address)
PA home email: mou10man@sgi.net (that's the number 10 in the middle of
the letters)
Colorado email: mou10man@RMI.net (that's the number 10 in the middle of
the letters)
On Fri, 27 Aug 1999 14:03:24 EDT Anji Henderson writes:
>
> ----------------------------Original
> message----------------------------
> In a message dated 8/26/99 11:44:38 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
> D.Neese@worldnet.att.net writes:
>
> << You may have to pay a little more for your phone service and
> have a few
> customers wait a few extra minutes, (chances are they will see
> something else
> to buy while waiting), but it is a part of doing business. >>
>
> Just wondering... Cant you deduct the cell phone bill on taxes??
>
> And I agree there are soooo many impulse shoppers out there.
> Anji
> http://www.angelfire.com/md/Anji/
Bonnie D. Hellman, Pittsburgh, PA
PA work email: oliviatcavy@juno.com (NO attachments please to this
address)
PA home email: mou10man@sgi.net (that's the number 10 in the middle of
the letters)
Colorado email: mou10man@RMI.net (that's the number 10 in the middle of
the letters)
___________________________________________________________________
Get the Internet just the way you want it.
Free software, free e-mail, and free Internet access for a month!
Try Juno Web: http://dl.www.juno.com/dynoget/tagj.
John Rodgers on sun 29 aug 99
Cell phone costs are a cost for doing business and are certainly deductible as a
business expense.
John Rodgers
In New Mexico
Anji Henderson wrote:
> ----------------------------Original message----------------------------
> In a message dated 8/26/99 11:44:38 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
> D.Neese@worldnet.att.net writes:
>
> << You may have to pay a little more for your phone service and have a few
> customers wait a few extra minutes, (chances are they will see something else
> to buy while waiting), but it is a part of doing business. >>
>
> Just wondering... Cant you deduct the cell phone bill on taxes??
>
> And I agree there are soooo many impulse shoppers out there.
> Anji
> http://www.angelfire.com/md/Anji/
Christopher J. Anton on sun 29 aug 99
Would forming an "S" corporation offer an advantage, at least with respect
to reduction of the tax burden by means of expenses?
The costs of cellular phone service (used strictly for business use!) should
then be a before tax expense. The problem, of course, is would the other
costs entailed in incorporation be worth the benefit.
What other concerns should one take into consideration?
- Chris
(preparing to go for his MAcc)
----- Original Message -----
From: Olivia T Cavy
To:
Sent: Saturday, August 28, 1999 7:02 AM
Subject: Re: a cautionary tale on street sales
> ----------------------------Original message----------------------------
> Anji,
>
> Yes, any "ordinary and necessary" business expense is deductible.
> However, in order to deduct it you have to spend the money.
>
> Even if you were in the highest federal tax bracket, and fully subject to
> social security (self-employment) taxes on all of your Schedule C income,
> you would not pay more than 55% in taxes, meaning that you would still be
> out of pocket 45% of the expense. Most of us are not in that 39.6% tax
> bracket. We pay tax at 15% or 28% plus the effective 13% or so self
> employment rate, for a total tax of 28% or 41% on our net self-employment
> income.
>
> This means that for most of we get back only 72% or 59% for every dollar
> we spend. So if there is a cheaper way to do that works for you, by all
> means take that cheaper route.You'll come out ahead in the long run.
>
> Bonnie
>
> Bonnie D. Hellman, CPA in PA & CO
>
> PA work email: oliviatcavy@juno.com (NO attachments please to this
> address)
> PA home email: mou10man@sgi.net (that's the number 10 in the middle of
> the letters)
> Colorado email: mou10man@RMI.net (that's the number 10 in the middle of
> the letters)
>
> On Fri, 27 Aug 1999 14:03:24 EDT Anji Henderson writes:
> >
> > ----------------------------Original
> > message----------------------------
> > In a message dated 8/26/99 11:44:38 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
> > D.Neese@worldnet.att.net writes:
> >
> > << You may have to pay a little more for your phone service and
> > have a few
> > customers wait a few extra minutes, (chances are they will see
> > something else
> > to buy while waiting), but it is a part of doing business. >>
> >
> > Just wondering... Cant you deduct the cell phone bill on taxes??
> >
> > And I agree there are soooo many impulse shoppers out there.
> > Anji
> > http://www.angelfire.com/md/Anji/
>
> Bonnie D. Hellman, Pittsburgh, PA
>
> PA work email: oliviatcavy@juno.com (NO attachments please to this
> address)
> PA home email: mou10man@sgi.net (that's the number 10 in the middle of
> the letters)
> Colorado email: mou10man@RMI.net (that's the number 10 in the middle of
> the letters)
>
> ___________________________________________________________________
> Get the Internet just the way you want it.
> Free software, free e-mail, and free Internet access for a month!
> Try Juno Web: http://dl.www.juno.com/dynoget/tagj.
>
Jeremy/Bonnie Hellman on tue 31 aug 99
Chris and other Clayarters,
For federal taxes there are unlikely to be ANY advantages in being an S
Corp or a partnership. It would probably cost you more to set up those
forms of businesses, and it certainly is a more complicated tax return.
As far as the states are concerned, there are definitely not any
advantages from the viewpoint of deducting expenses.
If the cell phone is an "ordinary and necessary" business expense for a
corp (S corp or C corp) or a partnership it is deductible for the
self-employed individual. If it's used for business purposes, it's
deductible. My point is that when you get a deduction, it means that
you've spent the money. And you only get a percentage of that expense
back on your tax returns. And you don't have the money because you've
spent it.
I would never advise anyone to spend money just to get a deduction. It's
economically unsound. I would advise a business owner to spend money on
those things that truly benefit the business (those "ordinary and
neccesary business expenses"), and on things that they would do anyway
but which can be deducted as business expenses.
As always, a business owner should have proper and adequate documentation
to support the deduction of the business expense. You've got to be able
to show that your cell phone, for example, wasn't used strictly for
personal use. Without going into all the details, with a cell phone, as
with a motor vehicle, it is particularly important to document the
business use. Both the cell phone and the car/small truck/mini-van are
considered to be so called-listed property.
Using the cell phone to verify credit card charges for your business is
clearly a business use. You just have to be able to document that you
used the phone for that purpose.
Bonnie
Bonnie Hellman, CPA in PA & CO
Now enjoying a vactaion in CO
>
>----------------------------Original message----------------------------
>Would forming an "S" corporation offer an advantage, at least with respect
>to reduction of the tax burden by means of expenses?
>
>The costs of cellular phone service (used strictly for business use!) should
>then be a before tax expense. The problem, of course, is would the other
>costs entailed in incorporation be worth the benefit.
>
>What other concerns should one take into consideration?
>
> - Chris
>
>(preparing to go for his MAcc)
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: Olivia T Cavy
>To:
>Sent: Saturday, August 28, 1999 7:02 AM
>Subject: Re: a cautionary tale on street sales
>
>
>> ----------------------------Original message----------------------------
>> Anji,
>>
>> Yes, any "ordinary and necessary" business expense is deductible.
>> However, in order to deduct it you have to spend the money.
>>
>> Even if you were in the highest federal tax bracket, and fully subject to
>> social security (self-employment) taxes on all of your Schedule C income,
>> you would not pay more than 55% in taxes, meaning that you would still be
>> out of pocket 45% of the expense. Most of us are not in that 39.6% tax
>> bracket. We pay tax at 15% or 28% plus the effective 13% or so self
>> employment rate, for a total tax of 28% or 41% on our net self-employment
>> income.
>>
>> This means that for most of we get back only 72% or 59% for every dollar
>> we spend. So if there is a cheaper way to do that works for you, by all
>> means take that cheaper route.You'll come out ahead in the long run.
>>
>> Bonnie
>>
>> Bonnie D. Hellman, CPA in PA & CO
>>
>> PA work email: oliviatcavy@juno.com (NO attachments please to this
>> address)
>> PA home email: mou10man@sgi.net (that's the number 10 in the middle of
>> the letters)
>> Colorado email: mou10man@RMI.net (that's the number 10 in the middle of
>> the letters)
>>
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