Ruff John on fri 3 sep 99
I'm interested to buy a small ball mill used something for no more than 2 lb
jars, laboratory style, togrind or mix small batches.
If anybody interested please send me details, dimensions and price, you can
email me at JRVA99@EARTHLINK.NET
Thank you
Alfredo Ratinoff
Scott B. Ackerman on wed 1 aug 01
As I am a hobbyist (and therefore unlikely to be able to afford a ball mill)
I was wondering if anyone has had any experience using a rock tumbler?
Scott B. Ackerman
Synergy Graphics, LLC
2290 E. Prospect Rd.
Suite 2
Fort Collins, CO 80525
(970)407-8480
Llewellyn Kouba on wed 1 aug 01
Scott,
I have made use of a rock tumbler for some time. The capacity isn't really
large but for a really fine slip it does the job. I haven't done cobalt in
this yet but when I do run out of my current mix I am going to do that as I
have also noticed some heavy blue spots where even finely ground colorants
have not totally dispersed. I know my future cobalt blue will be smoother
and more evenly blended.
Llewellyn
At 03:44 PM 8/1/2001 -0600, you wrote:
>As I am a hobbyist (and therefore unlikely to be able to afford a ball mill)
>I was wondering if anyone has had any experience using a rock tumbler?
>
>Scott B. Ackerman
>Synergy Graphics, LLC
>2290 E. Prospect Rd.
>Suite 2
>Fort Collins, CO 80525
>(970)407-8480
>
>______________________________________________________________________________
>Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
>You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
>settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
>Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
>melpots@pclink.com.
http://www.assumptionabbey.com/Pottery
keith merkley on thu 2 aug 01
Have used a rock tumbler for years, used glasse marbles from dollar store.
Easy to clean, no small cracks to store unwanted material.
The only problem, the noise. Sort of drives you up the wall.
Would like to build a wind powered mill one day, outside, quiet.
Made a rock tumbler when I was a kid that ran in the river behind our
house all summer, disappered when the fall rains started.
keith
_________________________________________________________________
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Michael Mandaville on sun 7 oct 01
On Wed, 1 Aug 2001 15:44:27 -0600, Scott B. Ackerman
wrote:
>As I am a hobbyist (and therefore unlikely to be able to afford a ball
mill)
>I was wondering if anyone has had any experience using a rock tumbler?
>
>Scott B. Ackerman
>Synergy Graphics, LLC
>2290 E. Prospect Rd.
>Suite 2
>Fort Collins, CO 80525
>(970)407-8480
Hello, Scott.
You might not be able to afford a ball mill, but you might be able to build
one. I myself have decided to build one by adding a power take off system
to the drive wheels of my self-propelled walk-mower, which in the case of
my mower happen to be the front wheels. If you don't have a self-propelled
mower, though, you might be able to use the drive wheel of a moped, or even
a bicycle, if you want to give yourself some exercise. I myself have seen
used treadmills at the Goodwill thrift shop for next to nothing. These are
all sources of low-speed power, and have enough "umph" to mix up a lot of
clay. I am just mentioning this as "food for thought", in case you might
be inclined in this direction. Good luck.
Michael Mandaville
Austin, Texas
Paul Herman on mon 25 nov 02
Donna,
I have seen some plans in Harry Davis' book "The Potter's Alternative".
There are plans for building one using a small thrown jar. If you are
more ambitious, and want to make some curved liner bricks and do a lot
of welding (re-inventing the wheel, as Lily says) there are also plans
for a BIG one.
I built my own by throwing the jar and building a roller arrangement to
turn it. It holds about one gallon of wet glaze.
Good luck,
Paul Herman
Great Basin Pottery
423-725 Scott Road
Doyle, California 96109 US
potter@psln.com
julene on tue 29 apr 03
My woodfired raku attempts have shown me that copper is to raku glazes as
iron is to the higher temperature work. After realizing that things have
changed in the world of metal oxides and carbonates, I purchased new
chemicals to test alongside the older ones that I have been using for glaze
tests. I was surprised and a bit disappointed to find that the new iron
oxide is now a liver color and even the new Spanish iron oxide is not as red
as what I had previously purchased as just red iron oxide. Now what to do
with 25 pounds of liver colored iron oxide. (?)
The new copper carbonate is the greener version that others have talked
about. Firing a green copper raku glaze (Radcliff Green) with the new and
old copper carbonates really was like firing two different glazes. Both are
nice and worth doing, just different. The old version had a more uniform
green crackle surface. The new copper carbonate version produced copper
flashing.
I am now wondering if others have used a ball mill to make these new
versions react as the older version did? What did you find? I am planning
on trying this out for my next firings. Fortunately, my son received a rock
tumbler for Christmas. I suspect that it will help grind the copper
carbonate, but could it be that the new liver colored iron oxide is actually
a finer mesh than the old or Spanish? Or what is it that makes the redder
color?
I also made up Berman's turquoise glaze that has lithium carbonate in it. I
have always in the past used spodamene. I could not get it to go through an
80 mesh screen. Is there something about this that I am missing? Is it
adviseable to ball mill lithium carbonate?
I will be testing out ball milling these colorants and I will do electric
firing tests on the iron oxides in cone 6 iron saturated glazes when I do my
next electric firings if my raku team doesn't fire up all the bisqueware
before I get to it. Just wondering what others are doing with these
materials.
julene, raising my son in Wisconsin, but always a Minnesota girl at heart.
lili krakowski on wed 17 dec 03
Wayne, a ballmill really is easy to create. Cardew has a design in his =
bool that also explains the proper speeds. If the mill turns too slowly =
stuff goes plop plop plop the way it does at the end of the spin cycle =
in a front-loading washing machine. Joseph Grebanier hjas a lovely cler =
design in HIS book--and that is what I built--no problem at all.
Marcia Selsor on wed 7 sep 05
I use the gallon size jars on my ball mill with 1500 grams of clay to
1000 of water.
Some people mill some glazes dry. I don't usually mill glazes but do
mill terra sig.
Some people mill crystalline glazes. Maybe some people returning from
the "Lattice" crystalline glaze conference will offer their opinions.
Marcia
also thinking about all those people who survived Katrina
On Sep 7, 2005, at 8:48 PM, Les wrote:
> Hi Clayarters -
>
> I am the recipient of a used but very functional Ball Mill. As I
> have never tried to grind minerals, etc.I do not know where to
> start and where the end is. I have the mill and a great quantity
> of the "porcelain" balls (actually small solid cylinder forms) and
> the containers for the materials.
>
> My question is...... how smal should the material to be ground
> be? ....... should it be dry or wet? ........etc., etc., etc.
>
> Any help would be gratefully accepted!
>
> Les Crimp in Nanoose Bay, B.C. (Vancouver Island)
> lcrimp@shaw.ca
>
> To our neighbours on the Gulf Coast, please know that you are in
> our thoughts constantly.
>
> __
Paul Herman on wed 7 sep 05
Hi Les,
For hard rock, I use this ratio to start:
crush the material to window screen size (16 mesh) before ball milling .
Material to be ground 100
water 70
Use a little more than half of the mill full of balls. Add slop to
fill about 80-90% of the jar.
The slop should be thick enough to coat everything, about like a
medium thick glaze. You can adjust the water content to get it just
right. Some materials need more water. Feldspar is good with 65
water, halloysite needs 110.
For hard rock like feldspar or granite it takes six hours.
good prospecting,
Paul Herman
Doyle, CA
On Sep 7, 2005, at 7:48 PM, Les wrote:
> My question is...... how smal should the material to be ground
> be? ....... should it be dry or wet? ........etc., etc., etc.
>
> Any help would be gratefully accepted!
>
> Les Crimp in Nanoose Bay, B.C. (Vancouver Island)
> lcrimp@shaw.ca
>
Fredrick Paget on wed 7 sep 05
Les,
I have found that for my small ball mill of 1 gallon size that I need
to get the stuff down to the size that will pass through a common
window screen about 12 mesh before milling. Otherwise it does not
grind the bigger pieces. I think a larger mill can handle bigger
stuff.
Wet or dry doesn't seem to matter as long as the mix is free to flow.
No sticky or pasty stuff.
--
From Fred &Nan Paget,
No Tengo Rancho,
Marin County,
California, USA
fredrick@well.com
Les on wed 7 sep 05
Hi Clayarters -=20
I am the recipient of a used but very functional Ball Mill. As I have =
never tried to grind minerals, etc.I do not know where to start and =
where the end is. I have the mill and a great quantity of the =
"porcelain" balls (actually small solid cylinder forms) and the =
containers for the materials.
My question is...... how smal should the material to be ground be? =
....... should it be dry or wet? ........etc., etc., etc.
Any help would be gratefully accepted!
Les Crimp in Nanoose Bay, B.C. (Vancouver Island)
lcrimp@shaw.ca
To our neighbours on the Gulf Coast, please know that you are in our =
thoughts constantly.
David Martin Hershey on thu 8 sep 05
Hi All,
I stumbled onto this
article, and I thought a few of you
ball millers out there might find it of some interest.
http://tinyurl.com/bwwsv
pdf: http://tinyurl.com/cwr3s
It's from the Paul O. Abbe Co. They've been making mills
since 1911. Somewhat technical, but understandable, and
not beyond typical ceramics applications.
A lot of it is geared towards paints & coatings, which are
really very similar to liquid glazes.
The most surprising thing I learned, is that smaller media
works better, with one-half to five-eighths inch
being the preferred size for most applications.
Somehow, I got it into my head that a mix of different media
sizes was better.
Also, the media should always be completely covered
when loading, to prevent excess wear of the grinding media.
As the skateboarders say, Keep on Grinding!
Best, DMH
Beautiful Hermosa Beach CA USA
Where the Blue Whales
have decided to pay
a rare visit
David Hendley on thu 8 sep 05
For ball milling material, the smaller the better when the material is
first added. If the particles are larger than coarse sand, a ball mill
is not really the appropriate machine - at least a small ball mill as
a potter would use.
When I received my ball mill, I also got both porcelain balls (spheres)
and inch-long cylinder pieces. I was told, and have put into practice,
that the spheres are for wet grinding and the cylinders are for dry
grinding.
You can get good results either way, but there can be a problem with
the material "packing" when dry grinding.
The main thing is to not over-fill the ball mill. The ratio I use is about
half material and half grinding medium, with the jar 2/3 full.
I know when I am finished grinding just by feel - I compare how the
material feels to the material in a bag of 200 mesh silica. If they feel
the same, I am finished grinding.
David Hendley
I don't know nothin' but the blues, cobalt that is.
david@farmpots.com
http://www.farmpots.com
----- Original Message -----
> I am the recipient of a used but very functional Ball Mill. As I have
> never tried to grind minerals, etc.I do not know where to start and where
> the end is. I have the mill and a great quantity of the "porcelain" balls
> (actually small solid cylinder forms) and the containers for the
> materials.
>
> My question is...... how smal should the material to be ground be?
> ....... should it be dry or wet? ........etc., etc., etc.
John Baymore on thu 8 sep 05
Paul,
Interesting...... you hit my "magic number" for ball milling my local NH
granite for glazes...... 6 hours.
best,
...............john
John Baymore
River Bend Pottery
22 Riverbend Way
Wilton, NH 03086 USA
JBaymore@compuserve.com
http://www.JohnBaymore.com
"Please use compuserve address for any direct communications."
Susan P on wed 12 apr 06
Thank you. I've written to see if my library can get a copy of Dinger's boo=
k
for me - however - I must admit that it looks frightening! I am an
intelligent person, however there are some things that will not seem to say
in my mind. Numbers and scientific principles are a couple of those. I DO
try.... I hope there is room in the ceramics art world for scientific
dunces.
Susan near Seattle
On 4/12/06, Susan P wrote:
>
>
>
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> From: Jonathan Kaplan
> Date: Apr 12, 2006 7:47 AM
> Subject: Re: Ball Mill
> To: CLAYART@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> We use a US Stoneware 2 leve ball mill that we purchased this year.
> Holds big jars...1 gallon sized each level if we want. We have some
> smaller jars that we can fit 2 per level. Machine has a DC speed
> controller that drives a 1hp DC Gear motor.
>
> We use the ball mill for all glazes as well as a magnetic separator
> device to remove tramp ferrous materials. The ball mill is very
> necessary to achieve optimum particle size reduction and glaze
> homogeneity. We add about one half V Gum Cer as well as some
> deflocculant to achieve what we need for specific gravity and
> viscosity. We measure viscosity with a Brookfield and specific
> gravity with a Pykenometer.
>
> Why? Well, as we are HVLP spraying many of our glazes, the
> requirements for surface hardening and optimum spraying are dependent
> on the rheology of the glaze slurry. The ball mill is the best piece
> of equipment to help achieve this. Its important to understand the
> rheology of glazes and there are many good texts available,
> especially "Rheology for Ceramics" by Dennis Dinger.
>
> Best
>
> Jonathan
>
> Jonathan Kaplan
> Ceramic Design Group
> PO Box 775112
> Steamboat Springs CO 80477
> (970) 879-9139
>
> Plant location for commercial deliveries excluding USPS
> 1280 13th Street Suite K
> Steamboat Springs CO 80487
>
> info@ceramicdesigngroup.net
> www.ceramicdesigngroup.net
>
> _________________________________________________________________________=
_____
>
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
> melpots@pclink.com.
>
Jonathan Kaplan on wed 12 apr 06
We use a US Stoneware 2 leve ball mill that we purchased this year.
Holds big jars...1 gallon sized each level if we want. We have some
smaller jars that we can fit 2 per level. Machine has a DC speed
controller that drives a 1hp DC Gear motor.
We use the ball mill for all glazes as well as a magnetic separator
device to remove tramp ferrous materials. The ball mill is very
necessary to achieve optimum particle size reduction and glaze
homogeneity. We add about one half V Gum Cer as well as some
deflocculant to achieve what we need for specific gravity and
viscosity. We measure viscosity with a Brookfield and specific
gravity with a Pykenometer.
Why? Well, as we are HVLP spraying many of our glazes, the
requirements for surface hardening and optimum spraying are dependent
on the rheology of the glaze slurry. The ball mill is the best piece
of equipment to help achieve this. Its important to understand the
rheology of glazes and there are many good texts available,
especially "Rheology for Ceramics" by Dennis Dinger.
Best
Jonathan
Jonathan Kaplan
Ceramic Design Group
PO Box 775112
Steamboat Springs CO 80477
(970) 879-9139
Plant location for commercial deliveries excluding USPS
1280 13th Street Suite K
Steamboat Springs CO 80487
info@ceramicdesigngroup.net
www.ceramicdesigngroup.net
David Martin Hershey on fri 14 apr 06
Hi Jonathan,
Always glad to see you find a little time to post.
Thanks for the tip on the Dinger book.
Great to find a good affordable technical book,
while it's still in print. I'm ordering it tonight.
It seems that you've made a quantum leap in the
reology area since your last post.
Now you're back to ball milling again.
(Which I guess pretty much everyone in industry does.)
As far as the pyknometer goes, are you using the
glass one, or the pressure type? (way overkill?)
Tell us about your Brookfield model please.
I've been using the typical Zahn cup method, and I find it
less than reliable, and a time consuming mess to use-
although I'm afraid to ask how much your
Brookfield cost...
Best always,
DMH
Beautiful Hermosa Beach CA USA
where we went from summer yesterday
back to winter today
and back to summer again tomorrow
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jonathan Kaplan"
Sent: Wednesday, April 12, 2006 7:47 AM
Subject: Re: [CLAYART] Ball Mill
> We use a US Stoneware 2 leve ball mill that we purchased this year.
> Holds big jars...1 gallon sized each level if we want. We have some
> smaller jars that we can fit 2 per level. Machine has a DC speed
> controller that drives a 1hp DC Gear motor.
>
> We use the ball mill for all glazes as well as a magnetic separator
> device to remove tramp ferrous materials. The ball mill is very
> necessary to achieve optimum particle size reduction and glaze
> homogeneity. We add about one half V Gum Cer as well as some
> deflocculant to achieve what we need for specific gravity and
> viscosity. We measure viscosity with a Brookfield and specific
> gravity with a Pykenometer.
>
> Why? Well, as we are HVLP spraying many of our glazes, the
> requirements for surface hardening and optimum spraying are dependent
> on the rheology of the glaze slurry. The ball mill is the best piece
> of equipment to help achieve this. Its important to understand the
> rheology of glazes and there are many good texts available,
> especially "Rheology for Ceramics" by Dennis Dinger.
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