CNW on fri 10 dec 99
****Warning***** I am wired and need to vent!
I attend a small community college. I have been working in clay about 7
years. While mostly do handbuilt sculpture keep up with what is going on
in functional ware.
The college has a small ceramic program, one professor is a handbuilder and
is very talented. I have to admit I would like a more interactive teacher
but he's okay. But he is not big on studio safety, glaze safety or teaching
the kids about these things. I try to bring these things up as I work on
projects and the kids ask me about what I'm doing.
The other guy that they have teaching the evening class (continuing-ed) is
even worse, absolutely no clean-up, I came in and found his class working
across from a fan with an open bag of silica and another of ball clay next
to it. I spent all of last year cleaning up after him and his class and had
to clean up this year before we could start the day classes. This guy is
self-taught and is very well educated in the history of ceramics and about
native clays. But he doesn't teach ANYTHING about safety not even in
clean-up or by example. He has his glaze buckets sitting by and on the
heating vent, dripping down the sides into the vent.
I have tried to talk to the director of the art department and he says that
I worry too much about it. He tries to give various students hints here and
there (he's a painter) and some of them are wrong or even unsafe.
I got tired of fighting it and just keep my mouth shut. Tonight the director
really got to me, he was telling about this foolish woman that purchased a
vase made by the continuing-ed instructor. She bought it thinking that since
it was a vase and glazed that she could put flowers and water in it. So she
did this and put it on her piano.......you got it, leaked. He said wasn't
stupid of the woman? I said that a vase was for holding water and that it
should not have leaked, it was the potter's obligation to make sure it
didn't before it was sold. He didn't agree and just shook his head
sorrowfully at me and told me that HE wouldn't put a ceramic vase on his
good furniture.
g-g-g-g-r-r-r-r-r
Aren't there any standards out there for teaching? Shouldn't the head of a
department have some responsibility for making sure safety and quality
standards are taught?
I am just irritated-I really like all of these people (except for the one I
have to clean-up after).
Celia
Dannon Rhudy on sat 11 dec 99
At 01:47 PM 12/10/1999 EST, you wrote:
>----------------------------Original message----------------------------
>
>I attend a small community college...... doesn't teach ANYTHING about
safety not even in
>clean-up........ has his glaze buckets sitting by and on the
>heating vent, dripping down the sides into the vent.
>
>I have tried to talk to the director..... says that
>I worry too much about it...... really like all of these people (except
for the one I
>have to clean-up after).......
--------------------------------------------------------
Well, Celia, there are a couple things you could do, depending upon
how annoyed you are. First, you could speak directly to the night-
teacher slob who doesn't clean up/have students clean up. Just say
(you needn't be hostile to be direct) that it is unfair and unreasonable
to expect other classes to have to choose between working in the
mess left by him/his class or cleaning up after them before they can work.
It is actually a fairly serious issue, philosophically speaking. The
unspoken attitude here is that HIS time is so precious that he cannot
use it to clean up his own messes, and everyone else's is so
unimportant that it is OK if they have to clean up after him.
If the practices are so bad as to be unsafe, then you can write a
letter to the administration, copies to department head, teachers, etc.,
stipulating the dangers and - most important from the school's
viewpoint - the LIABILITY of the school because of unsafe practices.
The school will in fact pay attention if there is a liability issue. But
you may not like the outcome.
Of course, as long as you clean up after the night class, they won't
change. Because, why should they? You always clean it up. From
their viewpoint, there is no negative outcome to their behavior.
regards,
Dannon Rhudy
potter@koyote.com
>
>Celia
>
amy parker on sat 11 dec 99
Celia - there SHOULD be standards for clay work. YES it is the "ultimate
responsibility" (to quote a marketing principle I learned years & years ago)
on the part of the department head to insure that the students and faculty
are all practicing safe techniques. In these days of ever-increasing
lawsuits at the drop of a hat, from "victims" of some perceived abuse, it is
astonishing that the department heads have not paid attention to their
potential to lawsuit vulnerability!
Functional pottery should function, absolutely. Containers for liquids
should hold water, forms that were designed to hold food should be glazed
with a non-contaminating glaze, forms designed for the oven should not break
when used in one! Students should be taught safe studio procedures from the
outset, and the sloppy and unsafe practices you describe should be grounds
for termination from the art program! In the "old days", before the true
(??) risks of our media were known, a lot of unsafe practices were
perpetuated. In these days of increased information flow, and in-depth
knowledge of hazards, there is no excuse for ignorance of safe practices and
enforcing same. If we don't regulate ourselves, the government in its
infinite wisdom will regulate us instead.
Think about that!
Amy in hotlanta, wondering what new hitherto-unknown risks we will find next
year!
>Aren't there any standards out there for teaching? Shouldn't the head of a
>department have some responsibility for making sure safety and quality
>standards are taught?
>Celia
>
>
amy parker Lithonia, GA
amyp@sd-software.com
Earl Brunner on sat 11 dec 99
Hey, I bet OSHA would really like to take a tour of this place. It could
probably be arranged.... The lady with the piano should sue. You are right
that people should expect pottery that is purchased to perform it's function.
(but I wouldn't put *any* container of water on my wife's baby grand, it cost
just too much money and even if things don't leak they can sweat)
CNW wrote:
> ----------------------------Original message----------------------------
> ****Warning***** I am wired and need to vent!
>
> I attend a small community college. I have been working in clay about 7
> years. While mostly do handbuilt sculpture keep up with what is going on
> in functional ware.
>
> The college has a small ceramic program, one professor is a handbuilder and
> is very talented. I have to admit I would like a more interactive teacher
> but he's okay. But he is not big on studio safety, glaze safety or teaching
> the kids about these things. I try to bring these things up as I work on
> projects and the kids ask me about what I'm doing.
> The other guy that they have teaching the evening class (continuing-ed) is
> even worse, absolutely no clean-up, I came in and found his class working
> across from a fan with an open bag of silica and another of ball clay next
> to it. I spent all of last year cleaning up after him and his class and had
> to clean up this year before we could start the day classes. This guy is
> self-taught and is very well educated in the history of ceramics and about
> native clays. But he doesn't teach ANYTHING about safety not even in
> clean-up or by example. He has his glaze buckets sitting by and on the
> heating vent, dripping down the sides into the vent.
>
> I have tried to talk to the director of the art department and he says that
> I worry too much about it. He tries to give various students hints here and
> there (he's a painter) and some of them are wrong or even unsafe.
>
> I got tired of fighting it and just keep my mouth shut. Tonight the director
> really got to me, he was telling about this foolish woman that purchased a
> vase made by the continuing-ed instructor. She bought it thinking that since
> it was a vase and glazed that she could put flowers and water in it. So she
> did this and put it on her piano.......you got it, leaked. He said wasn't
> stupid of the woman? I said that a vase was for holding water and that it
> should not have leaked, it was the potter's obligation to make sure it
> didn't before it was sold. He didn't agree and just shook his head
> sorrowfully at me and told me that HE wouldn't put a ceramic vase on his
> good furniture.
>
> g-g-g-g-r-r-r-r-r
>
> Aren't there any standards out there for teaching? Shouldn't the head of a
> department have some responsibility for making sure safety and quality
> standards are taught?
>
> I am just irritated-I really like all of these people (except for the one I
> have to clean-up after).
>
> Celia
--
Earl Brunner
http://coyote.accessnv.com/bruec
mailto:bruec@anv.net
Marian Morris on sun 12 dec 99
You know, I hate to sound like Dr. Laura, but it seems there is some
obligation to take this matter beyond the department chair. Some of the
problems you note are really dangerous. Having recieved a big ho hum from
the immediate supervisor, perhaps an article about studio safety to the dean
would be appropriate. Then there is your own health to consider!
>From: CNW
>Reply-To: Ceramic Arts Discussion List
>To: CLAYART@LSV.UKY.EDU
>Subject: Re: Teaching Technique-long and grumpy
>Date: Fri, 10 Dec 1999 13:47:46 EST
>
>----------------------------Original message----------------------------
>****Warning***** I am wired and need to vent!
>
>I attend a small community college. I have been working in clay about 7
>years. While mostly do handbuilt sculpture keep up with what is going on
>in functional ware.
>
>The college has a small ceramic program, one professor is a handbuilder and
>is very talented. I have to admit I would like a more interactive teacher
>but he's okay. But he is not big on studio safety, glaze safety or teaching
>the kids about these things. I try to bring these things up as I work on
>projects and the kids ask me about what I'm doing.
>The other guy that they have teaching the evening class (continuing-ed) is
>even worse, absolutely no clean-up, I came in and found his class working
>across from a fan with an open bag of silica and another of ball clay next
>to it. I spent all of last year cleaning up after him and his class and had
>to clean up this year before we could start the day classes. This guy is
>self-taught and is very well educated in the history of ceramics and about
>native clays. But he doesn't teach ANYTHING about safety not even in
>clean-up or by example. He has his glaze buckets sitting by and on the
>heating vent, dripping down the sides into the vent.
>
>I have tried to talk to the director of the art department and he says that
>I worry too much about it. He tries to give various students hints here and
>there (he's a painter) and some of them are wrong or even unsafe.
>
>I got tired of fighting it and just keep my mouth shut. Tonight the
>director
>really got to me, he was telling about this foolish woman that purchased a
>vase made by the continuing-ed instructor. She bought it thinking that
>since
>it was a vase and glazed that she could put flowers and water in it. So she
>did this and put it on her piano.......you got it, leaked. He said wasn't
>stupid of the woman? I said that a vase was for holding water and that it
>should not have leaked, it was the potter's obligation to make sure it
>didn't before it was sold. He didn't agree and just shook his head
>sorrowfully at me and told me that HE wouldn't put a ceramic vase on his
>good furniture.
>
>g-g-g-g-r-r-r-r-r
>
>Aren't there any standards out there for teaching? Shouldn't the head of a
>department have some responsibility for making sure safety and quality
>standards are taught?
>
>I am just irritated-I really like all of these people (except for the one I
>have to clean-up after).
>
>Celia
______________________________________________________
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Mike Gordon on mon 13 dec 99
If push comes toshove you can always leave a VERY large mess in the room
just before his class meet and see how he likes it. Some Jacjasses need
to be hit over the head before you can teach them anything. Also in your
letter you might mention OSHA administrators always perk their ears up
over that one. Mike
I.Lewis on mon 13 dec 99
------------------
Something seems to have changed since I left teaching, both in high schools =
and
in community colleges. Never having had that exalted experience of being
employed to teach at a higher academic level. Apart from the question of
Courtesy to one=92s colleagues there seems to be something sadly missing in =
the
attitudes of the people in the example under discussion.
One point about the pottery teaching studio and a couple of general points.
1 All wheels should be cleaned out by students before the end of any =
teaching
session.
2 Always leave the chalkboard as you would wish to find it. Clean and ready =
for
the next person.
3 What some instructors forget is that they teach a hidden agenda as well as=
the
aims and objectives of the curriculum they are given. Teachers are aware of =
this
and plan their lessons to exclude alternative influences. Be prepared to
indoctrinate as a way of changing attitudes.
If invited I could give a deeper analysis.
Best wishes to all for the Festive Season.
And Extra Special Thanks to the hard working souls who put this bulletin =
board
together. I hope you all take a few days off for well earned R =26R. Put the
switch in the cancel position for a while.
Ivor Lewis. Looking forward to making fresh peach ice cream.
I.Lewis on fri 17 dec 99
------------------
Subject: Re: Teaching Technique-long and grumpy
Something seems to have changed since I left teaching, both in high schools =
and
in community colleges. Apart from the question of Courtesy to one=92s =
colleagues
there seems to be something sadly missing in the attitudes of the people =
under
discussion who are instructors.
One point about the pottery teaching studio and a general point
1 All wheels should be cleaned out by students before the end of any =
teaching
session.
2 Always leave the chalkboard as you would wish to find it. Clean and ready =
for
the next person.
What some instructors forget is that they teach a hidden agenda as well as =
the
aims and objectives of the curriculum they are given.
Be prepared to indoctrinate as a way of changing attitudes.
If invited I could give a deeper analysis
Best wishes to all for the Festive Season.
And Extra Special Thanks to the hard working souls who put this bulletin =
board
together. I hope you all take a few days off for well earned R =26R. Put the
switch in the cancel position for a while.
Ivor Lewis. Looking forward to making fresh peach ice cream.
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