Mary Ella Yamashita on tue 1 feb 00
One of my customers has a favorite mug with a broken handle. He has asked
me to make him a mug with a similar handle. The cracks seem to be in
unusual places; I am speculating that the breaks were due to a combination
of the handle style and the way he holds the mug. If that is the case, I
worry that if I duplicate the handle, it may break, too. I am hoping that
someone engineeringly adept can determine whether or not my concern is valid.
I believe that the mug is made from porcelain. The body and the handle are
both about 1/8" thick. The outer glaze is slightly crazed. The wall of
the cup is straight at both points where the handle is attached. It has a
pulled handle; the top of the handle is butted straight onto the cup while
the bottom curves in to join flatly. The handle will accomodate two
fingers at the most. The handle looks approximately as follows, with the
x's representing the clay and the dashes representing the three breaks:
xxxxx_
x
x-
x x-
x
Furthermore, the customer said that he could hear cracking noises whenever
he used this mug.
I am not trying to duplicate the entire mug; the way the handle fits his
fingers is what appeals to him. I will be working with a ^6 stoneware, if
that makes any difference.
Here is what I would like to know: did this handle break due to a flaw in
design? If so, how can I improve upon it without destroying what he likes
about it? I should mention that he holds the handle with his thumb on top,
and index finger on the inside. I believe that he still has his middle
finger, but not the outer two digits, so he is unable to hold some other
styles of handles.
Thanks for any help you can give me.
Mary Ella
mey@cswnet.com
Chris Schafale on wed 2 feb 00
Mary Ella,
You don't say where the break was, but I don't think the problem is
the design or the way he's holding the mug. Most of my mugs
have a similarly shaped handle, and I've never had one break. My
guess is that there was a problem with the attachment, and that
possibly the only thing holding that handle on was the glaze. I
have had one mug where there was a hairline crack at the join.
The glaze covered this and the handle stayed on fine, until it got
knocked against something. Then you could see/feel/hear the
crack. My advice would be just to be sure you do sturdy
attachments and dry slowly to avoid hairline cracks around the join.
Chris
> ----------------------------Original message----------------------------
> One of my customers has a favorite mug with a broken handle. He has asked
> me to make him a mug with a similar handle. The cracks seem to be in
> unusual places; I am speculating that the breaks were due to a combination
> of the handle style and the way he holds the mug. If that is the case, I
> worry that if I duplicate the handle, it may break, too. I am hoping that
> someone engineeringly adept can determine whether or not my concern is valid.
>
> I believe that the mug is made from porcelain. The body and the handle are
> both about 1/8" thick. The outer glaze is slightly crazed. The wall of
> the cup is straight at both points where the handle is attached. It has a
> pulled handle; the top of the handle is butted straight onto the cup while
> the bottom curves in to join flatly. The handle will accomodate two
> fingers at the most. The handle looks approximately as follows, with the
> x's representing the clay and the dashes representing the three breaks:
>
> xxxxx_
> x
> x-
> x x-
> x
>
> Furthermore, the customer said that he could hear cracking noises whenever
> he used this mug.
>
> I am not trying to duplicate the entire mug; the way the handle fits his
> fingers is what appeals to him. I will be working with a ^6 stoneware, if
> that makes any difference.
>
> Here is what I would like to know: did this handle break due to a flaw in
> design? If so, how can I improve upon it without destroying what he likes
> about it? I should mention that he holds the handle with his thumb on top,
> and index finger on the inside. I believe that he still has his middle
> finger, but not the outer two digits, so he is unable to hold some other
> styles of handles.
>
> Thanks for any help you can give me.
>
> Mary Ella
> mey@cswnet.com
>
Light One Candle Pottery
Fuquay-Varina, NC
candle@intrex.net
http://www.angelfire.com/nc2/candle (work in progress)
Dwiggins, Sandra (NCI) on wed 2 feb 00
Mary Ellen---
This is not a job I would take on, i.e. replacing the handle with clay that may
not be the same as the cup. And it may not be possible for your customer to use
this mug again in its current state. If it's crackling, it's probably crazing
too. Why don't you ask him what it is he likes about it, and if he wants it
duplicated then duplicate the whole thing. Much easier. If he wants the old
one as a souvenir i.e. not to use, get the book on repairing porcelain that came
out about 4 years ago. Steve Branfman has it at the Potters Shoppe. It has
everything you need to know about porcelain repair. Don't set yourself up for
failure. You'll only frustrate yourself in the end.
Sandy
-----Original Message-----
From: Mary Ella Yamashita [SMTP:mey@cswnet.com]
Sent: Tuesday, February 01, 2000 2:28 PM
To: CLAYART@LSV.UKY.EDU
Subject: handle design/breakage
----------------------------Original message----------------------------
One of my customers has a favorite mug with a broken handle. He has asked
me to make him a mug with a similar handle. The cracks seem to be in
unusual places; I am speculating that the breaks were due to a combination
of the handle style and the way he holds the mug. If that is the case, I
worry that if I duplicate the handle, it may break, too. I am hoping that
someone engineeringly adept can determine whether or not my concern is valid.
I believe that the mug is made from porcelain. The body and the handle are
both about 1/8" thick. The outer glaze is slightly crazed. The wall of
the cup is straight at both points where the handle is attached. It has a
pulled handle; the top of the handle is butted straight onto the cup while
the bottom curves in to join flatly. The handle will accomodate two
fingers at the most. The handle looks approximately as follows, with the
x's representing the clay and the dashes representing the three breaks:
xxxxx_
x
x-
x x-
x
Furthermore, the customer said that he could hear cracking noises whenever
he used this mug.
I am not trying to duplicate the entire mug; the way the handle fits his
fingers is what appeals to him. I will be working with a ^6 stoneware, if
that makes any difference.
Here is what I would like to know: did this handle break due to a flaw in
design? If so, how can I improve upon it without destroying what he likes
about it? I should mention that he holds the handle with his thumb on top,
and index finger on the inside. I believe that he still has his middle
finger, but not the outer two digits, so he is unable to hold some other
styles of handles.
Thanks for any help you can give me.
Mary Ella
mey@cswnet.com
Cindy Strnad on wed 2 feb 00
Mary Ella,
Go ahead and make him the mug he wants with the handle he likes. If it
breaks, you can make him another one. Honestly, though, I suspect the handle
broke because the glaze fit was bad and weakened the clay. It also seems
likely the handle may never have attached firmly to the mug. In this case,
the glaze would have been holding it on, and the glaze was crazing. I don't
make handles in this particular configuration, but I've seen lots of them
made this way. I doubt the design of the handle had anything to do with it.
Cindy Strnad
earthenv@gwtc.net
Earthen Vessels Pottery
RR 1, Box 51
Custer, SD 57730
Antoinette Badenhorst on thu 3 feb 00
Mary Ella, these cracks are due to one of to things:
The one is the way your customer treated the mug,or
the way the creator of it attached the handle. If the
handle is attached and pulled further to completion on
the mug, the problem is not the creation of it. If it
is pulled and attached afterwards,it can be that the
clay was stretched too hard while bending.It could
have been too dry also when bended. If the last 2
scenarios was the case, it should have cracked in the
bisque firing. Your sketch give me the indication that
this handle bend quite far around,which make me think
that the problem is that it will be in the way when
normally handled during washing.The way you show the
breaks confirm that to me.
The sounds that you hear tells me that there is
something wrong with the clay glaze fit. It is also
possible that this piece did not go through all the
stages of firing and cooling down in the kiln.
The way I will make sure that that type of handle is
correct will be as follow:
Pull the handles from a cone shape. Make sure there
is no bumps and knots that will make you stretch the
clay too quick in areas.(The magnetic fields will
break,but you will not see it on the surface. It will
only come out during drying or bisque firing) Cut to
a generous size and let it dry off just enough that it
will not be slippery in your hands and that it will
allow you to form the handle. Start attaching the
handle with the top(about 1 cm) of the handle facing
downwards against the mug. Smear that part in very
well. Then make the bow very gentle. Do not force the
clay. Let it make a spontaneous curve and attach it at
the bottom. Pinch off clay if it is too long.Make sure
that you don`t lift it above the natural flow of the
clay. You will know that you done it correctly if you
take a ruler and measure it from the highest point of
the handle to the middle of the bottom of the mug. If
your line match, the balance is correct.Let it dry
upside down to take stress of the fresh handle that
will tend to drop down.
The other way to do that will be to pull the handle
half way and attach to the mug. Leave the one end
that you want to attach a little bit thicker than the
rest. Attach the thicker end straight to the mug.
Secure it before you start pulling again. Use the
natural flow of the clay to form the handle. The last
method is described as the better method,because
people that know more than me on design, says that you
will create a handle that "grows" from the mug.
Finally your client need to know how to wash his
mug...in particular in the dishwasher.
I hope this info is not too much and teaching an
expert how to make handles. If it is, I hope someone
else will benefit from this.
Good luck.
Antoinette.
--- Mary Ella Yamashita wrote:
> ----------------------------Original
> message----------------------------
> One of my customers has a favorite mug with a broken
> handle. He has asked
> me to make him a mug with a similar handle. The
> cracks seem to be in
> unusual places; I am speculating that the breaks
> were due to a combination
> of the handle style and the way he holds the mug.
> If that is the case, I
> worry that if I duplicate the handle, it may break,
> too. I am hoping that
> someone engineeringly adept can determine whether or
> not my concern is valid.
>
> I believe that the mug is made from porcelain. The
> body and the handle are
> both about 1/8" thick. The outer glaze is slightly
> crazed. The wall of
> the cup is straight at both points where the handle
> is attached. It has a
> pulled handle; the top of the handle is butted
> straight onto the cup while
> the bottom curves in to join flatly. The handle
> will accomodate two
> fingers at the most. The handle looks approximately
> as follows, with the
> x's representing the clay and the dashes
> representing the three breaks:
>
> xxxxx_
> x
> x-
> x x-
> x
>
> Furthermore, the customer said that he could hear
> cracking noises whenever
> he used this mug.
>
> I am not trying to duplicate the entire mug; the way
> the handle fits his
> fingers is what appeals to him. I will be working
> with a ^6 stoneware, if
> that makes any difference.
>
> Here is what I would like to know: did this handle
> break due to a flaw in
> design? If so, how can I improve upon it without
> destroying what he likes
> about it? I should mention that he holds the handle
> with his thumb on top,
> and index finger on the inside. I believe that he
> still has his middle
> finger, but not the outer two digits, so he is
> unable to hold some other
> styles of handles.
>
> Thanks for any help you can give me.
>
> Mary Ella
> mey@cswnet.com
>
=====
Antoinette Badenhorst
PO Box 552
Saltillo,Mississippi
38866
Telephone (601) 869-1651
timakia@yahoo.com
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Steve McNutt on thu 3 feb 00
There may have been something compromised in the construction of the original
handle, but I can't see anything inherent in the curve that should be a
problem. Personally, I don't find this a particularly pleasing curve
aesthetically, for the cup you describe. Some of my favorite mugs use this
curve, but for a longer handle. A one or two finger grip is more attractive
and comfortable when it is a balanced oval. It can approximate the wide end
of an egg or the narrow end and be set at about the vertical midpoint of the
cup. This is largely a matter of personal taste of course.
Is this a design in which you have any interest? That has to be question
number one.
I think we all get these requests from time to time to duplicate another
potter's work. Sometimes the request brings us a challenge we need or want.
Sometimes it wreaks hell with our time and work. You can spend a hundred
hours, literally, making a cup you don't like that the customer feels bound
to take or you can take his/her name and promise to call when you have some
cups that might qualify as a replacement. This frees you to make a series of
cups that you might enjoy and the customer to shop through them and maybe
take some other things as well.
Just my thoughts. I always have tended to be overly accommodating and have
learned to struggle against my need to please when my own comfort is being
compromised. Maybe you have already been through this part of the decision
process and are engaged by "the cup".
Mary Beth Bishop from Durham, NC
where the melt has begun.
PS: If you have time for a little fun, go to
http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=245750440 Hopefully
the site is still up. A little alternative revenue source?
Kent / Pat on thu 3 feb 00
Mary Ella,
I guess this is my night to be vocal. 8-)
I would go ahead and make the mug. It seems that there might have been a
timing problem in attaching the handle. If the handle was getting drier
than intended, the shaping and attaching may have caused stress fractures.
It has happened on occasion to a few of my mugs, and I know that was the
cause.
Pat Porter
pporter@4dv.net
Aurora CO USA
----- Original Message -----
From: "Cindy Strnad"
To:
Sent: Wednesday, February 02, 2000 2:08 PM
Subject: Re: handle design/breakage
> ----------------------------Original message----------------------------
> Mary Ella,
>
> Go ahead and make him the mug he wants with the handle he likes. If it
> breaks, you can make him another one. Honestly, though, I suspect the
handle
> broke because the glaze fit was bad and weakened the clay. It also seems
> likely the handle may never have attached firmly to the mug. In this case,
> the glaze would have been holding it on, and the glaze was crazing. I
don't
> make handles in this particular configuration, but I've seen lots of them
> made this way. I doubt the design of the handle had anything to do with
it.
>
> Cindy Strnad
> earthenv@gwtc.net
> Earthen Vessels Pottery
> RR 1, Box 51
> Custer, SD 57730
Peter Atwood on fri 4 feb 00
Hi All,
In response to the broken handle on the porcelain mug...I too have had this
problem except mine showed up in the greenware stage. My porcelain is so
short that it often cracks when trying to bend a drying handle. Many of
these cracks can be invisible until much later
which is one reason that I have not pursued this material very much. In my
case, I had made a few mugs and covered them with plastic for a slow dry.
The next day I came in to find that two of them had their handles sprung.
They had actually sheared in half towards the bottom. After that and several
other incidents I decided to say the hell with porcelain and pursued
stoneware for a while. I figure I'll eventually get the white bug again.
--Peter Atwood
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