tgschs10 on sat 22 apr 00
-------------------
I can't believe all of the responses on packing=3B many many great ideas=3B =
thanks
to everyone who has replied
Tom Sawyer
tghsch10=40msn.com
JoHanna Haines on thu 2 may 02
Hi!
Many many moons ago I used to work for the "brown guys" shipping company.
Let me tell you something.......Fragile means "Throw Harder"....., Can't
reach that shelf?.....here's a box to stand on.
Like someone said in an earlier post. Imagine the worst and prepare for
it!!
JoHanna
Dale Cochoy on thu 2 may 02
----- Original Message -----
From: "JoHanna Haines"
Subject: packing
> Hi!
> Many many moons ago I used to work for the "brown guys" shipping company.
> Let me tell you something.......Fragile means "Throw Harder"....., Can't
> reach that shelf?.....here's a box to stand on.
> Like someone said in an earlier post. Imagine the worst and prepare for
it!!
> JoHanna
Like I said yesterday. ....Insure...insure...insure.
Let the shipper buy what they break!!
How else can they be forced to handle important packages correctly?
Regards,
Dale
Richard Aerni on thu 2 may 02
> Like I said yesterday. ....Insure...insure...insure.
> Let the shipper buy what they break!!
> How else can they be forced to handle important packages correctly?
> Regards,
> Dale
With today's UPS, insuring really doesn't make any difference. As of the
last year or two, they've sold off their insurance payout arm to another
company. What that means is, that in order for this company to make any
money on the claims reimbursement business, they've got to make sure that
they pay out less than they pay for their own insurance on the UPS
claims...ergo, it is in their best interests to deny your claims.
When I first set up my business to deal with wholesale, and shipping, I
hired a packaging engineer to examine my product and my shipping needs, and
design several efficient and cost effective packing systems. Was money well
spent. I've been shipping pots now using these systems for twenty years.
My breakage rate, is and has been, extremely low. Over 18 years I only had
one breakage claim rejected (by UPS). Since the new company has taken over
insurance claims from UPS, I've had five claims filed, and five rejected.
Reason given...improper packaging, and insufficient packing materials. My
UPS driver says that my boxes look the best of all he deals with on his
route. I've had a UPS packing rep come out and watch me pack, and he claims
that I do everything by the book. Nevertheless, the claims are rejected,
and when I talk to UPS about it, they say there is nothing they can do.
When I was setting up my studio, I worked for the Post Office in the parcel
post branch, and handled parcels for two years. I know what they go
through, and expect that rough treatment. What I don't expect is that same
rough treatment from the claims dept.
Richard Aerni
Bloomfield, NY
PurpleLama@AOL.COM on mon 6 may 02
Just got back from an Orlando business conference/vacation with family and
am
catching up on my mail. I bought two (refurbished) computers in the last
couple of months - an iMAC for my grandchildren and a Powerbook laptop for
myself. I bought them from different sources. Both computers were shipped to
me in brown trucks. Both shipping boxes had something in common - footprints
on them. Guess they may have been used when someone couldn't reach a shelf!
You have solved the mystery. Thanks
Shula
glad to be home in Redondo Beach, CA.
<< Many many moons ago I used to work for the "brown guys" shipping company.
Let me tell you something.......Fragile means "Throw Harder"....., Can't
reach that shelf?.....here's a box to stand on. >>
claybair on mon 6 may 02
Hmmm.... this is pretty bad PR for that brown truck company.. perhaps one of
us should send this thread to their CEO, CEO sect'y or wife.
I have sent about 12 boxes USPS in the past 2 years. Of course I double box
except if it is just one small item. I've had only one piece break and that
was my fault.
I have seen them toss the boxes into the bin....... I figure that all boxes
get tossed but didn't quite figure they would be used as step stools etc.
My next box will be packed like it were a box filled with eggs about to be
dropped from a roof.
I don't want to have to remake the piece I have to send to PA.
Gayle Bair.... I thought it was "Drop Ship" not "Drop Kick"
Bainbridge Island, WA
http://claybair.com
Behalf Of PurpleLama@AOL.COM
Just got back from an Orlando business conference/vacation with family and
am
catching up on my mail. I bought two (refurbished) computers in the last
couple of months - an iMAC for my grandchildren and a Powerbook laptop for
myself. I bought them from different sources. Both computers were shipped to
me in brown trucks. Both shipping boxes had something in common - footprints
on them. Guess they may have been used when someone couldn't reach a shelf!
You have solved the mystery. Thanks
Shula
glad to be home in Redondo Beach, CA.
<< Many many moons ago I used to work for the "brown guys" shipping company.
Let me tell you something.......Fragile means "Throw Harder"....., Can't
reach that shelf?.....here's a box to stand on. >>
URL Krueger on thu 7 apr 05
Gee, Mel. With all the interest in packing maybe you should
rename this list to PackingArt. :-)
(Not complaining folks. Just found it interesting how much
interest there is in this subject.)
P.S. This post is just an example of how "interest" rates
are rising.
--
Earl K...
Bothell WA, USA
Sandy Miller on thu 7 apr 05
I made friends with our local florist. I get bags of peanuts and boxes of bubblewrap from them. They had been throwing it in the dumpster!! and I used to pay for the stuff. I used to trade them a pot but said please just take it because we pay for dumpster space!
Florists.......because they get loads of cheap glass and ceramic stuff shipped to them.....also check out their boxes!!!
Sandy Miller
www.sandymillerpottery.com
Jennifer Boyer on thu 7 apr 05
One trick for using peanuts when you don't double box(or even if you
do): always have some sort of spacer that keeps the pots from migrating
through the peanuts to the outside of you outer box. a bouncing UPS
truck will jiggle the innards of your box . I start my packing by
sprinkling a couple of inches of peanuts in the bottom of the box and
then laying in a piece of cardboard the same size as the box on top of
them. Then nothing can jiggle south...Also when you use peanuts your
have to STUFF them in. They need to be pressed against each other so
they lock in place. ALWAYS fight to close the box that is a bit
overstuffed with peanuts...
Jennifer, who learned the hard way...
On Apr 7, 2005, at 7:50 AM, Sandy Miller wrote:
> I made friends with our local florist. I get bags of peanuts and
> boxes of bubblewrap from them. They had been throwing it in the
> dumpster!! and I used to pay for the stuff. I used to trade them a
> pot but said please just take it because we pay for dumpster space!
> Florists.......because they get loads of cheap glass and ceramic stuff
> shipped to them.....also check out their boxes!!!
> Sandy Miller
> www.sandymillerpottery.com
>
> _______________________________________________________________________
> _______
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
> melpots@pclink.com.
>
>
************************
Jennifer Boyer
Thistle Hill Pottery
Montpelier, VT
http://thistlehillpottery.com
Cat Jarosz on fri 8 apr 05
Double ply boxes and egg flats has worked great for me all these yrs of
packing and shipping.. I am a pack rat of sorts for some things and recycle as
often as possible. Gerber baby food use to have a plant in this area and
one of the workers had a trailer full of boxes just a tad under the max. size
that UPS or USPO would take before upping the price for shipping..
These were double ply boxes meaning thick and sturdy and we got em for 50 cent
ea. ( every potter in area that knew about this guy was in heaven) I
am still on the last 100 boxes I got from him and will have to order more
from a real box company next time as Gerber went out of business yrs ago and
so did he... My best potter buddy's hubby is the computer guy at the
community college and saves all the puter boxes but they are all oversized and
we only use em with platters...
My father in law is the food and beverage manager at the country club
and was able to get the cooks help to save all the egg flats. they come 24
eggs per.. I line the box with these and then add a layer of packing
peanuts that my husband had workers recycle at the manufacturing machine shop
plant he works in... Depending on the item I would use paper from end rolls
Gotten at newspaper plants and for larger things both this paper and
bubble wrap that was also recycled from hubbys plant..
I dont do much shipping wholesale orders anymore.. actually NONE...
if they dont come get it or be close enough to have me deliver it then I just
dont take em on.. that said I do ship to pvt customers still.. but the
days of needing trucks to make a trip to the UPS warehouse to ship 15 or
more boxes out is over... yeahhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!!! not to mention the days it
takes to pack up... its crazy that 7% packing fee is the industry wide
max charged for packing seeing the costs of material and the time involved
to make sure the pots get there in one piece. ps that does not include
shipping costs just packing...
To wrap this up .... in all the yrs that I did do lots of shipping to
wholesalers I maybe had 2-3 pots break. and I think most of those were to
Pawleys Island SC where they drop ship out of airplanes and then drive over
them with tanks ... LOL.. its really amazing that its all that ever
broke.. I dont know where they got the tanks..
Do find out what the max size allowed before they up charge for oversized
packaging and order double ply boxes that size.. ps the computer boxes are
wonderful for platters but they are oversized so dont use em unless you
have to as it adds I think 20 bucks maybe more on to the cost of shipping ?
Also ask around to places like denny's or waffle house where REAL EGGS are
used and what they do with the egg flats.. maybe they will save em for you ..
if you can find a source for recycled bubble wrap and peanuts you have
hit a gold mine.. { thanks for the florist tip}.
A trip to the local paper to buy the end rolls of news print on a roll..
ps the added bonus is you have the hard core roll to use as a tool in your
studio.. hump mold for things you need rounded out.. I also bring these
rolls of paper to shows to wrap pots up for customers ... it transports easily .
Cat Jarosz who is finally going into glaze and fire mode after a long
winter haitus... Seems like eons since I last fired .... where did all that time
go ?
In a message dated 4/7/2005 9:25:11 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
jboyer@ADELPHIA.NET writes:
One trick for using peanuts when you don't double box(or even if you
do): always have some sort of spacer that keeps the pots from migrating
through the peanuts to the outside of you outer box. a bouncing UPS
truck will jiggle the innards of your box . I start my packing by
sprinkling a couple of inches of peanuts in the bottom of the box and
then laying in a piece of cardboard the same size as the box on top of
them. Then nothing can jiggle south...Also when you use peanuts your
have to STUFF them in. They need to be pressed against each other so
they lock in place. ALWAYS fight to close the box that is a bit
overstuffed with peanuts...
Jennifer, who learned the hard way...
http://www.guildcrafts.com/cat/
V)''(V woof & >^..^< mew; Chicks with beards rule !!!
(_o_)
\||/
Sarah House on fri 8 apr 05
< One trick for using peanuts when you don't double box(or even if you
do): always have some sort of spacer that keeps the pots from migrating
through the peanuts to the outside of you outer box. a bouncing UPS
truck will jiggle the innards of your box . I start my packing by
sprinkling a couple of inches of peanuts in the bottom of the box and
then laying in a piece of cardboard the same size as the box on top of
them. Then nothing can jiggle south...
I use egg flats for this same reason. They are the ones that hold 25
eggs. Some resturants still crack their own eggs. You do have to sort
out the messy ones though, I learned that the hard way.
And some newspapers do still print their papers in house and will give
away the end rolls. Also check with the places that print farm papers,
or classifieds.
Sarah House
Vicki Hardin on fri 8 apr 05
>
> < One trick for using peanuts when you don't double box(or even if you
> do): always have some sort of spacer that keeps the pots from migrating
> through the peanuts to the outside of you outer box. a bouncing UPS
> truck will jiggle the innards of your box . I start my packing by
> sprinkling a couple of inches of peanuts in the bottom of the box and
> then laying in a piece of cardboard the same size as the box on top of
> them. Then nothing can jiggle south...
>
>
Another packing trick I learned from another potter is to wrap the peanuts in pastic grocery store bags and then pack the bags around the pot. In this way, you can put the peanuts where you want them and when unpacking, there are not so many peanuts flying everywhere.
In terms of how much to put in a box, it is wise to follow the old rule, never put all your pots in one box.
Vicki Hardin
http://vickihardin.com
>
> ______________________________________________________________________________
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at melpots@pclink.com.
>
Rick Mahaffey on mon 3 sep 07
Mel is right about new boxes. I always shipped in new boxes because my work
was valuable and new boxes would reflect the respect I have for my work. It
is also much easier to collect on a damaged shipment that was shipped in new
boxes. UPS never questioned my claims. My work was double boxed (both
new) wrapped in bubble wrap at least three layers with extra where
appropriate, and the peanuts were put into plastic bags to prevent the item
from ending up on the bottom with all of the peanuts on top.
I worked with the UPS rep who took a sample box and ran it through their
testing facility in LA. After that we had no problems with UPS.
I buy some things on eBay and find that most folks do not pack properly.
In the Seattle area there is a guy whose business is picking up styro foam
peanuts and reselling them. He picks up at one building and delivers them
across the street for $. I know of at least one potter that buys from him.
I often would pick up peanuts from a shop near my studio after they got a
shipment.
Remember the purchaser or gallery's first impression is the packaging that
you ship in. New boxes reinforce the quality and value of your work.
YMMV,
Rick Mahaffey
John Rodgers on tue 4 sep 07
I use no peanuts for packing. Peanuts move around. If peanuts can move
around, then what is in the peanuts can move around. And as you say, the
item winds up on the bottom, and the peanuts on top. I typically pack
using bubble wrap combined with unprinted news paper roll ends. This
provides some cushion as well as some protection. This has always worked
for me.And I have shipped all over the US, Canada, and to several
non-North-American countries.
John Rodgers
Chelsea, AL
Rick Mahaffey wrote:
> Mel is right about new boxes. I always shipped in new boxes because my work
> was valuable and new boxes would reflect the respect I have for my work. It
> is also much easier to collect on a damaged shipment that was shipped in new
> boxes. UPS never questioned my claims. My work was double boxed (both
> new) wrapped in bubble wrap at least three layers with extra where
> appropriate, and the peanuts were put into plastic bags to prevent the item
> from ending up on the bottom with all of the peanuts on top.
>
> I worked with the UPS rep who took a sample box and ran it through their
> testing facility in LA. After that we had no problems with UPS.
>
> I buy some things on eBay and find that most folks do not pack properly.
>
> In the Seattle area there is a guy whose business is picking up styro foam
> peanuts and reselling them. He picks up at one building and delivers them
> across the street for $. I know of at least one potter that buys from him.
> I often would pick up peanuts from a shop near my studio after they got a
> shipment.
>
>
> Remember the purchaser or gallery's first impression is the packaging that
> you ship in. New boxes reinforce the quality and value of your work.
>
> YMMV,
> Rick Mahaffey
>
> ______________________________________________________________________________
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at melpots2@visi.com
>
>
>
William Melstrom on wed 5 sep 07
Rick Mahffrey wrote:
UPS never questioned my claims.
Maybe this has come up before, and a lot of you won't believe this, but UPS
and FedEx do not have to pay more than $100 on a ceramics insurance claim.
If you dig deep enough into their sites, this is plainly spelled out. Or
ask an employee who really knows their own regulations. It doesn't matter
how much insurance you buy from them, all that they are required to pay on a
ceramics insurance claim is $100.
If insurance matters to you, and you are shipping ceramics with a value over
$100, you must either use the US Post Office, or third party insurance such
as DSI (Discount Shipping Insurance):
http://www.dsiinsurance.com/default.asp
Rick says he was paid on a claim, and I once received $500 on a claim with
UPS, but possibly the $100 ceramics limit is new since then. I know plenty
of people who shipped very expensive ceramic objects with both UPS and FedEx
and found out the hard way about the $100 limit.
William Melstrom
Moderator, the Crystalline Glaze Forum
http://board3.cgiworld.paran.com/list.cgi?id=Crystal
Lois Ruben Aronow on wed 5 sep 07
FedEx told me they don't cover ANYTHING handmade or ANY artwork. Of course,
they were happy to take the money I gave them to insure the work.
UPS has never questioned my claims, and has always come through, even on
claims initially denied.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Clayart [mailto:CLAYART@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG] On Behalf Of
> William Melstrom
> Sent: Wednesday, September 05, 2007 1:46 AM
> To: CLAYART@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG
> Subject: Re: Packing
>
> Rick Mahffrey wrote:
> UPS never questioned my claims.
>
> Maybe this has come up before, and a lot of you won't believe
> this, but UPS and FedEx do not have to pay more than $100 on
> a ceramics insurance claim.
> If you dig deep enough into their sites, this is plainly
> spelled out. Or ask an employee who really knows their own
> regulations. It doesn't matter how much insurance you buy
> from them, all that they are required to pay on a ceramics
> insurance claim is $100.
> If insurance matters to you, and you are shipping ceramics
> with a value over $100, you must either use the US Post
> Office, or third party insurance such as DSI (Discount
> Shipping Insurance):
> http://www.dsiinsurance.com/default.asp
> Rick says he was paid on a claim, and I once received $500 on
> a claim with UPS, but possibly the $100 ceramics limit is new
> since then. I know plenty of people who shipped very
> expensive ceramic objects with both UPS and FedEx and found
> out the hard way about the $100 limit.
>
> William Melstrom
> Moderator, the Crystalline Glaze Forum
> http://board3.cgiworld.paran.com/list.cgi?id=Crystal
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> ________________
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your
> subscription settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
> melpots2@visi.com
Lois Ruben Aronow on wed 5 sep 07
When I started showing with The Guild, it was required that we use new
boxes. The thought was that we, as artists, were representing a
professional business - theirs and ours. I agreed, and have never again
shipped anything to a customer in a recycled box, for two reasons:
1. It looks REALLY unprofessional. The cost of new boxes - in the perfect
size that fits my work - is a relatively inexpensive part of doing business.
You work will be respected by your customers AND your shipper if your
packing material is new.
2. I have had breakage on stuff ordered from others, which was sent in
recycled boxes. The claim was ALWAYS denied. I will also add that the work
was never double boxed and the box size never quite fit the work. (Etsy &
eBay artists take note.)
So many people forget that they ARE IN BUSINESS, and that means a lot more
than making the work. Also - what is your time worth? Is it cost effective
to track down used boxes, bubble and peanuts like a squirrel waiting for
winter?
...Lo
Who gets breakage anyhow, mostly in the summer when the regular UPS guys are
on vacation, or too warm to care.
**********
Lois Aronow Ceramics
Brooklyn, NY
www.loisaronow.com
www.craftsofthedamned.blogspot.com
>
> Mel is right about new boxes. I always shipped in new boxes
> because my work was valuable and new boxes would reflect the
> respect I have for my work. It is also much easier to
> collect on a damaged shipment that was shipped in new
> boxes. UPS never questioned my claims. My work was double
> boxed (both
> new) wrapped in bubble wrap at least three layers with extra
> where appropriate, and the peanuts were put into plastic bags
> to prevent the item from ending up on the bottom with all of
> the peanuts on top.
>
> I worked with the UPS rep who took a sample box and ran it
> through their testing facility in LA. After that we had no
> problems with UPS.
>
> I buy some things on eBay and find that most folks do not
> pack properly.
>
> In the Seattle area there is a guy whose business is picking
> up styro foam peanuts and reselling them. He picks up at one
> building and delivers them across the street for $. I know
> of at least one potter that buys from him.
> I often would pick up peanuts from a shop near my studio
> after they got a shipment.
>
>
> Remember the purchaser or gallery's first impression is the
> packaging that
> you ship in. New boxes reinforce the quality and value of your work.
>
> YMMV,
> Rick Mahaffey
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> ________________
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your
> subscription settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
> melpots2@visi.com
June Gonzalez on thu 6 sep 07
I like Fedex, and they DO cover handmade items.
I'd filled out the form online, and when I got to the part that said I
needed to snail mail a copy of invoice, this, that, and the other paperwork,
I just let it go because it was $10 and I was really busy and didn't want to
bother. The next week I received a check for the $10 plus the shipping!
I'm happy with them. When I signed up for my account, I received a phone
call from the customer service representative thanking me, and asking me to
please contact her if I had any questions. Also received a couple of nice
chatty emails from her as well. She'd even looked at my website. I was
impressed that they took the time with such a small-timer as me!
-June Gonzalez
www.risingsunearthworks.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Lois Ruben Aronow"
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 05, 2007 5:59 PM
Subject: Re: Packing
> FedEx told me they don't cover ANYTHING handmade or ANY artwork. Of
> course,
> they were happy to take the money I gave them to insure the work.
>
> UPS has never questioned my claims, and has always come through, even on
> claims initially denied.
KATHI LESUEUR on thu 6 sep 07
On Sep 5, 2007, at 6:08 PM, Lois Ruben Aronow wrote:
> When I started showing with The Guild, it was required that we use new
> boxes. The thought was that we, as artists, were representing a
> professional business - theirs and ours. I agreed, and have never
> again
> shipped anything to a customer in a recycled box, for two reasons:
>
> 1. It looks REALLY unprofessional. ...
>
> 2. I have had breakage on stuff ordered from others, which was
> sent in
> recycled boxes. The claim was ALWAYS denied. I will also add that
> the work
> was never double boxed and the box size never quite fit the work.
> (Etsy &
> eBay artists take note.).....>>
I agree to a degree. I always use new outer boxes of standard sizes.
However. I have a great relationship with a number of people at my
local Meijer store in Ann Arbor. they save specific boxes for me that
fit specific items I make. All of the boxes they save for me are
double wall, heavy duty boxes. It is rare that I have any breakage. I
pack assuming the box will be dropped or that an extremely heavy box
will be thrown on top of it.
Kathi
>
>
Lois Ruben Aronow on thu 6 sep 07
>
> I like Fedex, and they DO cover handmade items.
My claim was for $250. After talking to them on the phone, they sent me a
form with tiny print, circled, showing me where they do not cover
"art/handmade/craft" items. I only used them at the request of a customer
and have never used them again. Sadly, the breakage was a one piece of a 4
piece nesting set. The entire set had to be remade.
>
Jennifer Boyer on fri 7 sep 07
I used Fedex for awhile and liked online the service, but I didn't
like the fact that when you used the online shipping you couldn't
tell what the final charge for each shipment would be. You could dig
back into the system way after the fact, but I found that there were
some hidden charges, mainly for rural(anything out of a town center)
delivery, and I think some fuel charge, that jacked up the price.
Also they randomly charged me a mystery charge of 11.00 which I think
was a home pickup charge, but I had always delivered to a shipping
center. They were great about crediting me, but it pays to carefully
watch your billing online...
I'm back to USPS because of the free home pickup. UPS is too
expensive for me. DHL has good prices but also charges for pickup and
isn't set up from drop off centers in my area.
Jennifer
PS, Ain't that the way with breakage? It always seems to be something
particularly important. In one firing I did, the only major seconds
were special orders....GROWL.
On Sep 6, 2007, at 7:53 PM, Lois Ruben Aronow wrote:
>>
>> I like Fedex, and they DO cover handmade items.
>
> My claim was for $250. After talking to them on the phone, they
> sent me a
> form with tiny print, circled, showing me where they do not cover
> "art/handmade/craft" items. I only used them at the request of a
> customer
> and have never used them again. Sadly, the breakage was a one
> piece of a 4
> piece nesting set. The entire set had to be remade.
>>
>
> ______________________________________________________________________
> ________
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
> melpots2@visi.com
*****************************
Jennifer Boyer
Thistle Hill Pottery
Montpelier, VT
http://thistlehillpottery.com
*****************************
| |
|
