vince pitelka on wed 26 apr 00
> I used to have a gas kiln that had Basso valves and thermocouples on it
> and they were forever doing that. I ended up clamping down all the
> reset buttons with C-clamps. Now I know that that comment will cause me
> more need for a flameproof suit that the kiln ever did.
> Paul Lewing, Seattle
Oh Paul I am appalled (didn't intend to make a pun!). You, clamping down a
Baso valve? Shame on you. Any Baso system which needs the valve button
clamped down is improperly installed or improperly maintained, or broken.
Since they almost never break, that means that the thermocouple and/or pilot
burner was improperly installed or was abused, or the thermocouples just
went bad.
One of the most frequent problems with the Baso system has to do with those
wimpy little pilot burners, like the one on your gas hot water heater. As
they corrode a bit, or even with changes in secondary-air demand, the flame
can shift so that it is not really heating the thermocouple probe properly.
If the system shuts down repeatedly, you can watch it carefully, and almost
always this will be the problem. I like a larger pilot burner, which can
also be used for preheat. It is very easy to make your own.
Another frequent problem with Baso valves is overheating of the valve body
itself. This is especially true when they are installed on rear-mounted
burners placed on either side of a chimney, with a single thickness of
hardbrick in the base of the chimney. Excess heat accelerates corrosion,
and damages the electromagnet coils within the valve body. As the coils
degenerate, it weakens the effect of the thermocouple. Eventually it gets
to where even a brand new thermocouple will not keep the valve open for
long.
Some people like to light their pilots by heating the hell out of the
thermocouple probe with a propane torch. Initially it will make the
thermocouple energize the Baso valve properly, but then when it is just the
pilot heating the probe, the thing shuts off. If you overheat the probe, it
degrades internally, and generates less electricity.
Only the tip half of the thermocouple probe should be in the pilot flame.
If the base of the thermocouple is in the flame, or worse yet, if the
copper-clad lead is exposed to flame, the thermocouple will degrade
internally and will fail almost immediately.
Another common fault is over-tightening of the thermocouple connection at
the Baso valve. The connection should be hand-tightened, and then snugged
up a small fraction of a turn with a wrench.
A properly installed Baso valve, with heat shields to protect it when
necessary, hardly ever fails for any reason at all. A properly installed
thermocouple should last for years and years, except on a salt or soda kiln,
where degredation of the burner components near the port are drastically
accelerated.
Best wishes -
- Vince
Vince Pitelka
Home - vpitelka@dekalb.net
615/597-5376
Work - wpitelka@tntech.edu
615/597-6801 ext. 111, fax 615/597-6803
Appalachian Center for Crafts
Tennessee Technological University
1560 Craft Center Drive, Smithville TN 37166
http://www.craftcenter.tntech.edu/
Louis H.. Katz on thu 27 apr 00
Another problem with the valves I use here is that I have them mounted
vertically and bugs use my burner orifices as nesting sites. Junk falls into
the baso valves. Whenever possible mount them horizontally. I probably missed
it in the directions.
Louis
--
Louis Katz
NEW EMAIL ADDRESS Louis.Katz@mail.tamucc.edu
NCECA Director of Electronic Communication and Webmaster(Ad-Hoc)
Texas A&M-CC Division of Visual and Performing Arts
Visit the NCECA World Ceramics Image Database Online
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Database Online
Don & June MacDonald on thu 27 apr 00
Last year I had two basso valves fail within a week of each other. The
problem with them was a wimpy little spring inside them which couldn't
stand the use for a kiln. When I took the dead one to find a
replacement, the man at the parts store said "Oh this happens all the
time with these ones, made somewhere in Mexico".
June from B.C.
vince pitelka wrote:
>
> ----------------------------Original message----------------------------
> > I used to have a gas kiln that had Basso valves and thermocouples on it
> > and they were forever doing that. I ended up clamping down all the
> > reset buttons with C-clamps. Now I know that that comment will cause me
> > more need for a flameproof suit that the kiln ever did.
> > Paul Lewing, Seattle
>
> Oh Paul I am appalled (didn't intend to make a pun!). You, clamping down a
> Baso valve? Shame on you. Any Baso system which needs the valve button
> clamped down is improperly installed or improperly maintained, or broken.
> Since they almost never break, that means that the thermocouple and/or pilot
> burner was improperly installed or was abused, or the thermocouples just
> went bad.
>
> One of the most frequent problems with the Baso system has to do with those
> wimpy little pilot burners, like the one on your gas hot water heater. As
> they corrode a bit, or even with changes in secondary-air demand, the flame
> can shift so that it is not really heating the thermocouple probe properly.
> If the system shuts down repeatedly, you can watch it carefully, and almost
> always this will be the problem. I like a larger pilot burner, which can
> also be used for preheat. It is very easy to make your own.
>
> Another frequent problem with Baso valves is overheating of the valve body
> itself. This is especially true when they are installed on rear-mounted
> burners placed on either side of a chimney, with a single thickness of
> hardbrick in the base of the chimney. Excess heat accelerates corrosion,
> and damages the electromagnet coils within the valve body. As the coils
> degenerate, it weakens the effect of the thermocouple. Eventually it gets
> to where even a brand new thermocouple will not keep the valve open for
> long.
>
> Some people like to light their pilots by heating the hell out of the
> thermocouple probe with a propane torch. Initially it will make the
> thermocouple energize the Baso valve properly, but then when it is just the
> pilot heating the probe, the thing shuts off. If you overheat the probe, it
> degrades internally, and generates less electricity.
>
> Only the tip half of the thermocouple probe should be in the pilot flame.
> If the base of the thermocouple is in the flame, or worse yet, if the
> copper-clad lead is exposed to flame, the thermocouple will degrade
> internally and will fail almost immediately.
>
> Another common fault is over-tightening of the thermocouple connection at
> the Baso valve. The connection should be hand-tightened, and then snugged
> up a small fraction of a turn with a wrench.
>
> A properly installed Baso valve, with heat shields to protect it when
> necessary, hardly ever fails for any reason at all. A properly installed
> thermocouple should last for years and years, except on a salt or soda kiln,
> where degredation of the burner components near the port are drastically
> accelerated.
> Best wishes -
> - Vince
>
> Vince Pitelka
> Home - vpitelka@dekalb.net
> 615/597-5376
> Work - wpitelka@tntech.edu
> 615/597-6801 ext. 111, fax 615/597-6803
> Appalachian Center for Crafts
> Tennessee Technological University
> 1560 Craft Center Drive, Smithville TN 37166
> http://www.craftcenter.tntech.edu/
Marc Ward on thu 27 apr 00
Just to add a few comments to Vince's reply;
If you are using a Johnson controls BASO valve, only the H19RA will allow gas
to pass to the main burner when you clamp down the reset button. These are
high pressure valves without flow interuptors (that's why the gas goes to the
main burner). An H19NA high pressure valve will not do this. If you have a
BASO valve with a large red button, that's a low pressure H15DA with flow
interuptor, so clamping down the reset will not work here either.
The low pressure H15DA valve hardly ever fails, while the H19RA (the one you
can clamp down) can fail because of it's higher tension shut-off spring.
Marc Ward
Ward Burner Systems
PO Box 1086
Dandridge, TN 37725
865.397-2914 Voice
865.397-1253 Fax
wardburner@aol.com Email
wardburner.com Online Catalog
Marc Ward on fri 28 apr 00
In a message dated 4/27/00 2:49:33 PM, judo@home.com writes:
<< Last year I had two basso valves fail within a week of each other. The
problem with them was a wimpy little spring inside them which couldn't
stand the use for a kiln. When I took the dead one to find a
replacement, the man at the parts store said "Oh this happens all the
time with these ones, made somewhere in Mexico".
June from B.C. >>
A little history lesson here; When Johnson Controls merged with Penn, The
Penn BASO valve became a Johnson Controls BASO Valve. Since then, all safety
shutoff valves that read the millivolt output of a thermocouple have come to
be known as BASO valves. They are not. Only Johnson Controls makes a "BASO"
Valve. It's become like like Kleenex....lots of folks make tissues, but they
are all called Kleenex. The BASO's that Johnson Controls makes comes out of
their Erlanger, KY plant.
Marc Ward
Ward Burner Systems
PO Box 1086
Dandridge, TN 37725
865.397-2914 Voice
865.397-1253 Fax
wardburner@aol.com Email
wardburner.com Online Catalog
vince pitelka on fri 28 apr 00
> ----------------------------Original message----------------------------
> Last year I had two basso valves fail within a week of each other. The
> problem with them was a wimpy little spring inside them which couldn't
> stand the use for a kiln. When I took the dead one to find a
> replacement, the man at the parts store said "Oh this happens all the
> time with these ones, made somewhere in Mexico".
> June from B.C.
June -
Well, yes, if some sleazy supplier sells you crappy Baso valves "made
somewhere in Mexico" you should expect nothing less. If you buy high
quality Johnson Controls Baso valves, and install them properly, you can
expect them to last you for decades.
Best wishes -
- Vince
Vince Pitelka
Home - vpitelka@dekalb.net
615/597-5376
Work - wpitelka@tntech.edu
615/597-6801 ext. 111, fax 615/597-6803
Appalachian Center for Crafts
Tennessee Technological University
1560 Craft Center Drive, Smithville TN 37166
http://www.craftcenter.tntech.edu/
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