friedlover on sat 29 apr 00
-------------------
Can anyone give any suggestions about keeping bats in place when the wheel =
has
no holes for pins? This has been especially difficult with large amounts of
clay. Do the types of bats make a difference? Thanks
Charles G Hughes on sun 30 apr 00
Try this...Take about 2 pounds of clay and throw it into a clay pad on the
wheel, very much like a plate, but no curve and no lip, bring it right to
the edge of the wheel. Then using a finger or a tool make 4 or 5 concentric
rings 1/4 to 1/2 inch deep in the clay. Get it damp and then center a bat on
the clay and press it down until it is secure. Use the back end of a wooded
knife tool to lever it off when you are finished with the pot.
-Charles
----- Original Message -----
From: friedlover
To:
Sent: Saturday, April 29, 2000 11:36 AM
Subject: adhering bats without pins
----------------------------Original message----------------------------
-------------------
Can anyone give any suggestions about keeping bats in place when the wheel
has
no holes for pins? This has been especially difficult with large amounts of
clay. Do the types of bats make a difference? Thanks
KYancey on sun 30 apr 00
The method I use is to take a handful of clay, not too big, say smaller than you
fist, throw it on the wheel and center it, then squish it flat and smooth upon t
wheel head. It should be, say, about 1/4 inch thick. Then I make big grooves in
the clay while it is still spinning, then wet it down real good. Stop the wheel
and place your bat gently on the wheel head. turn it slowly to center the bat. I
doesn't have to be perfect. When it is somewhat centered, press on the bat quite
hard so it will stick to the wet clay. If you are using plaster bats, I suggest
wetting the underside of the bat prior to sticking. When you are done, you can r
your cutting wire between your bat and wheel head. I still prefer bat pins,
however, and I use this method only when I run out of bats with holes in them.
Hope this helps Ken
friedlover wrote:
> ----------------------------Original message----------------------------
> -------------------
> Can anyone give any suggestions about keeping bats in place when the wheel has
> no holes for pins? This has been especially difficult with large amounts of
> clay. Do the types of bats make a difference? Thanks
Percy Toms on sun 30 apr 00
In a message dated 4/29/00 8:37:19 AM, friedlover@email.msn.com writes:
<< Can anyone give any suggestions about keeping bats in place when the wheel
has
no holes for pins? This has been especially difficult with large amounts of
clay. Do the types of bats make a difference? Thanks >>
Here's what I do - I get a lump of clay, and throw it on my Brent's metal
wheelhead. I form it into a circular disk no more than a half inch thick, and
from six inches diameter on up - depending on size of the batts I will be
throwing the real pots on. I could make the disk extend to the wheelhead
edge, if need be.
I use the side of my opened hand to firmly press down and flatten off the
clay disk/pad and finish with a straight edged throwing rib - resulting in a
truly flat, smooth surface.
Sometimes I may throw shallow furrows in it, so while the plane of the pad
remains truly level it has corrugations.
Batts made from different materials may not work equally well with this
method. For example I do not use plastibats after finding they always seem to
shift off center on top of a fresh-thrown clay pad. The smoother and shinier
the surface of a non-wooden, non-porous, batt the weaker the lateral holding
force of the moist clay pad. Formica, too, can be tricky. Still, using this
method on a pinless wheelhead works very well to hold in place batts of
plywood, particle board, duron, masonite etc - materials with more texture
and porosity to them.
best,
Ned
Diane G. Echlin on sun 30 apr 00
This method works best with masonite or plaster bats:
1. Throw a "patty" of clay to cover the entire wheel head.
Sort of like when you start to make a plate. Make it
between 1/2 and 1" thick
2. At about 1 inch intervals, while the wheel is turning fast,
push your finger into the clay so it makes a deep groove,
starting just off center and making concentric rings
3. Very lightly moisten the back of the bat
4. Stop the wheel and slide the bat onto the patty of clay
until it is more or less centered. It is not necessary for the
bat to be perfectly centered, but it's visually easier if it's
mostly centered
5. Start the wheel, wet the bat and your hands, and apply
pressure to the bat from the center outward.
6. After you've thrown your piece and want to remove the bat,
use a very stout stick tool (not your favorite one) and slide it under
one edge and lift GENTLY to release suction (try not to fling the
bat and pot across the room catapult style) You can then smooth
the patty out, reapply the grooves and go to it again.
Good luck!
Di
friedlover wrote:
> ----------------------------Original message----------------------------
> -------------------
> Can anyone give any suggestions about keeping bats in place when the wheel has
> no holes for pins? This has been especially difficult with large amounts of
> clay. Do the types of bats make a difference? Thanks
Debby Grant on sun 30 apr 00
Throw a thin disk of clay across the entire wheel head. Score it with a
wooden tool so that it has ridges. Take a bat, plaster is best as far as
adherence goes, and place it on the clay disk. Wiggle it a little and you
will see that it holds fast. Throw your piece and then carefully take a
spatula-like tool and pry up the bat. No need to throw another disk. You
can use the same one over and over again. Just give it a little water to
drink with a sponge. Try it. You'll like it.
Debby Grant in NH
Gregory D Lamont on sun 30 apr 00
At 11:36 AM 4/29/00 -0400, you wrote:
>----------------------------Original message----------------------------
>-------------------
>Can anyone give any suggestions about keeping bats in place when the wheel =
>has
>no holes for pins? This has been especially difficult with large amounts of
>clay. Do the types of bats make a difference? Thanks
Here's one method I was taught:
Throw a pancake of clay across the wheelhead--about 1/4" thick. Make sure
it's level. Make 3 or 4 concentric rings in the pancake with a
finger. Press onto this a barely dampened bat and give it a good whack or
two adhere it. A slight vacuum will occur where the concentric depressions
were made and--along with the usual adherence of the clay to the bat--will
allow you to throw without the bat coming loose (at least most of the
time). To losen the bat, just gently pry it up with a suitable wooden
tool. The pancake is re-useable and can be "re-thrown" as necessary.
Hope this helps.
Greg
E-mail address:
gdlamont@isunet.net
Pottery Web Page:
http://www.ourwebpage.net/greglamont/
Mailing address and Phone:
Greg Lamont
3011 Northwood Drive
Ames, IA 50010-4750
(515) 233-3442
Rick Hugel on sun 30 apr 00
I don't know your location, but, Gee Whiz, instead of trying all kinds of
clamps, tapes, and what not, why not take the wheel head to a local machine
shop and have them drill a couple of holes or weld a couple of pins to it
and get on with things. I use plywood bats which I jig saw cut myself and
drilled the holes to pin depth. Took a little time and care to do it
right, but once done throwing moves along smoothly for any and every size.
For pieces with a wider base, I made a few larger bats without holes which
I stick on top of a regular bat with three wads of clay. And if it is a
really huge piece, I don't move it off the wheel head - with or without a
bat - until it is dry enough to do so by picking up the piece with my
hands. While it is drying, I make other things with slabs or coils.
Good luck and good potting!
Rick
>----------------------------Original message----------------------------
>-------------------
>Can anyone give any suggestions about keeping bats in place when the wheel has
>no holes for pins? This has been especially difficult with large amounts of
>clay. Do the types of bats make a difference? Thanks
Marcia Selsor on sun 30 apr 00
I drilled holes for pins. It isn't that difficult and makes switching
bats lots easier. BUT if you don't want to do that, put three concentric
rings of clay coils on the wheel head and slap your bat onto it. Give it
a wack and there should be a good suction made to hold it on.
Marcia Selsor
friedlover wrote:
>
> ----------------------------Original message----------------------------
> -------------------
> Can anyone give any suggestions about keeping bats in place when the wheel has
> no holes for pins? This has been especially difficult with large amounts of
> clay. Do the types of bats make a difference? Thanks
--
Marcia Selsor
selsor@imt.net
http://www.imt.net/~mjbmls
http://www.imt.net/~mjbmls/spain99.html
http://www.silverhawk.com/ex99/selsor/welcome.html
Susan Fox on sun 30 apr 00
I use both plasti-bats and masonite ones. With the wheel running I
smear fairly wet clay over the whole wheelhead to a thickness of about an
eighth of an inch, making it as level as possible. I lay the bat on it
and center it, then press it down with a wet sponge while the wheel is
moving. If the clay is too wet, the bat moves around when I'm centering
the pot - but mostly it works! I just lift gently when the pot is done,
then put a new bat on the same clay pad. I use the same pad for days on
end if I remember to cover it with plastic when I leave it. Hope this
helps -
Susan
at the Milkhouse
On Sat, 29 Apr 2000 11:36:05 EDT friedlover
writes:
>----------------------------Original
>message----------------------------
>-------------------
>Can anyone give any suggestions about keeping bats in place when the
>wheel =
>has
>no holes for pins? This has been especially difficult with large
>amounts of
>clay. Do the types of bats make a difference? Thanks
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Deborah B. on sun 30 apr 00
Hi Friedlover!
Wow what a name!
I too have a wheel with no pins (kickwheel). I have one bat that I've tried
it is a plastic one and sticking it on with clay helps for small items, but
with larger hunks of clay I seem to lose it. So for those I have used
wooden ones, they seem to stick better on the wheel. Just throw some peices
of clay on the wheel and put the bat down and press hard to set in. Works
for me.
Deborah
>From: friedlover
>Reply-To: Ceramic Arts Discussion List
>To: CLAYART@LSV.UKY.EDU
>Subject: adhering bats without pins
>Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 11:36:05 EDT
>
>----------------------------Original message----------------------------
>-------------------
>Can anyone give any suggestions about keeping bats in place when the wheel
>has
>no holes for pins? This has been especially difficult with large amounts
>of
>clay. Do the types of bats make a difference? Thanks
________________________________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com
Carol Seidman on sun 30 apr 00
Plaster bats will grab the wheel head with just a little slip. SLide
them around in a circular motion and they will hold on fast.
Carol
friedlover wrote:
>
> ----------------------------Original message----------------------------
> -------------------
> Can anyone give any suggestions about keeping bats in place when the wheel has
> no holes for pins? This has been especially difficult with large amounts of
> clay. Do the types of bats make a difference? Thanks
_____________________________________________
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Tommy Humphries on sun 30 apr 00
I never use bat pins at work, I always throw a thin 1/4" disk the size of
the wheelhead. Then using my finger divide it into 8 sections like a pie. I
slightly moisten the bottom of my plywood bats and twist them into center
until they grab well. This method allows me to center 30 pounds without
slipping.
After every 4-5 pots you will have to re-score the clay disc, and moisten it
with a sponge. Rethrow the disc after 15-20 pots.
These are 20" bats on a 14" wheelhead. Bats are 3/4"
Tommy Humphries
"`You know, it's at times like this, that I really wish I'd listened to what
my mother told me when I was young.'
`Why, what did she tell you?'
`I don't know, I didn't listen.'"
(Douglas Adams)
----- Original Message -----
From: "friedlover"
To:
Sent: Saturday, April 29, 2000 8:36 AM
Subject: adhering bats without pins
----------------------------Original message----------------------------
-------------------
Can anyone give any suggestions about keeping bats in place when the wheel
has
no holes for pins? This has been especially difficult with large amounts of
clay. Do the types of bats make a difference? Thanks
Michael McDowell on sun 30 apr 00
Someone asked for those of us who attach bats without pins to speak of our
methods. I've done so for most of my potting years. I just use a broad flat
ring of stiff clay that I throw directly on the wheel head. By keeping just
the right moisture on the surface of that ring I can stick most bats to it
quite firmly. When I'm finished throwing I pry between the wheelhead and the
bat to pop it off the ring. As long as I keep it covered with plastic when not
in use, and wet it down occasionally, I can continue to work with the same
ring for weeks on end. When working with waterproof bats "just the right
moisture" is only enough to make the surface "tacky." Then set the bat on the
approximate center and give it a solid tap in the center "for luck" It will be
stuck. For absorptive bats, like plaster, which I use for "larger pieces",
I've found it better to use a layer of thick slip from the bottom of my
throwing slops on top of the ring. Just moments after setting the plaster bat
on that, it's sucked the moisture out of the slip and bonded firmly to the
ring.
Sometimes the bats come off. This can be entertaining... I always seem to get
them on a little off center, and that apparent wobble in the bat could be
distracting if I focused on it... If I am working in a style where I want to
bring pieces back to the wheel while still on their bats, it can be time
consuming to re center the bat, or rather the piece on the bat, without the
easy reference of pins. Attaching bats without pins is not perfect, but it is
elegantly simple.
Michael McDowell
Whatcom County, WA USA
mmpots@memes.com
http://www2.memes.com/mmpots
Jeff Campana on mon 1 may 00
Just to add a bit...
The shop bats here at UW-Whitewater are thickly polyurethaned, so they behave
much like a plastic bat - a bugger to stick onto the clay patty. What i found
to be a foolproof method is to press the clay to make 4 or so deep grooves in
the clay patty, then run a wooden rib in a plus-shaped pattern. Then center a
bat on the patty and give a quick pound with both fists. This squishes the air
out, via the ventilation "plus" and then seals up the path for air to re enter.
This results in an incredibly solid bond, and needs to be cut off after the pot
is thrown. I have centered 30 or so pounds on a slippery bat with no slipping,
so it is adequate for many applications.
Jeff
Percy Toms wrote:
> ----------------------------Original message----------------------------
>
> In a message dated 4/29/00 8:37:19 AM, friedlover@email.msn.com writes:
>
> << Can anyone give any suggestions about keeping bats in place when the wheel
> has
>
> no holes for pins? This has been especially difficult with large amounts of
>
> clay. Do the types of bats make a difference? Thanks >>
>
> Here's what I do - I get a lump of clay, and throw it on my Brent's metal
> wheelhead. I form it into a circular disk no more than a half inch thick, and
> from six inches diameter on up - depending on size of the batts I will be
> throwing the real pots on. I could make the disk extend to the wheelhead
> edge, if need be.
>
> I use the side of my opened hand to firmly press down and flatten off the
> clay disk/pad and finish with a straight edged throwing rib - resulting in a
> truly flat, smooth surface.
>
> Sometimes I may throw shallow furrows in it, so while the plane of the pad
> remains truly level it has corrugations.
>
> Batts made from different materials may not work equally well with this
> method. For example I do not use plastibats after finding they always seem to
> shift off center on top of a fresh-thrown clay pad. The smoother and shinier
> the surface of a non-wooden, non-porous, batt the weaker the lateral holding
> force of the moist clay pad. Formica, too, can be tricky. Still, using this
> method on a pinless wheelhead works very well to hold in place batts of
> plywood, particle board, duron, masonite etc - materials with more texture
> and porosity to them.
>
> best,
>
> Ned
Lois Ruben Aronow on mon 1 may 00
------------------
On Sat, 29 Apr 2000 11:36:05 EDT, you wrote:
=3E----------------------------Original message----------------------------
=3E-------------------
=3ECan anyone give any suggestions about keeping bats in place when the =
wheel has
=3Eno holes for pins? This has been especially difficult with large amounts=
of
=3Eclay. Do the types of bats make a difference? Thanks
I always use plaster bats. If your bat is flat on the bottom (I use a
cake pan as a mold), you can stick it with only water. Use alot of
water, and then move your bat around in a circular motion. Believe
me, it will stick. and stick. It takes a gentle push from a putty
knife to remove it from the wheelhead. This is the only method I have
ever used that sticks bats firm, with no wobble.
David Hendley on tue 2 may 00
The best way to adhere (wood product) bats to the
wheelhead is to attach 3 'cleats' to the bottom of the
bats.
The bats must be at least 2" greater in diameter than
the wheelhead. Center the bat on the wheelhead, and
draw a circle on the bottom, with a pencil against the
outside of the wheelhead, while turning the wheelhead.
Attach 3 1 by 2 by 2 or 3" long pieces of board, equally
spaced around the pencil line, just outside the line. Use
wood glue and screws.
Making these bats is more work than sticking the bats to
a clay pancake, but this is a long-term solution that will
be more reliable and save a lot of time in the long run.
--
David Hendley
Maydelle, Texas
hendley@tyler.net
http://www.farmpots.com/
Martin Howard on wed 3 may 00
In the most recent Ceramic Reviews there are adverts for a system which
seems to wrap around the edge of the wheel and the bat with a locating nib
in the wrapping clipped circle and a small cut out in the bat. No hole in
the wheel. It looks rather like those round wooden holders for doing
tapestry work.
I've already made a whole in the wheel and bats, the size of standard
dowels, and will stick with that method for now. It works for me.
Martin Howard
Webb's Cottage Pottery
Woolpits Road, Great Saling
BRAINTREE, Essex CM7 5DZ
England
martin@webbscottage.co.uk
Martin Howard on thu 4 may 00
As an update to my last posting on this theme, I now have the advert in
front of me.
Quote:- The simple solution for fixing bats
BatRetainer.com
Models to fit 25.5, 30, 30.5 wheels
Kits only (pounds sterling) 38.75 + 5.50 p&p UK
Please send cheque or P.O. (stating wheel-head size) to
Bryant Products, 21 High Street,
Cornforth, Ferrhill,Co.Durham DL17 9HN
Further details:- info&batretainer.com
The picture is as I described earlier.
Martin Howard
Webb's Cottage Pottery
Woolpits Road, Great Saling
BRAINTREE, Essex CM7 5DZ
England
martin@webbscottage.co.uk
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