priddy on mon 1 may 00
------------------
Kathi LeSueur =3CKLeSueur=40aol.com=3E wrote:
=3E ----------------------------Original message----------------------------
=3E If he'd made a mold the bowls wouldn't have been =22handmade=22. But =
they were
=3E =22mass-produced=22. In my opinion production such as this makes the =
whole
=3E =22handmade=22 discussion rather riduculus. Four thousand identical =
bowls made
by hand or machine is still mass produced.
And your problem with mass production would be...?
If you gather 1000 bowls from cast molds, the life force is just
not there.
Even the hand of a master thrower will vary from moment to moment as
his or her personal energy flows through them. Each might ostensibly be
identical, but the feeling each one gives you carries the essence of the
maker. I would rather hold and use the artifact left over from the pure
chi work of a master potter, than to stare at the lifeless carcass of an
=22ideation in clay=22 any day. (I am only referring to =7Ebad=7E conceptual
clay art, not the fascinating good quality work that I know is out there)
If potters who make one of a kind work could capture some of the vitality
found in mass produced thrown work, they would catch more interest.
And many do. Lana Wilson makes work with real energy. And I bet she
can produce a real mass of work in a day, too=21 (assuming she chose to,
of course...)
respectfully submitted,
elizabeth priddy
priddy-clay=40usa.net
http:www.angelfire.com/nc/clayworkshop
=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F==
5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5=
F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F
Get free email and a permanent address at http://www.netaddress.com/?N=3D1
Kathi LeSueur on tue 2 may 00
In a message dated 5/1/00 2:34:57 PM, priddy-clay@usa.net writes:
<< And your problem with mass production would be...? >>
I don't have a problem with "mass produced". I got accused of having a mass
produced look at the Ann Arbor Summer Art Fair everytime I displayed four
cups that matched.
While we potters may think that "handmade" or as I say, handthrown, in large
multiples of a form are still "one-of-a -kind", the people who are arguing to
"upgrade" the quality of shows disagree. One of a kind to them means there
isn't another like it. Even another similar. That's why functional potters
often have problems getting into top shows. They want one of a kind to be
just that. One.
Kathi LeSueur
Earl Brunner on tue 2 may 00
------------------
Many of the museum pieces from antiquity that are highly
valued today,
that we consider to be priceless works of beauty and art,
came from this =22mass-produced=22 type of production. We just
don't have the other 3,999
identical bowls (or other shape) around anymore.....
priddy wrote:
=3E
=3E ----------------------------Original message----------------------------
=3E ------------------
=3E Kathi LeSueur =3CKLeSueur=40aol.com=3E wrote:
=3E =3E ----------------------------Original =
message----------------------------
=3E
=3E =3E If he'd made a mold the bowls wouldn't have been =22handmade=22. But=
they were
=3E =3E =22mass-produced=22. In my opinion production such as this makes the=
whole
=3E =3E =22handmade=22 discussion rather riduculus. Four thousand identical =
bowls made
=3E by hand or machine is still mass produced.
=3E
=3E And your problem with mass production would be...?
=3E
=3E If you gather 1000 bowls from cast molds, the life force is just
=3E not there.
=3E
=3E Even the hand of a master thrower will vary from moment to moment as
=3E his or her personal energy flows through them. Each might ostensibly be
=3E identical, but the feeling each one gives you carries the essence of the
=3E maker. I would rather hold and use the artifact left over from the pure
=3E chi work of a master potter, than to stare at the lifeless carcass of an
=3E =22ideation in clay=22 any day. (I am only referring to =7Ebad=7E =
conceptual
=3E clay art, not the fascinating good quality work that I know is out =
there)
=3E
=3E If potters who make one of a kind work could capture some of the =
vitality
=3E found in mass produced thrown work, they would catch more interest.
=3E
=3E And many do. Lana Wilson makes work with real energy. And I bet she
=3E can produce a real mass of work in a day, too=21 (assuming she chose to,
=3E of course...)
=3E
=3E respectfully submitted,
=3E elizabeth priddy
=3E
=3E priddy-clay=40usa.net
=3E http:www.angelfire.com/nc/clayworkshop
=3E
=3E =
=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F==
FF
=3E =
5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=F=
F
=3E F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F
=3E Get free email and a permanent address at =
http://www.netaddress.com/?N=3D1
--
Earl Brunner
http://coyote.accessnv.com/bruec
mailto:bruec=40anv.net
Don & Isao Morrill on wed 3 may 00
At 14:56 5/2/00 EDT, you wrote:
>----------------------------Original message----------------------------
>------------------
>Many of the museum pieces from antiquity that are highly
>valued today,
>that we consider to be priceless works of beauty and art,
>came from this "mass-produced" type of production. We just
>don't have the other 3,999
>identical bowls (or other shape) around anymore.....
>
>priddy wrote:
>>
>> ----------------------------Original message----------------------------
>> ------------------
>> Kathi LeSueur wrote:
>> > ----------------------------Original message----------------------------
>>
>> > If he'd made a mold the bowls wouldn't have been "handmade". But they
were
>> > "mass-produced". In my opinion production such as this makes the whole
>> > "handmade" discussion rather riduculus. Four thousand identical bowls
made
>> by hand or machine is still mass produced.
>>
>> And your problem with mass production would be...?
>>
>> If you gather 1000 bowls from cast molds, the life force is just
>> not there.
>>
>> Even the hand of a master thrower will vary from moment to moment as
>> his or her personal energy flows through them. Each might ostensibly be
>> identical, but the feeling each one gives you carries the essence of the
>> maker. I would rather hold and use the artifact left over from the pure
>> chi work of a master potter, than to stare at the lifeless carcass of an
>> "ideation in clay" any day. (I am only referring to ~bad~ conceptual
>> clay art, not the fascinating good quality work that I know is out there)
>>
>> If potters who make one of a kind work could capture some of the vitality
>> found in mass produced thrown work, they would catch more interest.
>>
>> And many do. Lana Wilson makes work with real energy. And I bet she
>> can produce a real mass of work in a day, too! (assuming she chose to,
>> of course...)
>>
>> respectfully submitted,
>> elizabeth priddy
>>
>> priddy-clay@usa.net
>> http:www.angelfire.com/nc/clayworkshop
>>
>> _________________________FF
>> 5F________________________
>F
>> F_________________
>> Get free email and a permanent address at http://www.netaddress.com/?N=1
>
>--
>Earl Brunner
>http://coyote.accessnv.com/bruec
>mailto:bruec@anv.net
> Hi Earl, Your points are well taken. I add that
the potters wheel itself, is a machine for mass production. In some
cultures this means 'six of one and 12 of another' or perhaps 4000 rice
bowls appearing identical.....at least until the German introduction of
plaster of Paris to Japan, (I believe this was the opinion of Bernard
Leach. Myomy, let confusion continue.
Don & Isao
Don & Isao Sanami Morrill
e-Mail:
iandol on thu 4 may 00
-------------------
So tell me please, when does a limited edition become good mass production? =
And
do a limited editions produced by artists differ from the short production =
runs
of crafts people? Has the stage been reached where the term, limited =
edition,
has been devalued by major marketeers? Should pots be given designer labels
instead of potters seals?
Ivor. Confused by the plethora of rhetoric
Ray Aldridge on fri 5 may 00
At 02:13 PM 5/4/00 EDT, you wrote:
>----------------------------Original message----------------------------
>-------------------
>So tell me please, when does a limited edition become good mass
production? And
>do a limited editions produced by artists differ from the short production
runs
>of crafts people? Has the stage been reached where the term, limited edition,
>has been devalued by major marketeers? Should pots be given designer labels
>instead of potters seals?
>
I think that there are many significant differences between a limited run
of lithographs and a series of thrown production pots. For one thing,
there's no way to know how many pots will exist when the series ends,
unless you cut off the potter's hands. It's not like erasing the stone or
destroying the plates.
On the other hand, this is where slipcast pots could be used to develop a
similar value, since the molds can be destroyed. There's a bit of a
perception problem here, though, because of the way Elvis plates are hawked
(edition limited to only 10,000 firing days!!)
A production mug really isn't like, say, an offset print, because the
artist starts from scratch every time. A better analogy would be to the
caricature artist who sits in the carny midway and makes the same drawings
over and over.
Ray
Aldridge Porcelain and Stoneware
http://www.goodpots.com
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