Wade Blocker on sat 2 sep 00
Asta,
In order to avoid getting a lot of different items to mix glazes, I would
suggest that you buy a few commercial glazes in the cone range that you
intend to fire. eg some base glazes, gloss, matt, colored.If you buy three
or four different glazes, you can add your own colorants, eg copper, cobalt
and iron to them to see how you like them.Then try these glazes in
combinations to see how they look. Later you can add raw materials to mix
your own glazes.Since you are willing to do research just check out any and
all books on ceramics you can find in your local library.They will be
starting points for a direction you wish to take. Mia in ABQ
Asta Jorundardottir on sat 2 sep 00
Hi!
I have been lurking for a week or two, and I have learned so much =
already! I especially love the "olden days" and the mexico stories. =
Bravo! ClayArt is a wonderful and entertaining resource. :-)
I do have a question. I am a beginner (under 1 yr.) and my new wheel =
arrives Tuesday so I hope to be very prolific (gotta practice). I am =
interested in learning to mix glazes to put on all the items I hope to =
make. I have found a source (Axner) for the raw materials. Can someone =
suggest a basic list of items that will be good to make a few different =
glazes? I don't want to order 20 items. I just want to try it and see =
how it goes. I haven't had much luck searching the archives. Or if =
anyone can tell me a book that will help me - I'm no stranger to =
interlibrary loan.
Back to lurk mode.
Many thanks,=20
Beth in AL
Autumn Downey on sun 3 sep 00
Beth, you've had lots of good suggestions about glaze materials and reading
materials both.
I'd like to add another internet source on glaze chemistry. It's on the
Ceramics Web - which I trust you know about??
http://art.sdsu.edu/ceramicsweb/
Look under education and then class materials. You'll find Robert Fromme's
Glaze and Clay Tutorial. I have printed it and I read it periodically
when I want a review of glaze chemistry. It's well-written. Have found
that when I read something that I don't understand in one book, another
author will often approach it slightly differently and eureka! Anyway,
this is free! Just save the files and read them when you want or print
them off and make a binder of them.
Autumn Downey
Yellowknife, NWT
John Weber on sun 3 sep 00
Beth, there are many books that could help you get a basic understanding of
glazes and the process of firing a kiln. A good overall book with lots of
pictures is "The Complete Practical Potter:, by Josie Warshaw (ISBN 0 7548 0
195 0), and if it is still in print, "The Craft of the Potter" by Michael
Casson (ISBN 0 8120 2028 6). Then if you still want to make glazes after
reading those general survey books, go for Clay and Glazes for the Potter by
Daniel Rhodes or Cushings Handbook by Val Cushing. In your post, you did not
mention what temprature you plan to fire to, nor the atmosphere. These are
basic factors you will need to determine. If you do not have a kiln, I
suggest you talk to the person who will be firing your ware for you before
mixing up a glaze. They should be able to guide you, and advise you whether
or not they are willing to fire your ware using your glaze. Good Luck.
GURUSHAKTI@AOL.COM on sun 3 sep 00
I don't know what cone you'll be working with, but here are some very basic
items you can start with for stoneware temperatures.
Feldspar (G-200 or Custer - both are potash feldspars.I'd personally go with
the Custer if you could only get one)
Whiting
Talc
Silica
Clay (OM# Ball Clay or EPK Kaolin or both).
WIth these basic five ingredients plus some colorants like red iron oxide and
cobalt, copper and rutile, and an opacifier like Tin oxide or Zircopax you
can make a wide range of glazes, i.e. calcium matts, clay matts, high
magnesia glazes, etc.
If you want to up your list to more these 5 ingredients to start, then add
Nepheline Syenite to the list, particularly if you will be firing in the
lower stoneware range of cone 5-6. If you'll be working in that range, then
you will want to add a boron material and some zinc oxide, since many of
those glazes use these materials for their fluxing action. You'll also find
that if you're working in the cone 10 range boron materials are used a lot of
copper red and rutile blue glazes.
Since gerstley borate has recently become unavailable, you will have to use
recipes that have been reformulated to one or more of the boron frits or use
one or more of the newly available substitutes like Laguna, Borate, Murrays
Borate, Cadycal, etc. Ferro is also making a new frit substitute for
gerstley; but you will have to do a bit of testing with these materials till
you get the same look of the original glaze, unless you can reformulate it to
empirically match using frits.The frits that can be used for this are Ferro
3134, 3124, 3185 and 3195 as well as the new one. I don't have the number for
that one. You can check the archives for glaze recipes and you'll also find
some recipes that have been reformulated or just ask and I'm sure one of us
can help.
I've already freformulated some cone 6 glazes for friends as well a lot of
cone 10 glazes for myself, and when I get back from vacation and settled in,
I'll try to post some of them to clayart or put them on a web page.
Enjoy!
June Perry
CWilyums@AOL.COM on sun 3 sep 00
Beth,
The materials you will need will in part be decided at which cone(s) you
intend to fire. Flint (silics), feldspar, Kaolin, ball clay, nepheline
syenite, borosilicate frit, talc, rutile, bone ash and colorants (copper
carbonate, iron oxide, cobalt carbonate, etc.) and opacifiers (Superpax, tin
oxide, zinc oxide, etc.). This is a limited list, but a large number of
glazes can be made from the above items.
Recommended books: 1) The Ceramic Spectrum by Robin Hopper, 2) Glazes and
Glazing Techniques by Greg Daily. There are many other books, of course. I
would suggest you search your local library system for "glazes". Also, your
local college library may have all you will ever need in terms of reference
material, especially if the Art Dept. offers ceramics courses.
Also, go to the DIGITALFIRE.COM web site. This is the site for INSIGHT
glaze software and FORESIGHT materials database. This site has an extensive
galze course and materials database.
C Williams (Mississippi MudCat Pottery)
Earl Brunner on sun 3 sep 00
If what you want to begin to experience is the process of
mixing your own glazes, but want to go slowly, then I would
do as Wade suggests. You didn't say what temperature you
plan on firing to. Get some commercial glazes, try to get
them in powder, dry form (it will be cheaper). If you know
the formula to one or two glazes that you like (try to pick
a simple one with a few basic ingredients). Actually the
best place to go might be to go here:
http://digitalfire.com/ and pick one of the well tested
base glazes as a place to start.
This way you would only need to order in or buy maybe the 6
or 7 ingredients that you need for the one glaze and
experiment with colorants. Add chemicals as you find you
need them later.
You will need a good scale if you don't already have one, I
would recommend an Ohaus with extra weights and the extra
bar for the container.
Wade Blocker wrote:
>
> Asta,
> In order to avoid getting a lot of different items to mix glazes, I would
> suggest that you buy a few commercial glazes in the cone range that you
> intend to fire. eg some base glazes, gloss, matt, colored.If you buy three
> or four different glazes, you can add your own colorants, eg copper, cobalt
> and iron to them to see how you like them.Then try these glazes in
> combinations to see how they look. Later you can add raw materials to mix
> your own glazes.Since you are willing to do research just check out any and
> all books on ceramics you can find in your local library.They will be
> starting points for a direction you wish to take. Mia in ABQ
>
> ______________________________________________________________________________
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at melpots@pclink.com.
--
Earl Brunner
http://coyote.accessnv.com/bruec
mailto:bruec@anv.net
Paul Taylor on sun 3 sep 00
Dear Astra
There are hundreds of books on pottery Look up Amazon they will have them
all. You do not have to buy the book from Amazon. You should get a couple of
reviews with your search and only one should be from the authors mother.
I gather you are doing pottery part time and teaching your self. So you
have the luxury of doing what you want.
Some relevant Questions before you buy the book.
Have you decided on a temperature you wish to fire at because glaze
constituents and the approach differ with temperature?
As a beginner you will have an opportunity to change your mind and
try different stuff. I would buy a book that specializes in the area you are
interested in and a genral book.
What sort of kiln have you?
What sort of pottery do you intend to make? Do you like sculpture or
domestic ware or something in between?
Are you happy with a bit of maths or do you prefer a more practical
approach? Do you bung any thing in a bucket and see what happens or are you
happy to copy someone else methodology to get predictable results?
I am the sort that researches any thing and every thing and thus I am
inclined to happy confusion.
My opposite in a parallel universe is happier on a secure foundation He
takes a known potter and works through his method developing form there. If
you use an author on this list at least you will not be on your own.
There have been some negative comments about the ingratitude shown . This
is usually about people who want a quick fix who think ceramics is like
calling for a pitsa . All you have to do is say thank you and report your
progress and most of us so called experts will probably give generously if
only to increase our sense of self importance.
Are you a mud and water person or a piromaniack?
Most books for beginners are short and concise. Which seems strange when
as a beginner you Know less and logically the beginners book should be
longer containing all the info. If there is one general reference book it
has to be Frank and Janet Hammers The potters dictionary of materials and
Techniques. Frank and janets book will give you an over view of the choices
with out ever becoming obsolete no one could ever hold all that info in one
head . I wonder if the authors themselves ever find themselves using their
own book for reflectance.
What beginner needs is all the info in a clear manner but more important
a sense of priority. Knowing the range of particles and their size in a
stone ware body is irrelevant to someone whose major difficulty is getting
the stuff out of the bag .
One of the best bits of advice is always try to work from a secure
position. When you have decided on the effects you like and the temperature
and atmosphere you are likely to get it in try and buy a ready made glaze
from your supplier. One that fits the clay you are using then you will be
starting from a position of right ness as opposed to diving straight into
no-mans land - not sure if it is the kiln firing and/or, the body and/or the
glaze thickness et all that is giving you the disappointment. The price of
ready made glazes are probative but you only need enough to use as a
reflectance point.
There are as many methodologies for making glazes as their are books.
Most of the methodologies are suited to the methodical and are not the way
the author learnt, but the way the author wished he had. In hind site we all
tend to think our inefficiencys were a negative experience and bumbling
along was a waste if time. I feel differently. I think shoving crazy
substances (ashes sands clays and earths) in a bucket is great. Trying out
published glazes you like the look of is also a great way to learn and do
not worry to much if you have not got the exact ingredients unless you are
expecting to recreate precisely the effect having the equivalent clay and
the firing cycle . Save the triaxial line blending or or Seger analyses et
all for the day you have decided that you have enough idea to give focus to
your experiments.
I will give you a list of materials and why I think them use full if you are
using stone ware or porcelain clay. There are others more qualified than I
for the other firings Raku and cone six etc.
Will you be supporting the costs of materials with sales?
Sorry I have no time to organize this letter. I have to build a run for a
white rabbit.
-- Regards Paul Taylor.
Westport Pottery, Liscarney, County Mayo. Ireland.
http://www.anu.ie/westportpottery/
Ps toall. Please paragraph your posts and put a blank line in between the
paragraphs. I have great difficulty reading large blocks of type from a
screen.
> From: Asta Jorundardottir
> Reply-To: Ceramic Arts Discussion List
> Date: Sat, 2 Sep 2000 18:13:57 -0500
> To: CLAYART@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG
> Subject: Glaze materials for the beginner
>
> Hi!
>
> I have been lurking for a week or two, and I have learned so much already! I
> especially love the "olden days" and the mexico stories. Bravo! ClayArt is a
> wonderful and entertaining resource. :-)
>
> I do have a question. I am a beginner (under 1 yr.) and my new wheel arrives
> Tuesday so I hope to be very prolific (gotta practice). I am interested in
> learning to mix glazes to put on all the items I hope to make. I have found a
> source (Axner) for the raw materials. Can someone suggest a basic list of
> items that will be good to make a few different glazes? I don't want to order
> 20 items. I just want to try it and see how it goes. I haven't had much luck
> searching the archives. Or if anyone can tell me a book that will help me -
> I'm no stranger to interlibrary loan.
>
> Back to lurk mode.
>
> Many thanks,
> Beth in AL
>
> ______________________________________________________________________________
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
> melpots@pclink.com.
Don Goodrich on sun 3 sep 00
Hi Beth, welcome to the list.
Deep in the archives are a couple of lists of basic materials (both
provided by Ron Roy) from which you could start. Try searching for his post
on Thu, 21 Aug 1997
under the subject: Re: Glaze advice needed, and anther from Fri, 28 Mar 1997
with the subject: Re: Glaze toxicity. There are probably other such lists in
there, but these are the ones that come to mind.
Another good place to look is Tony Hansen's Digitalfire.com website.
There, you can find his 5-20s base glaze, from which you can go many
directions:
EPK 20 %
Custer feldspar 20 %
Wollastonite 20 %
Frit 3134 20 %
Flint 20 %
I think there's some explanation of how to develop this base at the
Digitalfire website, as there is in Tony's book The Magic of Fire.
The above ingredients are a good collection to start with, and I'd add
Kona F4 feldspar, talc, and nephelene syenite. None are expensive, and plenty
of glazes can be developed from them. You'll want colorants: oxides of iron,
cobalt, and copper will give you quite a few. Add some rutile or titanium
dioxide for surface interest.
There. That's twelve ingredients. You can buy enough of those for a
hundred dollars to make far more than you'd get spending the same money on
premixed glazes, and learn plenty in the bargain.
Good luck,
Don Goodrich
goodrichdn@aol.com
http://members.aol.com/goodrichdn/
Asta Jorundardottir on sun 3 sep 00
Hi! Thanks for responding!
>
> I gather you are doing pottery part time and teaching your self. So =
you
> have the luxury of doing what you want.
>
Yes, but with that comes uncertainty - that's why I'm trying to find out =
as
much as I can beforehand.
> Some relevant Questions before you buy the book.
>
> Have you decided on a temperature you wish to fire at because glaze
> constituents and the approach differ with temperature?
Mid-fire. My kiln only goes up to ^8 max. And I had someone tell me I
could get better colors the hotter I go - Is that correct?
>
> As a beginner you will have an opportunity to change your mind =
and
> try different stuff. I would buy a book that specializes in the area =
you
are
> interested in and a genral book.
>
I have The Potter's Manual by Kenneth Clark and it has 2 pages on the
composition of glaze. I kind of understand - I know you have to have
silica, flux, and alumina, and I think that you add frits to color it? =
And
you have to keep some sort of acid / base ratio... I don't understand =
all
of it.
I had 2 years of Chemistry in high school and a year in college, so I =
think
I will (eventually) be able to figure out the mixing part. The other
pottery book I have is from 1949 and it suggests using asbestos so I =
don't
use it where there might be toxicity issues. :-)
>
> What sort of kiln have you?
I have an EvenHeat electric.
>
> What sort of pottery do you intend to make? Do you like sculpture =
or
> domestic ware or something in between?
Mostly what I want to do are reproductions of 8-11th century functional
ware, but I like to make flowerpots and cats and so on. Thrown and
handbuilt.
>
> Are you happy with a bit of maths or do you prefer a more =
practical
> approach? Do you bung any thing in a bucket and see what happens or =
are
you
> happy to copy someone else methodology to get predictable results?
Both - there are about 4 of us in town that are playing with clay =
together
and we are big to say, "Let's do that and see what it does. It'll =
probably
explode anyway!"
But as far as glazing goes, to start I would probably like to follow =
glaze
recipies that have been tested. Although the Floating Blue discussion =
has
intrigued me... And then do the dump it in a bucket thing once I know a
little more about what's going on.
>
> I am the sort that researches any thing and every thing and thus I am
> inclined to happy confusion.
>
> My opposite in a parallel universe is happier on a secure foundation =
He
> takes a known potter and works through his method developing form =
there.
If
> you use an author on this list at least you will not be on your own.
>
> There have been some negative comments about the ingratitude shown =
.
This
> is usually about people who want a quick fix who think ceramics is =
like
> calling for a pitsa . All you have to do is say thank you and report =
your
> progress and most of us so called experts will probably give =
generously if
> only to increase our sense of self importance.
LOL! too funny :-) But I know, I have been in the same position. I =
know
there's not a "quick fix" - this is a never-ending process and there =
are
always so many new things to try! I've tried so many and I'm still not =
at
the point where I'll throw anything I've made away. Given a lot of it =
away,
but can't seem to toss anything (yet).
>
> Are you a mud and water person or a piromaniack?
Both. I love fire and I love to go into the shop when the kiln is at =
it's
hottest and see the red glow from the peepholes and see how close I can
stand before I get that feeling that I have crossed some sort of heat
barrier and see how close to the hole in the top I can hold my hand.
As far as the mud & water thing, I have always been a VERY MESSY person. =
I
can't eat lunch without dripping something on my shirt. Clay gives me =
an
excuse! I love getting up on a weekend morning and pulling on the jeans =
I
wore the night before that are covered in little beige scuffs where I
dripped or wiped clay on them...and going right back in there and =
playing
some more!
>
> Most books for beginners are short and concise. Which seems strange =
when
> as a beginner you Know less and logically the beginners book should be
> longer containing all the info. If there is one general reference =
book
it
> has to be Frank and Janet Hammers The potters dictionary of materials =
and
> Techniques. Frank and janets book will give you an over view of the
choices
> with out ever becoming obsolete no one could ever hold all that info =
in
one
> head . I wonder if the authors themselves ever find themselves using =
their
> own book for reflectance.
>
I will definitely look into that one. You're right, though. Most of =
the
ones I've flipped through at the local bookstore are either too basic or
they don't cover enough areas.
>
> What beginner needs is all the info in a clear manner but more
important
> a sense of priority. Knowing the range of particles and their size in =
a
> stone ware body is irrelevant to someone whose major difficulty is =
getting
> the stuff out of the bag .
>
Too funny!
> One of the best bits of advice is always try to work from a secure
> position. When you have decided on the effects you like and the
temperature
> and atmosphere you are likely to get it in try and buy a ready made =
glaze
> from your supplier. One that fits the clay you are using then you will =
be
> starting from a position of right ness as opposed to diving straight =
into
> no-mans land - not sure if it is the kiln firing and/or, the body =
and/or
the
> glaze thickness et all that is giving you the disappointment. The =
price of
> ready made glazes are probative but you only need enough to use as a
> reflectance point.
>
I have been using some - mostly Mayco and Gehr. The only problem I've =
had
is using the clear Gehr sometimes there is a milky effect on the pieces.
The only pieces I've had this problem with were on red clay - the first =
one
was on a burnished pot and the second one (several pieces) were on red =
clay
that had been fired to ^2 which was the highest recommended temp. for =
that
clay. I think the glaze must not have been absorbed, somehow.
> There are as many methodologies for making glazes as their are =
books.
> Most of the methodologies are suited to the methodical and are not the =
way
> the author learnt, but the way the author wished he had. In hind site =
we
all
> tend to think our inefficiencys were a negative experience and =
bumbling
> along was a waste if time. I feel differently. I think shoving crazy
> substances (ashes sands clays and earths) in a bucket is great. Trying =
out
> published glazes you like the look of is also a great way to learn =
and do
> not worry to much if you have not got the exact ingredients unless you =
are
> expecting to recreate precisely the effect having the equivalent clay =
and
> the firing cycle . Save the triaxial line blending or or Seger =
analyses et
> all for the day you have decided that you have enough idea to give =
focus
to
> your experiments.
>
So it sounds like you can be off a little in your glaze mixing and while =
you
may get a different effect, it will still work. Is this right?
> I will give you a list of materials and why I think them use full if =
you
are
> using stone ware or porcelain clay. There are others more qualified =
than I
> for the other firings Raku and cone six etc.
Haven't done Raku. Have used stoneware (mostly) and some brown, red, =
and
white clay from a pottery shop about an hour away. Unfortunately, the =
shop
we buy from sells basically clay, commercial glazes, and bisque. No raw
materials. Not much they can tell me, either, although they're very =
nice.
I don't know the names of the clays we get from them. They are in a box
stamped "red," "brown," "white," or "stone." I think I am afraid to try
porcelain.
>
> Will you be supporting the costs of materials with sales?
No. Most of what I make I intend to give away or use as gifts. I don't
intend to sell any at this time. But if cost is too prohibitive, I =
might
consider it.
>
> Sorry I have no time to organize this letter. I have to build a run =
for
a
> white rabbit.
Thank you so much for your time and the info!
Beth
>
> -- Regards Paul Taylor.
>
> Westport Pottery, Liscarney, County Mayo. Ireland.
>
> http://www.anu.ie/westportpottery/
>
> Ps toall. Please paragraph your posts and put a blank line in between =
the
> paragraphs. I have great difficulty reading large blocks of type =
from a
> screen.
WHew536674@CS.COM on sun 3 sep 00
Beth,
I am sure you will get a lot of opinions on this question. The first thing
that you have to decide on is what cone you plan on doing your glazing. At
this point before getting into heavy glaze calculation, I would find a good
base white glaze that you like at the cone you are planning to use. This is
best done by seeing one you like and asking someone for the base glaze
recipe. It will cut costs in supplies, as it may call for 5 or 6
ingredients. Then order some coloring oxides. (i.e.) red iron ox; cobalt
carb; copper carb; rutile, etc. With that one base glaze you can come up
with lots of different colors and experiment with that for a while. That
will get you into production right away. Later on you can get into
calculating your own glazes and that can keep you busy for the rest of your
life. If you plan on doing high fire, cone 9 or 10 I have a few slip recipes
that only call for 2 ingredients each, and using different color slips under
the base glaze or the base glaze with a colorant, you can come up with many,
many variations. Just don't decide to use any glaze that calls for Gerstley
Borate until that problem is worked out. If you want any slip recipes or
need more detailed help you can E-mail me off post.
Joyce A.
Mission, TX
Martin Howard on mon 4 sep 00
Many suggestions have been made for raw materials for the beginner.
All, so far, come from shops in more or less pure form and all have to be
paid for.
But a beginner may have a supply of raw materials to hand, recycled, green
materials. It is then just a matter or having them analysed and incorporated
into glazes according to their constituents; or do inline tests to see which
frit is suitable and in what proportions.
I found this approach to be much more satisfying, but it obviously does not
suit everyone. The original glazes I bought are still lying, almost rock
solid, in the buckets. They are used so rarely.
Martin Howard
Webb's Cottage Pottery
Woolpits Road, Great Saling
BRAINTREE, Essex CM7 5DZ
England
martin@webbscottage.co.uk
Asta Jorundardottir on tue 5 sep 00
Hi, everyone!
I just want to thank everyone who responded to my request for =
information.
I got a couple of good lists and a bunch of tips. I am sorting through =
all the info now and will post the list of what I intend to order once I =
get it ready.
MY WHEEL CAME TODAY!!!!
Thanks!
Asta-Beth in AL
"Oh, Bother!" said the Borg. "We've assimilated Pooh!"
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