Earl Brunner on wed 27 sep 00
Martin Howard wrote:
>
> What is ADHD? I think I know but cannot put words to the initials.
Attention Deficit hyperactive disorder (usually a case of
boys not getting enough outside play)
> < I can't put my hands over his because of "boundaries"
> issues.>
> I find that so sad. When teaching children or adults, male or female, I put
> my hands in there with them; guide them; let them feel just how the clay
> should move with each part of the throwing process.
> We are in a different social mode inside the pot from when outside in the
> normal world.
> Clay breaks down all boundaries.
Clay may break down all barriers, but not in a public school
setting or public art center type setting in the U.S.
especially if you are a male teacher.
You risk loss of job, reputation and possibly jail.
--
Earl Brunner
http://coyote.accessnv.com/bruec
mailto:bruec@anv.net
Earl Brunner on thu 28 sep 00
I have no problem with much of what has been said about true
ADHD children, I have taught 5 or 6 severe cases in my 11
years of teaching, some are less severe...
My point, from a teacher's perspective in the local public
school system is that far to many children are being drugged
to control them instead of behavioral training. (Yes some
children can learn how to use self control---What a
concept!!)
The public school system (as an extension of society) is in
trouble, low test scores, high drop out rates, high burnout
rates for teachers, etc. it's a bureaucracy and
bureaucracies change slowly if at all.
They sometimes go about trying to fix things backwards.
For example:
A certain number of minutes are required of instruction in
math, reading, language arts, science, etc. When you add
them all up, there is no time for the child to get out of
his/her desk and just run, work the wiggles out.
First, second, and third graders are expected to remain in
their seats the better part of the 6 hour day and be quiet,
and pay attention. Teacher's performance evaluations require
adherence to the required number of minutes of instruction
We have "class size reduction" in the primary grades in Las
Vegas, (lower student teacher ratio), Some argue it is
expensive and doesn't work. But it is a lie in the first
place. 35 children in a room designed for 20 is not "class
size reduction" even if there are two teachers. Put a
couple of ADHD kids in there, a couple of resource room kids
that can't do the work, physically and/or mentally and/or
sexually abused kids, a fetal alcohol child or two, hungry
children, children with not enough sleep (fighting all night
at home), neglected children, alcoholic or other substance
abusing parents, children who never cracked the cover of a
book until first grade, children that can't count higher
than 3 or 4 when they get to first grade,
children who's parents are proud of them and think they know
their ABC's because they can sing the ABC song...
The 6th largest school district in the US and we have 43%
transiency rate per year district wide. (meaning about 43%
of the kids move at least once during the year. (that's Las
Vegas for you)
No corporal punishment, precious little accountability
period. No or little consequences for bad behavior or acting
out.
So the schools turn to drugs, dope them down. How else are
you going to control them?
I was just suggesting that many more children are doped for
ADHD than actually treated for it.
Christopher Anton wrote:
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Chris Clarke"
> > > Attention Deficit hyperactive disorder (usually a case of
> > > boys not getting enough outside play)
> >
> > Boy are you going to piss some people off!! I agree though.
> >
> I'm not exactly pissed off (American slang, as in angry, British slang, as
> in drunk), but I do think there is some room for clarification. Many times
> people do jump to the conclusion that a person has ADHD (which, by the way,
> does nor _require_ that the hyperactivity component be present) when it is
> simply a training (or lack thereof) based behavioral problem. However, as
> an adult with ADHD, and with a son who also is afflicted, it is a legitimate
> brain disorder. Specific brain chemical imbalances are associated with it.
>
> Hope these thoughts help.
>
> - Chris
>
Earl Brunner
http://coyote.accessnv.com/bruec
mailto:bruec@anv.net
Christopher Anton on thu 28 sep 00
----- Original Message -----
From: "Chris Clarke" > I know some cases are real, but I think many are not.
Disruptive children
> should not be taken to the doctor for a pill, they should be taught to
> control themselves. I was not saying that it is not legit. There are
many
> diseases that were once thought to be phantom. Sometimes however when it
is
> discovered that an ailment is very real, people jump on the band wagon so
> they can blame something other then themselves.
>
Agreed! Even if one is ADHD afflicted, there is much that can be done
without medication. I am medication averse; I don't like to take any
medication as a matter of habit. This is one of the reasons I only take
ritalin when I feel I will have particular need, or if my ADHD is having a
particularly good (from its point of view) day. :)
- Chris
K&D Wilson on thu 28 sep 00
I have a site that may interest those who are acquainted with Attention Deficit
Disorder. If you peruse http://borntoexplore.org/ you will find a wealth of
information on ADD, as well as interesting information on artistic ability,
creativity and ADD.
For those who believe that all is required is discipline and a hard line,
please skip it. Those who are unable or unwilling to learn about, or at least
accept others as they are, are not going to get much out of the site.
Open minds, open hearts, and acceptance is the key. (having the patience of a
saint helps, also )
Jean Lehman wrote:
> Do you have any idea of the percentage of people with ADHD in the general
> population? I wonder if the percentage of potters with ADHD would be higher
> than that number??? It seems like clay has a calming effect and the few
> ADHD students I have had can really focus for a time when introduced to
> clay. It would be an interesting piece of research, if it hasn't already
> been done... Are there articles that suggest different jobs or interest
> areas for people with ADD and ADHD?
>
> Just curious... except I could be ADD myself, though not diagnosed. I am
> too old to care at this point. But I have a tendency to flit back and forth
> between things instead of sticking to one thing until it is finished. Have
> been that way forever. But I have been able to focus on clay and put in
> long hours just throwing, for example. Interesting to think about.
>
> Jean
>
> -------------------->
> Jean Lehman,
> back in Lancaster, PA getting busy working on the NEXT Strictly Functional
> Pottery National. Check out this year's show which is still on line at
> http://www.art-craftpa.com/sfpn1.html
--
Katherine & Donald Wilson
Nanaimo, BC Canada
I just love deadlines - especially the swooshing sound they make as they rush
by!
Chris Clarke on thu 28 sep 00
> Attention Deficit hyperactive disorder (usually a case of
> boys not getting enough outside play)
Boy are you going to piss some people off!! I agree though.
chris clarke
Temecula, CA
chris@ccpots.com
www.ccpots.com
look again
Christopher Anton on thu 28 sep 00
----- Original Message -----
From: "Chris Clarke"
> > Attention Deficit hyperactive disorder (usually a case of
> > boys not getting enough outside play)
>
> Boy are you going to piss some people off!! I agree though.
>
I'm not exactly pissed off (American slang, as in angry, British slang, as
in drunk), but I do think there is some room for clarification. Many times
people do jump to the conclusion that a person has ADHD (which, by the way,
does nor _require_ that the hyperactivity component be present) when it is
simply a training (or lack thereof) based behavioral problem. However, as
an adult with ADHD, and with a son who also is afflicted, it is a legitimate
brain disorder. Specific brain chemical imbalances are associated with it.
One good clue that one has it, is that certain stimulants or sedatives will
have the opposite effect as in "normal" or non-afflicted individuals. We
were as yet unaware of this when my son had to go in for relatively minor
surgery requiring general anesthesia when he was three. They give him a
shot to start getting him drowsy, and told us he'd be pretty much out of it
in five to seven minutes. Ten minutes later, when the corpsman (Navy
hospital) walked back in, Erik was standing on the bed, jumping from one end
to the other!
Now that he's seventeen, when he needs a slight calmative, we have him
drink a 20oz Coca Cola. It has just enough caffeine to take some of the
edge off.
When we discovered his ADHD, my wife was going through the diagnosis
criteria. She'd read one criterion, and stare pointedly at me. I went in
for diagnosis (with two seperate opinions for confirmation), and yes, I am
also ADHD. (BTW, neither my son nor I have the hyperactivity component).
We can tell when I am taking my ritaline and when I am not. However, I do
not take it just as a matter of course. I only use it when I know I will
particularly need to be able to concentrate.
Another aspect of ADHD which actually helps me in clay work is that in many
individuals it can also cause one to hyperfocus on a particular subject, to
the complete exclusion of what is going on around them. When working in a
studio with ten to twenty other people, the "disability" was actually an
asset!
Having multiple projects to switch between can be helpful. As far as
throwing goes, most beginners use too much water, so the clay will probably
need to stiffen up occassionally. While a wheel project is stiffening, he
can work on a hand building project. I enjoy coil building as it does allow
me to quickly build up a form. Since I like to work on largish forms, they
too often need to let the lower portions stiffen so they can support the
weight of new coils being added. Being able to move from a clay table, to a
wheel, to a glazing station gives me the ability to maintain a general
ceramics focus, while not feeling limited by one particular task.
Hope these thoughts help.
- Chris
K&D Wilson on thu 28 sep 00
You have struck a nerve with this one, as I, as well as my daughter, are ADD.
It's is attitudes such as these that make life so hard for people who are attention
deficit. I cannot count the number of times I, or my daughter, have been told "if
you would just pay attention and stop fidgeting...".
Attention Deficit is very real, and hard on those who are, as well as those who
know and love us.
K. Wilson
Chris Clarke wrote:
> > Attention Deficit hyperactive disorder (usually a case of
> > boys not getting enough outside play)
>
> Boy are you going to piss some people off!! I agree though.
>
> chris clarke
> Temecula, CA
> chris@ccpots.com
> www.ccpots.com
> look again
Chris Clarke on thu 28 sep 00
I know some cases are real, but I think many are not. Disruptive children
should not be taken to the doctor for a pill, they should be taught to
control themselves. I was not saying that it is not legit. There are many
diseases that were once thought to be phantom. Sometimes however when it is
discovered that an ailment is very real, people jump on the band wagon so
they can blame something other then themselves.
chris clarke
Temecula, CA
chris@ccpots.com
www.ccpots.com
look again
----- Original Message -----
From: K&D Wilson
To:
Sent: Thursday, September 28, 2000 3:12 PM
Subject: Re: Teaching kids with ADHD and "touching"
> You have struck a nerve with this one, as I, as well as my daughter, are
ADD.
> It's is attitudes such as these that make life so hard for people who are
attention
> deficit. I cannot count the number of times I, or my daughter, have been
told "if
> you would just pay attention and stop fidgeting...".
> Attention Deficit is very real, and hard on those who are, as well as
those who
> know and love us.
> K. Wilson
>
> Chris Clarke wrote:
>
> > > Attention Deficit hyperactive disorder (usually a case of
> > > boys not getting enough outside play)
> >
> > Boy are you going to piss some people off!! I agree though.
> >
> > chris clarke
> > Temecula, CA
> > chris@ccpots.com
> > www.ccpots.com
> > look again
>
>
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