Earl Brunner on tue 23 jan 01
Last year after about a year of increasing pain in my knees, I was
diagnosed with degenerative osteoarthritis. I have been on medication
for it for about 8 months now. Recently I have begun to experience a
lot of pain in the bones and joints of my feet and in my hands. If this
level of pain continues to get worse at it's present rate I worry that I
will not be able to continue in clay as I want to. This is particularly
troubling to me since I feel that I have only just gotten back into it.
I seem to recall a thread on some kind of (and I'm not even sure I
remember the correct words) calogen(?) supplements or something that was
being discussed. If anyone remembers the thread, could you point me in
the right direction in the archives?
Thanks
--
Earl Brunner
http://coyote.accessnv.com/bruec
mailto:bruec@anv.net
Dwiggins, Sandra (NCI) on wed 24 jan 01
Earl--
This extension of the pain is just more of the same. The exact same thing
happened to me. I take a non-steroidal anti-inflammatory (NSAID) called
voltaren prescribed by my rheumatologist once a day in the morning, and have
had less problems if I take it regularly. This is actually 1/2 the regular
dose, but I found I could get along with just one. I have tried chondroitin
and glucosamine supplements and have not found them to work for me because
the degeneration had gone too far. These supplements will stop the
cartilage breakdown and help the remaining cartilage stay healthy. You
might want to try them, they do seem to work. I have continued to do
pottery despite this problem. I find that the pain never goes away, but it
is bearable, but also very tiring. I get up from the wheel every 20
minutes or so and stretch and walk around a bit.
One should always remember that decreasing your activity just makes things
worse. I have also tried accupressure treatments, which work very well,
and also Q'i Chung exercises help alot. There is a book..."Qi Chung for
Arthritis" that gives an entire series of exercises meant to get the chi
flowing through those stiffening joints. It works for me.
Hope this helps.
Sandy
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Earl Brunner [SMTP:bruec@ANV.NET]
> Sent: Tuesday, January 23, 2001 11:16 PM
> To: CLAYART@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG
> Subject: Degenerative osteoarthritis
>
> Last year after about a year of increasing pain in my knees, I was
> diagnosed with degenerative osteoarthritis. I have been on medication
> for it for about 8 months now. Recently I have begun to experience a
> lot of pain in the bones and joints of my feet and in my hands. If this
> level of pain continues to get worse at it's present rate I worry that I
> will not be able to continue in clay as I want to. This is particularly
> troubling to me since I feel that I have only just gotten back into it.
>
> I seem to recall a thread on some kind of (and I'm not even sure I
> remember the correct words) calogen(?) supplements or something that was
> being discussed. If anyone remembers the thread, could you point me in
> the right direction in the archives?
>
> Thanks
>
>
> --
> Earl Brunner
> http://coyote.accessnv.com/bruec
> mailto:bruec@anv.net
>
> __________________________________________________________________________
> ____
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
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>
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> melpots@pclink.com.
Anne Hunt on wed 24 jan 01
Earl, mebbe glucosamine sulfate and chondroitin sulfate? For a good deal of
the population, helps the body actually build up new cartilege to replace
damaged, vice slapping a band-aid on. Takes patience, tho', as minimum
time required for it to work is about 6 weeks. It's all over the place.
Costco.
Something will work out. You'll be able to keep on doing clay.
anne & cats
Kurt Wild on wed 24 jan 01
I have it in my hips and some in one hand. Was taking Ibuprophen over the
counter, later put on prescribed Ketoprophen and ended up being
hospitalized with upper GI bleeding. Tried Vioxx for awhile and then
switched to Celebrex. Celebrex didn't feel right so I'm back on Vioxx
which helps some. Still looking/hoping for something better. Will be
watching the list for other comments.
Kurt
email: KURT.L.WILD@uwrf.edu
website: http://wwwpp.uwrf.edu/~kw77
Hank Murrow on wed 24 jan 01
Earl Brunner wrote;
>Last year after about a year of increasing pain in my knees, I was
>diagnosed with degenerative osteoarthritis. I have been on medication
>for it for about 8 months now. Recently I have begun to experience a
>lot of pain in the bones and joints of my feet and in my hands. If this
>level of pain continues to get worse at it's present rate I worry that I
>will not be able to continue in clay as I want to. This is particularly
>troubling to me since I feel that I have only just gotten back into it.
>
>I seem to recall a thread on some kind of (and I'm not even sure I
>remember the correct words) calogen(?) supplements or something that was
>being discussed. If anyone remembers the thread, could you point me in
>the right direction in the archives?
Dear Earl;
I have had the same diagnosis since I was 47 years old. I tried Glucosamine
sulfate and other 'Supplemental' minerals but finally at the age of 55 had
my left knee replaced with a shiny new cobalt/chrome alloy with teflon
'cartilage'. The new knee has performed flawlessly ever since, while the
right knee continued to deteriorate. Finally, Jan 5th I had surgery to
replace the right knee with a similar alloy joint. One week after surgery I
walked 8 blocks with crutches, at two weeks I walked a mile without them,
at three weeks, I am bicylcling for twentyfive minutes at a pop and walking
a mile a day. Promises to leave me with two sturdy limbs which are the same
length and will permit walking around those hill towns in Umbria I've been
avoiding until now. Can't believe how good my surgeon and his team are. The
operation took 1 and a quarter hours! I will be back in the studio potting
around Feb 10. "Your Mileage May Vary".
Regards, Hank in Eugene
Charles Moore on wed 24 jan 01
Earl,
Anne Hunt's posting on the cartilage supplement for osteoarthritis provides
the accurate names of the supplements. "Arthritis Today," the journal of
the American Arthritis Society, recommends that you take 1500 mgs of
Glucosamine and 1200 mgs of Chondroiton Sulfate daily. I think it is
worthwhile to check out the info from the Arthritis Society, which you can
find on the Internet.
In addition to these supplements, I have taken 100 or 200 mgs of Celebrex
for the past two years. The effect took about two weeks to kick in. This
anti-inflammatory medication has worked wonders for me. Though it does not
replace cartilage, it does reduce pain--for me. Kurt Wild recommends Vioxx.
I suggest trying both.
When I first developed arthritis, I thought my potting days were over. But
I discovered that, though there are bad days, potting does not really hurt
my hands if I am careful.
Try not to give up; look for answers and alternatives.
Charles Moore
camoore33@earthlink.net
change your subscription
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>
Janet on wed 24 jan 01
Earl,
You might ask your Dr. about Naprosyn, too.
Also an NSAID, generic name is Naproxen.
It's supposed to be an ok long-term med.
I've been taking 375mg 2x daily for the past
6 months and feel so much better I can=20
hardly stand it. I shouldn't have waited so=20
long to seek traditional help.
Being anti-meds, generally, I tried the natural
route for years to no avail.
Like Sandy said and you may know, the pain
sometimes can't be eliminated but it no longer
crushes my ambition.
A positive attitude is a must and an occasional
martini doesn't hurt!
Janet
Diane Woloshyn on wed 24 jan 01
My arthritis got much worse this winter and I was lurching around like a
drunk on bad knees and one very bad hip. Started taking Celebrex and am
walking like a human again. Maybe I will be able to put off having
replacements for a few years.
Diane Florida Bird Lady
Karin Abromaitis on wed 24 jan 01
A couple of things to try: Glucosamine and Chondroitin compounds, usually
found in the vitamin section of the drug store or at health food stores.
Really does seem to help. Also have your parathyroid and serum calcium
levels checked. Could be alot of other things as well, but this is what
worked for me. A newish drug Vioxx is also wonderful-you only have to take
it once a day. However its expensive, needs a doctor's RX and can have some
serious side effects. Hot soaks in the tub with epsom salts is good too.
Oh yeah and the homeopathic remedy Arnica montana is great stuff and comes
in a cream as well as the pellets. Good luck.
Karin
-----Original Message-----
From: Ceramic Arts Discussion List [mailto:CLAYART@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG]On
Behalf Of Earl Brunner
Sent: Tuesday, January 23, 2001 11:16 PM
To: CLAYART@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG
Subject: Degenerative osteoarthritis
Last year after about a year of increasing pain in my knees, I was
diagnosed with degenerative osteoarthritis. I have been on medication
for it for about 8 months now. Recently I have begun to experience a
lot of pain in the bones and joints of my feet and in my hands. If this
level of pain continues to get worse at it's present rate I worry that I
will not be able to continue in clay as I want to. This is particularly
troubling to me since I feel that I have only just gotten back into it.
I seem to recall a thread on some kind of (and I'm not even sure I
remember the correct words) calogen(?) supplements or something that was
being discussed. If anyone remembers the thread, could you point me in
the right direction in the archives?
Thanks
--
Earl Brunner
http://coyote.accessnv.com/bruec
mailto:bruec@anv.net
____________________________________________________________________________
__
Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
melpots@pclink.com.
Estrellita Ammirati on wed 24 jan 01
Hi Earl:
As a Physical Therapist who does home care I can
testify to Hank's success story regarding his total
knee replacements. I see many patients, post surgery
and as Earl says "your mileage" will vary. Recently I
saw a gentleman who had surgery on a Friday, came home
on Monday, I began treatment with him on Tuesday.
Within four weeks he went from bending his knee 35
degrees to 100 degrees and he went from walking with
a walker to a straight cane. He was well motivated
and did all I asked of him and together we succeeded.
Many patients with arthritis undergo this surgery once
the pain becomes unbearable and they can no longer
walk or function comfortably. Then everyone is
thrilled afterwards when they are "pain free" and
almost everyone says, "why did I wait so long?" Is the
surgery worth it? From what I've seen yes but only
you can make that decision. Unfortunately I haven't
met a "potter" who has had the surgery so I can't tell
you how they fared afterwards. We'll leave that up
to Hank after he returns to his wheel.
If you have any questions feel free to contact me off
line at EAmmirati@yahoo.com
Estrellita
--- Hank Murrow wrote:
> Earl Brunner wrote;
>
> >Last year after about a year of increasing pain in
> my knees, I was
> >diagnosed with degenerative osteoarthritis. I have
> been on medication
> >for it for about 8 months now. Recently I have
> begun to experience a
> >lot of pain in the bones and joints of my feet and
> in my hands. If this
> >level of pain continues to get worse at it's
> present rate I worry that I
> >will not be able to continue in clay as I want to.
> This is particularly
> >troubling to me since I feel that I have only just
> gotten back into it.
> >
> >I seem to recall a thread on some kind of (and I'm
> not even sure I
> >remember the correct words) calogen(?) supplements
> or something that was
> >being discussed. If anyone remembers the thread,
> could you point me in
> >the right direction in the archives?
>
>
> Dear Earl;
>
> I have had the same diagnosis since I was 47 years
> old. I tried Glucosamine
> sulfate and other 'Supplemental' minerals but
> finally at the age of 55 had
> my left knee replaced with a shiny new cobalt/chrome
> alloy with teflon
> 'cartilage'. The new knee has performed flawlessly
> ever since, while the
> right knee continued to deteriorate. Finally, Jan
> 5th I had surgery to
> replace the right knee with a similar alloy joint.
> One week after surgery I
> walked 8 blocks with crutches, at two weeks I walked
> a mile without them,
> at three weeks, I am bicylcling for twentyfive
> minutes at a pop and walking
> a mile a day. Promises to leave me with two sturdy
> limbs which are the same
> length and will permit walking around those hill
> towns in Umbria I've been
> avoiding until now. Can't believe how good my
> surgeon and his team are. The
> operation took 1 and a quarter hours! I will be back
> in the studio potting
> around Feb 10. "Your Mileage May Vary".
>
> Regards, Hank in Eugene
>
>
______________________________________________________________________________
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change
> your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be
> reached at melpots@pclink.com.
__________________________________________________
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Martin Howard on thu 25 jan 01
Whatever disease hits me
(or whatever disease I attract due my own stupidity; read it either way),
I do not wish to ever take advantage of anything that has caused the death
or suffering of animals in its development. Full stop.
Many are coming to this point of view.
There are many complementary and alternative therapies now which are not
reliant on vivisection and animal experimentation.
I am rather surprised at the numbers of drugs which are being suggested for
Earl and others, instead of methods and medications of herbal, homeopathic
etc origin.
Surely you have seen and heard of the disgusting goings on in HLS
(Huntingdon Life Sciences) etc?
Doesn't that have any affect?
Oh, well, it's some silly USA banks that have bailed out HLS, much to the
disgust of many of us over here. But their names will be found out and they
will go under in their turn, as public opinion turns against them.
You can't keep making chip and dip plates if the public really don't want
them:-)
Martin Howard
Webb's Cottage Pottery
Woolpits Road, Great Saling
BRAINTREE, Essex CM7 5DZ
England
martin@webbscottage.co.uk
Have you seen http://www.thefriend.org
Download The Friend, the weekly Quaker Newspaper,
3 days before it is published.
That's Quick for Quakers.
Elca Branman on thu 25 jan 01
I too am on Celebrex after working my way through Naproxin and Vioxx.
The most important thing is to keep using your hands; it may hurt..hell,
it DOES hurt, but they stiffen up if you don't use them and loosen up if
you do.
..Push past the pain !
Softer clay for throwing and giving little butterfly kisses to your
thumb joints help.
Yelping is also allowed. ..
Elca Branman in cool Sarasota , Fl.
> When I first developed arthritis, I thought my potting days were
> over. But
> I discovered that, though there are bad days, potting does not
> really hurt
> my hands if I am careful.
>
> Try not to give up; look for answers and alternatives.
>
> Charles Moore
> camoore33@earthlink.net
Elca Branman.. in Sarasota,Florida,USA
elcab1@juno.com
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Bobbi Bassett on thu 25 jan 01
Earl,
I read your post and can empathize with you. I have had what the doctor terms
DJD (degenerative joint disease) for over 20 years. It doesn't get better,
but with a positive attitude it just becomes a part of life to deal with just
like bills and taxes. You don't like them but you deal with them and get over
it. I have arthritis in my knees, lower spine, hips, both shoulders, and in
both hands.
I am a full time potter who has had to shorten her work day a little
(evenings off now). I notice that when I'm away from the studio for any
length of time I begin to get worse. All this "playing in the mud" is really
good for keeping the joints oiled. The real proof of this for me is going to
a movie. At the end of 2 hours I have to take a few minutes to straighten up
before I can walk. Some movies are worth it.
As it progresses you learn to compensate. I throw with warm water. When my
hands feel really bad I hold them under hot water for a few minutes. I take a
break from the wheel and stretch about every 20 to 30 minutes, and I keep 5
lb weights in the studio to use to keep my arms and shoulders limber. I've
adapted my throwing style and wedge sitting on the edge of a stool just to
take the strain off the knees.
I hope this helps. Reading the posts from all of you sure made me feel like I
wasn't alone. Being isolated in the studio sometimes makes one think you are
the only one it's happening to.
Bobbi in PA
Cyberpotter@AOL.COM on fri 26 jan 01
In a message dated 1/24/01 9:54:54 PM Eastern Standard Time,
dljcbrum@STARGATE.NET writes:
> Also an NSAID, generic name is Naproxen.
> It's supposed to be an ok long-term med
I also have rotten knees, and have found that Naproxen sodium, sold over the
counter as Aleve, works like a charm for me. After taking it faithfully for a
couple of days I was running up and down the stairs. However, my doctor has
advised me to take periodic "breaks" away from it because it can be hard on
the liver/kidneys.
Nancy in Sleety Cincinnati
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