Paul Lewing on thu 19 apr 01
Hi, Diane.
If the plug connections are scorched, don't fire it again without
replacing the plug. I assume you'e already unplugged it and looked at
the plug prongs.
I almost had a fire in my studio twice before I figured out why my kiln
plug was scorching. Luckily I had unplugged it to move it. Never saw
any smoke or had any indication that there was a problem, but when I
unplugged it, the metal in the plug was scorched and the plastic was a
bit melted. The problem was that I had mounted the receptacle too low
on the wall. The cord was too stiff to make that sharp a bend, and the
plug wasn't seating in the receptacle properly, so there was a small gap
at the bottom prongs, causing and arc. I cut the plug off and wired it
directly into a junction box, and I think that's much safer. I've been
firing that way for about 20 years now with no problem at all. And I do
periodically feel the junction box while it's firing to see if it's
heating up.
Paul Lewing, Seattle
Barney Adams on thu 19 apr 01
High power connections are tricky in electric circuits. If a contact
builds up some resistance due to corrosion,dirt...whatever it starts
a cycle called thermal runaway. The resistance of the connection causes
a build up in heat which in turn increases the resistance which generates
more heat.....thus the runaway. I would have the electrician take a look
if he's worth his salt he will stop by and take care of it.
Barney
Diane Echlin wrote:
> Hi Folks. I just got a call from my studio mate that while doing a
> bisque firing the plug from my Skutt KM1027 was smoking badly and making
> "bad sparky" noises. I had the outlet installed by a professional
> electrician about 8 months ago. At the time, he added a "buck-booster"
> to the panel and checked that the wiring from the panel to the plug was
> adequate, which he claimed it was. The kiln has been fired many
> times-at least a dozen-to ^06 and several times to ^6 since the wiring
> was done. Any ideas why this would happen? Should I trust the
> electrician to come back and try to figure out what happened or should I
> find someone else? I'm soooo bummed.
> Diane in CT
>
> ______________________________________________________________________________
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at melpots@pclink.com.
Cindy Strnad on thu 19 apr 01
Diane,
It sounds like your plug needs to be repaired or replaced. Better yet, have
the electrician hardwire the kiln into your electrical system and install an
extra box beside the kiln with a switch you can jerk out to disconnect the
kiln entirely. Plugs will always wear out, and kiln plugs, which carry so
much power, are more susceptible (and dangerous) than most.
Cindy Strnad
Earthen Vessels Pottery
RR 1, Box 51
Custer, SD 57730
USA
earthenv@gwtc.net
http://www.earthenvesselssd.com
Diane Echlin on thu 19 apr 01
Hi Folks. I just got a call from my studio mate that while doing a
bisque firing the plug from my Skutt KM1027 was smoking badly and making
"bad sparky" noises. I had the outlet installed by a professional
electrician about 8 months ago. At the time, he added a "buck-booster"
to the panel and checked that the wiring from the panel to the plug was
adequate, which he claimed it was. The kiln has been fired many
times-at least a dozen-to ^06 and several times to ^6 since the wiring
was done. Any ideas why this would happen? Should I trust the
electrician to come back and try to figure out what happened or should I
find someone else? I'm soooo bummed.
Diane in CT
Robert and Mary Ann Sparacin on thu 19 apr 01
Sometimes, when contacts become oxidized or are under less pressure than =
originally
( actually both), the poor contact will create heat and cause the plug to=
start to
melt. Contacts include lug connections as well as the plug and receptacle=
contacts.
The lack of insulation will then cause the plug to spark and short out. I=
f the wire
size is adequate, it may be possible to install an oversized plug and out=
let. Home
Depot carries them. That happened to my welder, and it is no great shakes=
to
install. However, in accord with today's mind set, if you want someone to=
sue if
the house burns down, then hire someone to do it. I guess Davy Crocket wo=
uld not
make it in today's world.
RJS
Diane Echlin wrote:
> Hi Folks. I just got a call from my studio mate that while doing a
> bisque firing the plug from my Skutt KM1027 was smoking badly and makin=
g
> "bad sparky" noises. I had the outlet installed by a professional
> electrician about 8 months ago. At the time, he added a "buck-booster"
> to the panel and checked that the wiring from the panel to the plug was
> adequate, which he claimed it was. The kiln has been fired many
> times-at least a dozen-to ^06 and several times to ^6 since the wiring
> was done. Any ideas why this would happen? Should I trust the
> electrician to come back and try to figure out what happened or should =
I
> find someone else? I'm soooo bummed.
> Diane in CT
>
> _______________________________________________________________________=
_______
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at melpots@pcl=
ink.com.
Frank & Pat Simons on fri 20 apr 01
Another problem with the plug and receptacle on Skutt 1027 is that there are
more than one make of receptacles. Assuming that this is installed by a
qualified electrician, there is small chance of anything happening like what
you describe. Being an electrician this has all the ear marks of a high
resistance or loose connection. Turn OFF the breaker, remove the receptacle
from its usually 4" square box and examine the connections. Look for burned
or discolored metal connections. A Skutt 1027 usually has #6 wire. This is
usually connected to the receptacle by the wire having the insulation
stripped back about !/2 an inch and then the stranded wire being pushed into
a hole in the connector and then tightened by means of a set screw. The ends
of the stranded wire should be tightly twisted and CLEAN. Make sure the wire
bottoms in the connector and then tighten really TIGHT. If this condition
happened after a qualified electrician installed same I would be looking for
a no-charge callback to verify the work was done properly. There are three
wires involved Black,Red and White for a 230 VAC hookup. Its usually the
White wire (neutral) that cause the problems. ....As previously stated the
prongs of the plug must be CLEAN and make a good tight connection with the
metal connections in the receptacle... Hope this helps.....
----- Original Message -----
From: "Paul Lewing"
To:
Sent: April 19, 2001 10:27 AM
Subject: Re: kiln/electrical/smoke
> Hi, Diane.
> If the plug connections are scorched, don't fire it again without
> replacing the plug. I assume you'e already unplugged it and looked at
> the plug prongs.
> I almost had a fire in my studio twice before I figured out why my kiln
> plug was scorching. Luckily I had unplugged it to move it. Never saw
> any smoke or had any indication that there was a problem, but when I
> unplugged it, the metal in the plug was scorched and the plastic was a
> bit melted. The problem was that I had mounted the receptacle too low
> on the wall. The cord was too stiff to make that sharp a bend, and the
> plug wasn't seating in the receptacle properly, so there was a small gap
> at the bottom prongs, causing and arc. I cut the plug off and wired it
> directly into a junction box, and I think that's much safer. I've been
> firing that way for about 20 years now with no problem at all. And I do
> periodically feel the junction box while it's firing to see if it's
> heating up.
> Paul Lewing, Seattle
>
>
____________________________________________________________________________
__
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
melpots@pclink.com.
Wade Blocker on fri 20 apr 01
Diane,
Much the same thing happened to me. I was checking on my firing and
smelled that peculiar odor of something burning. Saw that it was the outlet
into which my kiln was plugged. Turned everything off and called an
electrician. Had I come in much later instead of a scorched receptacle I
might have had a fire. According to the electrician I should have this
checked every couple of years in order to avoid a similar occurrence.
Actually it has been three years now and I have not bothered to do so.
However next time I have need for an electrician I will have him check
the outlet again. Mia in ABQ
Paul Huel on fri 20 apr 01
Hi Diane,
We had the same problems with the plugs on two of our kilns, the only
solution like Paul Lewing said, is to get rid of the plugs and wire
into a junction box. The kilns have been fine like this for years. I
think that the plugs work themselves loose a bit with the constant
heating and cooling which occurs in our kiln room.
Paul=20
>Hi Folks. I just got a call from my studio mate that while doing a
>bisque firing the plug from my Skutt KM1027 was smoking badly and making
>"bad sparky" noises. I had the outlet installed by a professional
>electrician about 8 months ago. At the time, he added a "buck-booster"
>to the panel and checked that the wiring from the panel to the plug was
>adequate, which he claimed it was. The kiln has been fired many
>times-at least a dozen-to ^06 and several times to ^6 since the wiring
>was done. Any ideas why this would happen? Should I trust the
>electrician to come back and try to figure out what happened or should I
>find someone else? I'm soooo bummed.
>Diane in CT
P a u l & C a r o l e H u e l - dragonfly@kispiox.com
http://www.kispiox.com/pottery
Frank & Pat Simons on fri 20 apr 01
Hi-- The plug on our Skutt 1027 seemed to be heating up and about to do the
same thing, We thoroughly cleaned the plug contacts and bent them outwards
slightly to make sure that it has a good tight contact surface wuth the
receptacle contacts and last two firings seem to be ok. But I think hard
wiring to a junction box is the way to go, If you have no need to disconnect
and move the kiln frequently----- Original Message -----
From: "Paul Huel"
To:
Sent: April 20, 2001 8:20 AM
Subject: Re: kiln/electrical/smoke
Hi Diane,
We had the same problems with the plugs on two of our kilns, the only
solution like Paul Lewing said, is to get rid of the plugs and wire
into a junction box. The kilns have been fine like this for years. I
think that the plugs work themselves loose a bit with the constant
heating and cooling which occurs in our kiln room.
Paul
>Hi Folks. I just got a call from my studio mate that while doing a
>bisque firing the plug from my Skutt KM1027 was smoking badly and making
>"bad sparky" noises. I had the outlet installed by a professional
>electrician about 8 months ago. At the time, he added a "buck-booster"
>to the panel and checked that the wiring from the panel to the plug was
>adequate, which he claimed it was. The kiln has been fired many
>times-at least a dozen-to ^06 and several times to ^6 since the wiring
>was done. Any ideas why this would happen? Should I trust the
>electrician to come back and try to figure out what happened or should I
>find someone else? I'm soooo bummed.
>Diane in CT
P a u l & C a r o l e H u e l - dragonfly@kispiox.com
http://www.kispiox.com/pottery
____________________________________________________________________________
__
Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
melpots@pclink.com.
Beverly Howard on sat 21 apr 01
FWIW, the plugs supplied wiith many kilns are rated only slightly above the actual load drawn. In addition, the run times are much longer than most devices (dryers, welders) so heat builds up in the connection and they loose their temper, leading to poorer connections and more heat and even earlier failure.
I've long since replaced ours with higher rated plugs. I use widely available "range" plugs although there is a code issue in that the third blade on a range plug is "neutral" and the third on most kilns is "protective ground" provided by a potentially smaller conductor behind the receptical.
The only real danger of a higher rated plug is that some one might use it for a larger device after you move on.
Beverly Howard
Bonnie Staffel on mon 23 apr 01
Dear Diane,
I would suggest that you have your electrician direct wire your kiln to the
fuse box. I also had a plug burn. That was the first thing the electrician
told me to do. Ever since then, have had no burning connections. Over time
the wires expand and contract and then start arcing. Not a good thing to
have happen.
Regards, Bonnie Staffel of Charlevoix, MI. Had my first good day in the
studio where I didn't feel like dropping dead from fatigue. Must be
bouncing back thanks to all your good wishes.
***********************************************************
Diane Echlin on mon 23 apr 01
Thanks to all for your comments/suggestions about the nature of my burning kiln
plug problem. I finally got ten minutes to run to the studio today to actually
look at the thing. (I was relieved to see that my studio mate unplugged the kiln
and shut off the breaker)
The prongs on the plug are all blackened and have a serious buildup of something on
them--much heavier on the flat prongs than on the u-shaped on. The receptacle
looked fine, but I'm not going to mess with it until an electrician comes.
I would consider doing a hard wiring, except that the head of the studio has
mentioned she may be leaving in December, and if that happens, the studio will
close altogether. And given my school schedule, I'm not up to the responsibility
of taking over. God, I feel discouraged.
Again, thanks for the input everyone.
Diane in CT
Cindy Strnad on mon 23 apr 01
Diane,
If you can't hardwire the kiln in due to "political/logistical" problems,
have your electrician transplant a heftier plug onto the kiln. That will
help. It may necessitate a different wall socket--I don't know about
that--but such shouldn't be too pricey.
Cindy Strnad
Earthen Vessels Pottery
RR 1, Box 51
Custer, SD 57730
USA
earthenv@gwtc.net
http://www.earthenvesselssd.com
Susan on fri 11 may 01
Okay, another hardwire/plug question for you all. I bought a used Bailey
electric 2327-1 kiln a few months ago & am finally setting it up. It's 7
cu. ft., 240v, and I believe its jacket plate says it's rated to cone 8. I
can't tell if it says 43 or 48 amps. I'll be firing to max of cone 6.
When I bought it (from a decent supplier), their kiln repair guy
said, "gee, it doesn't have a plug on it... I'll put one on." At the time,
it didn't occur to me that maybe it didn't have a plug because it needed to
be hardwired. He didn't bring it up, and so I didn't even think of it.
Several months down the road, I'm setting it up and it suddenly strikes
me... maybe this needed to be hardwired? I called Bailey, & they
said, "definitely hardwire it." I talked to two friends--a ceramics prof
and an electrical engineer--& they both said I should just feel the plug
periodically and see if it gets hot. If it doesn't get hot, they said I
should be fine.
My electrician says hardwiring it will run me $150-200. I just spend a
bushel of money getting him to wire my studio; he knew at the time what my
kiln draws, & I'm sure he used a receptacle that's beefy enough to handle
what my kiln needs. When I called to ask him for a quote, his first
response was that he didn't see why it needed to be hardwired, but when I
told him it would be on for 8-10 hours, he said that might be why.
Any thoughts? experiences? I can't personally imagine that every studio
potter with a kiln like mine has it hardwired. I don't want to do something
stupid, but I also would rather not spend an unnecessary $200. I won't be
in this studio for more than 5 years, so if I can safely stick with the
plug, I'd sure like to.
Thanks,
Susan
Robert and Mary Ann Sparacin on fri 11 may 01
Dear Susan,
Possible options which are not too hard to do:
Shut power off, remove plug and receptacle, use a metal junction box with
fittings, ground the box, and: connect wires with bolt type couplings tightly, use
nolux , or similar product, on connections. Wrap connections with thick 1/8"
electrical rubber pad insulation (get at electrical store, and then electrical tape
over them. This makes a better electrical connection because the pressure is much
greater than on a plug type connection. Also, and better, replace junction box with
a 100 amp industrial safety switch and use this as your means of hard wiring...
Make a diagram of what you wish to do and go to an electrical supply store, ask
questions, and just do it. If the supply store gives you trouble, go to one which
will help, they are out there. You would not believe how simple it is to do. Make
sure connectors are rated for the size wires you already have. I suggested an
oversize manual industrial safety switch to avoid any possible overload due to
duration of use. Safety switch may or may not have fuses (extra protection), it
only works as a switch.
Kind regards,
RJS
Susan wrote:
> Okay, another hardwire/plug question for you all. I bought a used Bailey
> electric 2327-1 kiln a few months ago & am finally setting it up. It's 7
> cu. ft., 240v, and I believe its jacket plate says it's rated to cone 8. I
> can't tell if it says 43 or 48 amps. I'll be firing to max of cone 6.
>
> When I bought it (from a decent supplier), their kiln repair guy
> said, "gee, it doesn't have a plug on it... I'll put one on." At the time,
> it didn't occur to me that maybe it didn't have a plug because it needed to
> be hardwired. He didn't bring it up, and so I didn't even think of it.
>
> Several months down the road, I'm setting it up and it suddenly strikes
> me... maybe this needed to be hardwired? I called Bailey, & they
> said, "definitely hardwire it." I talked to two friends--a ceramics prof
> and an electrical engineer--& they both said I should just feel the plug
> periodically and see if it gets hot. If it doesn't get hot, they said I
> should be fine.
>
> My electrician says hardwiring it will run me $150-200. I just spend a
> bushel of money getting him to wire my studio; he knew at the time what my
> kiln draws, & I'm sure he used a receptacle that's beefy enough to handle
> what my kiln needs. When I called to ask him for a quote, his first
> response was that he didn't see why it needed to be hardwired, but when I
> told him it would be on for 8-10 hours, he said that might be why.
>
> Any thoughts? experiences? I can't personally imagine that every studio
> potter with a kiln like mine has it hardwired. I don't want to do something
> stupid, but I also would rather not spend an unnecessary $200. I won't be
> in this studio for more than 5 years, so if I can safely stick with the
> plug, I'd sure like to.
>
> Thanks,
> Susan
>
> ______________________________________________________________________________
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at melpots@pclink.com.
craig clark on fri 11 may 01
Susan, though hardwiring is the best way to go if you don't ever need to
move your kiln it is not neccessary. I've got two Skutt electrics that I've
been running in my studio for the past seven years. Neither of them is
hardwired and I havn't had a problem. Just make sure that the kiln is on
it's own 50amp circuit and that the plug and recepticle are also rated for
this type of current demand. Ask the electrician who did the wiring for you.
He'll be able to tell you what he installed.
Craig Dunn Clark
619 East 11 1/2 st
Houston, Texas 77008
(713)861-2083
mudman@hal-pc.org
-----Original Message-----
From: Susan
To: CLAYART@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG
Date: Friday, May 11, 2001 1:03 PM
Subject: Re: kiln/electrical/smoke
>Okay, another hardwire/plug question for you all. I bought a used Bailey
>electric 2327-1 kiln a few months ago & am finally setting it up. It's 7
>cu. ft., 240v, and I believe its jacket plate says it's rated to cone 8. I
>can't tell if it says 43 or 48 amps. I'll be firing to max of cone 6.
>
>When I bought it (from a decent supplier), their kiln repair guy
>said, "gee, it doesn't have a plug on it... I'll put one on." At the time,
>it didn't occur to me that maybe it didn't have a plug because it needed to
>be hardwired. He didn't bring it up, and so I didn't even think of it.
>
>Several months down the road, I'm setting it up and it suddenly strikes
>me... maybe this needed to be hardwired? I called Bailey, & they
>said, "definitely hardwire it." I talked to two friends--a ceramics prof
>and an electrical engineer--& they both said I should just feel the plug
>periodically and see if it gets hot. If it doesn't get hot, they said I
>should be fine.
>
>My electrician says hardwiring it will run me $150-200. I just spend a
>bushel of money getting him to wire my studio; he knew at the time what my
>kiln draws, & I'm sure he used a receptacle that's beefy enough to handle
>what my kiln needs. When I called to ask him for a quote, his first
>response was that he didn't see why it needed to be hardwired, but when I
>told him it would be on for 8-10 hours, he said that might be why.
>
>Any thoughts? experiences? I can't personally imagine that every studio
>potter with a kiln like mine has it hardwired. I don't want to do something
>stupid, but I also would rather not spend an unnecessary $200. I won't be
>in this studio for more than 5 years, so if I can safely stick with the
>plug, I'd sure like to.
>
>Thanks,
>Susan
>
>___________________________________________________________________________
___
>Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
>You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
>settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
>Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
melpots@pclink.com.
>
Shirley Tschannen on fri 11 may 01
Hi Susan, I am in the process of investigating a lot of kilns in
anticipation of purchasing a new cone 10 unit. One thing I noticed on
your post is....did the electrician guy know which plug to put on it?
Because different volts, amps etc. call for different plugs. Be
careful....I would say about half of the kilns I am looking at call for
a "hard wire". Not too long ago I had to replace the plug on my old
kiln cause it had burned through a portion of the plug....luckily I
smelled the wire burning and quickly turned off the main switch. I
was using my dryer plug for this kiln... Now I am savvy enough having
spent so much time reading about the kilns that I would not do this
again but write the check for a pro to put in a dedicated line and
breaker for the kiln alone. Good luck and check it out!
Chris Clarke on sat 12 may 01
I've had a skutt for five years and up until six seven months ago it was my
primary kiln, I now just bisque in it (^06). I have a plug, never had a bit
of problem, but when I wired (yes me) I used the biggest wire possible for
my box and the shortest distance.
I never even thought of hard wiring it, although my father brought it up
(he's an electrical junky, outlet every other stud, my god I wired allot of
outlets). I'm not suggesting what you should do, but I've had no problems,
and I fire lots since I'm a full timer. chris
temecula, california
chris@ccpots.com
www.ccpots.com
----- Original Message -----
From: Susan
To:
Sent: Friday, May 11, 2001 8:12 AM
Subject: Re: kiln/electrical/smoke
> Okay, another hardwire/plug question for you all. I bought a used Bailey
> electric 2327-1 kiln a few months ago & am finally setting it up. It's 7
> cu. ft., 240v, and I believe its jacket plate says it's rated to cone 8. I
> can't tell if it says 43 or 48 amps. I'll be firing to max of cone 6.
>
> When I bought it (from a decent supplier), their kiln repair guy
> said, "gee, it doesn't have a plug on it... I'll put one on." At the time,
> it didn't occur to me that maybe it didn't have a plug because it needed
to
> be hardwired. He didn't bring it up, and so I didn't even think of it.
>
> Several months down the road, I'm setting it up and it suddenly strikes
> me... maybe this needed to be hardwired? I called Bailey, & they
> said, "definitely hardwire it." I talked to two friends--a ceramics prof
> and an electrical engineer--& they both said I should just feel the plug
> periodically and see if it gets hot. If it doesn't get hot, they said I
> should be fine.
>
> My electrician says hardwiring it will run me $150-200. I just spend a
> bushel of money getting him to wire my studio; he knew at the time what my
> kiln draws, & I'm sure he used a receptacle that's beefy enough to handle
> what my kiln needs. When I called to ask him for a quote, his first
> response was that he didn't see why it needed to be hardwired, but when I
> told him it would be on for 8-10 hours, he said that might be why.
>
> Any thoughts? experiences? I can't personally imagine that every studio
> potter with a kiln like mine has it hardwired. I don't want to do
something
> stupid, but I also would rather not spend an unnecessary $200. I won't be
> in this studio for more than 5 years, so if I can safely stick with the
> plug, I'd sure like to.
>
> Thanks,
> Susan
>
>
____________________________________________________________________________
__
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
melpots@pclink.com.
Susan Dickson-Smith on tue 15 may 01
Hello, all,
Thank you for all your advice & suggestions. My current plan is to try
plugging this sucker in (after cleaning up the plug as suggested) and
watch/feel the plug carefully through a firing. I'll just hope I can avoi=
d
hardwiring. However, if I do have to, it helps a lot to understand the
underlying electrical processes going on and to know what to ask for! Not
quite up to doing it myself yet, but I'm getting there.
Incidentally, my electrician used a receptacle that's rated for 50 amps, =
so
that's encouraging...
Thanks again,
Susan
mudlark on tue 15 may 01
Jim McKinnel use to say, "All mechanical systems will evenually fail. And=
in the
pure sense he is right. I would recomend hard wiring it eventually. May b=
e before
it fails.
Susan Dickson-Smith wrote:
> Hello, all,
>
> Thank you for all your advice & suggestions. My current plan is to try
> plugging this sucker in (after cleaning up the plug as suggested) and
> watch/feel the plug carefully through a firing. I'll just hope I can av=
oid
> hardwiring. However, if I do have to, it helps a lot to understand the
> underlying electrical processes going on and to know what to ask for! N=
ot
> quite up to doing it myself yet, but I'm getting there.
>
> Incidentally, my electrician used a receptacle that's rated for 50 amps=
, so
> that's encouraging...
>
> Thanks again,
> Susan
>
> _______________________________________________________________________=
_______
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at melpots@pcl=
ink.com.
--
Clyde Tullis
Mudlark Pottery
320 G Street
Salida, CO 81201
719-539-1299
mudlark@chaffee.net
http://www.mudlarkpottery.com
| |
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