Jose A. Velez on mon 31 dec 01
I was recently given a book titled The Potters Wheel written by a =
Spanish lady by the name of Barbaformosa. This a well organized and =
illustrated book about throwing different forms on the potters wheel, =
but in addition it includes extensive information on turning (trimming) =
the entire pot. Although I have not read the book in detail, just from =
perusing the book, I get the impression this is a prevailing practice in =
Spain. This in contrast to what I believe is the prevailing practice in =
the USA, i.e., throw forms that are as complete as possible and only do =
minimum trimming to remove excess clay at the base and turn a foot (on =
simply completing the pot in the throwing process without trimming at =
all). In addition, in the last Ceramics Monthly in an article by Ms. =
Yanina Blech-Hermoni about a summer internship in China she makes =
reference to a similar practice of throwing "thick pots" to be turn =
down. =20
On the surface this practice appears to be inefficient when compared to =
that of throwing a "thin pot" that requires minimum turning (trimming). =
I just wonder if there are things I am missing here? Why throw a pot =
with a thicker wall than is desired to then remove the excess thickness =
in a second step? In addition to the required use of large chucks, =
having to re-center, etc, etc. Is this strictly tradition (although =
traditions do have logical explanations they sometimes outlive their =
usefulness)? Is it that the available clay bodies at some locations do =
not lend themselves to throwing "thin pots"? Are these "thrown/turned" =
pots of a different quality than a "thrown" pot? =20
Although I have been interested in pottery for more than ten years I do =
not have the exposure and experience some of you have and would welcome =
any insight into these different practices.=20
Best Wishes in The New Year!!!
Jose A. Velez
Marcia Selsor on tue 1 jan 02
Dear Jose,
I lived in Spain for a year in 1985-86 and research traditional potters i=
n 48 different towns and villages. They did not do "turning the entire po=
t". In fact, rarely did they trim. I saw my friend throw 1100 morteros (5=
" tall bowl for grinding with a pestal) in one day with an assistant carr=
ying clay to him and carrying boards of pots away. The botijos, water coo=
lers, are thrown thin and not trimmed.-very elegant forms as are the cant=
aros, larger storage jars.
Marcia Selsor in Montana
"Jose A. Velez" wrote:
> I was recently given a book titled The Potters Wheel written by a Spani=
sh lady by the name of Barbaformosa. This a well organized and illustrat=
ed book about throwing different forms on the potters wheel, but in addit=
ion it includes extensive information on turning (trimming) the entire po=
t. Although I have not read the book in detail, just from perusing the b=
ook, I get the impression this is a prevailing practice in Spain. This i=
n contrast to what I believe is the prevailing practice in the USA, i.e.,=
throw forms that are as complete as possible and only do minimum trimmin=
g to remove excess clay at the base and turn a foot (on simply completing=
the pot in the throwing process without trimming at all). In addition, =
in the last Ceramics Monthly in an article by Ms. Yanina Blech-Hermoni ab=
out a summer internship in China she makes reference to a similar practic=
e of throwing "thick pots" to be turn down.
>
> On the surface this practice appears to be inefficient when compared to=
that of throwing a "thin pot" that requires minimum turning (trimming). =
I just wonder if there are things I am missing here? Why throw a pot wi=
th a thicker wall than is desired to then remove the excess thickness in =
a second step? In addition to the required use of large chucks, having t=
o re-center, etc, etc. Is this strictly tradition (although traditions d=
o have logical explanations they sometimes outlive their usefulness)? Is=
it that the available clay bodies at some locations do not lend themselv=
es to throwing "thin pots"? Are these "thrown/turned" pots of a differen=
t quality than a "thrown" pot?
>
> Although I have been interested in pottery for more than ten years I do=
not have the exposure and experience some of you have and would welcome =
any insight into these different practices.
>
> Best Wishes in The New Year!!!
>
> Jose A. Velez
>
> _______________________________________________________________________=
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Kate Johnson on wed 2 jan 02
Hello, Jose...
well, at last, another question I can answer, if not in relation to Spain...
You wrote, after a large snip on my part:
>On the surface this practice appears to be inefficient when compared to
that of throwing a "thin pot" that requires minimum turning (trimming). I
just wonder if there are things I am missing here? Why throw a pot with a
thicker wall than is desired to then remove the excess thickness in a second
step?
--
This is, in fact, how I was taught to throw. I can certainly see the
advantage to the more common American practice of throwing from start to
finish with only minimal trimming, but here's how it works for me, and how I
was taught to do it. It seems to work for everyone in our class and our
teacher/guru as well, so it's not just me.
We don't throw THAT much thicker, just _some_, and then use a hair dryer to
firm up the form on the wheel. To keep it from drying too much in one area
we keep the wheel AND the dryer moving, being careful not to overdry the
edge. (I've brought this up here before, and the practice may be
contributing to some of my problems, but the fact is that it works fine for
others in my group and for the teacher, so my problems may be partly just
ME, and they may be partly the clay I chose at the time. I was using a
midrange black clay and haven't had NEAR the problems with the red or
buff...)
The advantage, for me, is that I can "save" a pot that I've not done a
terrific job on and make it a nicely turned or trimmed piece. I can also
get a different kind of delicacy of detail that I can't do otherwise. I can
throw the form, then trim the neck and base and leave the middle thicker,
then facet it with a cheese cutter or faceting tool...I've gotten some
LOVELY results with that technique. In addition I can trim the walls much
thinner than I would dare throw, once they've firmed a bit, than if I were
working with as wet a clay as I do when I am just in the forming stages.
When the pot has begun to firm up, some, I can use trimming tools to create
these details and to even up wall thickness or thin them to a nicety.
It's not the traditional American way of working, no...but OH I wish you
could see the things my teacher does. He is GOOD.
It IS inefficient in the amount of clay I "waste," and I'm very aware of
that...but the finished product is rather satisfying for a raw newbie.
I'm saving my scraps for slip, anyway.
Granted I want to be able to pull a pot the traditional way, to create
lovely, even, uniform walls, to do what others take for granted...that's one
reason I'm buying my own wheel, so I'll have the luxury of practice,
practice, PRACTICE. But I HAVE been able to do some very nice forms using
this technique and others in my group have done far NICER things...
And by the way this also works well when my arthritis is acting up...less
stress on finger joints while still making a nice pot.
> In addition to the required use of large chucks,
I've not had to use chucks but once...we trim the pot on the wheel as it is
first centered.
>having to re-center, etc, etc.
I only have to do that when trimming the foot ring, and everyone has to do
that, don't they?
> Is this strictly tradition (although traditions do have logical
explanations they sometimes outlive their usefulness)? Is it that the
available clay bodies at some locations do not lend themselves to throwing
"thin pots"? Are these "thrown/turned" pots of a different quality than a
"thrown" pot?
I think they are, yes...sometimes they are smoother and more sophisticated,
at least those my teacher/guru throws, then trims. Hard to explain,
especially since I love and collect both...there is a more earthy, organic
feel to those that are thrown the more traditional way, and a more
controlled, highly finished effect to the ones he does. Mine are
floundering around in some no-man's-land in the middle.
Best--
Kate
Jose A. Velez on wed 2 jan 02
Ms. Kate Johnson:
Thanks for your informative e-mail. I do not know if you saw the e-mail =
from Mr. Snail Scott, on the same subject, about how he learned this =
method in Japan. His message coincides with yours in that by turning =
pots you get a different quality and can achieve looks/shapes that are =
not possible just by throwing. =20
I have been a pottery "aficionado" for over 10 years and had a kick =
wheel I built myself. I think the flywheel was not heavy enough and =
could not throw very large forms, but actually I enjoy trimming the foot =
of a pot as much as throwing. I have never used the techniques you =
described. Recently I bought an electric wheel and will start soon =
practicing. For sure will give these techniques a try. By the way I =
understand perfectly what you describe and think is slightly different =
than what is described in the Barbaformosa book, it seems she makes use =
of chucks a lot. Although I know this would be unavoidable in some =
shapes, the technique you describe would avoid the use of chucks in most =
cases. One advantage I can see in her method, by using the chuck she =
turns the walls and foot in one step without having to re-center. =20
Again thanks for your e-mail and Best Wishes in the New Year,
Jose A. Velez
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