Working Potter on tue 15 jan 02
Would those firing with propane in the larger tanks please share what it
costs in your area and tell whether there are other costs or requirements
like a certain volume per time period? Also who owns your tank and do you
pay rent or a price if you go for a spell without a regular fill? Was there
an installation fee and what was it and how did they apply this {give the
current rules, if you can]? What size of copper pipe was involved from the
tank to the gage, what kind and brand of gage was used for a gas reduction
kiln and raku kiln? Does anyone use welding hoses to make the connection to
the gas burners? Please answer only the parts of this that you personally
have used in recent years.Any exchange will be GREATLY appreciated.
potterybydai on tue 15 jan 02
Dear Working Potter (no signature---do you have a more "friendly name"?) -
here in British Columbia, we fire raku, and we have what is called an
80-gal. tank (aka "bomb", it stands over 4' high) which we pay $80/yr. to
rent from a propane company. The propane company owns it. They come and
fill it when we call them, usually two or three times a year. We pay
whatever the current propane price is (last fill, April 2001, 58.9
cents/litre); it's way higher now than when we started 7 years ago.
Originally, they came with the empty tank, positioned it where we wanted it,
and then filled it. There was no set-up charge. When we moved our studio,
they came and moved it for us, free of charge. There's a gauge on the tank
that lets you know when you're getting low; and when we call for a fill,
they usually come within two days.
We use the hoses that were bought for that purpose at a pottery supply
place.
That's the extent of what we have real experience with----hope it's useful.
We love not having to run to the gas station all the time with little BBQ
tanks, not having to put little tanks in hot water baths to keep the gas
flowing, love having constant pressure with the big tank---it's all worth
the rental cost, in our opinion.
Dai in Kelowna, BC
potterybydai@shaw.ca
"Never put off until tomorrow that which can be avoided altogether."
attributed to Ann Landers
Celeste Sabel on tue 15 jan 02
I, too, am interested in this question, so could you guys reply via ClayArt
rather than privately? Thanks. Celeste in Montgomery
>From: Working Potter
>Reply-To: Ceramic Arts Discussion List
>To: CLAYART@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG
>Subject: propane costs 1/2002?
>Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2002 11:45:59 EST
>
>Would those firing with propane in the larger tanks please share what it
>costs in your area and tell whether there are other costs or requirements
>like a certain volume per time period? Also who owns your tank and do you
>pay rent or a price if you go for a spell without a regular fill? Was
>there
>an installation fee and what was it and how did they apply this {give the
>current rules, if you can]? What size of copper pipe was involved from the
>tank to the gage, what kind and brand of gage was used for a gas reduction
>kiln and raku kiln? Does anyone use welding hoses to make the connection
>to
>the gas burners? Please answer only the parts of this that you personally
>have used in recent years.Any exchange will be GREATLY appreciated.
>
>______________________________________________________________________________
>Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
>You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
>settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
>Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
>melpots@pclink.com.
_________________________________________________________________
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dan mc kinnon on tue 15 jan 02
hey, i'm in jacksonville florida ... i use gas for
raku firing and purchased a 40 pound talk which is a
good side for the raku firings for myself and a few
private lesson type students i have. the talk cost
about $75. at home depot. if i refil it at a normal
hardware type place they charge about $25. to refil;
howver i go to BJ's and they only chare $15.00 so
obviously i go there.
--- Working Potter wrote:
> Would those firing with propane in the larger tanks
> please share what it
> costs in your area and tell whether there are other
> costs or requirements
> like a certain volume per time period? Also who
> owns your tank and do you
> pay rent or a price if you go for a spell without a
> regular fill? Was there
> an installation fee and what was it and how did they
> apply this {give the
> current rules, if you can]? What size of copper pipe
> was involved from the
> tank to the gage, what kind and brand of gage was
> used for a gas reduction
> kiln and raku kiln? Does anyone use welding hoses
> to make the connection to
> the gas burners? Please answer only the parts of
> this that you personally
> have used in recent years.Any exchange will be
> GREATLY appreciated.
>
>
______________________________________________________________________________
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change
> your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be
> reached at melpots@pclink.com.
__________________________________________________
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Roger Korn on tue 15 jan 02
Hi Working,
Is Potter really your last name ? I'm in Arizona and we pay around $1.00/gallon
for filling our 100 gallon tank. They own the tank and we pay $49/yr rent, or I
could buy the tank for $450. We call, they fill, no fine print, no minimums, etc. I
plumb high pressure with AGA approved 1/2" hoses. You will want an adjustable
regulator at the kiln(s). I design my kilns for 2 to 10 psi
propane. Get the regulator from a propane shop. Don't pay more than $25-30. Working
with relatively high pressure (compared to household appliance) lets you use
smaller pipe and smaller orfices on venturi burners, which increases gas velocity
at the jets and improves mixing, resulting in a better turn-down ratio for slow
firing.
Talk to your propane supplier - they like to sell propane and will help you do a
safe and effective installation.
Hope this helps - that's what this list is about,
Roger
Working Potter wrote:
> Would those firing with propane in the larger tanks please share what it
> costs in your area and tell whether there are other costs or requirements
> like a certain volume per time period? Also who owns your tank and do you
> pay rent or a price if you go for a spell without a regular fill? Was there
> an installation fee and what was it and how did they apply this {give the
> current rules, if you can]? What size of copper pipe was involved from the
> tank to the gage, what kind and brand of gage was used for a gas reduction
> kiln and raku kiln? Does anyone use welding hoses to make the connection to
> the gas burners? Please answer only the parts of this that you personally
> have used in recent years.Any exchange will be GREATLY appreciated.
>
> ______________________________________________________________________________
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at melpots@pclink.com.
--
Roger Korn
McKay Creek Ceramics
In AZ: PO Box 463
4215 Culpepper Ranch Rd
Rimrock, AZ 86335
928-567-5699 <-
In OR: PO Box 436
31330 NW Pacific Ave.
North Plains, OR 97133
503-647-5464
Richard Aerni on wed 16 jan 02
OK, propane info...
My tanks were filled yesterday. I paid 76.2 cents per gallon. This is down
from the earlier high prices in 2001, but up from several years ago when I
paid as little as 55 cents per gallon. As for getting a good price, I would
advise you to check around with _all_ available companies and comparison
shop. Years ago I did that, and as a result I have ended up cutting my
propane prices by about 40%. My price is now tied to the price of the
propane as it goes into the pipeline down in Texas. I can check the prices
in the Wall Street Journal every day and know what I will pay on any given
day.
I have two 1000 gallon tanks which service my 70 cubic foot kiln. A couple
of reasons for going with that much storage capacity: one, you don't have to
be calling them up all the time for a refill, and two, if you live in a cold
weather area, like I do, it gives you the ability to draw maximum BTUs for
your kiln down to very low temperatures. (The liquid propane converts to
gas based on available surface area as well as temperature.) The company
owns the tanks, and placed them for free. There is no monthly charge for my
use of them, other than what I pay in gas prices. The company was
interested in how often I would refill them initially, but over the years,
they have not evinced any concern, as I use a lot of propane. The company
also owns the pressure regulators. I own the piping from the tanks to my
kiln, and bought and installed it with the advice of the engineers from the
propane company. There are regulations in place as to the strength of pipe
needed for certain pressures, the depth at which it needs to be buried, and
the distance the tank must be from the heat source. The company can help
you with this. I would recommend you nail all of this down before you place
your tanks or kiln, especially if you are short of space. The company also
sent their engineer out to inspect my kiln, burners, and safety system
before they would make the final hook up. This is important not only to
them, but also to me, for safety as well as insurance purposes.
I hope this helps,
Richard Aerni
Bloomfield, NY
EDGOULD on wed 16 jan 02
My cost for propane; I have a 500 gallon tank that belongs to the delivery
company.:
2000 Nov $1.74 and 1.76/gal
2001 April $1.79/gal. Mar Sep 1.66 Nov $1.66/gal Dec. 1.63
2002 Jan.$1.63
between Baltimore and Washington DC
----- Original Message -----
From: Working Potter
To:
Sent: Tuesday, January 15, 2002 11:45 AM
Subject: propane costs 1/2002?
> Would those firing with propane in the larger tanks please share what it
> costs in your area and tell whether there are other costs or requirements
> like a certain volume per time period? Also who owns your tank and do
you
> pay rent or a price if you go for a spell without a regular fill? Was
there
> an installation fee and what was it and how did they apply this {give the
> current rules, if you can]? What size of copper pipe was involved from
the
> tank to the gage, what kind and brand of gage was used for a gas
reduction
> kiln and raku kiln? Does anyone use welding hoses to make the connection
to
> the gas burners? Please answer only the parts of this that you personally
> have used in recent years.Any exchange will be GREATLY appreciated.
>
>
____________________________________________________________________________
__
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
melpots@pclink.com.
Marvpots@AOL.COM on wed 16 jan 02
Hi:
I live/work in North/Central New Jersey, just got a delivery to be billed at
$2.96 per gallon. I have a 200 gallon tank, belonging to the gas company but
installed by them at no charge to me; they also dug, at no charge, the
trench and ran the line from the tank to the kiln, a distance of about 75
feet.
I hope this informaiton is helpful.
Marvin Flowerman
marvpots@aol.com
Ruth Ballou on wed 16 jan 02
Ed,
Looks like you're paying too much for propane. I'm in the Silver Spring
and my last fill up in November was $1.24 a gallon for a 1000 gal tank.
Don't know if the tank size makes a difference. Campbell's Bottled Gas of
VA. is the supplier (301) 567-6400. I switched from Suburban Propane
several years ago because of the price.
Ruth Ballou -- reading clayart while I try to work out the crick in my neck
just as I was reading about neck stress and studio dogs from Kimi
>My cost for propane; I have a 500 gallon tank that belongs to the delivery
>company.:
>2000 Nov $1.74 and 1.76/gal
>2001 April $1.79/gal. Mar Sep 1.66 Nov $1.66/gal Dec. 1.63
> 2002 Jan.$1.63
>between Baltimore and Washington DC
>
>
>
>
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: Working Potter
>To:
>Sent: Tuesday, January 15, 2002 11:45 AM
>Subject: propane costs 1/2002?
>
>
>> Would those firing with propane in the larger tanks please share what it
>> costs in your area and tell whether there are other costs or requirements
>> like a certain volume per time period? Also who owns your tank and do
>you
>> pay rent or a price if you go for a spell without a regular fill? Was
>there
>> an installation fee and what was it and how did they apply this {give the
>> current rules, if you can]? What size of copper pipe was involved from
>the
>> tank to the gage, what kind and brand of gage was used for a gas
>reduction
>> kiln and raku kiln? Does anyone use welding hoses to make the connection
>to
>> the gas burners? Please answer only the parts of this that you personally
>> have used in recent years.Any exchange will be GREATLY appreciated.
>>
>>
>____________________________________________________________________________
>__
>> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>>
>> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
>> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>>
>> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
>melpots@pclink.com.
>
>______________________________________________________________________________
>Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
>You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
>settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
>Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
>melpots@pclink.com.
Working Potter on thu 17 jan 02
Thanks all for the propane cost comparisons.They sure were eyeopeners.Why
complain about sales taxes when we can do better with these lower gas
prices?
I THINK AN ANNUAL COMPARISON MIGHT BE INFORMATIVE,MIGHT PROVIDE A BASIS FOR
NEGOTIATIONS.
Misty
n a message dated 1/17/2002 5:22:31 PM Pacific Standard Time,
IowaHarry@MYREALBOX.COM writes:
> Last fill in December was $.73 per gallon in a 500 gallon tank. How about I
> send you some?
>
> Harry in Iowa
>
Jennifer F Boyer on thu 17 jan 02
Just got our 1000 gallon tank filled: 1.199/gallon
I'm SO jealous of those cheaper numbers I'm hearing! But we've
shopped around some and the only cheaper deal is the one where
you lock into a price and it doesn't change even if the local
price goes down.....
Jennifer
Working Potter wrote:
>
> Would those firing with propane in the larger tanks please share what it
> costs in your area
~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*
Jennifer Boyer mailto:jboyer@adelphia.net
Thistle Hill Pottery
95 Powder Horn Glen Rd
Montpelier, VT 05602 USA
802-223-8926
http://www.thistlehillpottery.com/
Never pass on an email warning without checking out this site
for web hoaxes and junk:
http://urbanlegends.about.com/
~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*
Harry in Iowa on thu 17 jan 02
Last fill in December was $.73 per gallon in a 500 gallon tank. How about I
send you some?
Harry in Iowa
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ruth Ballou"
To:
Sent: Wednesday, January 16, 2002 1:19 PM
Subject: Re: propane costs 1/2002?
> Ed,
>
> Looks like you're paying too much for propane. I'm in the Silver Spring
> and my last fill up in November was $1.24 a gallon for a 1000 gal tank.
> Don't know if the tank size makes a difference. Campbell's Bottled Gas of
> VA. is the supplier (301) 567-6400. I switched from Suburban Propane
> several years ago because of the price.
>
> Ruth Ballou -- reading clayart while I try to work out the crick in my
neck
> just as I was reading about neck stress and studio dogs from Kimi
>
>
> >My cost for propane; I have a 500 gallon tank that belongs to the
delivery
> >company.:
> >2000 Nov $1.74 and 1.76/gal
> >2001 April $1.79/gal. Mar Sep 1.66 Nov $1.66/gal Dec. 1.63
> > 2002 Jan.$1.63
> >between Baltimore and Washington DC
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >----- Original Message -----
> >From: Working Potter
> >To:
> >Sent: Tuesday, January 15, 2002 11:45 AM
> >Subject: propane costs 1/2002?
> >
> >
> >> Would those firing with propane in the larger tanks please share what
it
> >> costs in your area and tell whether there are other costs or
requirements
> >> like a certain volume per time period? Also who owns your tank and do
> >you
> >> pay rent or a price if you go for a spell without a regular fill? Was
> >there
> >> an installation fee and what was it and how did they apply this {give
the
> >> current rules, if you can]? What size of copper pipe was involved from
> >the
> >> tank to the gage, what kind and brand of gage was used for a gas
> >reduction
> >> kiln and raku kiln? Does anyone use welding hoses to make the
connection
> >to
> >> the gas burners? Please answer only the parts of this that you
personally
> >> have used in recent years.Any exchange will be GREATLY appreciated.
> >>
> >>
>
>___________________________________________________________________________
_
> >__
> >> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
> >>
> >> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> >> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
> >>
> >> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
> >melpots@pclink.com.
> >
>
>___________________________________________________________________________
___
> >Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
> >
> >You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> >settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
> >
> >Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
> >melpots@pclink.com.
>
>
____________________________________________________________________________
__
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
melpots@pclink.com.
>
>
Harry in Iowa on fri 18 jan 02
Hi Marvin,
I usually get 4 to 5 fills per year depending on how cold the winter is.
I have payed in advance before to get a discount but lately I have been just
paying as I go. I do not have a contract with my supplier but I am on their
route. If they fill it I will pay, if they ding me on the price I will shop
around and get off their route.
Harry in Iowa, where winter is nowhere to be found
----- Original Message -----
From:
To:
Sent: Friday, January 18, 2002 4:20 PM
Subject: Re: propane costs 1/2002?
> Harry, how many deliveries (i.e., gallons) did you get in a 12 month
period?
> From what I know, that would be an important determinant of your price.
> Thanks for sharing your info.
>
> All the best.
>
> Marvin Flowerman
> marvpots@aol.com
>
>
____________________________________________________________________________
__
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
melpots@pclink.com.
>
>
Harry in Iowa on fri 18 jan 02
Marvin,
You need to do some shopping around, $2.96 per gallon is highway
robbery. How big a tank are you using? Is it something you can get in the
pickup? If you could haul it to a propane filling station it would have to
be cheaper. Some people drive cars and trucks that run on propane. Get out
your phone book and do some comparison shopping.
Maybe you should burn wood :)
Harry in Iowa
----- Original Message -----
From:
To:
Sent: Friday, January 18, 2002 3:43 PM
Subject: Re: propane costs 1/2002?
> I went into this question of propane prices with Amerigas, my supplier and
a
> large national company. As a concession, they reduced my price to $2.96
per
> gallon stating that because I only get about one delivery of 170 gallons
> annually, "the system" plugs in that price. Larger annual consumption
would
> plug in lower prices.
> I hope this information helps and if others have suggestions for my being
> able to lower my cost of propane I would gladly listen.
>
> All the best.
>
> Marvin Flowerman
> marvpots@aol.com
>
>
____________________________________________________________________________
__
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
melpots@pclink.com.
>
>
Carole Fox on fri 18 jan 02
Ruth wrote:
"Don't know if the tank size makes a difference. "
Yep. Tank size does make a difference in the price you will pay for =
propane. I am charged a much lower rate to fill my very large tank that =
runs my hot water, gas range,etc. than I am charged for the medium size =
tank that fires my raku kiln. Both tanks are free as long as I use this =
same company. Both are located on the same property. Unfortunately, they =
will not put the smaller tank on auto- delivery, (won't check it when =
they're here delivering for the other tank), and will not cut me a break =
on the price for fuel.
In the northeast corner of MD, I am paying 1.699 for the large tank (350 =
gal. ??)and close to TWICE that amount for the small (100 gal?) tank.
Carole Fox
Elkton, MD -Haven't thought about this for a long time, but now I'm all =
pissed off at my propane company again!
cfox@dca.net
Ed Kraft on fri 18 jan 02
Carol,
I fill the smaller tanks myself useing the hose and valve supplied by my
propane company at no extra charge. They seem to want to make it easy to use
as much of their product as possible. Ed
Earth Arrangements
2109 39th St
Bellingham, WA 98226
360 734- 6839
eartharr@msn.com
www.eartharrangements.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Carole Fox"
To:
Sent: Friday, January 18, 2002 7:25 AM
Subject: Re: propane costs 1/2002?
Ruth wrote:
"Don't know if the tank size makes a difference. "
Yep. Tank size does make a difference in the price you will pay for propane.
I am charged a much lower rate to fill my very large tank that runs my hot
water, gas range,etc. than I am charged for the medium size tank that fires
my raku kiln. Both tanks are free as long as I use this same company. Both
are located on the same property. Unfortunately, they will not put the
smaller tank on auto- delivery, (won't check it when they're here delivering
for the other tank), and will not cut me a break on the price for fuel.
In the northeast corner of MD, I am paying 1.699 for the large tank (350
gal. ??)and close to TWICE that amount for the small (100 gal?) tank.
Carole Fox
Elkton, MD -Haven't thought about this for a long time, but now I'm all
pissed off at my propane company again!
cfox@dca.net
____________________________________________________________________________
__
Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
melpots@pclink.com.
Marvpots@AOL.COM on fri 18 jan 02
Harry, how many deliveries (i.e., gallons) did you get in a 12 month period?
From what I know, that would be an important determinant of your price.
Thanks for sharing your info.
All the best.
Marvin Flowerman
marvpots@aol.com
Marvpots@AOL.COM on fri 18 jan 02
I went into this question of propane prices with Amerigas, my supplier and a
large national company. As a concession, they reduced my price to $2.96 per
gallon stating that because I only get about one delivery of 170 gallons
annually, "the system" plugs in that price. Larger annual consumption would
plug in lower prices.
I hope this information helps and if others have suggestions for my being
able to lower my cost of propane I would gladly listen.
All the best.
Marvin Flowerman
marvpots@aol.com
Marvpots@AOL.COM on sat 19 jan 02
Thanks for your comments Harry.
I have a 200 gallon tank, owned by the Amerigas Company, that's why I get my
propane from them.
Since, thanks to you and others, I understand the high price I am charged I
will investigate further.
Thanks again.
Marvin
iandol on sun 20 jan 02
Nightly Business Report is quoting forward price for Natural Gas as =
being $US 2.60 per MM Btu,or there abouts, for next months contracts on =
the New Your Stock Exchange.
Can anyone translate this into the cost of filling a 90 lb or a 45 Kg =
portable tank.
Ivor Lewis, Redhill. South Australia
m markey on fri 25 jan 02
Hi Everybody!
I've been off list for a few days. It's good to be back to the brisk Mojave
Desert air, after spending a few days in sunny warm San Diego.
Nonetheless, here's what propane costs in this neck of California: between
$1.40 and $1.69/gallon. The propane man comes tommorow, to refill the tank
for the house heaters and water heater. Our bill will come close to $200,
for a full 150-gallon tank.
Best wishes!
Mohabee NakedClay@hotmail.com
_________________________________________________________________
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James Bowen on sun 27 jan 02
To fill 100 LB bottles here in Eastern Colorado is.
$.95/gal, and we take them to town to be filled. For home
tanks it is $.85/gal, and he comes here to fill them. We are
going to start using a wet leg on our tank to fill our own
bottles.
Stay Centered
James Bowen
Boyero CO
jbowen43@yahoo.com
jbowen43@plains.net
Working Potter on mon 28 jan 02
Thanks for your reply, but please excuse my ignorance but what are you
calling wet leg?
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