artimater on fri 18 jan 02
rm wrote:
This idea whereby a perpetual student is given unfettered access to the
studio and is unsupervised by faculty and staff while there is
irresponsible, dangerous, and exposes the college to legal liability. I
have seen so-called "students" manipulate and exploit this situation. =
They
enroll for a semester and pay a small amount of tuition and fees (about =
100
US dollars) and think they have a studio for four months where they can
cordon off an area, commandeer equipment, use unlimited quantities of
expensive clay/glaze materials, fire their own work and generally have =
the
run of the place without concern for those who are taking the course for
college credit towards an Associate or Baccalaureate degree.
So what you are saying is that these bad bad people actually =
utilize the facilities...Oh for shame for shame...Those facilities =
should only be utilized by the government subsidized teachers...Does it =
cut down on the amount of work that you can get in the kiln?...Is that =
your problem.....Well then I think you should fire more often....You =
work in a community college and you have the whatever it takes to drag =
them deeper in the mud than anyone else...I pay to be there....I buy my =
clay...I buy my stains...I learn something every day...I daily consult =
with many fine fine artists(most have other jobs)...Even at the half =
rate of this semester I give them more money than I take....I do have =
access to any kind of kiln I could want...I have been known to use the =
grinder occasionally....The lights would be on whether I was there or =
not....I use a kickwheel to throw.....So your biggest problem with me is =
that I can produce twice as much work as you as I'm not fettered by =
maintaining a farcical teaching job...They would likely look askance at =
you if you spent ALL your time there working on your own work, =
huh?..Poor Rafy has to do a demo for the beginners while Don gets to =
make kick ass art....Wah Wah....So you think there should only be =
beginners around.....That would sure put you to work....I give demos =
every day....You would have to answer all the questions...Your classes =
would be cut in half or more but every time one of the kids messed with =
the grinder you damn well better be there watching...Or do the beginners =
not matter either?...They will all move on to other fields where they =
can reasonably become something and have a life instead of becoming what =
you are....That is the ones who didn't cut off their hand while you were =
working on your own work...
Art pottery got going in the US about 1870....By 1920 there were =
many factories employing many fine artists around the country....Then =
along came the Depression and away went the factories......What happened =
to artists such as Adelaide Robineau?....I quote, "The artists attached =
themselves to schools and universities"....I don't know who I just =
quoted and don't remember what book, but I sure remember the =
line.....Now that situation has transformed to the point that it is =
impossible to be a fine artist in America...It is easy to get your =
paperwork straight and get a job teaching....Oh, but then you have to =
teach don't you poor baby...
In your perfect world there would only be teachers....no =
artists...People could take two or three semesters and then move =
on.....You could walk amongst the beginners with your nose in the air =
and tell them all, "You are all too stupid to be artists...You have to =
have a degree on your wall before you can understand art" ...."Only =
pampered rich kids like me can make art"...Too bad for you that someone =
invented the concept(what a concept) of continuing ed....Too bad for you =
there are real artists hanging around your world, showing up your meager =
work....You make good money....I make good art...Sticks in your craw in =
a big way doesn't it?...HAHAHAHA....Once again I am forced to pass wind =
in your general direction....
Tell us all your feelings about the continuing ed concept....Don't =
hold back
Tell me this....Why are you giving people the clay bug if there is =
no other option than the school- degree- teacher route?....It sure cuts =
down your competition doesn't it....As I've said many times on this =
list....There ought to be some people creating fine art....not just =
teachers...That is the proper result of all this damn =
"teaching".....DOERS not teachers...What a concept....You like to TRY to =
appear intelligent....Yet you cannot see the truth to this =
statement?....Continuing Ed allows a few fine artists to get to create =
fine art without having to compete with the vapid crap that comes from =
the art party line...
Once again you singled me out...Once again you misspelled my =
name....Wouldn't you like to trample on my neck?....Put your thumb in my =
eye?....Make me go away?.....Well it's not gonna happen, The truth =
that art comes from the heart and not the brain is leaking out(Artimator =
has a BIG mouth)....Soon there will be people making meaningful art all =
over the country....Right in front of your shriveled, prune looking, =
pursed lips, angry face
Why don't you think about David when you spout crap that holds the =
art market to the club prison...He is making it as a clay artist in a =
world where there are no clay artists....Only teachers....(DH grew up in =
Highland Park and makes most of his cash off teaching workshops; even he =
would have trouble doing it full time).....If you are a full time =
teacher, then you must be a PART-TIME artist(logic-something the Greeks =
thought up)....Why don't you step aside and let the real artists of the =
world begin to emerge?
And I was thinking about burying the hatchet...Now I think it oughta be =
the axe
Rush
"I only indulge when I've seen a snake, so I keep a supply of =
indulgences and snakes handy"
http://artimator.com
rush@artimator.com
http://clubs.yahoo.com/clubs/texasceramics
Artimator Galleries
2420 Briarwood Ln.
Carrollton, TX 75006
972-841-1857
Bob Pulley on fri 18 jan 02
Catchy thread title. There are some good points here, but I don't see the =
need for all of the reckless charachter assasination and anger. The =
resentment and jealousy are palpable. Do you actually know and hate the =
person you are talking about or do you just like being clever at another's =
expense? If the idea is worth discussing intelligently try a little =
compassion and restraint and people will take the argument more seriously.
Bob
>>> artimater@ATTBI.COM 01/18/02 01:19PM >>>
rm wrote:
This idea whereby a perpetual student is given unfettered access to the
studio and is unsupervised by faculty and staff while there is
irresponsible, dangerous, and exposes the college to legal liability. I
have seen so-called "students" manipulate and exploit this situation. =
They
enroll for a semester and pay a small amount of tuition and fees (about =
100
US dollars) and think they have a studio for four months where they can
cordon off an area, commandeer equipment, use unlimited quantities of
expensive clay/glaze materials, fire their own work and generally have the
run of the place without concern for those who are taking the course for
college credit towards an Associate or Baccalaureate degree.
So what you are saying is that these bad bad people actually utilize =
the facilities...Oh for shame for shame...Those facilities should only be =
utilized by the government subsidized teachers...Does it cut down on the =
amount of work that you can get in the kiln?...Is that your problem.....Wel=
l then I think you should fire more often....You work in a community =
college and you have the whatever it takes to drag them deeper in the mud =
than anyone else...I pay to be there....I buy my clay...I buy my stains...I=
learn something every day...I daily consult with many fine fine artists(mo=
st have other jobs)...Even at the half rate of this semester I give them =
more money than I take....I do have access to any kind of kiln I could =
want...I have been known to use the grinder occasionally....The lights =
would be on whether I was there or not....I use a kickwheel to throw.....So=
your biggest problem with me is that I can produce twice as much work as =
you as I'm not fettered by maintaining a farcical teaching job...They =
would likely look askance at you if you spent ALL your time there working =
on your own work, huh?..Poor Rafy has to do a demo for the beginners while =
Don gets to make kick ass art....Wah Wah....So you think there should only =
be beginners around.....That would sure put you to work....I give demos =
every day....You would have to answer all the questions...Your classes =
would be cut in half or more but every time one of the kids messed with =
the grinder you damn well better be there watching...Or do the beginners =
not matter either?...They will all move on to other fields where they can =
reasonably become something and have a life instead of becoming what you =
are....That is the ones who didn't cut off their hand while you were =
working on your own work...
Art pottery got going in the US about 1870....By 1920 there were many =
factories employing many fine artists around the country....Then along =
came the Depression and away went the factories......What happened to =
artists such as Adelaide Robineau?....I quote, "The artists attached =
themselves to schools and universities"....I don't know who I just quoted =
and don't remember what book, but I sure remember the line.....Now that =
situation has transformed to the point that it is impossible to be a fine =
artist in America...It is easy to get your paperwork straight and get a =
job teaching....Oh, but then you have to teach don't you poor baby...
In your perfect world there would only be teachers....no artists...Peo=
ple could take two or three semesters and then move on.....You could walk =
amongst the beginners with your nose in the air and tell them all, "You =
are all too stupid to be artists...You have to have a degree on your wall =
before you can understand art" ...."Only pampered rich kids like me can =
make art"...Too bad for you that someone invented the concept(what a =
concept) of continuing ed....Too bad for you there are real artists =
hanging around your world, showing up your meager work....You make good =
money....I make good art...Sticks in your craw in a big way doesn't =
it?...HAHAHAHA....Once again I am forced to pass wind in your general =
direction....
Tell us all your feelings about the continuing ed concept....Don't =
hold back
Tell me this....Why are you giving people the clay bug if there is no =
other option than the school- degree- teacher route?....It sure cuts down =
your competition doesn't it....As I've said many times on this list....Ther=
e ought to be some people creating fine art....not just teachers...That is =
the proper result of all this damn "teaching".....DOERS not teachers...What=
a concept....You like to TRY to appear intelligent....Yet you cannot see =
the truth to this statement?....Continuing Ed allows a few fine artists to =
get to create fine art without having to compete with the vapid crap that =
comes from the art party line...
Once again you singled me out...Once again you misspelled my =
name....Wouldn't you like to trample on my neck?....Put your thumb in my =
eye?....Make me go away?.....Well it's not gonna happen, The truth that =
art comes from the heart and not the brain is leaking out(Artimator has a =
BIG mouth)....Soon there will be people making meaningful art all over the =
country....Right in front of your shriveled, prune looking, pursed lips, =
angry face
Why don't you think about David when you spout crap that holds the =
art market to the club prison...He is making it as a clay artist in a =
world where there are no clay artists....Only teachers....(DH grew up in =
Highland Park and makes most of his cash off teaching workshops; even he =
would have trouble doing it full time).....If you are a full time teacher, =
then you must be a PART-TIME artist(logic-something the Greeks thought =
up)....Why don't you step aside and let the real artists of the world =
begin to emerge?
And I was thinking about burying the hatchet...Now I think it oughta be =
the axe
Rush
"I only indulge when I've seen a snake, so I keep a supply of indulgences =
and snakes handy"
http://artimator.com=20
rush@artimator.com=20
http://clubs.yahoo.com/clubs/texasceramics=20
Artimator Galleries
2420 Briarwood Ln.
Carrollton, TX 75006
972-841-1857
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Lee Love on sat 19 jan 02
I simply can't understand why people are so damned worried about what others do.
Please, go to your studio and makes some stuff! Make Art, pots, breakfast.
Anything beats whining, moaning and groaning. ;^)
--
Lee Love In Mashiko Ikiru@kami.com
"The best pots for me are the pots that I like."--Shoji Hamada (1894-1978)
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