vince pitelka on wed 20 mar 02
Okay, here's a strong opinion about the whole "lid wax" thing. I believe
this and I teach it. I think that glaze-to-glaze contacts on lid seats are
offensive. It feels all wrong. There is beauty, and a wonderful contact
senstion, in a clay-to-clay lid seat when it is properly done. It is great
to expose the clay at this point (and on the foot as well, where I believe
the same thing), and when the lid fits well (as all lids should) it is like
a "ground-in" seat, giving a very positive, affirmative closure. No reason
to glaze lid seats, ever.
Best wishes -
- Vince
Vince Pitelka
Appalachian Center for Crafts
Tennessee Technological University
1560 Craft Center Drive, Smithville TN 37166
Home - vpitelka@dtccom.net
615/597-5376
Work - wpitelka@tntech.edu
615/597-6801 ext. 111, fax 615/597-6803
http://www.craftcenter.tntech.edu/
vince pitelka on sun 24 mar 02
> This issue most clearly came up for me when I began
> doing cremation urns. I started off by interviewing a couple of funeral
> directors to determine what the design criteria should be. One thing that
> these gentlemen impressed on me was that there was a variety of ways that
the
> piece would be used. One very likely possibility, other than interment,
was
> that once the ashes were scattered from it, the piece might be used as a
> memorial vase. Now my personal preference for a vase is that the lip have
> glaze on it, so I choose to fire lid and pot separately, glazing both, to
> accommodate that possibility.
Michael -
I acknowledge that there are always special circumstances. You point out a
very good one above with the cremation urns. That is a vessel where the lid
is not continually being removed and replaced, so the feel of that
glaze-to-glaze contact is not an issue. And I can see that customers might
want the entire surface glazed, whether or not they intend to use it as a
memorial vase.
But I can tell you that in 30 years in ceramics I have never seen a glazed
lid and lid seat which pleased me. To the contrary, it always seems all
wrong. When my students want to glaze a lid seat, I certainly do not tell
them not to, but I do challenge them to create a glazed lid seat which is
successful.
I have used some very gritty claybodies in the past, and with a little
silicon carbide grit in a slurry between the lid and seat while rotating the
two together, any roughness at the contact point is quickly removed.
The way we sell our pots is by finding things that the customer likes. I am
not worried about customers who want glazed lid seats. My customers always
appreciated the clay-to-clay contact on the lid seats. I will say that I
always had very snug-fitting lid seats, with the glaze line coming very
close to the contact between lid and seat, so there was never any
significant band of unglazed clay exposed until you remove the lid and
reveal it.
Best wishes -
- Vince
Vince Pitelka
Appalachian Center for Crafts
Tennessee Technological University
1560 Craft Center Drive, Smithville TN 37166
Home - vpitelka@dtccom.net
615/597-5376
Work - wpitelka@tntech.edu
615/597-6801 ext. 111, fax 615/597-6803
http://www.craftcenter.tntech.edu/
Brandon Phillips on sun 24 mar 02
On Malcolm Davis' small lidded jars he glazes the rims and fires the lid
seperately. The base form of the pot is basically his form of a tea bowl.
He depends completely on carbon trapping so that way if the lid doesn't work
out he still possibly has a nice teabowl. Just though it was interesting.
Brandon Phillips
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Michael McDowell on sun 24 mar 02
Well, here I go, seemingly in opposition to both Vince and Ivor. But so what
if I end up chopped meat, Clayart thrives on controversy. I just feel that
while both these esteemed gentlemen are entitled to their own tastes and
opinions, the question of whether to glaze or not to glaze lid seats and pot
bottoms is a matter of personal taste and circumstance, not to mention the
preferences of ones customers. Now in fairness to Vince, who started this
thread, he did no more than speak his own preference. But without any other
preferences being voiced, his attempt to express his likes ends up sounding
like an edict. I don't think that was his intention, so I'll oblige by
'fessing up some of my reasons for choosing to do otherwise. For many years, I
did as these two gentlemen suggest, but now I do a little of both. I consider
the decision of whether or not to glaze the lid seat and fire lid and pot
separately or together to be entirely situational. My stoneware clays tend to
be a little coarser than what I've seen that Vince customarily uses. They tend
to "spit out" a little in firing, and end up producing a grating sound more
like fingernails on a chalkboard than "like silk on skin" as described by
Ivor. Certainly, some clays do produce that sort of seal between a "fired on"
lid and the pot, but if it doesn't happen naturally, it can be a lot of bother
trying to sand or grind those exposed surfaces to the point where they will
produce that sort of sound and feel, without marring nearby glazed surfaces.
I've noticed that some people at shows and fairs are particularly turned off
by the "ground in" fit of an unglazed lid seating. Others are not, and some
may indeed prefer it. I would feel a little presumptuous in telling any of
these that their tastes are in error. They are just their tastes, and I can
decide whether or not I wish to cater to them. Personally, I feel that it is
much harder to produce a good fitting glazed lid and seat. When you can fire
both together, they serve to reduce the amount of warpage that might occur in
the glaze fire, and there is no need to estimate the thickness of the glaze
coat and figure that in when making the clay pieces. I'll agree that when the
design leaves too much leeway for those kind of tolerances, the end result can
be aesthetically wanting. But any kind of seating is capable of being poorly
done.
Finally, I would say that glazing both lid and gallery allows an independent
existence to both pieces. This issue most clearly came up for me when I began
doing cremation urns. I started off by interviewing a couple of funeral
directors to determine what the design criteria should be. One thing that
these gentlemen impressed on me was that there was a variety of ways that the
piece would be used. One very likely possibility, other than interment, was
that once the ashes were scattered from it, the piece might be used as a
memorial vase. Now my personal preference for a vase is that the lip have
glaze on it, so I choose to fire lid and pot separately, glazing both, to
accommodate that possibility.
So, I don't feel this a matter of right or wrong. Merely thought I'd share
some different viewpoints on the issue. Just to widen the discussion.
Michael McDowell
Whatcom County, WA USA
michael@mcdowellpottery.com
http://www.mcdowellpottery.com
Sharon on mon 25 mar 02
On my casseroles and jars I prefer to make the body with no gallery, putting
the vertical wall on the lid.
My thought, from many years of living with pottery, children, and lots of
meals, is that the base form can still be used even if the lid is broken. I
try to design so that the base looks intact on its own. Yes, there is an
unglazed portion, but it is an attractive, smooth porcelain.
If you break the base I don't know *what* you do with the lid, other than
hassle your local potter into making a replacement. ;-} Or turn it into a
bird/butterfly puddle in the garden.
Sharon
The Lane Pottery
Hinsdale, Illinois
Janet Kaiser on tue 26 mar 02
The grating of clay-on-clay, is like finger nails scratching down a
chalk board for some people. Yes, echoes of Dr. Strangelove... It is
tortuous. I respect that. That is their perception and experience. It
is not going to change, no matter how "appropriate", "traditional" or
"practical" for the potter, nor how "educated" they are.
Janet Kaiser
The Chapel of Art / Capel Celfyddyd
Home of The International Potters' Path
8 Marine Crescent : Criccieth : GB-Wales
URL: http://www.the-coa.org.uk
postbox@the-coa.org.uk
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